antalya shawl vs som

[Konah]

no som no template.

 

[Manisch Depressiv]

[X] I use SoM to win solo fights on a Paladin or an Armsman and I should delete my char.
[X] I think SoM will make my group win fights.
[X] I think cluttering the landscape with other SoM-zergers is cool!

Seriously, FAS for the groups due to the better overall template at the end and SoM on a Paladin or Armsman is not needed to kill other classes when you are out solo.

 

[Rub]

SoM on a Paladin or Armsman is not needed to kill other classes when you are out solo.

it's not needed but it helps a LOT

 

[Golena]

That's not true, SoM is *not* the better cloak, SoM simply has the better proc. The stats on FAS are far superior to those on SoM. SoM is absolutely rubbish, the *only* reason people use it is because of the proc.

SOM is by far the better cloak all being equal (the proc is what the cloak is about). The problem here is that you can't say you should use X or you should use Y without knowing what the rest of the template surrounding it is like.

As has been pointed out SOM only has to proc twice in a melee fight (that's not unusual) to make it's util far exceed any other cloak out there. Since paladins tend to take a fair beating, it's actually giving you an even greater advantage than those that don't.
Fighting casters it gives you very little util, so the question then becomes what are you giving up to make up for it. If you have to drop melee resists a touch and you can fit it in, then you might find that the amount of extra damage it lets you absorb is actually greater than you would of reduced by having those resists. Will the extra dex you can SC in with FAS let you block enough to negate the damage SOM would of taken.

Until you know what your losing from the template (and the enemy's you tend to be encountering) it's impossible to make a descission as to if the trade off is worth it.

The problem with thinking like that is SOM has such piss poor utility that fitting it into your template will usually mean you have to suffer weak spots elsewhere in your stats, skills or resists to make up for it.

I've always prefered to be good 24/7 with no weak spots then great for a limited time and weak the rest.

You cannot afford to have any low resists these days, specially with legendaries becoming spellcraftable and therefore more desireable next patch.

I think this depends very much on who you are as well however.

You play a high RR toon, and play it very very well.. This means you should in theory be able to put up a good fight against anyone out there. If you take a low RR character from someone who isn't as good then the scenario becomes very different.
Building a template that's uber for 1 minute out of every 15 and average for the other 14 mins might let them go out and get that kill every 15 minutes.. Remember they are most probably only going to be running into higher RR people than themselves, so they need some edge other than just nice stats, the other guy probably has higher passives so he's better than you in this department anyway.
It may be they do this by gimping a resist, which means 10% of the server will get free RP's off them. If it gives them a better chance against the other 90% that may be a good tradeoff for someone who simply isn't going to win every fight.

1 kill every 15 mins = 5-6k an hour
1 (I came close but lost cos my enemy had 7RR's on me) every 5 minutes = 0k an hour.

With the current state of the game, you tend not to find fights more than once every 10 mins anyway, especially if your not known so the FG's roll you. That makes having a few timers much more attractive than putting up a good fight against everyone but closely losing them all.

 

[Demon2k3]

SOM is by far the better cloak all being equal (the proc is what the cloak is about). The problem here is that you can't say you should use X or you should use Y without knowing what the rest of the template surrounding it is like.

As has been pointed out SOM only has to proc twice in a melee fight (that's not unusual) to make it's util far exceed any other cloak out there. Since paladins tend to take a fair beating, it's actually giving you an even greater advantage than those that don't.
Fighting casters it gives you very little util, so the question then becomes what are you giving up to make up for it. If you have to drop melee resists a touch and you can fit it in, then you might find that the amount of extra damage it lets you absorb is actually greater than you would of reduced by having those resists. Will the extra dex you can SC in with FAS let you block enough to negate the damage SOM would of taken.

Until you know what your losing from the template (and the enemy's you tend to be encountering) it's impossible to make a descission as to if the trade off is worth it.



I think this depends very much on who you are as well however.

