Friars not getting AoM, IP or Det???

[Lejemorder]

Yes, Scouts will be raping multiple Heroes when we get 1.69 too :|

 

[Jaff]

all this argueing with someone that seemingly is never wrong, whats the point?
and a typo is hardly a reason to knock someone, just shows that you really are scrapping that barrel for comebacks.

 

[Sigurd]

oh forgive me for making 1 typo during my entire post :touch:

If you've had enough of people like us, does that mean you wont be posting on FH again? I sure hope so :kissit:

Think you'll find I've been around a lot longer than you, so how about you take a little trip out of the door?

Anyway, Albs QQing worked again, Friars now have access to Det, IP etc... happy?

 

[Jpeg[LOD]]

BDs can be countered a lot easier than Necros... and fully buffed Necro pets are just nasty. Body sorcs > chanters, sorry. Wardens got NERFED, and even before that they did less damage than Paladins... Scouts may have less "toys" but they do the most damage of any archer with a bow... just like Warriors do the most damage of any tank in melee, but don't have anything interesting. Bards have no damage output really, Minstrels can get normal groups and stealth groups, as well as solo better than any other class in the game in RvR.

so you think 1v1 a bd is easier to kill than a necro ? lol get real ..

body sorcs suck "imo" cos there mezz skill not high enough. and all chanter has to do is /qc stun = DEAD sorc wihtout doubt.

so 1st u compare wardens to friars. now u comparing them to paladins? lol get real dont chop n chance class comparisons to suit your defense.

rangers + hunters > scout .... hunters and rangers tottally wtf pwn scouts when it comes to melee.... which negates the small (yes i think SMALL) dmge differnce to the scouts longbow. which dont forget is a slower draw time . so i wouldnt be suprised if a ranger/scout can outdmge a scout with a bow OVER TIME! also hunters+rangers can (if they choose) to ignore 1 spec line which many consider usefull and have themselves a bot. and cos mythic gave them the points to be able to spec into those lines (buff lines) then they can use them points in more dmge dealing spec lines (bow/melee) .


bards dont need dmge output they are a group class.. and find rvr grps VERY easy.. and even then a well played bard can beat melee classes 1v1 .. just involves a lot of kiting and dd'ing with his own insta this and that his dd's occasional melee hit . they are good chars

and yes mincers can solo and grp . but IMO they are uber in neither . they are great solo and great grp class,, only reason they get whined about is cos of sos. and they just people whome are frustrated meeting a mincer 1v1 and then nearly beating him for him to sos away to safety (similer with sklds mezzing n running when they about to lose)


but there again the above are MY opinions as im sure everybody may have a different opinion.. but to say alb has the best classes imo is just plain stupidity

 

[Bone_Idle]

Maybe you Friars should think like this:-

Ive got a while until frontiers comes along. Why dont i roll a future fotm Pala or Reaver that WILL have det.

Think ahead. Maybe you could wtfPL a future fotm now.

 

[Jpeg[LOD]]

Maybe you Friars should think like this:-

Ive got a while until frontiers comes along. Why dont i roll a future fotm Pala or Reaver that WILL have det.

Think ahead. Maybe you could wtfPL a future fotm now.

i wouldnt be suprised if friars become a future fotm anyways

buff shearing dont effect us (BIG plus goin by some of the stuff i have read)
we finnally get det (and can spec high purge on short timer)
dmge dealer
back up heals/rezz's/cures
can spec battlemaster or perfector (prolly the two best ml paths)
nice free rr5 ra
base buffs/high resist buffs

and i dont want to roll a class just to fit into future patches , i love playing my friar and he will no doubt be my main till its time to hang up his staff n go play another game


but ofc if read the latter posts in this thread u will of seen friars are now getting det

 

[Glacier]

Arent we some angry little fellas .

This is damn amusing, keep up the trashtalking and bitching :touch: :worthy:

 

[Yeppy Kinkster]

About to read drunken friar for info.

Yay for det I suppose..but then I'm a PvP Friar from Camlann and I solo 90% of the time. Are Mythic still thinking about taking dodger away? as it will completly gimp me as a pvp Friar, I love my Friar and can't really see me playing another PvP tank class. So i'm willing to pay (in shiny stones ) any hacker out there to break into Mythics computer steal all Frontiers files..which should delay them till WoW is released.

