Have GOA made a public boo-boo?

[Aoami]

Originally posted by noaim
But still he fails to see why anyone should teach anyone else anything.

WTF are you talking about?

 

[hiban]

Originally posted by kaod
Let's not forget of course that the PvP server was only in English.

So could the French and Germans get by there out of necessity or due to the fact that most can understand the language in-game?

Actually, i got annoyed by all fench and german pms i got there... And (as i was kinda new to alb then) when i asked for something, even in the most basic and simple english, i got replied in german or french. I dont know how they made it on the server. Tho groups made out of germans/frenchies only, were often seen.

 

[kaod]

Originally posted by noaim
But still he fails to see why anyone should teach anyone else anything.

I know what you are getting at, it 's just that what he's saying is why should a French or German have to learn English, when most primary English speakers don't give a rats ass about learning anyone else language - especially when a French company is prvoviding the service in question.

On this I agree with him - GOA have the right to provide the languages they see fit.
What I don't agree with is that all subscribers should pay for translations, extensive testing of those translations, approx 3 months of waiting and skipped patches and for maintenance of everyone elses better servers - when GOA themselves seem to make a distinction that Excal at least - is owned by the English Subscribers.

 

[Jayce_DA]

I think there is an asumption here ...

There are subscription pages in French, German and English and the assumption is if you subscribe via the French area then your 'home' servers are the French ones and thus you are a 'French' player, German subs = German servers = German players. English subs = English servers = English players.

Thus if there is an issue with any 'French' servers the 'French' players get compensated.

I think this is a fair assumption.

 

[noaim]

Originally posted by kaod
especially when a French company is prvoviding the service in question.

Thats the problem. Let GOA host German and French servers if they want to, and let german and french people wait for translations and pay extra for em, but give the rights to host the english server to someone else, who actually care about the english players.

And this game is originally using english language, so I really dont see a reason why people should learn german and french.

 

[Aoami]

Originally posted by kaod
I know what you are getting at, it 's just that what he's saying is why should a French or German have to learn English, when most primary English speakers don't give a rats ass about learning anyone else language - especially when a French company is prvoviding the service in question.

On this I agree with him - GOA have the right to provide the languages they see fit.
What I don't agree with is that all subscribers should pay for translations, extensive testing of those translations, approx 3 months of waiting and skipped patches and for maintenance of everyone elses better servers - when GOA themselves seem to make a distinction that Excal at least - is owned by the English Subscribers.

Firstly, your first point, thanks for explaining it better than i can
Secondly, my first reply to this thread said that maybe GOA should sell the 2 English servers (excal + pryd) to the american server provider, and maybe turn Camlann into a French or German speaking server. This would avoid not only the translation issue, but also, possibly, the fact we now have to pay VAT on subs costs.

 

[Lorthania]

Originally posted by hiban

French/germans lack of english skills isnt really news. Its all been seen lots before. The fact that ppl wanna use their own language and preserve it isnt really a problem. But dont fucking travel across the globe and expect me to know it, when there is one language thats used by (almost) every modern civilization now.

This is a common misconception. English may seem to be a widely spread language, but in fact it is not. English may be most prevalent on TV or on the Internet, but this does not automatically lead to the assumption that 'almost everybody understands' it. Two major points here:
- There are far more people who understand Chinese than there are who understand English. The same goes for the languages of the Indian subcontinent
- There are far more people who do _not_ understand English than there are who do understand it.

On the same topic, you do not have to travel very far to find yourself stuck if English is the only language you know. Try going to Lisbon and asking someone for directions. Good luck getting home.


Lorth

 

[kaod]

Originally posted by hiban
*Looks at US DAoC population*

Remove prydwen, excal and all the US servers and count the days before this game is no more

You see what I'm getting at though?

The English service is tagged on purely as profit to supplement the French and German services, since they don't need to pay for translations or for any extensive testing. (I accept they still have to test to a degree, although they have a nice workaround by sometimes letting the subscribers do the testing )

PvP:

Originally posted by hiban
Actually, i got annoyed by all fench and german pms i got there... And (as i was kinda new to alb then) when i asked for something, even in the most basic and simple english, i got replied in german or french. I dont know how they made it on the server. Tho groups made out of germans/frenchies only, were often seen.

I was curious, the question wasn't really going to lead anywhere I really don't know the answer to my original question.

I couldn't be arsed with the pvp server for similar reasons -

Broadcast: <something in french>
Broadcast: THIS IS AN ENGLISH SERVER
Broadcast: <something in french>
Broadcast: <something in french>
Broadcast: <something in German>
Broadcast: FFS. Stop broadcasting in your dumbass language, speak English you /vngf.d#r
Broadcast: <something in french> <followed by lots of hehe type sniggering>
etc. etc.

