Buffbots, from someone who doesnt have one

[Runolaz]

Originally posted by slacking
Surely when ur part of a group that makes sense as stated previously, you need to work as a group and if the buffer dies so do your buffs (not much chance of that with buff bot at atk).

Also the buffer in the group will take some of the RP's - not so if ur solo and buffed.

Its to the point where u cannot solo unless u have a buffbot, meaning a second account and (unless using 3rd party progs) another spare comp and router. Funny how its only the people with access to this setup which don't see the problem with it, coz u cant solo against a solo of similar spec and level using skill.

Buffed > un buffed solo, no skill required.

nerf buffbots - and many ways of aheiving this without harming the general gamers have been pointed out in other threads.

want buffs - be part of a grp - want to solo - use skill!

Buffs are part of the game...deal with it

I have soled most of the time in RvR without any buffs and often been flattened by other fully buffed soloers...I don't care . Another question how many solo player do you find in RvR. Most of the guys I have jumped has been in a grp and is fully buffed...why shouldn't I...were the buffs came from is IMO irelevant.

My frind has a lvl 43 Shaman and I hope to use him, and if I get for that so be it

Nah...lol...I can see your point but its still a game , and anyway RP is better in grp IMO

 

[Runolaz]

Originally posted by Fingoniel


The cleric running around can be killed, the cleric facing the wall can't.

That's the problem.

Jepp, but the buffed soloer runing around alone is an easy target, even with stealth those damnd Scouts/Rangers always TS, and then you are done buffs or no buffs

 

[belth]

Originally posted by Runolaz
I think it's a wrong to judge other ppl skills based on if they are buffed or not.

And that's only because you have a buffbot, in the making or completed.

 

[Runolaz]

Originally posted by belth

And that's only because you have a buffbot, in the making or completed.

Hmm...actually no, because going around solo, even for a SB is pretty pointless and specially after 1.50 IMO that changed everything. If I solo I usually team up with other SB/Hunters mostly by cg and I find it very amusing buffs or no buffs. Finding a solo player is not easy anymore. Very often it's about picking out targets that ARE buffed and why shouldn't I be buffed too? The point is that if I go into a grp fully buffed I have a good chance. Without buffs I'm attacking a fully buffed char and IMO is not right either.

I can see your point though vs other soloer, but buffs are part of the game. When I die in RvR it's usually from beeing overrun by 3-4fg of albs, and If i see Alpha...I go around him simple as that.

 

[old.chesnor]

Most of you have missed the whole point why buffbots suck.You cannot compare normal cleric/healer/druid buffs to the buffs from buffbots. Most non-bot buffing classes are not specced just to buff. Shamans may have a bit of cave magic, healers some pacificition, clerics some rejuv. If your character gets buffed by a yellow cons no-bot buffer, the buffs will be okay, but not great.

Buffbots are different. Most are redundant accounts, bought by players who will respec (or twink it) and only spec for buffs. The buffbot will be an abysmal character in RvR/PvE. Its only role is to buff, and due to the ~20 buffs rule, probably only buff 1 person.

Point is, how many 100% enhance clerics do you know ? How many full aug shammys? Who actually play regularly? (not including those who respecced in 1.52, they will soon get bored and sell, quit or reroll).

Its like an arms race. We have now reached the point where some classes can't compete unless they get one. People advertise and boast they have them, their victims whine, then get one themselves. So on, so on.

Mythic should really do something about this, and I don't want to hear "yeah but they don't care if people pay". That is totally missing the point. Its not really bad now, but compare the # of buffbots now to say 3 months ago. Now project that 3 months into the future. The it will be really bad. People who are unwilling/unable to run a buffbot will leave, disgusted.

Make all conc based buffs drop at ~10000 range, or something. But just don't accept it, 'cos it will shaft the game. Eventually.

 

[Hit ^_^]

nerf uber items. not all can get them. wich makes the game unfair.

