News Doping / Armstrong / Cycling

[opticle]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/cycling/19903716

Thoughts ?

Someone I know posted this as their status on Facebook:

"We all know that everybody dopes. People are just pissed because Lance Armstrong was so much better at it than they are."

I think it's really sad to be honest. The man was a hero in my eyes, and now he's nothing. Sure, he still did impressive things, but it turns out he's no better than the rest of us.

Sigh. "Strength and Honour" ?

 

[rynnor]

Cycling = Drugs

 

[Scouse]

Cycling = Drugs

I wish. I find it hard going and not at all like being whacked out of my head.

Oh, hang on. I do visit a lot of pubs on my rides, so if we're counting alcohol...

 

[Tom]

it turns out he's no better than the rest of us.

Well if he didn't dope he'd probably have been good enough to ride as a professional anyway. He's an idiot for denying it for so long.

 

[opticle]

Well if he didn't dope he'd probably have been good enough to ride as a professional anyway. He's an idiot for denying it for so long.

True, but it's pretty damn sad that sport is really like that under the surface. He did amazing things, but now they're not so amazing. De-legend-ed.

 

[rynnor]

Most of professional sport is about drugs - big scandals in the US about American Football players being dailly injected with anti-inflammatories so that they can play on - some ended up with liver damage from the side effects.

Wherever there is competition people will cheat and seek an advantage in any way they can - thats just human nature - there's no such thing as being a good sport or 'its the taking part' crap.

 

[old.Tohtori]

It's a good thing whenever these kind of thigns happen, kills peoples expectations and unhuman like opinions of celebrities

 

[Urgat]

Am I missing where there is proof of the allegations?

Has something come to light that proves he was doping?

 

[Soazak]

Am I missing where there is proof of the allegations?

Has something come to light that proves he was doping?

It's more of a... "his friends say he did it", and "he must have done because everyone in cycling does".

I don't think they've got anything in terms of failed drugs tests, but more looking at things like his bank account transactions etc.

I don't care much but think it's just a little OTT the vendetta they seem to have, when there are other people who actually tested positive for doping are just given a 2 year ban then allowed to come back to compete in the London Olympics.

 

[Tom]

Am I missing where there is proof of the allegations?

Has something come to light that proves he was doping?

His times up the mountains.

 

[Madmaxx]

12 former team mates naming and shaming him and a mad story to go with it.

 

[TdC]

you mean the "just tell us he did it, and we'll let you get away with it for another season" gambit?

 

[DaGaffer]

Bit unfortunate...

 

[opticle]

Bit unfortunate...

Rofl.

 

[Rubber Bullets]

Am I missing where there is proof of the allegations?

Has something come to light that proves he was doping?

Yes, you're missing something. During the 1999 Tour he tested positive for corticosteroids. Nothing came of it as he successfully claimed that they came from a cream he used for saddle sores. There were 2 problems with this explanation. Firstly the prescription was back dated, against the rules, he should have told the authorities before he used any such cream. and also according to Emma O'Reilly, his masseuse, he had no such sores, and she would have been in a position to know.

There is also some evidence that whist there was no test for EPO during those early wins, some of his samples from those years have since been tested and have shown positive. There are procedural problems with using this as evidence, but it is damning just the same.

Apparently though USADA do have evidence of EPO in his samples from the 2009 comeback tour. This evidence could well be in the 800 or so pages of their report that are not yet in the public domain due to ongoing legal action against others in the team, such as Johann Bruyneel.

Then their is Tyler Hamilton's assertion that he suspicious test consistent with the use of EPO during the 2001 Tour de Suisse, but a large 'donation' to the UCI saw that swept under the carpet. Interestingly Floyd Landis has just been found guilty of defamation for making this allegation, and ordered to pay compensation and costs, though that was before the USADA report was sent to the UCI, and it will be interesting to see what happens if it does turn out to be true.

There is a huge amount more, but these items do throw some doubt on LA's consistent assertion that he had 'never tested positive' because one way or another it looks increasingly likely that he did.

RB

 

[Ormorof]

so have any of the recent winners since LA first win not tested positive yet?

what do they actually do with the titles? bump the wins down the line?

 

[Gumbo]

so have any of the recent winners since LA first win not tested positive yet?

what do they actually do with the titles? bump the wins down the line?

Yep 2010 was 'won' by Contador who then failed a drug test so they gave it to Andy Schleck.