 

[Nausilus^^]

Jpeg:
I find it kinda funny that you try to compare the ranger "buffline" you call it? with the hunter "buffline". First of all you mention that they are a huge advantage compared to scouts due to selfbuffs and speedshout. Get real... rangers only spec in PATHFINDING (yes thats the actual name of the "buffline") to get speed shout, unless they don't have a buffbot and really need the shitty AF, str and dex/qui buff they get. Hunters spec in BEASTCRAFT (hunter "buffline") first and foremost to get their pet. Mostly up to 32 to get highest pet, and while speccing to 32 they also get a quite nice speedshout.

In a later post though, you mention that rangers and hunters can chose to ignore that specline to spec in more useful stuff like bow and melee... well, by doing that don't they eliminate their "huge" advantage to scouts? Yes, scouts do lousy melee damage, but try to find a scout that jumps people in melee distance. You have to look long and hard after a scout that doesn't roam near their own pk and TS around it, then go to max distance and own from there. Should they get into melee they just slam, and depending on their luck they either shoot or run off. Often have I met a scout that runs off after I shoot them 1 time, just to stealth and TS.

Anyway scouts aren't really as bad as you want to make it look like. The better damage and range DOES in fact make a big difference compared to hunters and rangers, where hunters are weakest in that matter. Rangers do get dual wield, which provides them with better damage output, where hunters only have the choice of a 2h weapon in melee, which again leads to worse chances against scouts as they can block.

My advice to you is to think through what you post before you try to justify your whine

As for you Lejemorder, get a dictionary and learn how to spell, go outside and piss in a pool or something more usefull than whine just to whine. Obviously you didn't have any other purpose with this thread than to whine over your classes... you just make no sense at all, but what is to be expected from an alb anyway :kissit:

 

[Lejemorder]

As for you Lejemorder, get a dictionary and learn how to spell, go outside and piss in a pool or something more usefull than whine just to whine. Obviously you didn't have any other purpose with this thread than to whine over your classes... you just make no sense at all, but what is to be expected from an alb anyway :kissit:

what if i dont care if i spell correct??, im danish and didnt bother really to learn english b4 i started on daoc, and just coz im not upper to english dont make my post lesser worth
second try not to be that prejudice, about ppl just coz they play another realm.
Friars is a broken class atm and most ppl agree on that, but some ppl (like sigurd) didnt agreed on that it would be a big lose if friars lost IP or didnt got det (as only hybrid fighter, even u little ranger, there have nothing to use it with, except when mezzed or stunned by minstrel).
ohh btw u should learn to spell too friars r only one class, not several classes .

 

[Nausilus^^]

Ok ok spelling aside (oh and btw you did mention other classes than friars... mincers and reavers no?)

Friars got nerfed for a few days, and hell breaks lose.. Try to think about all the other nerfs that hit hibernia and midgard... and I'm sure albion has had a tiny share of nerfs too. This is mythic's way of creating a game... first they make people like their class, and then they hit them with nerfs until they bite the dust.. except in some cases like this obviously, where they change it back again. Un-nerfed -> nerfed -> un-nerfed.

Besides I don't know what you were whining about in the first place. If you read the RA rewamp notes, you'll notice the big-ass nerf in determination itself. It'll cost 1-3-6-10-14 and give 1%-3%-6%-10%-14%, which, when you add it up gives 34% and costs 34 points, where before it would cost a tank class 22 points for 75%. If you happen to be a hero, armsman, zerker, bm, merc or savage you get the innate 25% with the passive ability Stoicism. If you are then a rr4L4 of that class and chose the full spec of determination you will then have 59% which is still shitloads less than before. I imagine very few will be speccing a lot in determination after this revamp. On to IP. IP will now cost 5-10 and 15 points per level. Level 1 gives 20% hp in combat, lvl 2 50% hp in combat and lvl 3 80% hp in combat. That means that you need to be rr4 to get the best IP there is, and even that is a taint version of the old IP. It's on a 10min reuse timer though, but still. If we say that you would want both IP and determination you'd have to be rr7L4. How many do you think will spend that many points in IP and determination? About my ranger getting it, what makes you think that that makes me happy? I would never spend points in det as a ranger.. I want those points spent in other more stealther-useful things. I may get mezzed/stunned by a mincer, but in that situation I'd use purge.

