[Football] How to improve the National Game

[soze]

I have just read more from that French prat Platini going on about how we need to have 6 English players per team to improve the national game.

A couple of things I though first thing was who give a fuck about national games. Being half Scottish I am not passionate about England's national football.

And I have previously said I do not think giving players who were not good enough a spot in a team because they are English. So I was thinking what other way could you do it. Every Premiership team got 50mil this season from Sky et al, what if The FA and Sky decided to give 10mil from each team to Universities and Collages round the country. Then Sky can show some grass roots football and the Schools could start offering Sports Scholarships get good footballers playing real competitive football young. You could even get kids who were not that interested in playing to start for the free University place. This is completely stolen from American football but I think that would be a better way to improve young English players that forcing teams to play them.

Anyone think of a better way that still means I can watch Arsenal as they are

 

[J s p]

I have just read more from that French prat Platini going on about how we need to have 6 English players per team to improve the national game.

A couple of things I though first thing was who give a fuck about national games. Being half Scottish I am not passionate about England's national football.

And I have previously said I do not think giving players who were not good enough a spot in a team because they are English. So I was thinking what other way could you do it. Every Premiership team got 50mil this season from Sky et al, what if The FA and Sky decided to give 10mil from each team to Universities and Collages round the country. Then Sky can show some grass roots football and the Schools could start offering Sports Scholarships get good footballers playing real competitive football young. You could even get kids who were not that interested in playing to start for the free University place. This is completely stolen from American football but I think that would be a better way to improve young English players that forcing teams to play them.

Anyone think of a better way that still means I can watch Arsenal as they are

Sooner the new ruling comes in the better..i want to see England do well tyvm.

Wenger will quit when that happens, as he can't handle english players.

 

[Lamp]

How to improve the national game:

What about topless womens football ?

The losing side has to strip of naked and invite various males from the crowd to grope their bouncy breasts.

*wakes up*

damn

 

[Thadius]

I dont agree with the ruling, it should be 5 players from the Home nations, Welsh, Scottish and Irish players can count!

 

[Jeremiah]

The EPL needs to go through what the SPL went through in order to improve their national game. The vast majority of our SPL teams started importing foreign talent which was no better than the Scottish talent, except would play for less wages.

When their wage demands went up and teams from all the scottish leagues were either going bankrupt (like Airdrie) or on the verge of receivership until they got rid of overseas players and went back to grass roots. Hence our national game has raised slightly because our top SPL players are getting regular games, and our star players who moved to the EPL are now getting first team football as well.

Yes, its true that the entire SPL will become reserves for Celtic and Rangers, but still it means our best players get to play in the CL (for a while anyway heh).

 

[soze]

Sooner the new ruling comes in the better..i want to see England do well tyvm.

Wenger will quit when that happens, as he can't handle english players.

nice way to dodge the real question and Wenger will be fine thanks 6 players in the team mean 1 on the pitch an 5 subs and we can do that with out spending 18 mil on a shite midfielder just cos he is English

 

[Thadius]

Its not going to work, what about those players that are eligible to play for two or more nations?

Such as Gabriel Agbonlahor, he can play for England, Scotland or Nigeria. If he picks to play forScotland, despite being English, does it mean he can no longer play a game?

 

[Tasslehoff]

No Thad, Roberto Carlos didn't count as being Brazilian as soon as he became a Spanish citizen, even though he still played for Brazil..

And definately doesen't mean he won't be able to play a game

 

[Thadius]

No Thad, Roberto Carlos didn't count as being Brazilian as soon as he became a Spanish citizen, even though he still played for Brazil..

And definately doesen't mean he won't be able to play a game

No, your not undertsanding

Im talking about if he plays for Scotland, does he count as one of the English players or from another nation to fill the quota?

 

[Tasslehoff]

I think he'll count as English, seeing as he's both English and Scottish.

Like me, I'm half Israeli and half Danish, so I have 2 nationalities, can go to the military both places.

And Roberto Carlos, even though he played for the Brazilian side he was seen as a Spanish citizen (due to him changing his nationality after an amount of years in Spain though, so not the exact same as the thing with Agbonlahor.)

 

[cHodAX]

How to improve the national game in 2 easy steps.

1. Stop playing Lampard and Gerrard together

2. Pick the national side based on a combination of players form and those who can work together


Job done. Platini's point holds no water in that regard, our main problems right now are selection and not quality.


Back to the subject though, for the last 15 years in a row the numbers of young English players coming through the ranks into the first team in the top 4 leagues has fallen year on year. We have reached saturation point right now when it comes to imported players, the problem is that we aren't really seeing the damage yet but mark my words in 10 years time England will be in the same situation that Scotland were in 5 years ago and are still struggling to recover from today.

