all realms adding

[Raven]

There have been some really tough low level assassins over the years who went on to be only slightly tougher high RR assassins. RR has far less meaning than it did 4 years ago, there are so many toys you can get in pve now that the difference doesn't show as much, personal "skill", equipment and knowledge of game mechanics is far more important in 1v1 than RR these days.

 

[Esselinithia]

kivik
Wrong.
1st. 2 years ago you had very different chances with soloing, but you proven one thing: rr5 took you 2 years, even if you loved soloing
2nd. I said some class that isn't extra strong in solo, so some visible pls
3rd. If I know well, you either use classic or roll buffed which isn't the same as getting out without help of a bot on normal servers
4th. You had prefarmed equipment
5th: In your time, you had a chance to get MLs on most raids, but since now everyone gets them from BPs...

So no, what you did isn't the same, but something FAR easier, and yet you proven, it takes 5 years to get to RR5 or so, for a class that is good for soloing and picking their fights. That is 40 realm skill point? On an old dragon raid: Purge 2 was excepted by most leaders, for healer types DI 2 was good (DI3 better) and some RAs for better casting speed / healing. So this is about the "needed" level. We can see other classes as well.

So in fact your had a HUGE head start over what we discussed here.
You had several big advantages, the strongest soloing class, and said it would take 2 years to get ready with your stuff.

A bit more if you can't start with full template, MLs, etc. because you need BPs to buy them, and even more with aless strong class.

You tried to avoid saying this by saying you done it already, but in essence you just proved yourself wrong.

 

[Cylian]

what's squishier than a SB ? o0

 

[Septima]

Kiv is right, if people can't see why it's beacause they never soloed from rr1 on any toon....

 

[kivik]

You had several big advantages, the strongest soloing class.

If most of you guys had any form of proper experience soloing maybe I'd assume you were right in some way, but...

I rest my case, assuming a bloody frostalf left axe shadowblade is the strongest soloing class and then suggesting me to roll a visible for hardmode is laughable.

A newbie player will lose to an experience player, yes. A bad player will lose to a good player, yes. A non-buffed player will lose to a buffed player, yes. A bad templated player will most likely lose to a well templated player, yes. But that has nothing to do with the original statement.

And the fact is took me almost two years to reach rr5 proves that I'm a casual player, plenty of soloers out there that get to rr7 within a few month(s).

 

[Gear]

Took me about 7 months in OF to get rr5 on the ranger, mostly without buffs. What's the point?

 

[old.Whoodoo]

Took me about 7 months in OF to get rr5 on the ranger, mostly without buffs. What's the point?

Most people didnt have buff bots in OF, you were not alone. Stealthers in OF had major advantages including the infamous bottlenecks like milegates.

 

[Golena]

Lets remove the possibilities of ebay for this discussion.

A newbie player will lose to an experience player, yes.

By the time you've got enough RP's for rr10 we can assume that you've got more experience than your freshly leveled 50 newb.

A bad player will lose to a good player, yes.

I'd guess that no matter how they got the RP's your average RR10 character is probably a better player than your new RR1 guy these days.

A non-buffed player will lose to a buffed player, yes.

Most players who have played to RR10 either have their own bot or know someone in the game able to give them buffs. Not so for most new players.

A bad templated player will most likely lose to a well templated player, yes.

Again your average RR10 character will have bounty points to buy the new jewelry. They probably also have most needed arti credits or can simply buy them along with the scrolls for BP's. They will also these days be ML10.
Your RR1 is probably ML0, no-one does raids anymore, and maybe with only a few arti's he's managed to scrape together.

And the fact is took me almost two years to reach rr5 proves that I'm a casual player, plenty of soloers out there that get to rr7 within a few month(s).

