Im thinking of...

[Sigh]

I dont agree with your front loading idea. Flurry helps, and if you can be arsed'd go crush for ubah slow weps + ofc off hand.

And imho, anytime > postional, i.e moc

 

[Vindicator]

Not going to quote all of Vinds rabble so will just post this under, firstly, who said anything about 2 moves with slow weapons? He is on about a half-ogre two-handed Armsman, the stun is back positional, no need for 2 moves.

.

He may have been asking for 2h but hey thought he would want some information, not the usual myth and lore .

As for 2h stun, sure Rear moves are nice to get off but not always useable. Why would u not want a free 9s stun for no drop in dmg?

About Pole styles.

The only any time moves you should be using in RvR are Stunning or Snaring moves, while crippling snares its not worth doing There Follow's because you can either spam snare them, no escape, or do phalanx as they run, or Slam them in the first place .

It seems That Defenders Revenge's damage has dropped to the same as Aegis's damage. Did a quick test on a sitting target <with no armor> a few times. They should have left Revenge's damage as it was tbh, it's not like we use are most damage stlyes often :/.

But hey, keep hiding behind your shield if it makes you feel safe, its your spec points.

Oi! you highlander guys wear skirts, nuff said bout whimps :touch: <joke ofc>

Keep living in the past thinking that speccing 50/50 makes any difference in damage while losing defence and most importantly 1 of the best offensive styles in game. Just dont try not yell at the top of your lungs to every person that decides to roll an arms, we actually want other ppl playing armsmen.

Other than that have fun with your spec is the main thing really!

 

[gunner440]

vind the anarchist

 

[*Ialkarn]

blabla blablablabla! blabla bla!!!

Don't do an armsman! they sux!
it's a cursed class,completely broken and whitout a precise role in any group setup.
ppl talking about double speccing issue is missing the real problem:an armsman would still sux if the class had enought points to spec 50 shield 2h pole parry melee and crossbow.

An armsman have basically two choices:
spec difensive 50 shield 50 melee and be a more efficent copy of a pali,too bad a group need end regen and the group can't affort 2 shield bots.

spec offensive pole/2h and lacking of damage output in front of a merc,even worse if they have to face something guarded (shields got bonuses against 2h weapons,while they have a malus in front of dual wielders),in this case your damage output decrease to 0..

I do +30% damage cause double speccing! I pwnz!

Bs:your caps are the same as a warrior using a 2h weapon whit the difference he got more ws (aloot aloot aloot more if he is a troll) so the average damage is the same (his average damage whit 1h styles are superior to a 1h full specced armsman)

Spec Hibrid? usless.
Your slam is redundant whit your 2h/pole styles,it gimps your damage output even more(it get parried,blocked,evaded and it miss aloot cause the low 1h spec,it make you lose precious rounds where you could have landed a positional for x3 damage instead to miss a slam)

Your 1h damage sux (yes you are specced 2h/pole but you have to use your 1h aloot).

You get pali slamming in offence aloot (when your mincer land SoS,when you jump a group and they get mezzed,when you have a theurg in group petting everything and rooting tanks)


If you think plates gives you more chances to survive YOU ARE WRONG:
plate isn't enought to save you from an assist train,you don't survive a round more than a merc,the only thing making the difference are sob/ap,things you can't affort before rr5-6 for SOB ,rr8-9 for AP.
A smart Merc can engage like you do and his Dirty tricks are a better defence than your stupid plate.

Wanna know how long survive a full buffed armsman whit 2.400 hits against a savage assist train whitout push ras? less than 4 seconds ( I 'm not joking :you get stunned from behind (duration 4 seconds) and you die before the stun wear off).

Go look at how much Armsmen are wanted in groups:

http://www.duskwave.com/daoc/classrank.php?class=Armsman&server=Excalibur&realm=&order=rp

http://www.duskwave.com/daoc/classrank.php?class=Armsman&server=Prydwen&realm=&order=rp

Now look at mercs rps last week:


http://www.duskwave.com/daoc/classrank.php?class=Mercenary&server=Excalibur&realm=&order=rp

http://www.duskwave.com/daoc/classrank.php?class=Mercenary&server=Prydwen&realm=&order=rp

My sugestion is to stop to roll armsmen,maybe soon or later Mithic 'll do something for us.

 

[Vodkafairy]

What the fook is Wub doing on last weeks rps #1?

That guy is so bugged, rr6 merc and never hit me over 80 dmg mainhand styled, it's very weird

 

[Yurka]

50 pole, 50 thrust, 7 shield, rest parry - get 5.9 spd dragon pole , starting 15 str rest con


2hd this patch sucks compared to old one, hated it.