Basically, what I'm talking about is that this whine thread of yours is pretty much useless... unless of course you are rr7L4+ and want to spend your points in defense RA's only. Remember at rr7L4 if you chose IP and determination, you still need 30 more points to get the best purge.

Are you absolutely sure, you'll want to spend that many points in 2-3 RA's?

 

[Lejemorder]

naus: i didnt whined over mincer or reavers (why should i whine over reavers got det and ip??).
and yes IF i stilled played my friars i would have taken 3 lvls in det + maybe 2 lvls in ip, i think the 2 lvls in IP can safe u if u r solo and 3 lvls in det make u dont stand for full duration of a root (mezz is no problem with a good sorc/mincer).
If u ever tried to play a hybrid in RvR u would know how annoying it to stand rooted for full duration.

 

[Nausilus^^]

edit: i also find it wired that arc...ne?!?!?!"... I mean c'mon... sheesh :kissit:

 

[Lejemorder]

Here you whine about mincers... in your very first post.


Oh yes, you told me that friars are only 1 class so I should learn how to spell, but tell me then... is this a spelling mistake or do you actually have more than 1 friar?

So bascially you want 10% determination for 10 points instead of maybe spending 30 points in purge and then have that every 5 mins?

Skalds wont get determination in frontiers, why is that then? Skald is as much a hybrid class as any other hybrid, so why allow friars to get determination, but not skalds?

Did you even think through all the aspects of your whine before posting? It's like saying "mommy mommy ben got a toy car why can't I have one?!?!?!"... I mean c'mon... sheesh :kissit:

1: i heardly call that comment a whine.
2: u started about me not spelling perfect
3: this tread is bout FRIARS, not skalds, ofc skalds deserve it too, but it r like saying savage r overpowered and mid counter with but mincer r overpowered in stealthwars, this 2 things have nothing to do with each other.
and no i dont want all what all other classes get, just some of it.
I dont want stocisme(sp?) coz light tank or pure tank "sacrifice" utility like dds, instant interrupt, healing etc. as some hybrids get.
I dont want friars to be a upper killing machine as they get some other nice thing to play with (or not), but i think then NF comes friars will be very good overall:
buff shearing dont affect em, red resist, okay dmg out put but not insane, ghetto ress, if perfector grp cure disease (dont think clerics got time to cast it) and last det+purge3
and yes i will still take det3 for the battles where purge is down or there last over 1 min so purge allready r used.

 

[Nausilus^^]

I'm just kidding here.. too much spare time makes one ponder too much

Don't think it's fair to leave any classes out where other classes of the same "type" gets the same thing, but still I think mythic should do what they could to keep the game balanced. Some may argue that friars don't need determination because of their other strengths and some may argue the other way around. It's the same way with skalds.. this could've been about skalds just as it is about friars.

The discussion wether friars should get det or not could go on for ages with good arguements from both sides. Sigurd mentions (I think, please don't quote me for it) that maybe mythic finally realized that all alb classes shouldn't get all RA's... but imo they shouldn't hit down on 1 class in particular, but work something out where everyone gets nerfed or raised to about the same level so we can have some more balance in the game. But it's not up to us anyway obviously..

Thanks for the discussion Leje... hope you didn't get too mad with me ;P

:worthy:

 

[Lejemorder]

I'm just kidding here.. too much spare time makes one ponder too much

Don't think it's fair to leave any classes out where other classes of the same "type" gets the same thing, but still I think mythic should do what they could to keep the game balanced. Some may argue that friars don't need determination because of their other strengths and some may argue the other way around. It's the same way with skalds.. this could've been about skalds just as it is about friars.

The discussion wether friars should get det or not could go on for ages with good arguements from both sides. Sigurd mentions (I think, please don't quote me for it) that maybe mythic finally realized that all alb classes shouldn't get all RA's... but imo they shouldn't hit down on 1 class in particular, but work something out where everyone gets nerfed or raised to about the same level so we can have some more balance in the game. But it's not up to us anyway obviously..

