Football Dead horse

[eksdee]

He never accepted that. He's always maintained his innocence.

If he's right and he's innocent, then he's not wrong to hold a grudge...

But he's not innocent is he? It's been objectively decided by a panel of his peers that what he did was wrong. Whether he thinks he is innocent or not couldn't be less relevant. Do you think criminals in prison all think they're guilty? No. It doesn't make them not guilty though.

 

[soze]

If you read the report. Initially Evra though Suarez called him a nigger not negro. Which he had / has every right to be upset about. That is what the complaint was made about. He now understands it was negro. I really do wonder if there was a time Suarez could of just said sorry for the misunderstanding I wont do it again and Evra would of accepted it?

I suppose at the end of the day i do not believe Suarez used negro in the same way a racist would use nigger so i find it hard to think he is one.

But telling Liverpool he would shake hands and then not doing it was a pure cunt move and he should lose a months wages for it. And as for the video Evra does not withdraw his hand completely he just does not offer it like he is waiting to see what Suarez does.

 

[eksdee]

I'm gonna walk down the street and say 'hey negro' to every black guy I see. Any bets on how long I go without getting the shit kicked out of me?

 

[gohan]

Tbh it's fairly clear for the handshake the Suarez blanks Evra, no one can really say Evra pulled out. Suarez made no eye contact atall and skated had hand straight past Evra to De Gea, IF Evra's hand was outstretched Suarez would have knocked into it on his way past, by accident.

 

[soze]

I'm gonna walk down the street and say 'hey negro' to every black guy I see. Any bets on how long I go without getting the shit kicked out of me?

If you are English then you mean it as a racial slur, the important part for me about this is intent. And seeing as he uses it with fellow players in a non hateful way I am not convinced he meant it in a race hate way with Evra.

 

[gohan]

I'm gonna walk down the street and say 'hey negro' to every black guy I see. Any bets on how long I go without getting the shit kicked out of me?

record it plz

 

[eksdee]

If you are English then you mean it as a racial slur, the important part for me about this is intent. And seeing as he uses it with fellow players in a non hateful way I am not convinced he meant it in a race hate way with Evra.

This is the problem, I could call a black guy a nigger and not MEAN it to be offensive at all, but it still is and in 99.9% of cases the person on the receiving end is going to find it hurtful. Once again: it doesn't matter what Suarez thinks or feels on the matter.

 

[Scouse]

But he's not innocent is he?

Personally I think he is.

Would have preferred it to go to trial tbfh. Of course, it would have been thrown out for a lack of evidence...

 

[soze]

This is the problem, I could call a black guy a nigger and not MEAN it to be offensive at all, but it still is and in 99.9% of cases the person on the receiving end is going to find it hurtful. Once again: it doesn't matter what Suarez thinks or feels on the matter.

But you know nigger is offensive. Suarez did not know saying negro would be taken as a racist term. That report mentions he calls Glen Johnston something negro. If he was never told that was racist its fair to assume he did not know and therefore safe to say there was no intent. So for me they are different.

 

[eksdee]

But the argument about it being accepted in Uruguay negates itself surely? In the sense that it isn't acceptable here.

 

[rynnor]

But you know nigger is offensive. Suarez did not know saying negro would be taken as a racist term. That report mentions he calls Glen Johnston something negro. If he was never told that was racist its fair to assume he did not know and therefore safe to say there was no intent. So for me they are different.

Are you sure you read the FA report on this? Even in his homeland the use of the word negro to another person could be offensive - its all about context. If your talking to a good friend it could be harmless but if you say it 5 times in a couple of minutes to a black guy you dont know even there it would be deemed offensive.

Thus he has no defense.

 

[soze]

Again for me it is intent. I accept it not acceptable here and tbh if someone at Liverpool heard him saying it they should of said something. If for him in his home country it is a perfectly fine turn of phrase you need to prove he knew it was racially charged here to call him a racist.

I think racism is a horrible nasty crime so being labelled one for what could be a simple misunderstanding does not sit well with me.

 

[rynnor]

If for him in his home country it is a perfectly fine turn of phrase you need to prove he knew it was racially charged here to call him a racist.

Read the post above - its not acceptable in his country so he had no basis to think it would be fine here.

 

[soze]

Are you sure you read the FA report on this? Even in his homeland the use of the word negro to another person could be offensive - its all about context. If your talking to a good friend it could be harmless but if you say it 5 times in a couple of minutes to a black guy you dont know even there it would be deemed offensive.

Thus he has no defense.

Yes I did. And you just need to look at the commonly used nicknames for black players to see that and they don't take it personally and do not report it as racism. The report is very boring and i did find the regional experts reports to be particularly boring.

 

[eksdee]

It's subjectively boring so it's objectively untrue?

 

[Ch3tan]

OP, how do you explain Suarez apologising for refusing to shake Evra's hand and explain this video. What a pointless rehash of everything we've already discussed.

 

[Lethul]

Read the post above - its not acceptable in his country so he had no basis to think it would be fine here.

Even Messi is racist now days!

