A Poisoned World

[Joor]

what is a credible source mr tris ?

 

[tris-]

well this is just imo ofc, and im sure some people may agree

1)the source isnt biased

i will leave you with that one for now.

 

[Ballard]

Well how about some of the questions raised in this article by the guardian, one of the respected papers in the UK

http://politics.guardian.co.uk/homeaffairs/story/0,11026,1667772,00.html

sure aspartame maybe one molecule but on digestion it breaks down into three other compounds:

Aspartame breaks down into three components - a methyl ester and two amino acids: phenylalanine and aspartic acid, according to Roger Williams during the parliamentary debate.

The sweetener industry repeatedly pointed out that these compounds occur naturally in food and drink, yet that statement hid the complex science that makes each one harmful to humans when found in aspartame, he added. In food, phenylalanine and aspartic acid are bound to other amino acids in long, complex chains of proteins so that they are not absorbed in a way that could cause damage. But in aspartame they are not, and enzymes in the gut can easily split them apart.

Once phenylalanine is released in its free form, it is metabolised into diketopiperazine, a suspected carcinogen. Aspartic acid in its free form becomes an excitotoxin, a toxic molecule that stimulates nerve cells to the point of damage or death.

The third component of aspartame, methyl ester, was the most harmful, Mr Williams said. It is metabolised by the body into methanol, a well-known poison. In the US, the environmental protection agency defines safe consumption of methanol as no more than 7.8mg a day. Anyone drinking three cans of a drink sweetened with aspartame a day was consuming about 56mg of methanol, the MP said.

another key point:

Doubts about aspartame among FDA scientists were overruled by the FDA's administration and it was given approval. Many other countries soon followed suit and approved aspartame on the basis of the same flawed studies, Mr Williams said. In 1996 a review of aspartame research found that every single industry-funded study found aspartame safe. But 92% of independent studies identified one or more problems with its safety.

 

[tris-]

Lethal doses are thought to range from 30-240 mL; the minimum lethal dose is believed to be 1 g/kg body weight.

http://www.emedicine.com/NEURO/topic217.htm

BELIEVED. its not a fact u c.

 

[Ballard]

Any papers that I can find suggest that N-methyl-D-aspartate (metabolite of aspartame..) actually helps protect against nigrostriatal degeneration in Parkinson's patients rather than exacerbating it. (Armentero et al, Neurobiology of Disease, Volume 22, Issue 1, April 2006, Pages 1-9).

Can you please provide a link to this source (if it is avaliable in the public domain) as I would like to read it in the interest of being informed.

But seriously guys, just fully read this for some more info.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aspartame

How can you not at least be concerned?

 

[Marc]

Well the EFSA says its safe so I will take their word from it. And as the E stands for EUROPEAN all you anti-us europeans cant play the "oh it must be bullshit cos its come out of the us" card.

 

[old.Tohtori]

btw, i ask again where is your credible sources about this? mr grown up man sir.

Such jerry lewis material

 

[Joor]

From the same site http://www.emedicine.com/NEURO/topic217.htm : Parkinsonism and other dystonic/hypokinetic clinical pictures also can occur.

 

[Marc]

http://www.aspartame.info/aspartame_opinion.html

"adults need at least 10 cans of a drink fully sweetened with aspartame alone to reach the acceptable daily intake of 40 mg/kg/day"

fuck me, if you are drinking 10 cans of fizzy pop a day you deserve to be ill.

 

[Ballard]

Well the EFSA says its safe so I will take their word from it. And as the E stands for EUROPEAN all you anti-us europeans cant play the "oh it must be bullshit cos its come out of the us" card.

To be honest the EU is the think you britons and other europeans should be most worried about, but thats a whole different topic of discusion

 

[Marc]

From the same site http://www.emedicine.com/NEURO/topic217.htm : Parkinsonism and other dystonic/hypokinetic clinical pictures also can occur.

Hang on, the guy who wrote that was american. Surely its scare mongering??