People re-rolling characters at RR1 are NOT RR1 players.
You can fairly safely say that RR1 < RR10 if you take into account their highest level toon. Someone with an RR6 char can reroll an RR1 char and solo ok. They know the game mechanics, they probably have friends on the server to help out with the PvE stuff. Your NEW RR1 character has pretty much none of that stuff, and saying that in a few days they can be competing with the proper soloers out on the server is almost laughable. I doubt more than 1% of the casual population would stay playing a game where they managed to kill something once every week due to "getting lucky with the RNG".
I tried to solo on Dyvet quite a bit on low RR toons and did okish. If I only played the hours many casual players could put in i'd probably only of got 3 or 4 kills a week tho. Now i've rolled on the US servers and killed 30 people without dying.. how many kills do you think that lot would of got if they had tried to solo over here?

You say it took you almost 2 years to reach RR5. Most casual players don't play the same game for 2 years! In your world no proper casual player would get close to RR5.
People are talking about casual players playing 2/3 hours a day!! In reality it's probably less than half that.

 

[kivik]

You say it took you almost 2 years to reach RR5. Most casual players don't play the same game for 2 years! In your world no proper casual player would get close to RR5.
People are talking about casual players playing 2/3 hours a day!! In reality it's probably less than half that.

Sure they play games more than 2 years. Also, it took me two years not only because I didn't play much, but because I also soloed exclusively, I almost didn't even help my realmmates if they were getting spanked 2v1. That's why most casuals choose to zerg n' add, for the holy realmpoint meights!

The rest of your post is pointless, again, old.Whoodoo said:

"Mr. RR1 can't kill Mr. RR10 for obvious reasons"

Now if he would've said

"Mr. new-to-the-game-with-no-friends-and-no-template can't kill Mr. old-timer-buffboted-supertemplated for obvious reasons"

I would agree with him.

But he didn't.

He only mentioned the RRs cause he thought that was obvious reasons enough.

But it isn't

Comprende?

 

[Esselinithia]

kivik: No. I can say kivik, without saying the soloer who uses the name kivik on the fh and can have other names in the game to make people know who we are talking about.

YOU know you are destructive in the game.
But instead of admiting it and trying to improve you become a forum troll and try to side track a valid and easy to understand post by trying to interpret details.

Next time, you will say an RR1 who is played by someone who works in Industrial Light and Magic can win against an RR10... if we speak about a daoc video contest and he is free to use his tools. Or an RR1 player spends more with IRL activities so can win in soccer, so indeed he can win. Got the point?

 

[Esselinithia]

I rest my case, assuming a bloody frostalf left axe shadowblade is the strongest soloing class and then suggesting me to roll a visible for hardmode is laughable.

You play a stealther, who has good chance to choose who he wants to fight with.

Lets make a visible.

Lets make a support class.

Make sure he don't have a buffbot.

And see.

Why? Because most people who want to play for fun, and the people who have problems don't have buffbots, play visibles. And to make the game viable for them it should be viable for all classes, and if they want to have a support class it is their choice. And If they don't specc for buffs that is their choice as well.

And when you have tried you will know why your SB is easymode.

 

[Cylian]

You play a stealther, who has good chance to choose who he wants to fight with.

Lets make a visible.

Lets make a support class.

Make sure he don't have a buffbot.

take off all armor

fight barehanded

do not use the mouse

And see.

Why? Because most people who want to play for fun, and the people who have problems don't have buffbots, play visibles. And to make the game viable for them it should be viable for all classes, and if they want to have a support class it is their choice. And If they don't specc for buffs that is their choice as well.

And when you have tried you will know why your SB is easymode.

you forgot some.

 

[kivik]

Just give up already

I won't even bother argue with you anymore, cause you're going into completly different things.

I'm right you are not.

Your turn.

 

[Golena]

I'm right you are not.

Your turn.

Your right by taking the quote completely out of the context in which it was written.

If we take the quote and discuss it in the style of a tabloid newspaper trying to fabricate a story/advertise how big your epeen is then your 100% right.

There, a solution we can all be happy with.

 

[kivik]

Your right by taking the quote completely out of the context in which it was written.