Pole has anytime snare, then a possible 9 sec stun to get.

......

But crush h/orge merc would do better job dmg wise

 

[Alithiel]

Ialkarn!

We can't have Ialkarn getting down... everyone needs to give him hugs when they see him to make him feel wanted!

 

[Coren]

How to make an armsman:

a) be inconnu (preferably with ginger goatee)
b) click randomly on screen to sort out stats/spec [well you may as well...]
c) buy some plate and a pointy hat.

ROAR!

Sit back and let the emotes roll in....

 

[judas]

cba to read what other ppl said. but allways go for 50 2h.
i auto trained my arms so was abel to get 40thrust aswell.
allso got 42shiled for slam/pve (and guard in rvr on rare ocations)
rest i put in parry.

so 2h 50.
weapon spec 39(40)
shiled 42
rest parry.

oh btw corean. incunnus pwn only reason to be something else is when ho gets here. got pets on me in lots of fights and assist train sometimes too.
draws major aggro from the casters.
no big diff in the start stats aswell.

 

[Kagato]

http://www.duskwave.com/daoc/classrank.php?class=Armsman&server=Excalibur&realm=&order=rp

Noooo damn crappy XML, when they going to fix this to show unguilded people as well? I should be 16th on there.

Whilst I agree with Ialkarn about mercs doing the job better then Armsman at the moment, I do not think we are quite obsolete yet, though if Mythic keep up with there track record for 'improving' the class we soon will be.

High RR Armsman can still do a fine job but if you look on the low RR side a typical Merc will always be more favourable alas.

But god knows how the new RA system will effect things.

If they'd just fix double-speccing to do what it should do and negate damage variance in accordance with spec to primary weaponspec then we would be far far happier.

 

[Bracken]

This thread is deteriorating The guy wants to make a 2H half-ogre and asked about specs. Now we got people going on about poles, armsmen, mercs...only thing missing is someone to mention 2H pallies. Bet the man wishes he never asked...

 

[Asha]

So people should just give him a spec and not warn him that the class is becoming more and more difficult to find groups for, both in pve and pvp? I don't think so... I think he would rather know that before leveling a new character. If he chooses to do so in spite of the state of things, then fine, but there is no harm in giving people info. I would rather know the info and make my own choice.

And Kagato, I am sorry but you're wrong about high RR arms... I have seen pick up groups and other guilds groups choose low rr mercs before high rr arms. The rps for arms reflects that. Doesn't mean the groups are right or that a well played high rr arms is worse than an average played low rr merc. It just means that armsmen find it very hard to find rvr (and I am guessing pve is 10x worse) groups - this will get worse with the new crop of fotm ho mercs.

 

[Kagato]

And Kagato, I am sorry but you're wrong about high RR arms... I have seen pick up groups and other guilds groups choose low rr mercs before high rr arms. The rps for arms reflects that. Doesn't mean the groups are right or that a well played high rr arms is worse than an average played low rr merc. It just means that armsmen find it very hard to find rvr (and I am guessing pve is 10x worse) groups - this will get worse with the new crop of fotm ho mercs.

A sad state of affairs and possibly true Asha, though I think a group that thinks like that has got problems. Personally though seeing how much we laugh at mids rerolling to savages i'd hate to see Albion doing the same thing with h/o-mercs. Thankfully im much to stubborn to respec or change class after 2 years as I am just for fotm groups.

 

[Calamore]

such moan.........says calamore, love your armsman

 

[Bracken]

So people should just give him a spec and not warn him that the class is becoming more and more difficult to find groups for, both in pve and pvp? .

That's what he asked about, so yep might have been a good idea. Ya know, maybe he just likes the concept of an armsman half-ogre and wasn't too concerned if it was fotm or not? Oh and for the record, armsmen might not be the group-essential class they once were but to imply he's gonna have a real hard time getting groups in both pve and pvp? Don't be silly. There are plenty of classes having a much harder time of it.

 

[Sigh]

doork > prejudice

Make a char thats not fotm, it soon will be. armsman and wizards <identical situation> at high RR's combined with good players will compete at a high level, low rr's will have problems with game play. Albions wtfpwn chars in the beginning, even before smite clerics. mythic are just punishing you for your lack of team spirit;P but sure as eggs is eggs, there will soon be a nerf armsman thread on Fh :touch:

 

[Asha]

That's what he asked about, so yep might have been a good idea. Ya know, maybe he just likes the concept of an armsman half-ogre and wasn't too concerned if it was fotm or not? Oh and for the record, armsmen might not be the group-essential class they once were but to imply he's gonna have a real hard time getting groups in both pve and pvp? Don't be silly. There are plenty of classes having a much harder time of it.