 

[K0nah]

Alpha is very obviously a highly skilled player but he simply couldn't do what he does without a buffbot. And I'm sure (hope) he'd be the first to agree with me

Would I like 40+ enhance buffs that don't drop when the grps healer drops? Fkin A I would! Who wouldn't?!

Question is do u take the game seriously enuf to pay for it?

Second question is should u be allowed to?

I think its a loophole Mythic left in the game to actually encourage buff accounts and hence higher income for themselves.

If Mythic is interested in game balance they will fix buffbots. If their more interested in cash, they wont.

 

[Stormm]

Originally posted by Hit ^_^
nerf uber items. not all can get them. wich makes the game unfair.

drivel.

All players have equal chance to get them depending on how they play, not how much cash the have in RL to support a comp running 2 accounts or 2 comps.

 

[ferghus]

I am a level 50 Champ with a level 36 Bard Buffbot.

For RvR it is almost totally useless. The buffs that I can get from the Bard are nowhere near what I can get from being grouped with a level 50 Druid and Bard. Also if I meet more than two people my level and I am out solo I will almost always get ganked.

I have, on occassion, taken out my buffbot on stick and had a hoot chasing down solo players. HOWEVER the only thing that made a difference was having the speed of the bard to help me. I even managed to take out Alpha in a very close fight both me and my buffbot against Alpha. That was with Bard mezzed and Champ doin all the work.

BUT I would MUCH rather be in a well balanced group out in Emain than running around with my buffbot.

Why do I have one then??

The answer is very simple = as a taxi and as a healer for farming for objects.

Those of you who do not have speed will know where I am coming from when you gotta cover huge distances in your own realm to get to places.

The main use is for object farming. I have been after a belt now and spent over 12 hours killing Black Wraiths with no result 8/. With my bard buffbot I can kill them almost nonstop (orange/ red con to level 50).

Anytime a guildy wants to join me I let em and anytime anyone needs help out in the swamp (hero and warden usually doing epic I lend a hand).

This is often the ONLY way to get items I want as I can log in and start killing immediately whereas to get a group to Innis and then get them to swamp etc usually takes at LEAST half an hour. I often play at odd hours where there are less than 200 people on the whole server and play in short bursts so for me a buffbot makes a LOT of sense.

Also when friends come round I let em play the buffbot as does my 6 year old son. (get em addicted early!!)

All these people flaming buffbots are assuming that they give you a HUGE advantage in RvR. They don't because they are only 1 set of buffs not the 2 you can get from a group and if they are left behind at a keep and you die or are in combat they are utterly useless - cant heal rezz rebuff etc.

And anyway what is to stop a solo player asking another player for a buff?? Why is this any different from a buffbot??

My main point here is that the advantage of having a buffbot is HUGELY overrated in RvR as there isn't really one at all.

1 vs 1 even with no buffs vs buffs the most skilled player will always win out, More important are natural resists and armours, RA's, use of RA's, use of styles and tactics.

1 vs more than one - numbers will usually win out unless the player is a very skilled one.


My twopenneth





Ferghus level 50 Champion
Ferghas level 36 Bard

 

[Eleasias]

uffff a lvl 36 bard is nothing compared to a lvl 50 druid/cleric/shaman with 40 in buffing .. _TT__TT_-t-tT_T_T_T_T_T_T__________T_T_T_

 

[Runolaz]

Originally posted by old.chesnor


Most of you have missed the whole point why buffbots suck.You cannot compare normal cleric/healer/druid buffs to the buffs from buffbots. Most non-bot buffing classes are not specced just to buff. Shamans may have a bit of cave magic, healers some pacificition, clerics some rejuv. If your character gets buffed by a yellow cons no-bot buffer, the buffs will be okay, but not great.

Hehe...my little shaman is full specced cave, but I will respec him later...just wanted to see how it was. That said I'm not going to spec max Aug as someday I migth have fun in RvR with him toO.