Heh, expected that one way earlier, if it now was 'out of context'

Sucks being wrong, does it?

 

[Ctuchik]

You could just say:

Newbie/Bad player << Experienced/Good player

And I would agree with you Cause the reasons here are obvious enough

so 2 equally good/bad players, one is RR1 and the other is RR10 wont mean that the RR10 will win 9.9 times out of 10?

i'm not trying to compare good players versus bad player. i'm comparing 2 equal players.

and when you face a equally good player then all i comes down to is who has the most RA's..... and then the RR10 will win. hands down.

 

[kivik]

so 2 equally good/bad players, one is RR1 and the other is RR10 wont mean that the RR10 will win 9.9 times out of 10?

i'm not trying to compare good players versus bad player. i'm comparing 2 equal players.

and when you face a equally good player then all i comes down to is who has the most RA's..... and then the RR10 will win. hands down.

Great, at last someone who sees my point. I understand you do look at the statement this way, I think most do, cause it does sounds most logical.

However, the RR10 has an disadvantage that is stronger than any RA in his arsenal, overconfidence. I can't remember how many times I've spotted another rr2 stealther and thought 'heh, lowbie, free rps! won't need to swap weapons ' and then got: BOOM hamstring chain, dead Same with many low RR tanks.

Ontop of that there's also the RNG (random numbers generator), if a rr1 infil evade-stun and follow up with landing full hamstring chain and matter debuff procs you're practically dead.

Think we all have seen stealthers evading 80% of the attacks and tanks block/parry 99% of the attacks.

The higher RR does have an advantage, mop5 and purge3 will win most fights for you. But, thinking 'I won't need to use abilities on this lowbie' and getting absolutely shred to bits before you can react will cost you many losses aswell

So in theory you could probably say: RR10 > RR1

But practically it'd be more like: RR10 >= RR1

This doesn't mean I suggest all RR1s to solo from scratch cause it'll be easy peasy, it requires alot of work and patience. Collecting a few RPs in iRvR zerg to get you to rr3ish should be enough to get the basic RAs and to be more of a threat to high RRs

 

[Golena]

However, the RR10 has an disadvantage that is stronger than any RA in his arsenal, overconfidence. I can't remember how many times I've spotted another rr2 stealther and thought 'heh, lowbie, free rps! won't need to swap weapons ' and then got: BOOM hamstring chain, dead Same with many low RR tanks.

Roger Federer isn't a better tennis player than me because once when I played him he wasn't really concentrating and double faulted on his serve giving me a point!

Again that isn't proving that the RR1 is greater than the RR10. It's just you've found one rare example of an RR10 being stupid. Next you'll argue that an RR10 = RR1 because the RR10 could be sat down AFK during the fight, or of forgotten to actually equip a sword!

It's all irrelevant because again you've taken the quote completely out of context purely to shout about how uber you are. If you want to go one step further then why not point out that R is a number greater than zero, since all he did was write a mathematical equation. (R * R * 10) > (R * R)

 

[kivik]

to shout about how uber you are

No, that's even why I pointed out I don't even consider myself a good player Nice try, though.

I'm shouting about how RR10 >>> RR1 isn't obvious enough just because of RRs.

But feel free to keep saying I'm 'out of context' because you ran out of arguments, you're not the first one to do that.

I've done this I'm talking about, I've soloed from RR1, therefore I can tell you you are wrong. Have you done that? No, didn't think so. Again, I'm not saying I'm more uberer than you, but I've experienced it, while you have not.

 

[Maeloch]

I don't understand exactly what the argument is here, but if it's that u can't play competitively solo on a toon at low rr and a couple of hrs a day playing. Just need to use ur brains an bit and learn from mistakes and what's killing u and stick with it.

ofc if you define 'casual player' as soemone who is not interested or cba to thiink a bit about tatics, templating, etc then ofc they will get killed alot more.

Moaners who just lose a bit then quit, the game isn't fair etc will never give the game chance to learn a bit either.