And then more often than not (for the limited time I played there anyhow) , said English speaker getting his ass handed to him by an overwhelming group of Johnny Foreigners. (and not understanding the spoken taunting that comes at his corpse.)

 

[hiban]

Well... a shitload of "modern" ppl, living in bigger cities speak some english. China seems to get better and better at speaking english... as is the rest of the world.and with modern civilization i didnt mean chinese farmers or ppl who sleep on the street in india or someone making a campfire in a jungle somewhere in africa, as i doubt they play daoc very much? Also, many of the ppl that dont speak more than their own native language dont do it because they are poor. (said MANY, not all) So... are germans poor? are frenchies poor?

 

[kaod]

Originally posted by Hiban
But dont fucking travel across the globe and expect me to know it, when there is one language thats used by (almost) every modern civilization now. [/B]

Originally posted by Lorthania
This is a common misconception. English may seem to be a widely spread language, but in fact it is not. English may be most prevalent on TV or on the Internet, but this does not automatically lead to the assumption that 'almost everybody understands' it. Two major points here:
- There are far more people who understand Chinese than there are who understand English. The same goes for the languages of the Indian subcontinent

All that would prove is that more people speak Chinese(Mandarin ?) and Indian languages than English.
It doesn't disprove that English is a language that is used in (almost) every civilization now.

Originally posted by Lorthania
- There are far more people who do _not_ understand English than there are who do understand it.[/B]

And what percentage of these non-english speakers are you every likely to come into contact with, or will ever want an Indian / African games server?
Theres a whole load of poor as hell people out there hat may not speak a word of English - and that affects your percentages.

Originally posted by Lorthania
On the same topic, you do not have to travel very far to find yourself stuck if English is the only language you know. Try going to Lisbon and asking someone for directions. Good luck getting home.[/B]

If you come from Britain you proabaly don't want the luck. We'd want to stay.
(and talk really loudly at everyone so they understand you.)

 

[kaod]

Originally posted by hiban
Well... a shitload of "modern" ppl, living in bigger cities speak some english. China seems to get better and better at speaking english... as is the rest of the world.and with modern civilization i didnt mean chinese farmers or ppl who sleep on the street in india or someone making a campfire in a jungle somewhere in africa, as i doubt they play daoc very much? Also, many of the ppl that dont speak more than their own native language dont do it because they are poor. (said MANY, not all) So... are germans poor? are frenchies poor?

You beat me to it.

 

[hiban]

 

[Aoami]

Originally posted by kaod
If you come from Britain you proabaly don't want the luck. We'd want to stay.
(and talk really loudly at everyone so they understand you.)

Pfft, other than Culture, Heat, Sandy Beaches, drinks with little unbrellas in, etc etc what does Portugal have that we don't?

 

[kaod]

Originally posted by Aoami
Pfft, other than Culture, Heat, Sandy Beaches, drinks with little unbrellas in, etc etc what does Portugal have that we don't?

Irrigation? Oh, hold on that's the Romans.

 

[ning]

Why french, german, italian and spanish absolultly don't need to learn english like swedish for example ?
Simply because France, Germany, Italy and Spain are "great" countries (I mean population > 60 millions) and they can keep alive their languages (whereas swedish, finnish are dying ; in 75 years these languages will have disappeared).

Every videogames , movies, books, etc. are translated in these countries. For example, Everquest, Asheron Call 2, Planetside are translated in german and french. Matrix 2 was released the same day in US and in Germany and France but it was translated in these countries.

Want the patchs rightnow (and the bugs ) ? Ok , play on US servers (and pay the european VAT tax )

PS : sorry but in France, most people learn first german before english.

 

[JoxerTheMighty]

Noaim, it seems to me that you are mixing up game and rl again, mate. I dont think the developers chose skandinavian mythology, english history or irish tales to attract Skandinavians and English/Irish folks. I think the writers chose those realms because it suited their purposes. They all prolly sat around a table drinking some coffee and the most promising ideas were taken in the end.

Besides....do you really wanna know why there are german and french servers? Because the german and french gaming market is pretty strong. Look at the statistics....most german/french servers are crowded while the english ones still dont reach their maximum capacity during the best hours. GOA would probably have brought another english server up already, IF there was the market and they could be assured that it would pay off.
And the reason of french people playing on the french servers (and germans on the german servers) is simple: Because its there and because its more comfortable playing in your mother language. As I said before, the french and german market are pretty strong and the fact that those servers are also the most crowded ones in europe (although probably only the french and germans play there) means that GOA made a good financial business decision - releasing french and german servers.