If that is the case then it doesn't hurt for him to know what he is getting into. What is the problem with informing people? I can't think of a class other than a stealther that would have a harder time getting pve groups. Reaver has debuffs, friar has buffs, pala end. It's been a couple months since I lvled up, but at the time armsman was the last choice of those tanks to group. As for rvr, just look at lwrp. Again, I don't agree with that totally but it's how it is atm.

:wub: si, we miss ya ^^ but before smite clerics ?
There was nothing BEFORE smite clerics !!!!

 

[Bracken]

If that is the case then it doesn't hurt for him to know what he is getting into. What is the problem with informing people? I can't think of a class other than a stealther that would have a harder time getting pve groups. Reaver has debuffs, friar has buffs, pala end. It's been a couple months since I lvled up, but at the time armsman was the last choice of those tanks to group. As for rvr, just look at lwrp. Again, I don't agree with that totally but it's how it is atm.

The problem is that the "informing" people we've seen on this thread basically amounted to "don't roll an armsman they sux". I don't see any informed discussion on difficulties getting pve or rvr groups. As we have seen so many times in the past with different classes/specs we're back into people dissing a class because they aren't the current fotm. I play an armsman and was levelling another - stopped to wait for ToA (yup I fancy having a HO). It simply aint true that they don't get groups - in either pve or rvr. I agree it aint as easy as it used to be but these things always go in cycles. Absolutely no reason for the "dont roll an armsman" nonsense. The bottom line is that advice on a spec was asked for and yet we have the usual claptrap that 1) doesn't answer the question and 2) is based on a very narrow view of the game which in the wider scheme of things is just plain wrong.

 

[Kagato]

I could never see why people whine so much about getting pve groups, 9 times out of 10 i'd make my own groups, problem solved simple as that, if your the group leader your the one deciding. Some people are just to lazy to organise the groups and prefer to whine about how unfair it is instead.

But anyway this is getting dreadfully of topic.

Sum of it is, use whatever spec you want, you can always respec if you dislike it, but keep in mind Armsman are a class that needs improving alot still.

There now everyone can be happy and quietly curse at one another behind the scenes :wub:

 

[Asha]

Ok Bracken. You're right and all the high rr armsmen except Ialkarn have just independently decided they don't like rvr all the sudden. The reason for the don't roll an armsmen posts (which I didn't make incidentally) is the frustration that several high rr armsmen are feeling with the class - that is in addition to the grouping issue. I think it's a valid point. Also it’s not a narrow view. It’s a view coming from many people with very different play styles.
This is a discussion board; there is no rule that says you have to only answer the question of the poster. If someone asks me how much crush they should get as a reaver, I am going to tell them that I don't think crush is the best way to go (don't get any ideas Fing ). There is no reason why someone can't read the experiences and opinions of other people and then decide; hey I still really want to make one. I don't know what you're so scared of.

 

[wittor]

Asha :wub:

 

[Kagato]

Ok Bracken. You're right and all the high rr armsmen except Ialkarn have just independently decided they don't like rvr all the sudden. The reason for the don't roll an armsmen posts (which I didn't make incidentally) is the frustration that several high rr armsmen are feeling with the class - that is in addition to the grouping issue. I think it's a valid point. Also it’s not a narrow view. It’s a view coming from many people with very different play styles.

Theres still a few of us Armsman loyally RvRing we're not quite extinct, meanie. :touch:

 

[Asha]

I know I spend 99.999999% of my time with one, happily

 

[Flimgoblin]

This is a discussion board; there is no rule that says you have to only answer the question of the poster. If someone asks me how much crush they should get as a reaver, I am going to tell them that I don't think crush is the best way to go (don't get any ideas Fing ). There is no reason why someone can't read the experiences and opinions of other people and then decide; hey I still really want to make one. I don't know what you're so scared of.

crush rocks (for mercs - I'd say the flex line is both interesting and powerful so probably shouldn't be passed up on a reaver - slash/thrust/crush just aren't as fun imho)

as does the natty font Asha posts in forsooth.

 

[Calamore]

Ok Bracken. You're right and all the high rr armsmen except Ialkarn have just independently decided they don't like rvr all the sudden.

I play too

 

[Asha]

yes and you went from 170-200k+ a week before patch to what 65k? You and several others. Is this because you all suddenly got busy irl? Is there an armsmen convention somewhere?

