How much should a SCer charge

[Xeanor]

All the overabundance of 99% stuff is because of people keeping it when trying to make MPs, while the buyer of the MP already pays for the retries you can make the cost of the retry a 2nd time + more. Just that 5 retries is a bit much for that no?

 

[chretien]

Agree with what you're saying Tesla, however you have to remember that crafting materials are expensive for the other 'traditional' crafts. and relatively cheap for SC and alchemy so there's more room for markup. A 99% suit of af102 chain or plate will usually cost in the region of 3plat at materials cost. I'll sell it for 4 plat because that's what the market will support. There's no way I'd sell a single suit if I asked 18 plat for it. Characters just don't have the money to pay for that especially at lower levels - an af 50 chain suit costs 74 gold at random quality. I'll charge 225 for a 99% suit but not many level 20s could dredge up 450 gold for a suit of armour.
If all crafters charged a vast amount then that would go some way to alleviating the charge that SC has ruined PvE as crafted stuff would be a lot harder to get than it is now. However you'd need to make sure that every crafter was charging that and the only way to ensure it would be to substantially hike up the cost of crafting materials.
As far as people selling off spare 99% stuff cheap, I hate it and I never do it myself because it makes other crafters trying to charge a fair price for stuff look bad. Selling to friends guildies is ok but flooding the open market with cheap 99% bits isn't on.

 

[chretien]

Also Tesla retry cost is significantly less than the actual cost of the item. For example af102 breastplates costs 500 to make but retry rate is 125 so 500+(5x125) =1125 which is a much closer approximation to the true cost of a 99% item.

 

[Flesh]

Originally posted by Danya
Cost me 640g to get my entire 9 piece set done 33/28, 300g/piece is a huge profit margin.

Yeh but you slept with Sarum for it.

 

[Tesla Monkor]

You're addressing the symptoms and not the fundamental problem of the system.

It was designed with people wanting 99s and MPs being accidental. This is mistake (underestimation?) Mythic made, and as you mentioned, results in an overabundance of 99s as side-effect, which are sold 'for cheap'.

The average price of 99s has dropped BELOW the price of crafting one on most servers in the US. (0.9x material cost). I know it is futile mentioning this, since it can't be averted for the European servers either.

My point still stands, though. All crafts save SC and ALCH are basically screwed, and ALCH will be when Housing arrives when people just drop shitloads of Tinctures on their CM.

SC will not change since it is 'custom fit' and cannot be put on a CM. I'm sure many will not agree, but SC is the only healthy craft left in 1.64.

 

[kameh]

The arguing seen here is precisely why I only SC for my friends and my guild. If you think that 1 hour of my time isn't worth 200-300gp then sod off and make it yourself. That's how much profit I'd expect when crafting after putting the effort into getting to LGM level.

I'm cheap, I know I am and you can thank all the wankers who demand 99/100% gems at near cost price for there being less and less SCers willing to help out these days. Don't like it? go take up the craft! I'm more than willing to pay other crafters for thier time without any hassle so I expect the same back

Edit: Tesla you're quite right, one thing that always puzzled me though was that there's more level 50s around = more cash. but people forcing crafters to charge less. Strange!

 

[Flesh]

Imo charge for any craft should be cost + 750g/1plat per hour ..
Crafters could easily spend the time they do crafting farming in DF.

 

[-Nxs-]

So.... are we any closer to an idea of what to charge for SC, or is it still make up a price you (the crafter) are happy to charge, and if people done like it tell them to find another SC'er or take up the stkill themselves.