Thanks for the discussion Leje... hope you didn't get too mad with me ;P

:worthy:

its hard to get mad on some with good point i tried to discusse with sigurd most of the tread and i think only 1 time i got a bit mad on him

 

[Jpeg[LOD]]

Jpeg:
I find it kinda funny that you try to compare the ranger "buffline" you call it? with the hunter "buffline". First of all you mention that they are a huge advantage compared to scouts due to selfbuffs and speedshout. Get real... rangers only spec in PATHFINDING (yes thats the actual name of the "buffline") to get speed shout, unless they don't have a buffbot and really need the shitty AF, str and dex/qui buff they get. Hunters spec in BEASTCRAFT (hunter "buffline") first and foremost to get their pet. Mostly up to 32 to get highest pet, and while speccing to 32 they also get a quite nice speedshout.

In a later post though, you mention that rangers and hunters can chose to ignore that specline to spec in more useful stuff like bow and melee... well, by doing that don't they eliminate their "huge" advantage to scouts? Yes, scouts do lousy melee damage, but try to find a scout that jumps people in melee distance. You have to look long and hard after a scout that doesn't roam near their own pk and TS around it, then go to max distance and own from there. Should they get into melee they just slam, and depending on their luck they either shoot or run off. Often have I met a scout that runs off after I shoot them 1 time, just to stealth and TS.

Anyway scouts aren't really as bad as you want to make it look like. The better damage and range DOES in fact make a big difference compared to hunters and rangers, where hunters are weakest in that matter. Rangers do get dual wield, which provides them with better damage output, where hunters only have the choice of a 2h weapon in melee, which again leads to worse chances against scouts as they can block.

My advice to you is to think through what you post before you try to justify your whine

As for you Lejemorder, get a dictionary and learn how to spell, go outside and piss in a pool or something more usefull than whine just to whine. Obviously you didn't have any other purpose with this thread than to whine over your classes... you just make no sense at all, but what is to be expected from an alb anyway :kissit:

the point i was making was scouts very rarely get a chance to use MAX range . if somebody is stupid enoug to stand still long enough for a scout to back off n get max range he deserves to die... IMO ranger/hunter dmge over time (considering they use faster bows) isnt much difference than that of a scout...

and to beastcraft and pathfinding . my point there was mything gave them enough pnts to spend in those lines if they wish. but many dont cos they have a buffbot and can do without it. hence giving them more melee dmge by far. ussually if a scout see's a ranger/hunter destealthed n shoots. that hunter/ranger deserves to do.. but id guess if a ranger/hunter met a scout in stealth and fight started as melee scout would lose . stealthers like hunter/ranger depend on speed buff to escape enemys when they have been de-stealthed ,, its not much of an offensive spell but it sure as hell makes life easier for them to escape than a scout has.. cos he aint go no speed escape at all .

as said above tho i aint bothered about stealth classes cos they are all good at something ... where as my main class (the friar) has been unable to get into grps.. and due to the insane amount of buffbots around these days its still hard to solo......
and with mythic at1st giving us DET and then taking it away + taking away i.p and aom . after already taking away dodger was a kick in the bolox.... yes its been sorted now due to late change..... and i will be speccing high det + high purge so i WIL finnally be able to get a decent rvr grp. instead of spending another 6+months sat at atk waiting for a decent rvr grp,

 

[Nausilus^^]

It's very rare that a ranger or hunter gets to shoot at max range also... it all depends on waiting for the right moment. There are so many aspects of this subject that it's hard to comprehend all the things I want to write down.
First of all:
Rogue - Scout DEX ,QUI ,STR | Skill x2.0
Stalker - Ranger DEX ,QUI ,STR | Skill x2.0
Rogue - Hunter DEX ,QUI ,STR | Skill x2.0