Now you could oc say: patch up the english community sooner cause the patch is already available in that language. But do you know what that would mean? The mayority of french/german players who can speak english would move to the english servers. And the rest? Well, I think some of them would just take that pill and wait but most of the others would protest against that decision and maybe even leave the game cause of it.
I dont think that GOA is willing to take that chance...not if it means angering most of their european customers..and face it: the mayority of those customers are french/german people.

 

[ning]

Originally posted by JoxerTheMighty
Noaim, it seems to me that you are mixing up game and rl again, mate. I dont think the developers chose skandinavian mythology, english history or irish tales to attract Skandinavians and English/Irish folks. I think the writers chose those realms because it suited their purposes. They all prolly sat around a table drinking some coffee and the most promising ideas were taken in the end.

Besides....do you really wanna know why there are german and french servers? Because the german and french gaming market is pretty strong. Look at the statistics....most german/french servers are crowded while the english ones still dont reach their maximum capacity during the best hours. GOA would probably have brought another english server up already, IF there was the market and they could be assured that it would pay off.
And the reason of french people playing on the french servers (and germans on the german servers) is simple: Because its there and because its more comfortable playing in your mother language. As I said before, the french and german market are pretty strong and the fact that those servers are also the most crowded ones in europe (although probably only the french and germans play there) means that GOA made a good financial business decision - releasing french and german servers.

Now you could oc say: patch up the english community sooner cause the patch is already available in that language. But do you know what that would mean? The mayority of french/german players who can speak english would move to the english servers. And the rest? Well, I think some of them would just take that pill and wait but most of the others would protest against that decision and maybe even leave the game cause of it.
I dont think that GOA is willing to take that chance...not if it means angering most of their european customers..and face it: the mayority of those customers are french/german people.

Agree !
I want just add something : french and german are not only spoken in France and Germany.
French : France, Belgium, Switzerland, North Africa, Quebec (many players from Quebec on french servers)
German : Germany, Austria, Switzerland.

In fact it's a big market (about 200M people, half of the Europe)

 

[brommix]

There is a perfectly valid reason that English should and is the world language...not only from the reason it got spread out quite alot due to imperialism in the 17th century and 18th century ......first of all its the worlds most numerous language in terms of words, i believe its around 800.000 words in the english dictionary which far exceeds any other language...2ndly english consists of 3 different language tribes...it consists of celtic, latin and germanic therefore makes it more approachable to all the peoples who have languages within those barriers. Im well aware that this dosnt help Africa or Asia but at the time English became dominating the world was dominated by the western world, aka Europe and North America.

 

[old.FIN]

#1 spoken language in wolrd???

English


#1 most understandable language with what ever language= English


#1 what language u will learn if u have som ebrains on u=

English


---French, german, italian, russia, rest of asian monkey language???

who feck needs them when u have 1 language with that u can manage to get around all over in the world, and if peeps dont understand engliash as 1 sentence, then feck them, we dont need those.


just give euros t sweden, denmark, england, 3 fecking countr ywhere im travelling on my holiday and they dont have a clue whats EURO

 

[noaim]

Originally posted by JoxerTheMighty
Now you could oc say: patch up the english community sooner cause the patch is already available in that language. But do you know what that would mean? The mayority of french/german players who can speak english would move to the english servers. And the rest? Well, I think some of them would just take that pill and wait but most of the others would protest against that decision and maybe even leave the game cause of it.
I dont think that GOA is willing to take that chance...not if it means angering most of their european customers..and face it: the mayority of those customers are french/german people.

Wtf is there to protest about? That englishspeaking players dont have to wait to get already complete patches because of some people who cant be arsed to learn one of the most worldside languages?

But as I said, GOA shouldnt even have the right to host the english servers, give em to a company who cares about the englishspeaking players instead, and let GOA translate everything for those who dont wanna learn the english language, and let those people wait.

 

[hiban]

Originally posted by old.FIN
just give euros t sweden, denmark, england, 3 fecking countr ywhere im travelling on my holiday and they dont have a clue whats EURO

Hehe. get a clue yourself... We perfectly know what euro is mate. Its more like we dont want the crap. We have our own money, which we think works just perf. Wont go in deeper on this here, as this thread is not made for it.

Btw, u can pay with euro in most of the bigger shops around in sweden now.

 

[belth]

Euro's are cheaper, don't have to pay any stupid exchange fees Still, I want my FIM's back

 

[kaod]

Originally posted by JoxerTheMighty
Now you could oc say: patch up the english community sooner cause the patch is already available in that language. But do you know what that would mean? The mayority of french/german players who can speak english would move to the english servers.