I got an extra account mainly to build upp a buffbot to help lvl alts...when I want to solo. I off course will use him on Runolas in RvR if I'm alone, but I would prefere a grp. Solo RvR tendts to be less rewarding both in fun and RP...at least for me.

I think the Buffbot thing in RvR is overrated. Only a small % of my deaths (when solo without buffs) have been caused by Uber buffed solo players like Alpha (think he has flattened me 2 times).

 

[Novamir]

buffbots are underrated as we can see from runolaz post. people think they "don't make much difference". if they made no difference, why would people go to the expense and bother of levelling/aquiring a 2nd char and never be without their buffs?

and L36 bard is a world of diff between 40 enh/nurt/aug bot

 

[Vasconcelos]

Well i wonder if after Alchemy u will be able to combine buff potions and buffs from a buffbot, i you won´t, well we will see some balanced fights. If u can combine both potions n buffs..... OMG a sb killing a group of tanks

 

[Cap'n Sissyfoo]

I have a buff bot (so to speak...it won't arrive till tomorrow) but I have no intention of using it in RvR...EVER! I frankly think that using buff bots in RvR is a stupid way to get an unfair advantage on people who have no buffs or can't find a cleric to give them spare buffs. However, as I don't actually bother with RvR much anyway its not something I worry about. Where buff bots really shine is in soloing. All you people who say that this is a group game and I should be playing a single player game instead can stick their notions up their ass! I'm not going to spend 10-30 mins running around looking for a tangler group or begging someone to let me into their tree group. Its a waste of time. When I have my buff bot all nice and leveled up I won't need to worry about begging people to let me into their groups or asking if I can go on ... the list.

I think that giving buffs a range factor would be the best thing to do but then people who get legit buffs from a cleric and then go off and solo, whether it be RvR or PvE, will feel the sting as well and it won't be fair on them.

Another way to do it would be to put all the buffs on a timer. That way people who take their buff bots into RvR and leave them at the TK will have to come back every 10/15 minutes to get rebuffed. Sure, it will be bloody annoying for clerics having to rebuff everyone every 10/15 minutes but to be honest I can't see another way around it without some group of people whining, can you?


Mythic are not going to get rid of extra accounts for 2 reasons:

1) Its more money in their wallets.

2) There may be a legit reason for having 2 accounts; girl/boy friend/brother/spouse want a different account to play their characters on. It may be that you have made a buff bot using one of their spaces. Do you think that Mythic have the time to search through every account to make sure that people are using the characters correctly and not as buff bots?

Timers/Range factors are probably the only way that Mythic will be able to reduce the use of buff bots but it will only cause a massive outcry from legit enhance characters who will be forced to live a very difficult and tedious life.

Another possibility would be to do away with buffs altogether...no buffs, no buff bots, hence no reason to complain!

 

[belth]

Anyone who says buffs don't affect very much is plain wrong, they make a world of difference to a rogue when buffed vs unbuffed, even zerkers are meleeable to death with 40 enh buffs. Yeah it takes a bit of luck, but when you're hitting them for almost the same as they hit you for (ratmode not counted) and have Evade7 and a bit of Dodger... Guess who's going to lose?

Originally posted by Vasconcelos
Well i wonder if after Alchemy u will be able to combine buff potions and buffs from a buffbot, i you won´t, well we will see some balanced fights. If u can combine both potions n buffs..... OMG a sb killing a group of tanks

Can't combine both Alchemical buffs and casted buffs of same type. They won't bring any resemblance of balance either, as you can drink one potion every 3 minutes and the effect lasts 10 minutes.

 

[hotrat]

1 vs 1 even with no buffs vs buffs the most skilled player will always win out, More important are natural resists and armours, RA's, use of RA's, use of styles and tactics.

Not true, on gorre i wanted to test the power of buffs so i asked my lvl 50 cleric (40 enhance spec) friend to buff me. I then beckoned Wuren (spear hero) for a duel and beat him using no styles and no dd's//stun//mezz, how is that skill? I lost about 30-40% of my hits.
I also did the same with Jozen although he slammed me and so i had to use a few styles on him (no dd's though).