All 3 archer classes gets an equal amount of points to spend in their skills. Scouts get to chose from 2 weapon types, stealth, bow and shield. Rangers get 2 weapon types, stealth, bow, pathfinding and celtic dual. Hunters get 2 weapon types, stealth, bow and beastcraft. From this I hope you can see that rangers have more things to chose from than the 2 other archer classes. 1 weapon type (melee) is of course essential. Same is stealth and bow. Celtic dual increases their chance of hitting with their offhand weapon, and increasing damage afaik, so this is also a very useful skill. The last one they have is pathfinding, which is very useless when looking at buffs due to the big amount of buffbots. They do get speedshout as you know, which can be used both for getting away, but also for chasing opponents. Hunters get to chose from spear or sword. Many chose spear to get the lvl 39 back position stun style, again stealth and bow is essential, but here they also have the dilemma of beastcraft. In order to get their pets, which can be a lifesaver, bait, interrupt pet etc etc they need to spec in beastcraft. To get the best type of pet they need 32 in that particular skill. That means they have to try to balance their skills between all 4 essential skills. Good thing about beastcraft for hunters is that if they chose 32 beastcraft they also get the lvl 3 speedshout. A scout innately gets long bow range and higher bow damage than the other 2 archer classes, hence you can't compare that with the beastcraft and pathfinding specline. You can compare those 2 speclines with scouts being able to spec in shield, which as I understand, you don't have any problem with. It's true scouts really suck in melee, but if they get a good slam and the opponent has purge down or low determination, they draw an arrow and shoots for high damage.
If a hunter choses to discard the beastcraft specline, yes he can spec either more in bow or melee, or some in both, but he will also lose a dmg source of another kind... the kind you can interrupt other players with while shooting or hitting another person. After all a good hunters avatar can hit for a good 100+dmg, which isn't that bad for a pet, and is greatly needed for the hunter which in fact is the weakest (unless very well played) of all 3 archer classes.
You must agree that scouts gets a few advantages over rangers and hunters: block, slam, long range (yes many times scouts wont jump anything unless they are in max range), higher bow damage (as you mention longer time to draw bow=higher damage, in fact Albion has access to the slowest bows in game afaik)

Basically rangers will most likely spec at least 9 in pathfinding and many people will even go to 16 for 2nd speed shout, hunters will in most cases spec at least something if not most of the cases 32 for the hunter pet. And to draw a line to scouts, they spec in shield to be able to slam. Hunters have 4 (3 if the player choses to discard beastcraft) important skills, rangers have 5 (4 if the player choses to discard pathfinding) important skills and scouts have 4 (3 if the player choses to discard shield), but which scout would ever not spec in shield?

You say yourself that stealthers are all good at something.. at least there you are right, but then it's just dead silly that you want scouts to get better as they have exactly the same amount of spec points as the others and they have the exact amount of important skills to spec in. It all depends on which level the player himself thinks is important, and that's really not up to you to judge. They all have their advantages, and they all have their disadvantages.

Abou friars I really said what I wanted to say in the posts directed at Lejemorder, but 1 thing I find really really stupid is that you sit and wait for 6+months at atk waiting for groups (yes ofcourse you maybe got groups once in a while, but nothing worth mentioning), where you could've gone out solo'ing, maybe gotten 1 or maybe a few solo kills which is at least 900 (maybe times 2+) realm points. In a group you would've gotten 200 times 2+ for the same amount of kills... maybe you would've survived a little longer, but trust me - 900 realm points feels a heck of a lot better than getting 200 realm points.

It's all a matter of play style and wether or not you are willing to accept that noone likes to group with friars.. show what they can do instead of whining about what they can't do.

 

[Gengi]

What do Champs get ?

Later

 

[Jpeg[LOD]]

You say yourself that stealthers are all good at something.. at least there you are right, but then it's just dead silly that you want scouts to get better

Abou friars I really said what I wanted to say in the posts directed at Lejemorder, but 1 thing I find really really stupid is that you sit and wait for 6+months at atk waiting for groups (yes ofcourse you maybe got groups once in a while, but nothing worth mentioning), where you could've gone out solo'ing, maybe gotten 1 or maybe a few solo kills which is at least 900 (maybe times 2+) realm points. In a group you would've gotten 200 times 2+ for the same amount of kills... maybe you would've survived a little longer, but trust me - 900 realm points feels a heck of a lot better than getting 200 realm points.

