Women, what's the state of play now?

[Imgormiel]

Right the politics thread mildly got the response and varied views I wanted. So before going on to religion, I wanted to discuss another social taboo....

Ok, controversial subject. Nothing brought this on in my real life at this moment in time - well save a few years of abuse in the past by women and yet I thought that I was the one responsible.

Just wondering what's going on seeing as my life as a consonant vowel consonant consonant has become more than just a verb and a pronoun when it comes to the word 'monk' after 4 years of not being involved in what I term to be a truly alien species. (up for discussion)

Pro :

My analysis is this, abused, then given free rights, right to vote, liberalism of job positions over men although it could be argued they haven't quite achieved that status of the term 'equal' just yet. Has the right to cry twat if there's a divorce. Has the right to be a total twat and treat everything in sight like a piece of shit. Has bridged the gap between metrosexual and the female sides of men for whatever shit that was for in the first place. Knows how to be a bitch and get away with it - almost a superpower in our society. Omg she's turned up in twat mode, run! On the plus side, she can be quite nice when the mood takes her and she decides that just for once the world isn't her oyster after all, that would be a silly thing indeed and that just going on with the natural flow would be ok, just as long as it doesn't piss her off when her mood swings confuse her and she has no answer for why she's feeling why she does, but hey it's a sunny day outside and a smile cure's everything. She's financially and economically more astute than she's every been in the past. Babies, yep love or hate, you can't eat em, they are just not bacon and that's where she bond's the family and her nest and all around so that her selfish needs are more than just selfish and everyone is involved. Can move people (aka Sarah Palin and other celebrities that sell newspapers and what ever other tat that people want to buy), society and the whole earth with a simple smile and a half decent arguement, well that's today's woman, Margret Thatcher? who's that twat? She's not worthy of my former panty hose

Con :

Still retains the position of underdog, (in developed western societies) mistreated, slave that never saw out of the 1940's and still believes her opinion isn't heard. Yet the opposite is true and we all know it. Divorce see's her take a job anyway, not to be hypocritical and despite arguing her way through the courts and saying that she's financially unviable she still does it anyway, just like anything else that she argues with in her life.....
Meddling little money hungry consonant vowel consonant consonant, in fact meddling little... cnut on most issues. Gossip is power, the eternal tool of the woman is about as far away as her laptop, mobile phone and her vacuum cleaner, what a useful tool it is...especially when feeling scorned, irrational and totally self obsessed. Treats men like shit now because of liberation without understanding of what it is, how nice for you that your empowerment has taught you nothing. In fact ladies, buy a dildo, it doesn't have a thought when you throw it out on the street, and after all, you can always buy a new one without all the hassle...... Yep the pro's and con's will go on and on.

Do you ever get bored of this crap and start to see what this crap is really about or ...... do you get left with a load of ???????????? Buy hey! There's a hello magazine on the shelf feeling lonely.....

/discuss

 

[Amanita]

I don't actually understand what this thread is about. I read as much of that Great Wall of Text as the time of night permits and I still don't get it.

 

[Imgormiel]

I don't actually understand what this thread is about. I read as much of that Great Wall of Text as the time of night permits and I still don't get it.

It's about social values, perceptions, roles and beliefs in today's society and how people personify things for what they want it to be, whether it's politically, socially or personally motivated. It's open ended, say what you want.

 

[Bahumat]

I gave up when I got to Pro

 

[CorNokZ]

GWoT! tl;dr

Also the first two lines had both politics and religion in them, so I stopped right there

Sorry mate, but I tried! It's late, but I'll perhabs give it another go again tomorrow

 

[Imgormiel]

I gave up when I got to Pro

you gave up before the politics debate bahu

 

[Imgormiel]

GWoT! tl;dr

Also the first two lines had both politics and religion in them, so I stopped right there

Sorry mate, but I tried! It's late, but I'll perhabs give it another go again tomorrow

I thought this was right down your street CoRn

 

[CorNokZ]

I thought this was right down your street CoRn

It probably is mate, but I'm so tired atm, that I have no idea what this thread is about!

Women, politics and religion? I'll probably give some retarded reply tomorrow, if I have the time to write you a decent answer, but I'm well busy!

School 8am->2pm, then bus from 2pm->2:40->eat->3pm->work->8:30pm->wank->sleep

 

[Imgormiel]

It probably is mate, but I'm so tired atm, that I have no idea what this thread is about!

