July 1st, Smoke Free England & smoking lounges

[Chronictank]

And so its here.. I am sat here in a Shisha Bar (What is Shisha)
taking my final toke of minty goodness (mint+strawberry = <3), pondering over the future of such establishments who will go out of business in the governments attempt to crack a walnut with a sledge hammer.
I didnt see a discussion previously, and cba to search to see if there is one but the question is;
Should cigar/shisha/smoking lounges be exempted from the law?

I have tried to see the other side of the fence, but to be quite frank i draw a blank.
The whole point of smokefree is to make sure that people arent affected by second hand smoke, now if this is the true intention why on earth is the ban extended to places where the intention of people going there is to smoke? , i mean thats like saying pubs arent allowed to sell alcohol (will get back to this) or resteraunts aren't allowed to sell food.
I can understand the view point of banning smoking in pubs, resteraunts and clubs because the reason the establishment exists isnt smoking, that is simply a by-product of its customers.

Now as a secondary motive if you will is that the government is trying to "save us from ourselves", as smoking is bad for you. Then why not ban the sale of cigarettes altogether?, this also could be extended to all sorts of things, the biggest one being alcohol (told you i would come back to this). Now before the usual's D) come out the woodwork there is a significant difference between the drinking culture in Britain and our European brethren.
Seeing as alcohol has a derogatory effect, why isnt the same being applied to it?, same could be said about junk food because of the rising level of obesety in the uk, i could go on but you get the idea.

Banning it in places where it is a by-product is one thing, but banning it where the whole intention of the establishment is to do it is another thing entirely and just seems (in my slightly biased opinion), a little silly to me.

Discuss

 

[Samaroon|Terracotta]

I'm all for it in clubs, bars, sociable areas etc, mainly cuz' I'm working in a bar atm and it's nice to come home from work/a day out and not to smell like an ashtray. But for places like Shisha's should be different, what the hell are people going to go to places like that for now?

 

[old.Tohtori]

Ban burgers from McD! Them be filled with fatty fat which fatty fatties eat and get fatter! It's McD fault!

Oh oh and ban guinness from bars 'cause it's not generic crap from a tap!

Oh oh and yes! LEt's ban eating from restaurants so the smell of a dish won't bother the person on the other table!!

Ooooooh!! And when we're at it, kill all the vegetarians/PC-brigaders/anti-smoke-loonies(hint) for trying to change everything and ruining the world

 

[Jeros]

Im all for the smoking ban, people who smoke are really starting to get on my nerves, i should not have to worry about getting cancer when im sitting in a pub enjoying a beer.

Just about had enough of smokers when some dude (note i think he may have been nuts) had a go at me at work when i asked him to put out his cig when he was ordering food at the counter when there was a massive sign saying "no smoking", he went on after he put it out that "people have rights" i said somthing along the lines of "our customers have the right to eat in our restuarant and not get cancer, that will be the law in a few weeks anyway" resisting the urge to kick him out. I mean for gods sake, there we kids all around, and its a FOOD premises!

People have the right to smoke all they want, they do NOT have the right to subject others to heath risks by doing so.

 

[old.Tohtori]

Jeros, i didn't mind the smoking ban, i'm a smoker and i took it with smiles and lifted middlefingers, but now their going after smoking pubs.

Pubs that are meant for smoking of all places. That's just 100% wrong.

I bet, when they come after something the non-smokies love, they'll be cryin out "no it's our rightzors to have/do this!"

And that day will come.

 

[Glacier]

Smoking laws been like this for years in Norway, only ones complaining are tourists.

 

[Gotrag]

I mean, I don't smoke and still find this abit far -fetch.

Did you know that if you work from home you have to put a no smoking sticker up in you 'Home office'? That's just pathatic.

My whole family smoke and I have no problem with it but this is seriously stupid, whats the point of a heavey smoker going to a pub? they'll spend most of there time outside.

 

[Bugz]

Maybe its to help all those smoking realising their complete idiots for doing so and stop?

 

[dub]

either you ban tobacco or you dont.

ban on smoking in establishments should be left to the owner to decide upon as long as tobacco is legal.

 

[Zenith]

Quite weird you cant smoke the Shisha... Correct me if Im wrong, but the tobaco in those things are not even holding nicotine? Or even tar? I might be way off here, but in Sweden most of the ones I buy doesnt.. And there is places in sweden where you can still smoke "peacepipes", I think.

