Feminism gone too far?

[Gorbachioo]

ABC News: Wives Hit Changes to SWAT Team Selection


This is just ridiculous. The feminist movement has gotten completely insane in the last decade and i think the first womens rights activists are turning in their graves.

 

[Ezteq]

rofl i cant even be arsed to read this it makes me sick.

Yes we want to be able to do the same jobs as men!

Yes we want the same pay level!

no we dont want to have to be able to perform at the same level as men...thats just unfair!

im sure if they were in a dangerous situation against armed suspects they would run a little bit slower so the girlies had a fair chance to catch them.

it really makes me sick it gives women a bad name, its like at B2's work this woman works there and she had only just completed her provisional period and waited to be signed on a preminant staff then she said Oh btw im preggers ill need maturnity leave and reduced hours. but if they said well your no longer able to do the job your contracted for so bugger off or take less money because your actually doing less work she'd be straight to a tribunal.


I'm not saying that woman are not as capable as men, some are some are more capable but i know that im damn well not and i wouldnt dream of taking a job where someones life depends on strength i just do not have.

 

[Helme]

I'm all for equality aslong as the girls holds up their end and it goes both ways(I want people to hold up doors for me damnit). But this is just giving everyone a bad name.

 

[leviathane]

stupidity comes to mind, why change something that is pretty much prefect. Lowering the admission bar will in turn lower standards. Crazy.

 

[Dukat]

Sorry but this is old news. This sort of thing goes on ALL THE TIME.

The entry requirements for the army are lower for women than for men, and probably have always been. I dont see this as a major problem per se, but its not like the SWAT teams are doing anything groundbreaking by making entry requirements easier for women.

I think the whole "token female" thing is the problem, why should we need rounded figures? So the pen-pushers can feel safe and happy that the numbers are rounded? Why do we need certain numbers of people in certain jobs?

Its the same with race and everything else. I suppose its all done to try and ensure that there isnt discrimination against a certain group, but this sort of thing creates discrimination too - its discrimination against men if women get it easier, in exactly the same way as it is discrimination against women if men get things easier.

I dont know whether its "fair" or not, but as others have said at the end of the day the bad guys arent going to slow down or shoot wide just because they're up against a woman, so the training should probably be the same across the board.

Like I say, I really dont mind that women have lower fitness requirements, I just wanted to point out that this sort of thing is hardly new

 

[Ezteq]

its not new but its bloody wrong tbh.

If i got somewhere i would want it to be because i fought tooth and nail and worked my arse off to get it, not because ive been given special standards. Its like when i was a kid i'd throw a right old wobbler if anyone let me win at something i'd get furious because it demeaned me, i can either do something or i cant, pretending i can do it as well as everybody else is the same as not being able to do it.

and i mean like i said people's lives depend on folk in the SWAT and the army etc so its not the sort of thing that should be dumbed down.

 

[Iceforge]

Stupid is the word for it, nothing less..

Every member of the SWAT team (atleast those going in) are relying on the performance (fitness) of all the other members to be able to stay alive, among the knowledge gained from training surely, but having one member on the SWAT team who does not meet the requirement (it was set as it is for a reason!) could endanger the lives and wellbeing of all the other members AND those they are supposed to save in a situation in which they are brought in.

Pro-favourism is also discrimination, but apperently when discrimination is in the favour of women (i.e. discriminating the men) it is socially acceptable by some people..

For instance here in Denmark, if you want to hire someone for a job, it is illegal to hire only for 1 gender, but it is rarely acted on if they only hire women, while it is an immidiate disaster if someone only hires men.

World gone mad at times

 

[tris-]

feminism has been fucked for centuries.

the minute it made you a bad man not to hold open a door for a woman, was the minute the world went to shit.

 

[leviathane]

tbh as a woman would you really feel "proud" of yourself knowing you got into something easier than a man had. I know if it was the other way round i'd wouldn't accept it. This kinda lacks the sense of achievement.

 

[Chronictank]

what the...
How on earth do people who come up with this stuff get in charge!

 

[Ezteq]

lol every MD i have ever encountered has been a moron, i assume the IQ gets lower the higher up you get tbh.