You play a high RR toon, and play it very very well.. This means you should in theory be able to put up a good fight against anyone out there. If you take a low RR character from someone who isn't as good then the scenario becomes very different.
Building a template that's uber for 1 minute out of every 15 and average for the other 14 mins might let them go out and get that kill every 15 minutes.. Remember they are most probably only going to be running into higher RR people than themselves, so they need some edge other than just nice stats, the other guy probably has higher passives so he's better than you in this department anyway.
It may be they do this by gimping a resist, which means 10% of the server will get free RP's off them. If it gives them a better chance against the other 90% that may be a good tradeoff for someone who simply isn't going to win every fight.

1 kill every 15 mins = 5-6k an hour
1 (I came close but lost cos my enemy had 7RR's on me) every 5 minutes = 0k an hour.

With the current state of the game, you tend not to find fights more than once every 10 mins anyway, especially if your not known so the FG's roll you. That makes having a few timers much more attractive than putting up a good fight against everyone but closely losing them all.

alot of valid points there. Yes i'm low rr only 3l8. finding fights ai'nt so hard actually as i roam irvr areas.

Now about my pally
Spec: 50 2h 34 crush 46 chants 7 shield rest parry. So the statement that i block more with more dex is also wrong. I find 2H supperior to S/S, partially for the damage output, atm i have over 300 damage styled. unstyled around 150-170.

But with FAS i can easily get those extra resists in like energy, matter and spirit than i get it with SoM. But then i guess i'll have to make a template and try them both .

 

[Kagato]

Im not going to debate about antalya vs som anymore as all that needs to be said has already been said wether you agree or disagree and secondly its all basically a matter of opinion.

No one can say 100% for certain 1 is better then the other, its down to template, preferance and playstyle.

However to answer an earlier question, old legendaries DO become retroactively spellcraftable.

BUT the old old pre-1.70 patch ones with the different stats (like con rather then dex) wont be spellcraftable.

This is something to do with the stats being changed already once, so when you zone they revert.

That is my understanding of things.

 

[Demon2k3]

Im not going to debate about antalya vs som anymore as all that needs to be said has already been said wether you agree or disagree and secondly its all basically a matter of opinion.

No one can say 100% for certain 1 is better then the other, its down to template, preferance and playstyle.

However to answer an earlier question, old legendaries DO become retroactively spellcraftable.

BUT the old old pre-1.70 patch ones with the different stats (like con rather then dex) wont be spellcraftable.

This is something to do with the stats being changed already once, so when you zone they revert.

That is my understanding of things.

no not at all i agree with you both on many thing, my playstyles i more or less
to be item dependant, altho som don't make me item dependant it would ne quite good to learn without having to rely on a proc to go off to survive.

golena got a point tho that the som proc is quite good and i know it's good myself to. But i'll listen to what's been said and try them both in a template .

rep bor both kagato and golena for making such constructive posts .

 

[Cloudz]

Shawl does look nice and if you can find a template with it to fit really nice into then go for that, I wanted to make a temp with it, but it was to exspensive at the time etc, SoM proc is pretty uber though

 

[Konah]

No one can say 100% for certain 1 is better then the other

get 2 ppl of the same class/spec & rr, one with a shawl template, the other with an som template, have them duel 10 times with som up. the overall winner will be the som user, end of story.

 

[Sharaft]

i agree with those saying no cloak is the best, its all about your template.

and yes SoM only for proc, it looks cool, but the shawl is alot more unique, and that makes it more cool to run with it imo xD

try to make a template around that cloak imo ^ ^

 

[Kagato]

get 2 ppl of the same class/spec & rr, one with a shawl template, the other with an som template, have them duel 10 times with som up. the overall winner will be the som user, end of story.

That will only tell you which one is best if you are fighting someone who happens to be the same RR same spec and same class. RvR does not work like that sadly as you should well know.

fighting an enemy slow weapon user the som proc will rarely go off, I know as I am a slow weapon user and rarely have trouble from enemy som's.

but reverse the situration and fight fast weapon DW users and you will soon see how different that can be when they will be procing your SOM all the time.

In one situration the utility of Antalya will be better, in the other, SOM will benefit for you more = there is no one better cloak then the other.

 

[Smellysox]

I use SoM because im worth it .

 

[DavidH]

I use SoM because im worth it .

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On topic: Use cloak bought from dye master!

 

[Rub]

On topic: Use cloak bought from dye master!

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think theres something wrong with my quote button