 

[astarib]

the price veries a lot any standard lvl 51 99% 5 point over charge best price is about 300g so 10g per point would be valid.

for anyone who thinks thats a lot and a huge markup as had been said i will provide a single midguard example item that will cost on average 412g in materals

Two Handed:
Imbue Points: 20.5 of 15 (97% Qual) Overcharge: 20%
Gem 1: 28 Piety - 99% perfect Watery Essence Jewel
Gem 2: 50 Bonedancing Focus - 99% perfect Ashen Rune
Gem 3: 50 Suppression - 99% perfect Dust Rune
Gem 4: 50 Darkness Focus - 99% perfect Ice Rune
Utility: 21.6666660308838

thats a lvl 36 staff 97% i made it for my bd the last staff he'll eva need it cost me i am both the fletcher and the scer 1.1 plat in just materials it was a bad day for crafting

i admit a well designed full set u can make an easy 1p profit but its 2 hours thats about the same as the normal crafts are

 

[old.linnet]

Originally posted by Tesla Monkor


My point still stands, though. All crafts save SC and ALCH are basically screwed, and ALCH will be when Housing arrives when people just drop shitloads of Tinctures on their CM.

SC will not change since it is 'custom fit' and cannot be put on a CM. I'm sure many will not agree, but SC is the only healthy craft left in 1.64.

The main difference between the crafts is that SC is basically a service industry, the SCer needs to tailor it personally to each customer. The others are all simply a matter of production, one 99% leather jerkin is identical to another. Alchemy will be a LOT more accessible when the housing merchants come in, which is probably good for both alchemists and users (I imagine alchemists will start charging for adding a proc to a weapon or piece of armour when that happens, since that is the part that requires the personal contact.)


BUT it doesn't need to stay that way for SCing when housing is out. The housing consignment merchants will allow the manufacture of gems to be done separately from the imbuing, and will make that pretty easy to organise.

eg. if any SCer out there wants to play the market a bit, there is definitely scope for making some 99% versions of the most commonly asked for gems and sticking those on a merchant at some reasonable profit, and then encouraging customers (or other spellcrafters) to pick out their own gems and do the templates and prep work themselves. Now, crafters like Tesla might see that as ruining the market, but I bet there are a ton of other retired SCers who would be happy to come out of retirement and do some imbuing, again at a not excessive profit since it isn't that time consuming, if other people made the gems ... I know that with my little 500 SC alt, I'll be placing some 99% gems on the market to see how they sell.

 

[Tesla Monkor]

While the idea might sound like it'll work, it won't. (A similar thread has run on the IGN crafterboard and had a lot of interesting input on it.) (Crafter area is one of the few where the post vs. troll ratio is still acceptable.

Anyway.. there simply are too many 'commonly used' gems in SC to make the idea worthwhile. The CM has only a limited number of spots - 100, if I remember correctly.

They had a little calculation there, that came out to if you wanted to stock, say, 4 gems of the most common ones, you'd need almost 10 merchants to keep your stock on. (You can have only one merchant at any one time pet house.)

 

[Draylor]

Originally posted by Tesla Monkor
You must realise however, that ALL the other crafts, save SC and ALC, are ruined. There are too many people and there's an overabundance of available gear througgh power-levelling crafters, resulting in pathetically low prices. Two times material cost for a 99%Q item? That's insane. It should be 6 times cost, but everyone's been so spoiled by insane low prices that you can't sell it at that anymore.

Yup, thats why after having a 1100+ ACer and tailor I added a spellcrafter.

The first 2 to be useful, the spellcrafter for profit. Profit from AC or tailor these days is just too little gold for too much hassle

Housing is only going to make matters worse - nice for those buying though.

 

[Danya]

Originally posted by astarib
the price veries a lot any standard lvl 51 99% 5 point over charge best price is about 300g so 10g per point would be valid.

for anyone who thinks thats a lot and a huge markup as had been said i will provide a single midguard example item that will cost on average 412g in materals

Two Handed:
Imbue Points: 20.5 of 15 (97% Qual) Overcharge: 20%
Gem 1: 28 Piety - 99% perfect Watery Essence Jewel
Gem 2: 50 Bonedancing Focus - 99% perfect Ashen Rune
Gem 3: 50 Suppression - 99% perfect Dust Rune
Gem 4: 50 Darkness Focus - 99% perfect Ice Rune
Utility: 21.6666660308838

thats a lvl 36 staff 97% i made it for my bd the last staff he'll eva need it cost me i am both the fletcher and the scer 1.1 plat in just materials it was a bad day for crafting

i admit a well designed full set u can make an easy 1p profit but its 2 hours thats about the same as the normal crafts are

A piece with 4 perfect gems is not your typical item though. Focus staves are by far the most expensive piece to make, most other items cost a fraction of that.