It's all a matter of play style and wether or not you are willing to accept that noone likes to group with friars.. show what they can do instead of whining about what they can't do.

i didnt say scouts needed boosting all i said was that
hunter/ranger >>>> scout. ... so dont try enhance what i said into a whine or call to say they are gimped.

as for friar when i said i sit atk for 6months lfg.. that was a figure of speeech . i do solo REGULER (80% of my rp's id say i got solo)
i havent stopped playing my friar as main since i started lvling him.. and i wil always play my friar as main .... even when my theurg becameFOTM i stayed playing my friar ... so again your comments are wrong again

 

[Nausilus^^]

Really no point argueing with you as you obviously don't understand what I'm writing to you. If you don't see my point, your really beyond my ability to discuss with.

 

[Jpeg[LOD]]

Really no point argueing with you as you obviously don't understand what I'm writing to you. If you don't see my point, your really beyond my ability to discuss with.

i do see your point , maybe u dont see mine? and i aint arguing im expressing my opnion and your expressing yours

 

[Awarkle]

animist pve vs necro pve.


Hmmm interesting comparison i would say they are both equal both have benefits and down sides.

Necro can chain kill very quickly with 0 down time (thats if specced deathsight)
Animist can chain kill very quickly lots of mobs but then has a serious amount of down time unless they got MCL or power pots.

Necro is helpful in groups due too the power transfer they can keep the group running constantly however they have trouble hitting higher end mobs.

Animist can do the same however can increase the damage that everyone does too higher end mobs.

RvR necro has some down sides mainly due too the resists on the pet ie a caster will tear them too peices. However they do hold up well against tanks (ive seen a fully buffed one against a hero )

RvR animists can work well in groups but only if arb specced , creep and verdant are still a bit more difficult too work out. Great camping class but only if the enemy is really stupid and has no AOE mezz/stun.

Either way both the classes are in similar boats both are good in one respect and garbage in another. Personally i think they are both good classes a bit of tweeking on there weaker lines would make the class more varied instead of the deathsight/arboreal single spec they are at the moment.

I know this is about friars but i always thought that they were half decent classes although im sure people forget that if friars didnt spec so high in staff and went regrowth ok they iliminate there Darkness falls Diamond seal farming status but they would fill the spot of support healer far better and high evade means they are less likely too be taken down in a fight than say a bard (who gets torn too peices).

Although from what i hear they got IP back so <shrug> frontiers isnt out yet i think they making sure the realms are stable and you can do a keep take with a good size zerg without having too worry about the server crashing. AS for the RA's look at Necro and Animist for unique abilitys they both get access too 3 Realm abilitys.

 

[Lejemorder]

I know this is about friars but i always thought that they were half decent classes although im sure people forget that if friars didnt spec so high in staff and went regrowth ok they iliminate there Darkness falls Diamond seal farming status but they would fill the spot of support healer far better and high evade means they are less likely too be taken down in a fight than say a bard (who gets torn too peices).

lets c what an alb and a hib grp need of supports b4 taking dmg dealers in:

typical alb:
2 clerics
1 mincer
1 mind sorc
1 pala

in that there r 2 main healers(with 16%resist), 1 speed/demezz/interrupt class, 1 cc/demezz call, 1 end/guard/bg bot.

typical hib:
2 druids
1 bard
1 warden
1 hero

in that there r 2 main healers(with 16%resist and gp(howmany druids dosnt take gp as first RA?)), 1 speed/cc/end/demezz class, 1 backup healer w/pbt and 24% resist and bg, 1 bg bot.

now there r 3 spots back to fill for dmg:
alb can choice: 1 theur, 2 merc or 1 theur, 1 caba, 1 sorc or 1 theur, 2 wizzys.
hib can choice: 3 pbaoes or 2 bms or 2 pbaoes, 1 light caster or 3/2 animists maybe with 1 void eld.

then tell me where r the spot for friars?? in many case they will serve the same job as wardens except they dont have pbt.

 

[Starbuck]

Cc

This is probably a daft concept but I'd love to try RvR without CC, just to see what is plays like. I know it would invalidate many classes but I'm sure it would make RvR more about fighting then Mezzing.