Imports are a good thing but like anything too much of a good thing does harm over the long term. Platini makes some good points but they are more related to what will happen in the future, young English players are being squeezed out of the game by imports even in the lowest professional leagues, that is how much of an effect cheap labour is having on our game. In the end we need to reintroduce quotas to protect our system of developing young English players before it dies completely and we end up with 10 teams in the top league without a single English starter.

 

[Thadius]

I think he'll count as English, seeing as he's both English and Scottish.

But if he picks Scotland, he isnt elgible for for the England team, therefore he has to count as a foreign player?

See where I am coming from, its going to get very confusing

 

[leviathane]

the funny thing is, english players are soooo overrated why would any club want them?

a) they're all so money hungry, take Cashley Cole.
b) can get better quality of foreign players for alot less money.

Now i'm not saying english players are crap, just that they need an attitude adjustment.

 

[Lollie]

But if he picks Scotland, he isnt elgible for for the England team, therefore he has to count as a foreign player?

See where I am coming from, its going to get very confusing

i think it'll be what ever is on his passport

 

[J s p]

nice way to dodge the real question and Wenger will be fine thanks 6 players in the team mean 1 on the pitch an 5 subs and we can do that with out spending 18 mil on a shite midfielder just cos he is English

Oh really?

Bentley/Sidwell/Pennant/Upson ones that to spring to mind..

And who's this shite midfielder your referring to?

 

[Tasslehoff]

i think it'll be what ever is on his passport

Aye, that's how it works in Spain anyway.

 

[Shagrat]

Is it any wonder Premiership teams arent using English players..

Darren Bent 16million, Dimitar Berbatov was about 9million wasnt he...

I know which of the two I'd bloody buy, and its nothing to do with nationality.


It's all crap anyway we'd end up with the worlds largest courtcase as it contravene's EU law to restrict movement of employees between countries.

The whole school/youth setup in this country needs investment and an overhaul.

 

[Huntingtons]

this discussion amounted to bla bla bla in my ears once again... execpt lamps post which was quite reasonble

 

[Tasslehoff]

Is it any wonder Premiership teams arent using English players..

Darren Bent 16million, Dimitar Berbatov was about 9million wasnt he...

I know which of the two I'd bloody buy, and its nothing to do with nationality.


It's all crap anyway we'd end up with the worlds largest courtcase as it contravene's EU law to restrict movement of employees between countries.

The whole school/youth setup in this country needs investment and an overhaul.

Darren Bent also costed 2 million when Charlton bought him.. I don't think you can look at it that way, if you were to buy Berbatov now you'd probably end up splashing out 25 million +, but I do agree with you on the whole, seeing as English players are overly expensive.

One thing to consider though, is there a reason English players are more expensive? Things we don't see from just watching football.
Culture wise it's probably best buying English players, but is it worth the extra money? I don't think it is, but Platini could make it.

I'm still undecided about this, I agree with it being weird, if entire teams were made up of bought players from other countries. On the other hand Arsenal have developed a lot more talent than most of the other English teams in the Premier League, shouldn't those talents be okay to use too?

As I said, I'm undecided.

 

[Golly]

ashley coles one of the best left backs in the world at the moment, bit of a harsh comment even though hes a money grabbing etc etc

england are fine as is, just a case of needing to perform

the good players make it into the setups, even at the big clubs (fergie had no probs playing simpson at the weekend and it paid dividends with his beautiful cross for rooney)

agbonlahar is a great asset at villa, newcastle have been blooding youngsters over last few years (amoebi went to sunderland?)- the fact that the premierships such a high standard due to its international status, imo means that players of a decent caliber are put in at the deep end, to them its like champions league football week in week out- players like micah richards are flourishing and the good young talent often gets loaned out to lesser prem clubs (a win-win for both parties) which also gives them valuable exp.

the top teams do take care of the youngsters, all hoping for the next gerrard/rooney/george best!

joe cole made his west ham debut at 17, it would have been 16 had it been allowed, how is that not having faith in youngsters? same situation with rooney- 10 years down the line now and we have 2 world class players who've won many big games at club level across many competitions etc etc

also didnt the U21's just reach the semi's of their respective tournie?and iirc they deserved to get into final (penalties was it?)

in a simple ratio of population to footballing talent, we must be up near the top with brazil and argentina in players produced, its pretty much the national sport and even if sir Bobby disagrees, 90% of kids grow up playing it (boys anyways)

in all fairness, can anyone call or forsee a crisis at international level? we have the talent its just putting it to good use

and what about the benefits of overseas players?

players like, fletcher, richardson, bardsley and simspon- they've been training every day against the likes of ronaldo and giggs for the past 4-5yrs, im sure that can't of been too much harm:england:

the players good enough make it through, the lesser players, well why do we need a bunch of average-subpar english players that wont even get a sniff of international footy? makes no sense

 

[Marc]

I dont mind foreigners in the premiership if they are top class foreigners. Its the dog shit foreigners who are only here cos fat sam or harry redknapp fancied making a quick 10 grand from their agents, that do my head in.

