Homebrew speaker cable

[TdC]

arr, so you mean it could sound better than it already does? I mean, even now there is a difference over the other cable! btw, I did cheat and use a candle, but rushing me buggered it up a couple of times and there were flames. and swearing oO

 

[Ch3tan]

The cable I used burns clean (without toxins), so catching fire could be a nice easy way of stripping Just blow it out when it's at the right length

 

[Tom]

@ Tom

Now, the biwire approach (in my hands) has the advantage of using separate wires for woofer and tweeter. This is nice because you are increasing the cross sectional area you are using (lowered resistance) - but more importantly, woofer and tweeters are each assigned separate amplifier channels. Each speaker has a back emf/voltage which is the amplifier has to deal with - by giving each cone/coil a channel - the channel has to deal with less back emf and hence is better capable of driving the speaker accurately, particularly at volume.

Bi-wiring a speaker with a single amplifier is exactly the same circuit as single wiring it. There is absolutely no difference whatsoever, exactly the same signal is reaching both drivers as they have a common source. You might consider the increased cross-section of the two wires running to the speaker, but it matters not how it is terminated.

The only advantage to be gained is from bi-amping, which is more expensive.

The resistance is negligible, since it only affects gain. Impedance is far more relevant.

 

[Tom]

Oh Tdc, get your missus to blindfold you (she should be used to requests like that), and ask her to randomly swap between cables.

Do it 10 times, noting the result each time, to see if you can tell the difference.

I'm betting you'll find it extremely difficult to reliably detect the difference. Much of the audiophile world relies on people's belief that they can accurately tell the difference between differing circuit designs. Of course beyond the most basic differences, its all a load of bollocks.

I have a turntable that originally cost over a grand, ditto amps, and speakers that were about £700 new. Things like that can make a big difference, since they all use different designs when compared to other manufacturers. Speaker cables or interconnects make practically no difference whatsoever - proven by not one person ever being able to reliably tell the difference in a double-blind test.

 

[Danya]

So it's no better than cheapo bell wire then?

 

[Tom]

Bell wire is solid core tin crap. Entirely unsuitable for audio applications.

I'm willing to bet that nobody could detect the difference between QED 79 strand at a quid per metre (or whatever it is now), and some expensive hardcore stuff at £1000 a pair, when blindfolded.

 

[old.user4556]

I have QED Quenex component video leads - a definite improvement over my old £10 Dixon jobbies.

I could tell the difference, blindfolded, between different video leads on my projector... oh, hang on a minute...

/thinks

 

[Tom]

Video cables are an entirely different kettle of fish (presuming you're being half serious). Audio signals down speaker cables and interconnects are not modulated, unlike video. Video signals require proper screening to reduce crosstalk.

Have a look at a typical testcard. The black and white vertical lines, in blocks? They demonstrate the ability of the receiving equipment to correctly separate the luma and chroma signals (chroma is on a sub-carrier). The better able the receiver, the less noise is seen (blue/purple interference) at low frequencies (ie the fat lines). Poor quality video cables have a similar effect, albeit in a different way.

 

[Ch3tan]

My god damn Qunex cable is faulty :/ At least AVLand are replacing it, but I got to pay the postage to them.

Ordered a component cable from the guy making them on AVForums, the build quality is amazing, and the picture is vertainly no worse than my Qunex when it was working, if not better.

Tom, I needed new speaker cable anyway as I moved my kit around. Making it out of cat5 was not only a fun little project, but cheaper than buying ready made speaker cable. Listening to CD's that I have played many a time before, I hear things I simply didnt before. This IMO is an improvement, double blind or not.

 

[Tom]

Not knocking what you're doing, it sounds like an interesting little project. Just don't believe everything your ears tell you, thats how audiophiles get started Your wallet would never be the same again.

 

[Danya]

Bell wire is solid core tin crap. Entirely unsuitable for audio applications.

I'm willing to bet that nobody could detect the difference between QED 79 strand at a quid per metre (or whatever it is now), and some expensive hardcore stuff at £1000 a pair, when blindfolded.

Well I don't mean literally bell wire, because it's generally too crappy for much of anything. I have some cheap stranded audio cable that I got for free when I bought my speakers - just asked at the shop and they threw in a spool of it. Seems to do the job.

 

[old.user4556]

Video cables are an entirely different kettle of fish (presuming you're being half serious).