 

[Scouse]

I'm gonna walk down the street and say 'hey negro' to every black guy I see. Any bets on how long I go without getting the shit kicked out of me?

In England I daresay you'd have the shit kicked out of you.

In Uraguay you say it to people with black hair. His wife calls him it.


Of course, if you want to be like the tabloid press and dumb the argument down and go "rahrahrahracistOMGz0r!!1!1!!" then it's your perogative. However the FA report says this:

The word "negro" is by no means, however, always used offensively. The term can also be
used as a friendly form of address to someone seen as somewhat brown-skinned or even
just black-haired. It may be used affectionately between man and wife, or
girlfriend/boyfriend, it may be used as a nickname in everyday speech, it may be used to
identify in neutral and descriptive fashion someone of dark skin; several famous people in
Uruguay are known as "el negro/la negra such-and-such".

In a court of law this would have gone nowhere.

 

[Lethul]

OP, how do you explain Suarez apologising for refusing to shake Evra's hand and explain this video. What a pointless rehash of everything we've already discussed.

If you even read the post I just said It does not exactly look like Evra wants to shake his hand either.

 

[Ch3tan]

Yep clearly grabbing his hand and getting pissed off that suarez did not shake his was just a dream! You Lollolerpool fans are on some trippy shit. Except for gohan.

 

[Lethul]

Yep clearly grabbing his hand and getting pissed off that suarez did not shake his was just a dream! You Lollolerpool fans are on some trippy shit. Except for gohan.

Did you watch the video? oO

 

[Calaen]

Read the post above - its not acceptable in his country so he had no basis to think it would be fine here.

I guess until we all live in the countries and learn how the speak to each other we'll never know, fact is in the UK we always tend to make a massive deal about everything. I don't think Suarez is racist at all, I just think he's a twat.

It's all about context and the relationship you have with the person!

Gus Poyet mentioned it in his own interview.

“I played with a player and nobody knew him as Fernando Caceres. Everyone knows him as Negro Caceres – even in the newspapers and on TV they all him that. Is that racist?
“In England it is but in the rest of the world, in South America or Spain, it’s not. Because I read that 100 times in newspapers and I listen to TV programmes calling Fernando, a good friend of mine, Negro Caceres.

 

[soze]

Thanks for the quote Scouse i was beginning to doubt seeing something similar to that. I am now back to being sure it was just poorly handled / worded by FA

 

[eksdee]

In England I daresay you'd have the shit kicked out of you.

In Uraguay you say it to people with black hair. His wife calls him it.


Of course, if you want to be like the tabloid press and dumb the argument down and go "rahrahrahracistOMGz0r!!1!1!!" then it's your perogative.

This line of 'argument' has already been proven to be invalid:

Are you sure you read the FA report on this? Even in his homeland the use of the word negro to another person could be offensive - its all about context. If your talking to a good friend it could be harmless but if you say it 5 times in a couple of minutes to a black guy you dont know even there it would be deemed offensive.

Thus he has no defense.

 

[Ch3tan]

Thanks for the quote Scouse i was beginning to doubt seeing something similar to that. I am now back to being sure it was just poorly handled / worded by FA

Not really, Suarez fucked his own defence and should have just apologised at the start for any misunderstanding if that is all he felt it was. At the end of the day there was a massive gulf between what evra and suarez reported had happened. I agree that negro depending on language and context is not a rascist term, however they were not having banter and they were not friends. I think Suarez is a massive cunt, I don't think he's racist though.

 

[gohan]

This line of 'argument' has already been proven to be invalid:

proven? since when is someones opinion proof? this is the kind of "proof" that got suarez banned but would be laughed at and thrown out in any real court process

 

[gohan]

Not really, Suarez fucked his own defence and should have just apologised at the start for any misunderstanding if that is all he felt it was. At the end of the day there was a massive gulf between what evra and suarez reported had happened. I agree that negro depending on language and context is not a rascist term, however they were not having banter and they were not friends. I think Suarez is a massive cunt, I don't think he's racist though.

to be fair.... this

I've never denied he can be a cunt, I just don't agree with the world and its dog labeling him racist

 

[Lethul]

Concha de tu hermana

 

[soze]

Not really, Suarez fucked his own defence and should have just apologised at the start for any misunderstanding if that is all he felt it was. At the end of the day there was a massive gulf between what evra and suarez reported had happened. I agree that negro depending on language and context is not a rascist term, however they were not having banter and they were not friends. I think Suarez is a massive cunt, I don't think he's racist though.

I only meant in terms of branding him a racist mate. I do not think he is blameless and everything else he has done shows the guys a prick.

 

[rynnor]

proven? since when is someones opinion proof? this is the kind of "proof" that got suarez banned but would be laughed at and thrown out in any real court process

Not a chance - in UK courts we dont judge peoples actions by if its acceptable where they come from but by if its acceptable here.

Sex wiith an under 16 - oh but you say its ok in your country - fair enough then.

Beating your children - oh cultural is it - fair enough...

Lol!

'Ignorance of the law is not a defense.'