Thus proving any argument that there's no need for seperate language servers. (It would at best balance out the servers, at worst drain the other language servers of most of the players, subs lost would be made up by not having to translate etc)
I wouldn't play on the French server if it was patched first, unless just to test things, as I don't understand French.

Originally posted by JoxerTheMighty
And the rest? Well, I think some of them would just take that pill and wait but most of the others would protest against that decision and maybe even leave the game cause of it.

Doubt it. They would threaten to and then just put up with it, the same way that the English subscribers have with their shoddy end of the deal.

Originally posted by JoxerTheMighty
I dont think that GOA is willing to take that chance...not if it means angering most of their european customers..and face it: the mayority of those customers are french/german people.

You're right on the money there and it sums up the whole argument really.

 

[ning]

Originally posted by hiban
Hehe. get a clue yourself... We perfectly know what euro is mate. Its more like we dont want the crap. We have our own money, which we think works just perf. Wont go in deeper on this here, as this thread is not made for it.

Btw, u can pay with euro in most of the bigger shops around in sweden now.

Did you know that Swedish money is strongly linked to the Euro money ? (it's not like english money that is not linked with euro).
If euro go up, swedish money go up, if euro fall, swedish money fall.

PS : I'm european, Euro is my OWN money.

 

[hiban]

Originally posted by ning
Did you know that Sweden money is strongly linked to the Euro money ? (it's not like english money that is not linked with euro).
If euro go up, sweden money go up, if euro fall, sweden money fall.

As i posted above, i wont go deeper in on economy, but swedish money goes up and down more depending on US dollars than on Euro. And i dont give a fuck what kind of money ppl use in Poland, if its Zlotty (spelling?) or euro, exchanging isnt that hard.

Wont reply more about this in here. If u wanna disuss money, start a new thread.

 

[Lorthania]

Originally posted by kaod
All that would prove is that more people speak Chinese(Mandarin ?) and Indian languages than English.
It doesn't disprove that English is a language that is used in (almost) every civilization now.


I didn't really try to prove anything, I was merely pointing out that saying that 'everybody living in today's modern world should know English' is not as plausible as it may seem.

I work for an IT company and I meet French and German ppl every day, most of them highly skilled tech people. And still, some of these people do not speak English. And why should they? They manage very well without it and no-one can oblige them to learn it. Not knowing English does not give you any less rights than someone who does, nor does knowing English give you any more.

BTW I have no idea anymore what this thread was about and it's Sunday afternoon, so I can't be bothered to find out

Lorth

 

[Gamah]

What a pile of shit...you got a free day whoop..why does everyone have to make a mountin out of a mole hill...english players got a free day french/germans did not...who gives a fuck..i mean really..all the "political correctness" fucks me off

/rant

 

[Marwolaeth]

A quote from Joxerthemighty about german spelling of English

Sure, maybe the spelling is incorrect

Erm, *holds up hand* I'm english and have you actually ever seen MY spelling?

 

[Sohan_THC]

Well as english speaking player you pay more that is a fact , simple:
2 servers / month fee = more then 4 french,german / month fee.

If there was a dutch server im sure all of belgium and netherlands would play on it , so the base amount of ppl would be much higher. same if you make a swedish server. much more swedish ppl would be online and i think they also need 3 servers then.

Second point we get screwed over in the whole europe is the events. They say in the start up screen , even on the package that you can enjoy and paticipate in events that happen on the server.
Well im online for about 1,5 year and i can count the events on 1 hand and hmmm it happend in the beginning of the game.

Last reall annoying thing is that the stats does not work for long !
WAY TO LONG. bull that they cannot the xml going but they do not have real programmers on the payroll or don't get the prio they should give.
Tons of ppl love the stats that is what is all about , Ranking leveling RR level etc. you can see that on site's like duskwave who are enormous populair for the stats.

So basicly keep the maingame going.
screw events , server specific bugs , and obove all just name some date's about update's on hard or software and add atleast 2 week or 2 months to it without telling cause we do not mind what users are thinking in. <psst pretent you can not read english put office residence in france, which all of europe hate's already and were stike's are as normal as wine and cammanbert >


Still we keep playing cause nothing else compare's atm
and whee got a free 40cents/1day from a french toko and YES im buying drugs for it

 

[old.Glendower]

Originally posted by ReaLX
If it weren't for the "froggies", there was no DAoC to play in europe you moron...

Dont be an idiot.

GOA got the franchise because they offered to pay the most, and probably some to do with the interconnection of serveral companies relating to this business and its infrastructure.

If they didn't take it, another company would have.