I know lets start putting people in positions of responsibility just to level out the demographics...skill and ability pfft they should have nothing to do with it!

 

[Rookiescot]

I can see the biggest problem with women in SWAT teams is similar to what the Israelie forces found when they put women in the front line units.
They found that the when a male soldier was shot the other soldiers reacted as they had been trained to do.
However when a female soldier was shot the male soldiers would react in a different way.
They would immediatly stop what they were supposed to be doing and would flock to the wounded female soldier in an attempt to protect her.
This ment that assaults faltered and defensive actions were compromised.
When they examined this in detail they discovered something odd. It was not the female soldiers fault. They were carrying out their duties normally. Often with great bravery.
The fault lay with the male soldiers. It seems it is a deep seated and indeed ancient male behavioural traite to protect the female of the species.
We cant help it. Try as the Israelie defense forces did they simply could not train this reaction out of the male soldiers.

 

[Iceforge]

I can see the biggest problem with women in SWAT teams is similar to what the Israelie forces found when they put women in the front line units.
They found that the when a male soldier was shot the other soldiers reacted as they had been trained to do.
However when a female soldier was shot the male soldiers would react in a different way.
They would immediatly stop what they were supposed to be doing and would flock to the wounded female soldier in an attempt to protect her.
This ment that assaults faltered and defensive actions were compromised.
When they examined this in detail they discovered something odd. It was not the female soldiers fault. They were carrying out their duties normally. Often with great bravery.
The fault lay with the male soldiers. It seems it is a deep seated and indeed ancient male behavioural traite to protect the female of the species.
We cant help it. Try as the Israelie defense forces did they simply could not train this reaction out of the male soldiers.

Then it should be natural to put any limitations to prevent it in the negative influence of the males.

That something is our nature that we can't fight as men, still makes it our flaw, not the females.

One thing I think would have been natural to do then to avoid those situations, would be to station men and females in different sectors, so when a woman was injured, those around would all also be women who could control themselves and carry on their instructions and training instead of compromising.

Odd how complete seperation could seem best in such situations through, seeing how in workplaces mixed groups often works best.

Know this from a factory where I used to work and my father is one production manager.

They found that the productivity pr. worker in a group was dramastically tied to the ratio of women and men.

Pure men groups did bad compared to if the same group received 2 women to their workgroup. 1 Women did not have a major impact.

Same with a pure group of women, except a single man present spiked it right back up.

It might sound prejudice, but the reason for it was quite simple. When men was left alone, they fooled around, and became like little boys in some aspects. When there was 1 women present, they stopped fooling around like boys, but unfortunately they grew ineffective due to being split over winning the favour of the single women (not that they was all singles or anything, just a natural thing to do in a group) and work effort was hence not dramaticly increased. With 2 women present, they didn't fight internal about it and they did not fool around like little boys = effectiveness.

Pure groups of women divided themselves up into fractions and was after each other (ladies, you know what I am talking about, if there is anyone who know how to be after a women, it is another women!), but the presense of a man made that go away, either because women didn't want to do it infront of a man or the man didn't want to listen to all that foul talking.

These was just general observations by the way, as ofc. sometimes things didn't quite follow those principles, but they saw again and again that if they had a group working together which was either pure men or pure women, they just had to send in 2 women / 1 man into the group and it would all solve itself.

 

[soze]

I do not like things like this if you can't pass the test you can't do the job. I heard they are doing the same for the fire exams. I might go in and say i want the job and when im not fit enough i will say they are sizeist will they change the rules for that?

 

[Lamp]

Crazy. Mind you, what isn't these days...

 

[Nate]

im sure if they were in a dangerous situation against armed suspects they would run a little bit slower so the girlies had a fair chance to catch them.

If they managed to run for 100 miles, then and only after that distance would a woman be equal in endurance Saw it on SAS it has to be true!

It happens, I'm sure some criminals run for 100miles...just get runnin Ez, in a few days you'll get em!

 

[Chronictank]

Crazy. Mind you, what isn't these days...

Neil Patrick Harris!

H&K2 25th April /glee

 

[noblok]

I don't see them saying anywhere they'll have different admission standards for women. What I read was that they're changing the admission standards for everyone with less emphasis on physical fitness and more on qualities in which women are generally better. These qualities are claimed to be necessary as well, but currently underemphasised.