Realm rank is an advantage, but not the bee all, and tbh part of the fun of playing a lowbie toon is 'giant slaying' high rr toons anyhow. Might not kill as much stuff, but it's sweeter when u do.

 

[Ctuchik]

since all he did was write a mathematical equation. (R * R * 10) > (R * R)

i did? man i HATE math!

 

[Thadius]

I don't understand exactly what the argument is here, but if it's that u can't play competitively solo on a toon at low rr and a couple of hrs a day playing. Just need to use ur brains an bit and learn from mistakes and what's killing u and stick with it.

ofc if you define 'casual player' as soemone who is not interested or cba to thiink a bit about tatics, templating, etc then ofc they will get killed alot more.

Moaners who just lose a bit then quit, the game isn't fair etc will never give the game chance to learn a bit either.

Realm rank is an advantage, but not the bee all, and tbh part of the fun of playing a lowbie toon is 'giant slaying' high rr toons anyhow. Might not kill as much stuff, but it's sweeter when u do.

There is generally less skill at high realm rank, look at Horner

 

[old.Whoodoo]

OK, so now we all have it firmly in our heads that ebayers and new inexperienced players are to all be refered to as n00bs or unskilled, and someone with 5 years background of no daylight, pizza eating, monkey spanking, solvent sniffing to the prospect of acheiving the pinacle of melee damage and creating a template with 2000 utility being his only pleasure in life should be regarded as a god and allowed to cry "OI NOOB STOP LEECHING MY SOLO KEELS".

Riiiiiight.

Now back to the subject of adding.

If its red, its dead. Anything else is up to the individual, regardless of what opinion other players have. Liberal use of the /ignore command is recommended, as well as avoiding forums like this where you will be flamed on sight as not being "733Tz0r!". This could otherwise be called "f*ck em, lets have fun!".


Thad m8, Horner was French, nuff said.

 

[kivik]

OK, so now we all have it firmly in our heads that ebayers and new inexperienced players are to all be refered to as n00bs or unskilled, and someone with 5 years background of no daylight, pizza eating, monkey spanking, solvent sniffing to the prospect of acheiving the pinacle of melee damage and creating a template with 2000 utility being his only pleasure in life should be regarded as a god and allowed to cry "OI NOOB STOP LEECHING MY SOLO KEELS".

Riiiiiight.

That... was not exactly what I was trying to say But you just had to twist it around and throw around more prejudices and crap instead of just accepting it. Oh well

This could otherwise be called "f*ck em, lets have fun!".

Or a vicious circle.

 

[Golena]

I've done this I'm talking about, I've soloed from RR1, therefore I can tell you you are wrong. Have you done that? No, didn't think so. Again, I'm not saying I'm more uberer than you, but I've experienced it, while you have not.

I've spent more time than you soloing on sub RR4 classes.
Want to make any other completely false assumptions about me?

I've also beaten RR10+ characters but it doesn't mean that they don't have an advantage over me, the same as having a better template or being a better player might mean I have an advantage over them..

Or would you say that good player > bad player was also a load of crap because the bad player can sometimes win against the good player if they get lucky with the RNG or have the right RA's up.

 

[kirennia]

Tbh I think people are being too harsh on Kivik. He has some valid points in there and he isn't saying any of them are absolute as such.

No, that's even why I pointed out I don't even consider myself a good player Nice try, though.

I'm shouting about how RR10 >>> RR1 isn't obvious enough just because of RRs.

But feel free to keep saying I'm 'out of context' because you ran out of arguments, you're not the first one to do that.

I've done this I'm talking about, I've soloed from RR1, therefore I can tell you you are wrong. Have you done that? No, didn't think so. Again, I'm not saying I'm more uberer than you, but I've experienced it, while you have not.

Apart from the end of that one

 

[Golena]

Tbh I think people are being too harsh on Kivik. He has some valid points in there and he isn't saying any of them are absolute as such.

All his points are technically correct yes.

