News Greece - Time to cut them off?

[Gwadien]

Yup, the dream died today and though it will trundle along for a good bit, it's true intentions have been laid out and we have good old basketcase Greece to thank for that.

I don't know, I think the German handling of the whole situation has totally put a nail in the coffin.

The way that they've dictated the talks and the way they have treated France and all the other European nations as been lesser partners has been quite obvious and backed the lesser Eurosceptic view of the German domination of Europe so we should be in Europe but whilst keeping at an arms length.

Personally, I feel the Germans should have just scrapped it and started again, in reality the currency won't really work unless the fiscal and monetary policies are both standardised and centralised across Europe so they should have offered the currency again with those terms to all nations, and ensure that all nations enter with a referendum.

I can't help but Greece is going to be setup to fail again. Their economic culture will always outshine stuff forced upon them.

 

[Job]

Well actually I meant the Greeks made the Germans show their true intentions, but yes, this will repeat exactly in a months time.

 

[Scouse]

power to the masses, eh Scouse?

Exactly the opposite - agendas set by a rich cunt in his own interests adopted by a poorly-educated population...

 

[Job]

Now the Guardian wants out of the EU, that's the end of that then.

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/jul/14/left-reject-eu-greece-eurosceptic

Edit...holy crap the IMF have just stepped in , telling the EU to write off the debt for 30 years.
-This'll be fun.

 

[Ormorof]

Send in Tom Cruise he works for the IMF

 

[Ctuchik]

It does look increasingly like the Greeks are being actively punished rather than this being an actual attempt to fix the problem. They couldn't pay back the last two bailouts so there's jack all chance they'll be able to pay back this one given their economy is still shrinking. And literally taking €50bn of assets as "collateral", manages to simultaneously remind everyone of the last time Germany went around Europe carrying off cartloads of stuff, and that loansharking works for entire countries as well as chavs on council estates.

Then maybe the Greek government could start sorting their shit out already? How about they start with a law saying "no, rebar sticking out of the roof of a house does not mean it's incomplete and tax-exempt when it's been lived in for years and years.."? Because that's apparently still a thing.....

After that they can continue with the stupid amount of people that still refuse to pay their income tax....

Greece needs to realize that they will have to sacrifice a LOT to get back up on their feet.

 

[DaGaffer]

Then maybe the Greek government could start sorting their shit out already? How about they start with a law saying "no, rebar sticking out of the roof of a house does not mean it's incomplete and tax-exempt when it's been lived in for years and years.."? Because that's apparently still a thing.....

After that they can continue with the stupid amount of people that still refuse to pay their income tax....

Greece needs to realize that they will have to sacrifice a LOT to get back up on their feet.

Don't get me wrong, I'm no apologist for Greek corruption, but at this stage its slightly missing the point; an additional bailout and dropping off 50bn of assets at the pawn shop probably won't a. fix any of the fundamental problems with Greece's ability to pay back the debt, because even if they fixed all the corruption and tax issues tomorrow, their economy has shrunk too much to grow the tax base enough to do the job anyway, and b. continues to leave the Eurozone exposed to Greek contagion. All the Germans have done is kick the problem down the road, again, whilst giving Greece a metaphorical wedgie and a Chinese burn.

I'm pretty convinced that Tsipras was strongarmed into accepting the terms of the bailout by the Germans threatening economic sanctions and all kinds of other shit if Greece left the Euro. Its the only way his climb down makes any sense, that the threatened alternative was worse.

 

[Gwadien]

Then maybe the Greek government could start sorting their shit out already? How about they start with a law saying "no, rebar sticking out of the roof of a house does not mean it's incomplete and tax-exempt when it's been lived in for years and years.."? Because that's apparently still a thing.....

After that they can continue with the stupid amount of people that still refuse to pay their income tax....

Greece needs to realize that they will have to sacrifice a LOT to get back up on their feet.

Yes. They do, they need to sacrifice a lot in order to get into the same mindset as the Germans.

Hence why it would make more sense for the Germans to say look you leave, or we control your taxes and stuff, we won't tell you what to do but we'll do it for you.

Issue is, its too in your face especially with recent history, the Germans have to assert their authority across Europe its deeply ingrained in their culture, it always has been, it was the key factor in Bismarck's work, he was amazing at unification, but there's a reason for it.

 

[Ormorof]

What a load of bollox, the simple reason germany are happy to keep things shit is because it benefits them hugely, the PR has gone in their favor until now with the "lazy greeks" angle, but a weak euro = booming german exports

WW2 was 70 years ago get over it

The Greek government was running a surplus (before debt payments) until recently (which is why they did a u turn and accepted bailout terms) - tbh they should just have bailed out their own banks then told german and frenchies to fuck off, if german government want to bail out their own banks they are welcome to do so without pushing an entire country into ruin

Yes the greek economy is structurally flawed but if a private business makes a bad investment over the free market then why should the entire EU be used to keep their profits high?

 

[fettoken]

Can't we have a similarly made thread set up. Such as: "Time to cut Toht/Raven off", and we discuss the reprecussions, pros and cons of this action.

 

[Job]

Greek stock market in shock destruction on first day of trading...now lenders budget surplus entering a fantasy land.
I'm pretty sure everyone knew that was going to happen, but the desire to keep smiling and pretend is epic in it's resillience.

 

[Job]

50bn garage sale of Greece...everything to go..railways, ports, airports, tourist attractions, telephone/power/gas companies, land and rights to tax tourist sites.
Jesus fuk...they have raped Greece to pay back incompetent bwankers.
It's a travesty.

 

[Wij]

50bn garage sale of Greece...everything to go..railways, ports, airports, tourist attractions, telephone/power/gas companies, land and rights to tax tourist sites.
Jesus fuk...they have raped Greece to pay back incompetent bwankers.
It's a travesty.

That's not quite true. Buying Greek debt was one of the cleverest things banks and other institutions did. Because their economy was a bit iffy Greek bonds commanded a higher return to reflect the greater perception of risk. However, they knew that because Greece was part of the Euro Greece would never be allowed to default on its institutional debts. Germany and the ECB simply would not allow it.

Therefore those who invested in the bonds got the high return without any actual risk. What's incompetent about that?