Maybe a few active RA's and moose would make it a closer fight, but we both get IP and when he mooses i can just SOS, stealth and wait till moose runs out.

You cant compare a bard's baseline buffs to a high enhance spec clerics//druids//shamans.

Basically buffs need a range like speed song 5 does, make it a wider radius, say 8000, and when someone leaves the radius they loose buffs until they re-enter the area.

 

[belth]

Originally posted by Sissyfoo
Mythic are not going to get rid of extra accounts for 2 reasons:

1) Its more money in their wallets.

It's been proven in a quite large amount of MMORPGs that unfair advantages ruin the game for the players without the said advantage, which in turn leads to mass exodus at some point, be the advantage buffbots, cheats, etc, it means less money to the games publisher/upkeeper in the end.

 

[Flimgoblin]

Originally posted by K0nah
If Mythic is interested in game balance they will fix buffbots. If their more interested in cash, they wont.

It ain't that simple.

Buffbot accounts if perceived to be a huge imbalance by the players (and not just the IGN vault whiners) will lead to people leaving in disgust, not to more money for Mythic.

Also they can't just slap a heavy nerf on buffs without screwing over the real-life buffers. No matter what solution they come up with it will affect the healers/shamen/clerics/druids who actually play their characters. They need to minimise any negative effects on the real players while still solving the 'immortal buffer' problem.

 

[Stormm]

well why not allow buffers to only buff those in a grp, then if you use a buff bot u lose half ur rps - fair enough methinks

 

[Flimgoblin]

Originally posted by Runolaz


Jepp, but the buffed soloer runing around alone is an easy target, even with stealth those damnd Scouts/Rangers always TS, and then you are done buffs or no buffs

so a once every 30m realm ability that costs lots of RAs is the counter to assassins with buffbots?

every other 29m they can run around killing anything they run into

good plan that, don't play an assassin perchance do you?

 

[Flimgoblin]

Originally posted by slacking
well why not allow buffers to only buff those in a grp, then if you use a buff bot u lose half ur rps - fair enough methinks

that'd piss off half the real-clerics etc. it's one suggestion that's been put forward - there are a few that are quite good. All of them impact on the real-life buffers in some way.

 

[Runolaz]

Originally posted by Novamir
buffbots are underrated as we can see from runolaz post. people think they "don't make much difference". if they made no difference, why would people go to the expense and bother of levelling/aquiring a 2nd char and never be without their buffs?

and L36 bard is a world of diff between 40 enh/nurt/aug bot

Because ppl allways bitch and whine...if it wasn't this it would be something else. What I ment was how many are actually soloing in RvR? Most ppl are grped and fully buffed. Off course buffs matter if you solo 1v1 no point arguing about that.

And as a simple answer to why get two accounts. More chars to play, irl wanting to play from time to time etc. And expense? I don't know about you, but paying for 2 accounts is only a "piss in the sea" for me.

 

[Novamir]

Originally posted by Runolaz

Off course buffs matter if you solo 1v1 no point arguing about that.

so, what were you arguing about? because i was making the point that stealthers who can pick their fights are god-like with buffbots (if they have skills). highlander minstrel with decent buffbot + IP + SoS = WOW type of character.

you just confirmed what i had said. tx.

 

[Novamir]

ps. refer to http://forums.barrysworld.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=37442

 

[Runolaz]

Originally posted by Novamir


so, what were you arguing about? because i was making the point that stealthers who can pick their fights are god-like with buffbots (if they have skills). highlander minstrel with decent buffbot + IP + SoS = WOW type of character.

you just confirmed what i had said. tx.

I don't believe anyone thinks it doesn't matter if you use buffbots or not 1v1, but you have to get the big picture here and I think you missed my point. Most ppl are in grps and buffed. How do you know where the buffs came from? Buffs are part of the game...deal with it and stop whining.