People who are prepared to spend weeks putting together a template and trying to learn how to get everthing out of their class without having actually killed a member of the oposing realms ever in their life are rather few and far between however, so the fact that it's actually possible for an above average player to beat people of higher RR than them really has nothing to do with what was being discussed tho. I could walk into a discusssion about what the best chocolate is and make lots of valid points about how armsmen are overpowered in 1v1's, i'd be "right" but not particularly constructive.

Everyone that's killed an RR10 char with an RR1 char solo is either playing an alt or is a very large exception to the rule. He pretty much summed it up when he claimed that the reason the new RR1 people can't kill RR10 people was because they were too lazy to try. It's very rarely about being lazy for new players, that's just the standard rant given by people that are too lazy to want to worry about positioning in RvR so die to newbie adds.

When I was soloing and died to an add then I viewed it as me messing up for being placed on the battle field wrong. Most people seem to simply assume it's the fault of the RR2 char that wandered past for being lazy these days as if learning your class doesn't include how to play it in an RvR environment and that's somehow other people's fault.

 

[kivik]

Or would you say that good player > bad player was also a load of crap because the bad player can sometimes win against the good player if they get lucky with the RNG or have the right RA's up.

Not really, because playing your class properly over playing it bad is more important to the outcome of the fight than who is highest RR.

That's what I'm trying to say.

And again, I wouldn't expect or want a RR1 newbie to the game to come out and start of with hardcore soloing. That's not the point I'm trying to make, yet you seem to assume that all the time.

I've spent more time than you soloing on sub RR4 classes.
Want to make any other completely false assumptions about me?

Isn't that an assumption in itself?

I asked before that post if anyone had any form of proper solo experience, it all got very quiet. Until I said it again but this time as a fact, then you saw the opportunity to jump it, huh?

 

[Gamah]

Why do people who enjoy competative fights based on even numbers get called "leetz0rs" which is normally followed by some mock sentence containing more numbers than letters by the crowd that enjoys zerging things down with little care or ability to test thier class to the max.

I never understood that, I guess it is an attempt to put them in a bad light so the "adders" can feel better about the way they play and attempt to take the moral high ground!

I'll tell you now that no one I have ever played with has typed a sentence like "omfg we r teh 1337sz0rs" if they didn't I would tell them to be silent.

 

[Golena]

Not really, because playing your class properly over playing it bad is more important to the outcome of the fight than who is highest RR.

That's what I'm trying to say.

To be fair we're now arguing over semantics. Technically i'm probably right but in arguing it i'm being no better than you with regards to the point of the thread so lets just admit that playing your class well is the most important thing in a fight, but RR is also important (although can be countered by good play) and move on?

And again, I wouldn't expect or want a RR1 newbie to the game to come out and start of with hardcore soloing. That's not the point I'm trying to make, yet you seem to assume that all the time.

I'm actually not assuming that your implying it. It's more of a general whine against the endless people that come here to whine about constant zerging and adding knowing full well that most of the people doing it arn't at a point in the game where hardcore soloing is an enjoyable option for them. Screaming "omg I got added down by clueless albs" every 5 minutes on a forum isn't compatible with a I don't expect RR2's to solo all the time attitude. It's not from what I remember normally you that's doing it so not aiming it at you.

Isn't that an assumption in itself?

I asked before that post if anyone had any form of proper solo experience, it all got very quiet. Until I said it again but this time as a fact, then you saw the opportunity to jump it, huh?

Yeah it probably is and based upon the fact that you called yourself a casual player. The number of hours i've wasted (actually I had fun during them so don't consider it a waste since that's what I view as what's important) running about solo on low RR toons is something that I don't think a casual player would be able to match.

The problem with defining "proper solo experience" is that it seems to change by the hour. Is soloing running about solo looking for kills or standing motionless at a bridge waiting for duels. Is killing someone on low life then trying to get away alive soloing or lame ganking of someone on low life? It differs depending on who you talk to so what does the term "proper" mean here?