Or did I read it all wrong?

 

[old.Tohtori]

I was wondering what the hell that news article has to do with feminism? And why would changing, special weapons and tactics training towards more tactics and less fitness be bad?

"Cry ism" again? Meaning, that the "cry wolf" has been changed these days to accuse some form of "ism" everytime anything pops up. Terrorism, feminism, chauvinism, nazism...

Jesus, Mary and Josef Ism from Israel people, say that "No SWAT shouldn't lower standards to let more members in, they should keep elite and train elite.", but don't bring f'cking isms into this.

 

[liloe]

The old admissions tests over-emphasized "physical prowess and tactical acumen," the report said, and under-emphasized "negotiating skills, patience, empathy, and flexibility."

This is the worst shit I've ever heard, but people are gonna fall for that argument, I'm sure. Every special unit has a set of highly trained psychologists at hand to do the negotation and empathy things. So what about booting all male psychologists, cause women are obviously so much better at negotiating?

I say the BETTER person gets the job and that's it. I dont care what gender my co-workers have, as long as they do their job.

Maybe the SWAT just needs to do some public work to get more women in the first place? More applications result in a higher chance to find someone. The thing is, if a job seems unattractive, nobody will sign up.

 

[Gorbachioo]

Part of the reason might be that some consider women could bring more to the table when it comes to negotiation (i personally disagree as most criminals are men anyway and why would they prefer negotiating with a women? ;O) but since women cant handle the physical requirements and theres no evidence that they would do the talking any better i dont see the point of this. You need both.

 

[soze]

They will spin it to sound like they are not dropping standards where if that was the case they would not drop the physical standards just improve the over stadards??

 

[Ezteq]

If they managed to run for 100 miles, then and only after that distance would a woman be equal in endurance Saw it on SAS it has to be true!

It happens, I'm sure some criminals run for 100miles...just get runnin Ez, in a few days you'll get em!

HA!!! me? i can not run, at all, i do a thing thats somewhere between a mince and a waddle (just think of a gay duck) and then after doing this mincing waddle for anything over about 30 seconds i tend to turn purple and start throwing up and tripping over my own feet and clutching my heart.

there are plenty of gals out there who pwn at running *tips hat at dame kelly* but man, i sure aint one of em.

 

[Golena]

It's only discrimination if it's in favour of a white male.

 

[Ezteq]

It's only discrimination if it's in favour of a white, able bodied, middle classed, hetrosexual male aged between 25 to 50.

now i think thats about right

 

[yaruar]

ABC News: Wives Hit Changes to SWAT Team Selection


This is just ridiculous. The feminist movement has gotten completely insane in the last decade and i think the first womens rights activists are turning in their graves.

funnily enough if you actually read the artical it's got nothing to do with feminism and everything to do with analying the changing needs of the SWAT team and the possbile extra chance of women getting in is a byproduct.

 

[Rookiescot]

Part of the reason might be that some consider women could bring more to the table when it comes to negotiation (i personally disagree as most criminals are men anyway and why would they prefer negotiating with a women? ;O) but since women cant handle the physical requirements and theres no evidence that they would do the talking any better i dont see the point of this. You need both.

I feel this is wrong mate. Psycologists do the negotiation part. SWAT teams do the explosive entry and room clearance.

Totally different skill set required for the two different jobs.

In the UK only the Army can do explosive entrances. Which makes me feel safer for some reason.

 

[liloe]

I feel this is wrong mate. Psycologists do the negotiation part. SWAT teams do the explosive entry and room clearance.

Totally different skill set required for the two different jobs.

Yer, like I said, a team always consists of the front and the support, which means psychologists and professional negotiators.

 

[Nate]

America, fuck yeah! Comin again to save the mother fuckin day yeah!

 

[Ctuchik]

Pro-favourism is also discrimination, but apperently when discrimination is in the favour of women (i.e. discriminating the men) it is socially acceptable by some people..

for SOME, yes. but there is far far FAR more that finds it perfectly ok to discriminate females.


me personally dont give a damn. i dont live in the US, so aslong as they dont come and invade my quiet little corner they can do whatever the fuck they want.