Same link I posted earlier

http://www.aspartame.info/aspartame_opinion.html

"Evidence does not support links between aspartame and cancer, hair loss, depression, dementia, behavioural disturbances, or any of the other conditions appearing in websites"

 

[Joor]

Well the EFSA says its safe so I will take their word from it. .

Ow yes , lets all beleave what the EFSA , FDA and other officials tells us, and only them. Never ask question, just :worthy: and say "yes sir!"

 

[haarewin]

I never said ALL but, Formaldehyde is a deadly neurotoxin right?
Where do we find formaldehyde? yes in aspartame.
A neurotoxin is a toxin that acts specifically on nerve cells, as far as i know neurodegenerative disease is a condition which affects brain function, like Alzheimer's disease, Parkinson's disease, Creutzfeldt-Jakob Disease and meny others ?

sortof. a neurodegenerative disease is a where the degeneration of nerves (neurones) brings about a change as a result of the neurones that are lost. disorders are typically noted when there is a lesion to a specific region of the brain (in PD, it's the nigrostriatal pathway), "symptoms" occur as a result of the brain adapting to this neuronal loss.
formaldehyde is a carcinogen. in small amounts, ie; where someone is not exposed to massive amounts every day, it is not likely to be carcinogenic. it is only potentially lethal if drank in large amounts.
i cannot find a source that suggests formaldehyde is neurotoxic. if you have a reference for this, i'd like to see it.
the only possible neurotoxic side effect i know of formaldehyde is where there is a reaction of formaldehyde with dopamine (catalysed by excess iron) that only occurs under oxidative stress / superoxidation.

keep in mind i am not arguing against the fact that aspartame does have some potential negative side effects. everything does, because everyone is sensitive to different molecules.

Ow yes , lets all beleave what the EFSA , FDA and other officials tells us, and only them. Never ask question, just :worthy: and say "yes sir!"

but they have more evidence than you do.

 

[Ballard]

Hang on, the guy who wrote that was american. Surely its scare mongering??

Same link I posted earlier

http://www.aspartame.info/aspartame_opinion.html

"Evidence does not support links between aspartame and cancer, hair loss, depression, dementia, behavioural disturbances, or any of the other conditions appearing in websites"

LOL, stop linking to that website mate... as clearly labelled at the bottom of that site....

The Aspartame Information Service is provided by Ajinomoto, a producer of aspartame and supplier to well known food and drink makers.

 

[Marc]

Ow yes , lets all beleave what the EFSA , FDA and other officials tells us, and only them. Never ask question, just :worthy: and say "yes sir!"

Here we go again

 

[Marc]

LOL, stop linking to that website mate... as clearly labelled at the bottom of that site....

LOL i got owned!!!!

 

[Joor]

i cannot find a source that suggests formaldehyde is neurotoxic. if you have a reference for this, i'd like to see it.
.

from Wiki.
Formaldehyde (also known as methanal) The initial symptoms of methanol intoxication are those of central nervous system depression: headache, dizziness, nausea, lack of coordination, confusion, drowsiness, and with suffiently large doses, unconsciousness and death.

 

[Marc]

LOL wiki, u mean that website where any tom dick or harry can post anything and everything

 

[haarewin]

Can you please provide a link to this source (if it is avaliable in the public domain) as I would like to read it in the interest of being informed.

But seriously guys, just fully read this for some more info.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aspartame

How can you not at least be concerned?

i think i can link the abstract. let me try

edit: Joor, does wiki have a reference for that?

 

[Ballard]

This is an extract form that guardian article, You guys have to admit it sounds at least a little bit dodgy whether or not you agree with the conclusions, its quite interesting reading.

In 1977 Donald Rumsfeld, now George Bush's defence secretary but then chief executive of the pharmaceutical company GD Searle, publicly stated that he would "call in his markers" to win a licence for aspartame, the sweetener that had been discovered by chance in Searle's laboratories, according to Roger Williams in the Commons yesterday.
Mr Williams, MP for Brecon and Radnorshire, said in an adjournment debate that there was much controversy about aspartame's safety at the time but "Rumsfeld appears to have honoured his pledge". In fact, "the history of the approval of aspartame puts public health regulators and politicians to shame".