 

[-Nxs-]

300% material cost seams to work - someone wanted some SC done for a BG alt today and didnt mind me asking for 10G infact he offered more.

 

[uma_thurman]

Originally posted by -Nxs-
300% material cost seams to work - someone wanted some SC done for a BG alt today and didnt mind me asking for 10G infact he offered more.

I charged someone 2g for a bit of BG SCing

 

[i-scream]

Originally posted by -Nxs-
So.... are we any closer to an idea of what to charge for SC, or is it still make up a price you (the crafter) are happy to charge, and if people done like it tell them to find another SC'er or take up the stkill themselves.

That's right Nxs, just pay the price you agree with a crafter (doesn't matter which craft) and if you don't like the price, find another one.
Anyway, you'll be happy to find a SC'er who is so kind to take an order. Good luck with it.

 

[-Nxs-]

Well i reached LGM with my alt this weekend. After playing around on the calculator and building a few o/c sets and being stung on one of them for charging not enough, ive come to the following tarrif.

No Overchare = meterials + 50%
Overcharge (any amount) = materials + 200%

Any further comments /sugestions ?

 

[i-scream]

Gratz on reaching LGM m8.

Happy crafting !

 

[the_smurflord]

I normally work it out as follows.
I start with exactly 2p in my wallet. I make the order, see what I've got left and work out the difference.
I then apply my "arsehole scale" to the price. Most people will get a 50% markup, but the bigger the arsehole the larger the markup. Have charged 4x the cost to some idiots just because they annoyed me.

Basic rule of thumb: There is no price you should be charging. Charge what you think you can get away with.

 

[-Nxs-]

Originally posted by the_smurflord
I then apply my "arsehole scale" to the price. Most people will get a 50% markup, but the bigger the arsehole the larger the markup. Have charged 4x the cost to some idiots just because they annoyed me.

Roflmao !!! Shame the SC Calc doesnt have an arsehole factor I know exactly what you mean tho, had a few customers that state what they need then... just as you have got the materials and are hitting the craft button they say "Ohh no wait, lets change the +10 str to +10 dex"

Or the people that expect a full 99% 5.5 o/c set to be completed within 30 mins

 

[svartmetall]

Originally posted by -Nxs-
... just as you have got the materials and are hitting the craft button they say "Ohh no wait, lets change the +10 str to +10 dex"

You might have a point there...I know I've faffed around at times when getting stuff SC'd in exactly that way. Telling prospective clients to know exactly what they want first would be a good plan.

 

[-Nxs-]

The only issue I have, is for an overcharge order, asking the customer for materials+200% can seem like alot of money, I think it works out about 2plat or more for a full set of armour.

But when you hit a problem whereby it takes over 50 attempts to make a high level gem, its the only way to be certain you will come out even or with a nice proffit.

Some people say charging 300G per item is about average, but I made a dual 50 focus staff for a guild member yesterday which cost over 300G in materials with all the remakes.

So... untill the majority of customers say "sod off your too expensive" i will stick with the following.

non o/c order = materials+50%
any o/c order, no matter how small = materials+200%

Most customers are willing to email over a template anyway for an o/c order which gets past the "ohh wait i changed my mind" factor.

 

[kr0n]

So far the price I've paid for SC, 2 full sets, 6 items including 3 weapons per character, 1.5p and 2p.
1.5p was from a guildie but doubt she would charge for more than that from anyone.
2p was only due the fact I fucked up with my SCC file and had to remake several gems and ditch the already made ones. And this was from a neverheard crafter, not 1k tho, he made gems and I imbued them with a higher SCer who made me only 1 gem the lower one couldn't make at all.