2006 it was 'won' by Floyd Landis who then failed a drug test so they gave it to Oscar Pereiro. Of course Pereiro also failed tests in the 2006 race for an asthma med which he didn't have clearance to use, but they gave him clearance later because it would be kind of embarrassing to DQ two 'winners' after the race has ended. If they had they'd have needed to give it to Andreas Kloden who it later emerged had an illegal blood transfusion during the 2006 tour, so they'd have needed to DQ him really, which would have meant giving the win to Carlos Sastre who I don't think has been caught doing anything.

There's a good argument for disregarding Pro Cycling up until this year as the whole thing is horribly tainted. I think Wiggins win was probably clean, but take the British element out of that tour and it was horribly dull to watch. It was just about managing the power meters on the handlebars, there was no excitement no passion and nothing unexpected.

 

[Hawkwind]

Cycling as a sport was riddled with drugs cheats and the organisers knew it. Something that widespread does not stay hidden forever.

 

[Nate]

Wiggins must be on it then surely? If everyone does it.

 

[Ctuchik]

There is a huge amount more, but these items do throw some doubt on LA's consistent assertion that he had 'never tested positive' because one way or another it looks increasingly likely that he did.

RB

Not claiming he's innocent, but there's been a lot of hate towards LA because he's been winning so much. So right now i don't trust either side.

That sport is more corrupt now then boxing was in the 80's and 90's when Don King ruled supreme...

 

[megadave]

Everyone ready for him to confess, shed some fake tears, have Oprah say how brave he is and the stupid masses to lap it all up?

 

[Tom]

The interview should consist of this:

LA: "I'm sorry everyone"

OW: "Right, now fuckoff and don't come back"

 

[Raven]

Setting up a nice book deal here isn't he?

 

[Shagrat]

Stupid isnt it. Can only agree with what Nicola Cooke said on Twitter this week as she retired:

''When Lance 'cries' on Oprah later this week and she passes him the tissue, spare a thought for all those genuine people who walked away with no rewards - just shattered dreams.''

He's enjoyed the rewards of his cheating for years, compared to clean cyclists who struggled to get funding and compete, then he goes on Oprah purely I think to engineer another pay day.

he can fuck off.

 

[Hawkwind]

Apparently though USADA do have evidence of EPO in his samples from the 2009 comeback tour. This evidence could well be in the 800 or so pages of their report that are not yet in the public domain due to ongoing legal action against others in the team, such as Johann Bruyneel.

According to a spokesperson from USADA early samples were re-tested and confirmed to have very high levels of EPO. The news program 60 Minutes went on to suggest that once proved he could face jail for perjury. Also as he was racing for US Postal he could be sued by the Federal Government. Saw Oprah on the news last night and she did not state that he openly admits it. Instead he says enough to suggest that the allegations are not incorrect. He skirts around the issue very carefully. Will be interesting to see the full interview, over two hours of it and will be aired on Thursday and Friday in US.

 

[Yoni]

I am watching it now. He does openly admit doping, no suggestions he answered a yes / no question, with yes....

 

[Job]

He will need more than a handkercheif when the lawyers come after his money...but of course the world of cycling will havebto be ripped apart to find who was backing him and then we will have to start to ask ourselves if there is any future in the rather ridiculous notion of competitive sport that is facing an avalanche of cheating options that requires a bearacracy bigger than the sport itself to maintain an ideal of fairness that in itself is flawed

 

[BloodOmen]

He will need more than a handkercheif when the lawyers come after his money...but of course the world of cycling will havebto be ripped apart to find who was backing him and then we will have to start to ask ourselves if there is any future in the rather ridiculous notion of competitive sport that is facing an avalanche of cheating options that requires a bearacracy bigger than the sport itself to maintain an ideal of fairness that in itself is flawed

Wouldnt at all surprise me if in the next few months we see a headline saying "Lance Armstrong found dead at home from suspected suicide" not wishing it on him but you've got to wonder how tempting its looking to him now after basically losing everything.

 

[Lamp]

The guy's an arse.

He's confirmed what most of us suspected for some time. Sick of hearing about him on every news bulletin TBH. I suppose it will make another appearance when his book comes out and the inevitable Hollywood movie flop ("Armsrong" or "Powerlegs" or "Riding High").

 

[Raven]

His film will be called Riding high.