How can i test video cables blindfolded? I was having a larf!

But seriously, the QED cables are the shiz.

 

[Chilly]

I was having awful problems with interference and crappy noise in my mum's studio, after much testing and nearly throwing the sound card on her PC away, we decided to check teh cables against my high spec ones inside and low and behond, all noise was gone and no interference. This didn't include the speaker cable, but the internconnects and adapter leads. Now we have really heavy duty cambridge audio cables for all interconnects and beefty adapters and get crystal clear audio.
It does make a difference, if you have the high end amp/speakers to hear it, and of course the high end ear to appreciate it.

 

[Tom]

Of course those problems were far more likely to be a symptom of poor earthing, which is poor cable design, not cheap cables.

 

[smurkin]

There is absolutely no difference whatsoever, exactly the same signal is reaching both drivers as they have a common source.

I'm not sure I concur - each of the four channels has its own independant rating - at least thats what the Linn specialist told me...ofc, he WAS trying to make a sale

 

[Tom]

Erm, correct me if I'm wrong, but stereo has 2 channels. Now, lets take just one of those channels.

That channel has a +ve and a -ve connector. So, when single wiring, you connect a twin core cable to those 2 connectors on the amp, and the same on the speaker. The crossover in the speaker filters out LF to the tweeter, and HF to the woofer.

Now, for biwiring, you get 2 twin core cables, and connect one end of both to the +ve and -ve connectors on the amp. You then remove the connecting bar from the back of the speaker. You then connect one set of cables to the tweeter, and the other to the woofer.

Fine you think, until you realise that they both share a common point - the amplifier terminals.

Hence, bi-wiring and single-wiring are exactly the same electrical circuit. Its even more obvious when you consider that when single-wiring, the bar on the speaker terminals is effectively creating the same circuit - its just that the common point is now on the speaker terminals, rather than the amp terminals. Its no different whatsoever.

Basically, its snakeoil.

 

[smurkin]

Fine you think, until you realise that they both share a common point - the amplifier terminals.

No, separate terminals/channels - four sets of +/- from the amp its possible to run four speakers on my amp or two in biwire (I really ought to research this more thoroughly)

ps...btw...I bought one of those remotes - not quite the same as yours, but bloody marvelous

 

[Ch3tan]

thats bi-amping, not bi-wiring.

 

[smurkin]

oh

 

[old.user4556]

Was waiting for the first person to confuse the two

 

[TdC]

Oh Tdc, get your missus to blindfold you (she should be used to requests like that), and ask her to randomly swap between cables.

Do it 10 times, noting the result each time, to see if you can tell the difference.

I'm betting you'll find it extremely difficult to reliably detect the difference. Much of the audiophile world relies on people's belief that they can accurately tell the difference between differing circuit designs. Of course beyond the most basic differences, its all a load of bollocks.

I have a turntable that originally cost over a grand, ditto amps, and speakers that were about £700 new. Things like that can make a big difference, since they all use different designs when compared to other manufacturers. Speaker cables or interconnects make practically no difference whatsoever - proven by not one person ever being able to reliably tell the difference in a double-blind test.

not that I've done the above, but I really think that the bass is crisper that said, I stated before that I do not have a stereo that is even remotely audiophile in any way shape or form. still, it was a fun way to while away some time with the risk of the speakers sounding brilliant/the same/worse at the end.

 

[Tom]

thats bi-amping, not bi-wiring.

I wouldn't be surprised if inside the amplifier the terminals were linked. Its a clever ploy, and very much cheaper than having 2 power amp circuits inside the box.

Open it up and have a look Smurkin, take a piccie

 

[smurkin]

You could be right...however, I'm not brave (or determined) enough to open it up (it lives sandwiched between my satty and DVD player). I tried to find out from the manufacturers web site, but to no avail - I did find a faq on biwiring (http://www.linn.co.uk/cust_supp/faq.cfm?CFID=2245192&CFTOKEN=58820118#14 ). I'd be surpised if Linn promotes snake oil being the company that it is - I prefer to go with the theory that biwiring is more of a fad than bogus.

 

[Tom]

heh, its laughable that they can claim that 'each driver has its own individual circuit path to the amplifier'. Its total utter bollocks of the highest order, and tbh is flagrant mis-information.

I've owned Linn stuff, and fair enough it is very good equipment, but Ivor Tienbrumfunklebottom or whatever he is called can be a bit of a pillock.