 

[Bahumat]

All England need to do is merge countries with Brazil

 

[soze]

Oh really?

Bentley/Sidwell/Pennant/Upson ones that to spring to mind..

And who's this shite midfielder your referring to?

Carrik or Hargreves take your pick really both cost about twice what they would if they were not English and right now i would not Drop Flamini for either of them.

Why are you listing players that did not make it at Arsenal? How many of those are regular England players maybe Bently stands a chance thats it.


y point was if you need 6 english players in your 16 man team we can have 5 on the bench and Walcott on the pitch. Another player that cost twice what he should because hes English.

 

[Thadius]

i think it'll be what ever is on his passport

Its a British passport


See how its going to get confusing?


It will work in countries like Germany and France, mainly because most teams are 80% or more filled with home nation players.

Its Bitain thats the problem, we have 4 countries within one "country"

 

[Jeremiah]

His nationality would be "UK" since thats how the passports scheme goes. We wouldnt be viewed as seperate countries as such, just seperate states =)

 

[tierk]

......Anyone think of a better way that still means I can watch Arsenal as they are

Dont think its a lack of good quality players that is the problem, there are so many great football players coming up in England today in so many teams. The reason people feel that there is a lack of talent is because we attract so many of the best foriegn players now and we can compete with the top spenders in Europe for their services. Its these players that attract all the attention and detract from all the really good players coming through.

Imo the problem is not the lack of talented players but shit selection on the part of the FA of mangers. The only two good mangers we have had in the last fook knows how long have been Bobby Robson and Terry Venables. With the greatest respect but Mclaren!?!?! I wouldnt have this guy coaching a under elevens team for the disabled let alone the national side.

Its amazing what a good manger can get from a side of not so good players, just look at the job Walter Smith did for Scotland recently. Now imagine what could be done with a good manger with the players that England currently have.

 

[Thadius]

Its amazing what a good manger can get from a side of not so good players, just look at the job Walter Smith did for Scotland recently. Now imagine what could be done with a good manger with the players that England currently have.

Good point, its getting a manger who takes no shit from the primma donnas and gets them fighting for every ball.

Cue Alex Fergeson, Sam Alladyce and Harry Redknapp

 

[Bahumat]

Good point, its getting a manger who takes no shit from the primma donnas and gets them fighting for every ball.

Cue Alex Fergeson, Sam Alladyce and Harry Redknapp

Bill Hicks, Sadam Hussein, Ronald McDonald, Satan

 

[Unleashed]

Carrik or Hargreves take your pick really both cost about twice what they would if they were not English and right now i would not Drop Flamini for either of them.

Why are you listing players that did not make it at Arsenal? How many of those are regular England players maybe Bently stands a chance thats it.


y point was if you need 6 english players in your 16 man team we can have 5 on the bench and Walcott on the pitch. Another player that cost twice what he should because hes English.

You really do talk some shite.

 

[Aesgir]

Introducing a quota doesn't seem that much of an issue to me. Its an english league....it should have english players. Year after year we hear of transfer records being broken and fees being dished out, this is balanced out by the influx of cheaper continental players, so clubs can afford 'big names'. The only way to stop silly money being spent is to limit sky's subsidy to big clubs, who make enough money on merchandising alone, and yes, invest in grass roots football or subsidy to the FA. Who could then use the cash to prevent the bankrupcy of lower league clubs.

Personally i've always had an issue of majority foreign sides. I don't see how it can be called an English team, when half your squad is French/Italian. And yeah, its true of my own side, Manchester City. We have a reliance on foreign talent that i think is unhealthy for the game, and under Sven will get even more reliant, while it might do a lot to improve Manchester City, it isn't getting a lot done for the English national squad or the stability of the game. Thankfully City also have a very good Youth system (same as Arsenal i might add, just Arsenal tend to sell half their Youth players to West Ham ).

But put simply, i don't see why the big clubs would argue with this system. Yeah it means you can't import xyz player for £2m cheaper from Serie A, but in stead, you get to buy the best in a limited labour pool, as everyone has to abide by the same rules. And with less money to throw around from TV rights, we might actually have a game thats not living up in the clouds (and maybe have footballers who realise they aren't 'special' just lucky people who got to have a job doing what they love).

Oh and yeah, i agree, instead of 'English' read home nations. England, Scotland, Wales, and Northern Ireland/Eire. Anywhere on the British Isles. Of course they'd then have to get the backing of the other FA's.