Politics 2024/25 General Election Voting Intention (2022)

[DaGaffer]

I'd like you to define "fine".

I didn't have a problem with it personally, but a stack of polish and romanians put a load of builders around here under a lot of pressure (and yes, I like builders under pressure) - and now they've gone, because they've been made to feel not welcome, the builders are doing better again.


I'd like you to bring that data. There's plenty of data, official data, that shows that migration boosts labour supply and that the impact on native workers is uneven, and often negative in low-skilled sectors - which I've said above. On wages alone The Bank of England show a 2% drop in the pay of native workers for every 10% rise in the proportion of immigrants in that sector. The Home Office and UCL say similar.

And this is in a country which has long term ideological bent towards open immigration - we generally produce economic papers that support what we want to think.

But the big bit of what you said that says a lot (and is a very commonly held view) is this:

1. Fuck them. Competition did us all good. And to the second point, you're looking at the wrong system, widen out to the EU level and it the wage thing rebalances because of wider opportunity.

Leave home. Move to another country. Leave your family, friends, loved-ones behind. Take advantage of all these "wonderful opportunities" - even if you really don't want to. Because if you don't - we'll call you feckless, lazy, tell you that it's your fault that you're poor because you didn't want to get on your bike.

The working class in my family didn't not move to Europe when they could because they were lazy or feckless. They work fucking hard. They stayed because they love the people they grew up with. They tend to look after their parents and grandparents.

It's the university educated wankers like me who ditch the family and fuck off elsewhere.

They shouldn't have to move away to earn a decent living. They already live in one of the richest countries on the planet. Their wages have been fucked over by legions of cheap labour being brought in that benefitted business.

2. Yeah fuck them too. My Dad (who didn't have degree) went to Germany for work in 1973. And then on the rigs, because it was the right thing to do for his family. And as all those Poles and Romanians and Greeks realised, it's not fucking permanent. No one owes you a job at the location of your choosing, they never have. I have far more time for the people who go half way around the world for a better life than the feckless twats who can't even move within their own country most of the time. Do you really think my family wanted to live in fucking Grimsby? No, that's where the work was at the time.

I don't disagree, but open migration jump-started massively in 1997 under Blair.. Johnson did what you said, and the UK public guzzled it down, because we don't educate people to think critically in in that manner. We educate for a compliant, gullible population that will suck business' dick.
I made the quip about "uneducated" above - and in many ways this is true. But people know when their job goes to someone cheaper who'd just moved here (or if you've been made redundant and your job's been offshored to what is effectively chinese slave labour (which my company is doing en-mass right now - accellerating their decades long mode of operation)).

Yes it jump-started, and yes Labour got their figures wrong, but that was also a massive early warning system that people need to re-calibrate their understanding of the world they live in. We actually got a head start. And once again, yes there may have been downward pressure on some jobs, but that's definitely not true in every sector, and there were whole parts of the economy where Brits were flat out refusing to do jobs (health and social care) or wouldn't get educated in the right ones (STEM) and that was at a time when education opportunities were being expanded not gutted as they were under the Tories.

Nah. Politicians in Britain won't tell the truth because they're hamstrung by a global economic system they have to pander to. Our politicians are just middle managers trying to keep a lid on the population's anger, whilst living under technocratic rule. If people felt what it was really like, they'd riot more.

Labour isn't doing anything economically because they never wanted to do anything economically. In fact, there's very little they can do.

What Labour is doing is this: their legislative programme, as passed up until now, and on the schedule, is likely to entrench a left-leaning beauracracy regardless of whoever gets voted in next.

Labour is rewiring the state, with new agencies, oversight bodies, and civil service mandates. These are structural changes that go further than Blair's "managerialism" - their reforms are more institutionally entrenching. It'll be difficult for any incumbent to reverse what they're doing - institutional inerta will be the order of the day.

Every time Labour get in, the UK becomes less pleasant

The UK is much worse at it than almost everywhere, because there's no room for more than the two identikit voices. You've even said it yourself, Tory or Tory-lite, and now "Tory with extra cunt" but they're all the flavours of the same shit, but no one is standing up and pointing it out. It's not just globalism, its denialism.

 

[Scouse]

1. Fuck them. Competition did us all good. And to the second point, you're looking at the wrong system, widen out to the EU level and it the wage thing rebalances because of wider opportunity.

So, it helps Romanians, Polish, immigrants, but it fucks over local people.

Why was it hard for you to just say that then? "Fuck them" is a valid point of view. I don't agree with it, obviously, but it's valid. But it is an admission that what I've been saying about migration is correct.

2. Yeah fuck them too. My Dad (who didn't have degree) went to Germany for work in 1973. And then on the rigs, because it was the right thing to do for his family. And as all those Poles and Romanians and Greeks realised, it's not fucking permanent. No one owes you a job at the location of your choosing, they never have. I have far more time for the people who go half way around the world for a better life than the feckless twats who can't even move within their own country most of the time. Do you really think my family wanted to live in fucking Grimsby? No, that's where the work was at the time.

So yes, you don't give a fuck about the lots of people who want to stay with their families. Which, btw, is how humans have evolved.

I left. I get it. But it's not right to say that everyone should, and if they don't they're feckless twats who deserve their poverty.

They don't. The system needs to change - not them. Economics should bend for the desires of the people, not the other way around. We create misery otherwise - which we're succesfully doing. Maybe when people were religious they could hang on to hope of happiness in the afterlife, but right now everyone understands this is it - and it's shit.

Yes it jump-started, and yes Labour got their figures wrong, but that was also a massive early warning system that people need to re-calibrate their understanding of the world they live in.