 

[Bahumat]

I think if women are hot and they want to smoke in places like bars/pubs etc, they have to be naked.

guys have to all sit in a dirty shed and smoke their faces off

 

[Lollie]

They've gone about it the wrong way, make part of the pub a seperate room and have allow the smokers go in there. Funniest thing i've heard is if your self employed, smoke and drive a van you can smoke but must have no smoking stickers up, but if you have a passenger who smokes also your not allowed

 

[Mabs]

its nanny state gone mad

you cant smoke in any enclosed or "substantially enclosed" public places, which from memory, is anything that has walls covering more than about half the circumference of the roof.
if you smoke at "home office", you cant smoke anywhere where members of the public go, including postmen etc. so if you have lots of deliveries etc, you cant smoke in your own house....
im waiting for the drinking ban in pubs tbh sometime soon, and dont tell me that drinking doesnt cause deaths and deaths through "secondary drinking"

as for people who work in a pub, they can fuck right off. "oh i work in a pub i shouldnt have to be exposed to smoke", its part of pub culture same as the drinking etc, you choose to work there its your own decision

i really hope it makes a massive dent in the alcohol industry profits this year. and on the money issue, how much tax does the government make off smokers? Who are all apparently going to stop overnight ?! so wheres all this extra cash going to come from eh ?

for the record, i dont smoke currently, recently stopped, again

 

[yaruar]

And so its here.. I am sat here in a Shisha Bar (What is Shisha)
taking my final toke of minty goodness (mint+strawberry = <3), pondering over the future of such establishments who will go out of business in the governments attempt to crack a walnut with a sledge hammer.
I didnt see a discussion previously, and cba to search to see if there is one but the question is;
Should cigar/shisha/smoking lounges be exempted from the law?

THe law is an arse, they keep shutting down my crack house. I keep telling them that everyone who comes there wants to smoke crack and the staff are all 2 dollar crak ho's, but they just won't listen.

It's political correctness gone mad.:kissit:

 

[Overdriven]

I'm actually against this for more than one reason. Like mentioned above, this has seriously screwed over alot of businesses/pubs etc AND will annoy everyone who smokes in my family. (Atleast, UK based ones) I've got no big deal with it, as you can still smoke outside/going to work (I walk everywhere, so..) as long as you put the buts in a trashcan(?) it's totally fine. (Or am I wrong? Since it's not publically enclosed)

@Jeros: Your post was stupidly OTT, the likelyhood of you getting cancer from somebody second hand smoking is the likelyhood of me getting hit by a bugatti at 5am tomorrow. Yes, there's a very minimal chance, but people are being stupid with it.

@Sama: Get a new job then, as mentioned; it's part of the culture... It's like asking McDonald staff not to be chavs... It happens, but it's rare... If you don't lile it, temp agencies are around.

 

[Calaen]

I think its great, as for stopping a restaurant from selling food or a bar selling alcohol, well thats quite a stupid thing to say. Having a drink or eating food does not directly effect other customers. Smelling like a mong is not on my list of day to day priorities yet whenever I enter a pub/bar I come out smelling like shit.

Will be nice to go on a night out and not have headaches from overcrowded pubs with shit ventilation because of the smoke hanging around. Now I am not a scientist but I do not think passive smoking can be any good for you at all, there may as you put it be a slight risk but I would like to be able to choose not to have that risk increased by people I do not know.

I do not think it is anything to do with a nanny state, it is merely giving people a choice.

 

[Overdriven]

it is merely giving people a choice.

But then, doesn't that contradict the whole idea of the smoking ban? It's forcing the smokers to stop, not giving them a choise. (Yes, I know where you came from, but I'm doing this intentionally) I mean, if it's something like a club (e.g. a rock one) you'd expect people to be smoking there, if you didn't like it you would have the choice to go in or not go in. Now, the smokers are being forced to go outside. (Without having a decision on the matter)

Is unfair =<

 

[Mabs]

only one thing i would add, is that people in general are ignorant rude wankers these days.
if im in a pub, and someone is eating next to me, i wouldnt smoke.. not cos its illegal, but cos its really rude. you shouldnt need to have a law for common sense and manners tbh

 

[Amanita]

Sadly you seem to.

I'm all relieved by the ban because I am allergic to cigerette smoke and walking into a pub makes my lungs cry. Totally selfish I guess!