 

[Bracken]

Ok Bracken. You're right and all the high rr armsmen except Ialkarn have just independently decided they don't like rvr all the sudden. The reason for the don't roll an armsmen posts (which I didn't make incidentally) is the frustration that several high rr armsmen are feeling with the class - that is in addition to the grouping issue. I think it's a valid point. Also it’s not a narrow view. It’s a view coming from many people with very different play styles.
This is a discussion board; there is no rule that says you have to only answer the question of the poster. If someone asks me how much crush they should get as a reaver, I am going to tell them that I don't think crush is the best way to go (don't get any ideas Fing ). There is no reason why someone can't read the experiences and opinions of other people and then decide; hey I still really want to make one. I don't know what you're so scared of.

LoL. I made a post saying how the thread had gone down hill - this was particularly in response to the flames that had started (it was afterall a simple request from the guy who started the thread - a shame it got so heated), and ofc we had Ialkarn's sweeping generalisation that armsmen sux and he shouldnt roll one. You then respond to my post saying that he's only pointing out some difficulties getting groups in both pve and rvr - which just wasn't what Ialkarn had said, aswell as just being wrong. Did I say people couldn't post? No. Having frustration with the class is understandable - all those of us who have played them from the start share some degree of frustration on it. But it is a narrow view to say don't roll an armsmen - those of us who aint fussed about making 100k a week rps know that we can still get groups - both pve and rvr. I get a group every night. Sure I need a little more patience than I used to have and might have to wait a while but I still get them. So do many armsmen. Ofc if someone wants to be guaranteed a spot in a high level rvr group then armsman isn't currently the way to go - but that wasn't the issue here. For 90% of the population for whom that ain't their biggest concern then there is no freaking reason why they shouldn't roll one. It doesn't matter how much you try and wangle it, to say armsmen suck and someone shouldn't roll them is just bloody stupid. But lets face it - this all started with you taking exception to me commenting the thread had gone down hill. Pathetic really.

 

[*Ialkarn]

is based on a very narrow view of the game which in the wider scheme of things is just plain wrong.

Ok my point of view is narrow and limited,then show me the real reason someone should roll an armsman;
for fun? it's not fun at all.

a Friar is limited in RvR cause lacking of determination but atlast it's fun.
an armsman isn't fun,it's just a limited class,limited in every situations.
It's a broken warrior in a realm where a guardbot need end regen.

And it's not a problem related only whit the class
it's a problem linked whit the gimpness of 2h weapons:its the main reason all savages respecced from 2h to h2h,even frontload trolls,it's the reason why blademasters replaced celtic spear heroes.

That dosen't mean everyone whit an armsman have to reroll but I don't see anything of bad to warn someone is going to do one.

 

[Asha]

First off, no one was flaming as far as I am concerned. I guess if people disagree with you, then it's flaming in your head.

I don't think the thread went downhill. Why is it a shame it got so heated? What on earth is wrong with people having strong opinions about a class they played for 2 years or more? Ialkarn was pointing out the problems with the class which TRANSLATES to less groups in rvr and pve. If you can't make that jump, then I am sorry. You talk such bs. 90% of ppl don't care about being able to play in good rvr groups? That is complete and utter bollocks. You can tell yourself you don't care, but it's completely obvious that you do and you have a huge chip on your shoulder about it everytime you post. I've seen the "groups" you run in and I doubt 90% of the player base wants to have to play like that.

And yes, it is pathetic how you have to jump in whenever you think someone is being elitist. The truth is people with experience are posting their opinions. It's a discussion board, that is what it's for. The poster is perfectly capable of reading the opinions and deciding what he wants. But as usual, Bracken comes running to make sure no one gets a little advice from higher rr players, cause obviously that is just elitist!

zzzzzz

 

[Kagato]

Nothing wrong with a heated debate in my view, specially when its over something as important as Armsman The more people that yell and scream about it, the more chance something will be done about it, so long as insults are kept out of it, its constructive.

Armsman do have serious problems, its true that we will get out performed, specially when h/o mercs hit the scene, so there is nothing wrong with warning new people to the class that they are likely to be disapointed when it comes to groups. No one is telling them they can't roll an Armsman, just that mercs will be the big thing. Sad but true.

I still think high RR Armsman will do as well in groups as the new flood of low RR mercs, but fact is high RR Armsman are few in number, active ones even less and most groups wont care how good, skilled or capable they are, they'll just go for the ugly new mercs.

But personally, im much to stubborn to give in, I still enjoy my Armsman and after 2 years I wont so much as respec him, let alone play anything else.