The sweetener is now used in 6,000 products, from crisps such as Walkers prawn cocktail, to soft drinks including Diet Coke and Robinson's fruit squash, chewing gums such as Orbit, and vitamins pills and medicines. Yet the science on which it was given approval was "biased, inconclusive, and incompetent". "There is compelling and reliable evidence for this carcinogenic substance to be banned from the UK food and drinks market."
On the day of his inauguration as president in 1981, with Mr Rumsfeld on his transition team, Ronald Reagan personally wrote an executive order suspending the head of the US Food and Drug Administration's powers on aspartame, Mr Williams further claimed. One month later Mr Reagan appointed a new head of the regulatory authority, Arthur Hayes, who granted a licence for the sweetener.

"The history of aspartame's approval is littered with examples showing that if key decision makers found against aspartame's safety, they were discredited or replaced by industry sympathisers, who were recompensed with lucrative jobs."

The MP said he was using his parliamentary privilege to highlight "the strong scientific evidence" that the components of aspartame and their metabolites can cause very serious toxic effects on humans, and that long-term aspartame use can cause cancer.

Searle had originally submitted a host of studies to the FDA in 1970s in the hope of getting aspartame approved. But when flaws were revealed in the science behind another Searle product, Flagyl, the FDA set up a taskforce to investigate 15 of the key studies submitted by Searle on aspartame. Dr Jerome Bressler was commissioned by the FDA to investigate three of these studies. He had found 52 major discrepancies in Searle's clinical conduct of the studies, Mr Williams told the Commons. Tumours contracted by rats were removed before dissection but not reported; one record shows an animal in the experiment was alive, then dead, then alive again, then dead again.

MPs were told that because it lacked funds, the FDA submitted 12 other studies to be analysed by a research body that was under contract to Searle at the time. It declared all 12 studies authentic.

Doubts about aspartame among FDA scientists were overruled by the FDA's administration and it was given approval. Many other countries soon followed suit and approved aspartame on the basis of the same flawed studies, Mr Williams said. In 1996 a review of aspartame research found that every single industry-funded study found aspartame safe. But 92% of independent studies identified one or more problems with its safety.

 

[Marc]

I cant believe People are using wiki as refernce

Look what i just posted at the bottom lolol

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aspartame

Aspartame does not harm you (marc)


see, its that easy

 

[Ballard]

I cant believe People are using wiki as refernce

Look what i just posted at the bottom lolol

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aspartame

Aspartame does not harm you (marc)


see, its that easy

haha, very effective point. I do have to rep you for that one

 

[Joor]

I cant believe People are using wiki as refernce

Look what i just posted at the bottom lolol

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aspartame

Aspartame does not harm you (marc)


see, its that easy

It will be deleted soon, since that statement has no background facts

 

[haarewin]

what i think is even funnier about that article is this

Categories: Articles with unsourced statements

It will be deleted soon, since that statement has no background facts

neither does the rest of the article according to what it says at the bottom

 

[Ballard]

It will be deleted soon, since that statement has no background facts

in fact someone <cough cough> just did it

 

[Marc]

Joor! U are famous!!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joor

 

[Marc]

Aww they took it down and banned me :<

 

[Ballard]

neither does the rest of the article according to what it says at the bottom

I think it just means parts of it. but you are right what we have clearly established is there is a lot of misinformation floating around, from both sides. marc has shown us the industry sites, and yeah there is the chance wiki is wrong aswell. but you do have to admit there is some controvesy around the way it was approved by the FDA..

 

[Marc]

Maybe its like discussing who is the better footballer, ROnaldinho or Henry? There is no right or wrong answer

 

[Ballard]

Aww they took it down and banned me :<

from posting or visiting? by IP or something?