 

[old.Tohtori]

I think its great, as for stopping a restaurant from selling food or a bar selling alcohol, well thats quite a stupid thing to say. Having a drink or eating food does not directly effect other customers. Smelling like a mong is not on my list of day to day priorities yet whenever I enter a pub/bar I come out smelling like shit.

Said the same thing about smoking 10 years ago. "Never gonna be banned, that would be sillly". Just wait and see, they will come after something you like too, and then you'll see.

Having a drink makes some people a-holes who ruin a whole evening for others, more then ciggies ever could. Should drinking be banned from people who might not handle it?

Some foods make me gag and can ruin my meal also. Should those foods be banned from restaurants?

Will be nice to go on a night out and not have headaches from overcrowded pubs with shit ventilation because of the smoke hanging around. Now I am not a scientist but I do not think passive smoking can be any good for you at all, there may as you put it be a slight risk but I would like to be able to choose not to have that risk increased by people I do not know.

Never proven that bar smoke has caused cancers. People living with smokers, sure, but never a case of "This man went to the bar at weekends and now dies of cancer from passive smoke". People who worked all their lives at bars, usually smoke themselves and are now pissed off, and they belong basicly in the same category as the REAL passive smoke issues. Those living in passive smoke.

I do not think it is anything to do with a nanny state, it is merely giving people a choice.

And at the same time, forcing othe peoples choices to a minimum.

These are just facts, and unless you're an anti-smoking looney like i said, you'll realise i'm right.

 

[Bugz]

As someone said above, its just common curtousy.

I don't want to inhale your filthy smoke because of a habit you find hard to give up/don't wish to give up. It's not my problem.

As for the losing of free choices etc., it shouldn't have been a choice in the first place...

Oh and all this 'passive smoking doesn't hurt you shit' is bollocks or the chances are OH-SO-LOW. Regardless of the point, why should I even have to put my health in danger because of some filthy habit?

 

[Overdriven]

Oh and all this 'passive smoking doesn't hurt you shit' is bollocks or the chances are OH-SO-LOW. Regardless of the point, why should I even have to put my health in danger because of some filthy habit?

Don't like it, leave... Like most here (atleast, 50%) I've grown up around smoking and it doesn't piss me off at all. (The ban does, more than anything) If you're going to a place where there's smokers, they don't make you stay around. As I just said, if you don't like it leave. Attitudes like yours, are from people who really have no clue and just need to grow up. As mentioned before, it would be more effective banning 'alcohol' as that causes more problems than smoking does.


Let's go to the TOTAL extremity here.. Chavs are bad for our health, does that mean we should ban them? I mean, they piss me off and cause issues when ever I'm around, so we should ban them from public/closed spaces

 

[Bugz]

Don't like it, leave... Like most here (atleast, 50%) I've grown up around smoking and it doesn't piss me off at all. (The ban does, more than anything) If you're going to a place where there's smokers, they don't make you stay around. As I just said, if you don't like it leave. Attitudes like yours, are from people who really have no clue and just need to grow up. As mentioned before, it would be more effective banning 'alcohol' as that causes more problems than smoking does.


Let's go to the TOTAL extremity here.. Chavs are bad for our health, does that mean we should ban them? I mean, they piss me off and cause issues when ever I'm around, so we should ban them from public/closed spaces

I know the media infuses you with crap about cancer but seriously - thats not the only thing passive smoking can lead to. Research it.

I'm not sure what your getting at with the 'don't like it - leave.' So now the art of damaging other peoples health is okey? Would you like it if I came up to you and knocked you on the nose and said 'don't like it - leave.'

And if you don't care about passive smoking than that is your decision. I hate coming out of a restaurant smelling of smoke and knowing I've inhaled someone's shitty fag when I'm trying to eat. That's not even getting into the health reasons.

& why are you comparing chavs to cigarettes? That's so absurd! But yes, most of them probably are banned from a lot of public places

 

[Overdriven]

I'm not sure what your getting at with the 'don't like it - leave.' So now the art of damaging other peoples health is okey? Would you like it if I came up to you and knocked you on the nose and said 'don't like it - leave.'

& why are you comparing chavs to cigarettes? That's so absurd! But yes, most of them probably are banned from a lot of public places

1) You're not going to passivley 'knock me on the nose' - That's a stupid compaison. Mine actually worked. If you were going to a place where you KNEW there would be smokers. (Some resteraunts never had a smoking section) YOU would have to make the decision to go in or not to go in. I think I used the wrong words in my original remark. No one forces anyone to go where smokers go, it's up to the person to make the decision. (What I was basically trying to say) So... "If you don't like it - leave" - Still works =D

2) They're both 'bad for health and living' - Was a rather odd comparison, but it follows the same guideline... I should have the choice to be in a place where they are, give a chav ban.