If you want to take up issues that effect most ppl RvR I'll tell you what I think make Buffbots pale in comparison and that is the hugh Zergs mostly done by Albs. Last night, as we have had many nigths b4 there was an UBER alb Zerg at mmg Emain. I couldn't even get out. I think it must have been like 10-1. And yes I got some buffs (not all the time) from a Buffbot...not mine...did it help...no, and of all the ppl I jumped all were buffed. I'll bet that ppl die 100x more of one side having UBER edge in numbers and fare less to Buffed soloers walking arround. That said I think whining over Zergs is silly too, if you don't like it go play an alt or what ever.

To me the whining w00t I got owned by Alpha...but he was buffed, as in w00t he is cheating/has no skill, is IMO just bitching. If you wanna get buffs...get into a grp or ask someone if they have something left over. As I've said b4 I have very seldom had any buffs at all, but i have never bitched about it...keep that in mind.

And finaly Novamir...you have "ganked" me more than once buffed to the sky...and me without, not that it matters, beacuse I would have died anyway

 

[old.LandShark]

Originally posted by lofff
actually herbal, ur preety wrong there

buffed stealther = shadowtank. stealthers aint meant to outtank puremelee classes (hero, warrior, armsman) NO THEY ARE NOT. They shouldnt... buffbots = wrong.

First, a stealther outmeleeing a tank with buffs? Hasn't yet happened for me i'm afraid, not vs a lvl50...
Secondly, BUFFS = wrong, not buffbots, if you're saying that...
Is it wrong for stealthers to outmelee pure melee classes if they're grouped with a real player who is buffing them??

 

[Novamir]

Originally posted by Runolaz

Most ppl are in grps and buffed. How do you know where the buffs came from? Buffs are part of the game...deal with it and stop whining.

er? we know that if you're grouped and a player buffs you, the buffs have come from that player do we not? i can completely deal with the fact that buffs are part of the game- but it's when a non-playing-character makes a stealth char uber thats the prob.

yes I got some buffs (not all the time) from a Buffbot...not mine...did it help...no, and of all the ppl I jumped all were buffed.

why were you trying to solo in a zerg? go to gorge or something like aussie and alpha the buffbot twins.

To me the whining w00t I got owned by Alpha...but he was buffed, as in w00t he is cheating/has no skill, is IMO just bitching. If you wanna get buffs...get into a grp or ask someone if they have something left over.

ok i don't think alpha has no skill, or is cheating. i think it's cheap that he uses a buffbot and can gank heros in melee. it's an unfair advantage imo. and don't worry about me- you'll never find me solo anymore for this very reason.

 

[old.chesnor]

Runloaz, you are wrong. If you are in a fg with say 2 classes that can buff. Thats about 40 buffs they can spread out. That works out at 5 buffs per group member. Also take most Healers/Shaman in Mid as an example. How many full Aug healers does Mid have ? How many full Aug Shaman? Now, think about how many of the buffbots are specced just to buff, they don't have to do anything else. Also, the bot normally only buffs 1 person.

So rather than 5 ok buffs, you get a full set of uber buffs. That makes a massive difference to ANY class in this game. End of....

 

[hotrat]

Indeed it maybe that a lot of ppl are buffed, but as people have said they aren't usually buffs from a full enhance spec, nor are they fully buffed as the buffer must buff all the group not just one player.
Being buffed and trying to kill zergs is pointless and really gives you very little advantage. Although a solo mage could rack up the rp's if they had full buffs and just nuked away from the safety of the back of a zerg.
However a buffed solo character has a much higher chance of beating someone one vs one, which is why a buffed stealther is so much more effective because they can pick their fights, and win most of them (unless their opponent is also buffed )

highlander minstrel with decent buffbot + IP + SoS = WOW type of character

Highlander doesn't matter (2xx in all stats with buffs) , plus they were a skirt so that makes them less WOW

 

[belth]

Runolaz, teh ubah wannabe, wants to kill people with impunity in zergs. That's what he's saying.