Nah. The leaders and the rich need to recalibrate how they fucking treat people.

The UK is much worse at it than almost everywhere, because there's no room for more than the two identikit voices. You've even said it yourself, Tory or Tory-lite, and now "Tory with extra cunt" but they're all the flavours of the same shit, but no one is standing up and pointing it out. It's not just globalism, its denialism.

Lots of people are pointing it out. But we've all been stuck in a global denialism since the 1970's really. Young adults today are the canaries that have been brought up in captivity - they don't know any different, and they can't see it.

I daresay we were blind to shitloads when we were young too - but what we've definitely lost in our lifetimes is our overt political thinking.

Even our media is stripped of it, deliberately.

 

[Embattle]

Nigel Farage and Burger King have one thing in common, they both sell Whoppers:

Reform UK prepared to deport 600,000 under migration plans

The party outlines its plans to detain and deport all migrants who arrive in the UK on small boats.

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[Scouse]

Elon Musk launches fresh attack on ‘weak’ Nigel Farage

Musk’s attack is the latest saga in his deteriorating relationship with Reform UK’s Farage

www.independent.co.uk

Musk laying into Farage again.

Seems to like this guy more:


View: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=eWq7o-5PUYo&pp=0gcJCRsBo7VqN5tD

 

[Tom]

Can't talk about immigration without addressing that we're not having enough babies to support an ageing population. We're not alone, all western nations have this issue.

I don't think the conversation has moved on much since the post-war era when we invited people in to work in our textile mills and other jobs. The same complaints were made then as are being made now.

The real issue IMO isn't culture, it's poverty.

Farage and his knuckle-dragging supporters can all just fuck off. Let them explain how their pensions will be funded when they retire.

 

[Scouse]

Can't talk about immigration without addressing that we're not having enough babies to support an ageing population.

That's crap. It's just because of how we organise our economics. We have the resources, they're just not in the right place.

We've got too many humans for the planet. Having more kids so people can keep on with poverty-level pensions when they're closing in on death isn't perhaps the best use of our resources.

And don't discount the cultural issues. They can be felt, without people being inherently racist. As long as that's never acknowledged, we'll never get anywhere.

 

[DaGaffer]

That's crap. It's just because of how we organise our economics. We have the resources, they're just not in the right place.

We've got too many humans for the planet. Having more kids so people can keep on with poverty-level pensions when they're closing in on death isn't perhaps the best use of our resources.

And don't discount the cultural issues. They can be felt, without people being inherently racist. As long as that's never acknowledged, we'll never get anywhere.

It's not crap and the rest of your post is fatuous bollocks. Yes we have too many people but in case you haven't noticed the people the right age are in the wrong place and usually have the wrong skills.

You can't rewrite economics at a stroke. Get over it.

 

[Scouse]

It's not crap and the rest of your post is fatuous bollocks. Yes we have too many people but in case you haven't noticed the people the right age are in the wrong place and usually have the wrong skills.

You can't rewrite economics at a stroke. Get over it.

It's not fatuous bollocks. We've got plenty of resources to support the people we've got - but they're in the hands of a vanishingly small number of people. The fact that we're not going to do anything about it doesn't mean I shouldn't point out when we're being fucking morons. Which we are.


We're clearly not going to rewrite our broken economics - which are simply a set of rules we've made up. We'll keep legal immigration high (which is the actual problem) to cover the poverty-level state pension. But I don't accept for a minute that we need to keep having babies. We need the opposite.

Continuing to grow the human population <> the desire for the human race to keep existing on this planet.


Just because state pensions are unsustainable long term doesn't make that fact any less factual.

 

[Scouse]

Reform council’s Nottingham Post ban a ‘massive attack on local democracy’

Nottinghamshire council’s administration says it will no longer deal with local paper, in unprecedented move

www.theguardian.com

 

[Tom]

https://hopenothate.org.uk/2025/08/22/operation-raise-the-colours-organised-by-well-known-far-right-extremists/

 

[Gwadien]

https://hopenothate.org.uk/2025/08/22/operation-raise-the-colours-organised-by-well-known-far-right-extremists/

on The Rest is Politics, Alistair Campbell had stats suggesting something like 60% of the people arrested at these events had been previously arrested for domestic violence.

lol.

I mean not lol for the victims, but lol at them for having a go at innocents.

 

[Scouse]

on The Rest is Politics, Alistair Campbell had stats suggesting something like 60% of the people arrested at these events had been previously arrested for domestic violence.

It's not surprising that people who kick off, are people who kick off eh?

Interesting fact though - the domestic violence stats are skewed. If there's a call about domestic violence, po-po arrest the man, always, regardless of the who or what. Because if he kicks off, the result is worse.

But that isn't reflected in the narrative. It's just what it is. In a perverse way, that's what privilege looks like.

 

[Raven]

Red crosses painted on faded mini roundabouts, pretty much sums up Britain, atm.

 

[Scouse]

Red crosses painted on faded mini roundabouts, pretty much sums up Britain, atm.

I mean, Farage is the next PM. I might actually put money on it.

It's a poor choice, but rich arseholes leading idiots when successive governments have ignored them and made them poorer and poorer is a lesson of history nobody bothers to follow.

At least the roundabouts are more colourful. I'd hope that some counter-people would turn them into big sunflowers or something

 

[Scouse]

I know people won't expect this from me but it's not the police at fault:

Police must focus on ‘streets not tweets’, says Wes Streeting after Graham Linehan arrest

Health secretary subtly criticises Tory governments after Father Ted writer’s arrest over social media posts on transgender issues

www.theguardian.com

It's our archaic and repressive laws, that Labour have doubled down in support of this very morning.