PS: I've been up for <1h, so ignore my poor writing.

 

[Bahumat]

It's a good thing this law. We know smoking kills and we know it has a chance of causing cancer. That chance can be miniscule, but its still a chance and thats not exactly a good thing.

To the people who smoked they're kinda screwed at the moment...i'd guess? BUt lets be honest here, if smoking is harder to do in public places, then possibly the next generation of youth's wont have much interest. And whether you smoke or not, you know its not a healthy thing. So in a weird way, you guys will suffer, but it could help society in the future?

fuck knows, im going off on a weird tangent.

 

[Bugz]

To be honest - i'm all for making smoking & non-smoking zones in restaurants etc. I just don't feel smokers should be able to affect where others go because they don't wish to be hurt by their fumes & their habit.

 

[old.Tohtori]

I'm not sure what your getting at with the 'don't like it - leave.' So now the art of damaging other peoples health is okey? Would you like it if I came up to you and knocked you on the nose and said 'don't like it - leave.'

There are those who do that after a couple of drinks, should they be forever banned from drinking in public houses? And how about those who haven't done it yet? Those should surely be banned too.

I can't count with two hands the times my evening out has been "ruined"(because my friends want to leave etc etc) because of drunken a-holes who want nothing more then to fight.

And like siad above, what about food places? If some foods make me gag and i have to leave the restaurant? Isn't that taking away my freedom like pre-smokeban did for you?(for a fact if i smell gabbage food, other then raw, i'm really close to hurling a couple of appetisers).

Like i said, i didn't mind the smokeban, i'm just telling people that before they come for YOUR passtime/hobby/habbit, you will be all giddy and say "This good thing!"...which shouldn't be the case.

 

[Vladamir]

Smoking lounges or whatever do what you want there, i've never visited one so it doesnt bother me.

However pubs, clubs and so on, why should i be subjected to another peoples habit? Why should i be made to inhale their cigarette minus the filters?

Most places around here have refurbished to accomodate smoking areas/terraces. Why other places can't do that is a mystery.

Glad the bans in place, make it illegal for all i care

 

[Chronictank]

To be honest - i'm all for making smoking & non-smoking zones in restaurants etc. I just don't feel smokers should be able to affect where others go because they don't wish to be hurt by their fumes & their habit.

Have you actually read the thread at all, not picking on you but all the people saying the same thing.

If it's a smoking lounge, (the clue is in the name), why on earth as a non-smoker who doesnt want to breath in second hand smoke are you going in there?
The whole reason people go there is to smoke
As it happens speaking to a guy working there, employee's sign a waver saying they understand the risks

As for "freedom", closing places which are created for the purpose because you decided to go in there is exactly the same.

I 100% agree places such as pubs, clubs etc etc as said in the original post should be covered by the ban, but places where the intention of people going there is to smoke? you have to be a special breed of moron to believe that is in any way right

It's a good thing this law. We know smoking kills and we know it has a chance of causing cancer. That chance can be miniscule, but its still a chance and thats not exactly a good thing.

To the people who smoked they're kinda screwed at the moment...i'd guess? BUt lets be honest here, if smoking is harder to do in public places, then possibly the next generation of youth's wont have much interest. And whether you smoke or not, you know its not a healthy thing. So in a weird way, you guys will suffer, but it could help society in the future?

fuck knows, im going off on a weird tangent.

As for being bad for you, i would put money on you drinking alcohol and eating junk food, how would you like it if you werent allowed to drink alcohol in a pub or eat junk food in a fast food resteraunt? or does that make perfect sense to you guys?

Smoking a water-pipe is a hell of alot of a lesser evil than alcohol, especially if they use tobacco,nocotine & tar free mollases (sp?)

 

[Vladamir]

As for being bad for you, i would put money on you drinking alcohol and eating junk food, how would you like it if you werent allowed to drink alcohol in a pub or eat junk food in a fast food resteraunt? or does that make perfect sense to you guys?

Careful where you go with that perspective. Like i said do what you like in smoking lounges. But comparing alcohol & food consumption in a public place is so different its not even worth trying to compare it.