3p is a total ripoff. Shame on you!

 

[-Nxs-]

Originally posted by kr0n
3p is a total ripoff. Shame on you!

A full 99% Gem O/C on all 6 armour items and two weapon slots came to around 2p-2.5p Which I think is fair, the number of LGM SC'ers is growing so now doubt the prices will have to come down soon.

I dont see how people can only charge 1.5p for doing a full set and actualy make a proffit, its just not possible unless you are lucky and manage to make all the 99% gems within the 6 attempts it is suposed to take.

 

[lairiodd]

its just not possible unless you are lucky and manage to make all the 99% gems within the 6 attempts it is suposed to take.

Well, actually, thats one of the advantages of spellcrafting over other crafts, there is alot less varience. It's true that you can sometimes get nailed making a focus gem or something more than the 6 times, but remember if you were a mundane crafter ( esp weaponcrafter ), then that would be alot more painful. Its not uncommon for a MP weapon attempt ( i.e. what someone who needs the best wants ) to cost 3p+ more than average. ( due to excess attempts ). This is unheard of in spellcrafting, where the cost is unlikely to vary from average by more than 100-200g at worst for a 32 gem set at 99%. This is due to the large number of rolls which reduces the varience.

 

[old.Elfslayer]

I work on cost price +25% and 5g per oc point, this tends to work out at an average cost of about 1.2p per full suit (depending on my luck of course). What must be taken into account is the time crafting in the first place, I spent 13p to get lgm and I could far easier get cash from farming, so scing or crafting full stop should have some incentive to do it rather than just go out and farm cash to raise funds. saying that it does appear that some people take the complete piss when charging. A nice ballance is what is needed. Most of the time people are happy with my work and will tip, so obviously they dont consider 1.2p to be a bad price.

 

[Jessy]

Originally posted by lairiodd
Well, actually, thats one of the advantages of spellcrafting over other crafts, there is alot less varience. It's true that you can sometimes get nailed making a focus gem or something more than the 6 times, but remember if you were a mundane crafter ( esp weaponcrafter ), then that would be alot more painful. Its not uncommon for a MP weapon attempt ( i.e. what someone who needs the best wants ) to cost 3p+ more than average. ( due to excess attempts ). This is unheard of in spellcrafting, where the cost is unlikely to vary from average by more than 100-200g at worst for a 32 gem set at 99%. This is due to the large number of rolls which reduces the varience.

I kinda agree to an extent, but when crafting using a "classic" trade you only intend to make one item, with spellcrafting you need to make 4 99% gems per item so that 100-200G could easily approach 400-800G on a bad day. and its not like you can vault any MP/99 gems that are made while doing a normal imbue due to the amount of vauly space needed - unlike most "classic" trades

Obviously you know what you are on about being LGM in 2 trades but i still feel materials+200% for an overcharge order is justified and acceptable.

 

[Armalite]

Follow my sc page to check my prices. I'm not the most expensive around. Cheaper for guildys ofc, but those prices are not for this forum =). I currently charge more for mp pieces mainly cause they got more imbue points and generally uses higher lvl gems.

As for non-lvl 51 items, I don't do them no more. I used to charge lvl of item in gold & didn't do oc on them.

 

[-Nxs-]

One question.

In Lleana's SC calculator.... how is the EST total calculated ?

When making items for the guild, I set NO markups at all, and tell them the EST total, then proceed to make the gems and charge them how much money I have used to make the gems, effectivly a cost prince, but this price is ALWAYS more than the EST total when making 99% gems.

This is my reason for going mat+200% on overcharge items, as the EST figure often lies.

 

[Xeanor]

Like Layl said,

3p is a total ripoff.

I've paid 1.7p for 7 items, 37.5/32 imbue, which seems very fair.