Women, politics and religion? I'll probably give some retarded reply tomorrow, if I have the time to write you a decent answer, but I'm well busy!

School 8am->2pm, then bus from 2pm->2:40->eat->3pm->work->8:30pm->wank->sleep

Your life suxx, no time for beer or woman

 

[Olgaline]

this thread needs CpR:

Fake Boobs..?

Pro or Con ?

 

[kirennia]

Very negative stance on women there mate. Quite a lot of sexism etc involved. Don't worry, I call out sexism when it's done towards men as well even though it's often brought down on deaf ears, much like I perceive a white man calling someone for being racist towards them.

As far as I'm concerned, I don't care who you are; white, black, green, pink, tall, short, male, female etc etc, people should be treated the same until they prove they're worthy of more or less.

Sadly this isn't the way the world currently works. While to some degree (back on topic) women are still disadvantaged in society, in other aspects, the scales have fallen the other way.

Less wages in some companies which I think it's disgraceful, blatent discrimination yet a years break to pop a sprogg entitles them to the same level of free money. As far as I'm concerned with this individual aspect, half wages, capped at £20,000 should be what women who go out on maternity leave get. No more is needed and it's unfair to expect a company to fork out 2x full wages for a child. This is an honest overview of why I think certain jobs are more difficult for a woman to get then for a man.

Cheaper car insurance which...again, is sexist.

Usually get majority of a couples stuff in the event of a divorce if there is a kid involved... shady area but I'm sure everyone knows of someone who has been completely unfairly broken by a divorce.


Basically, all of the problems aren't with women its with societies overcompensation for a negative past. Hate to bring the old dog back to life for another slapping but DAoCs character 'balancing' is a classic example of what seemed to happen in the modern era when race and sex balancing for equal human rights came about. All of a sudden, in an attempt to 'balance' society, rights were given in relation to the existing society of rules (not really sure how better to word that bit...) and yet when you step back and look at it, it's quite easy to recognise that in some areas, things have gone way too far leading to resentment and that's where the problem lies. That resentment shouldn't be pushed upon the people who benefit from this, it should be pushed upon the people who decide what's right and wrong for us... the puppetmasters. Hence why I can still say everyone is equal in my eyes while I may still disagree with certain privileges some groups get.



I still question why a survey was ever done in relation to sex and number of accidents incurred when that in itself shouldn't be a baring on tariffs. If the same was done for peoples skin colour there'd be uproar. Far as I'm concerned it should be one rate dependant on your car and years of no-claims...simple and fair. Okay so women could argue that they aren't as likely to crash but then I can say I'm sensible so I'm less likely to crash then some stupid 17yo bint who drives like a moron...or say okay, so why isn't skin colour taken into account, hair colour, colour of your eyes etc etc...it's plain stupid.

 

[Imgormiel]

this thread needs CpR:

Fake Boobs..?

Pro or Con ?

I was mildly overlaying the superficial crap with the supposed irl hybrid of all the other monotonous crap too. IE references to hello magazine etc

 

[CorNokZ]

Your life suxx, no time for beer or woman

You've clearly never met me on the backseat of the bus

 

[Imgormiel]

You've clearly never met me on the backseat of the bus

I never intimated with tumble weed neither, i am so deprived

 

[Laddey]

Yeah i would agree but..........



























i couldn't be arsed reading all that, i do apologise Imgormiel

 

[Imgormiel]

Very negative stance on women there mate. Quite a lot of sexism etc involved. Don't worry, I call out sexism when it's done towards men as well even though it's often brought down on deaf ears, much like I perceive a white man calling someone for being racist towards them.

As far as I'm concerned, I don't care who you are; white, black, green, pink, tall, short, male, female etc etc, people should be treated the same until they prove they're worthy of more or less.

Sadly this isn't the way the world currently works. While to some degree (back on topic) women are still disadvantaged in society, in other aspects, the scales have fallen the other way.

Less wages in some companies which I think it's disgraceful, blatent discrimination yet a years break to pop a sprogg entitles them to the same level of free money. As far as I'm concerned with this individual aspect, half wages, capped at £20,000 should be what women who go out on maternity leave get. No more is needed and it's unfair to expect a company to fork out 2x full wages for a child. This is an honest overview of why I think certain jobs are more difficult for a woman to get then for a man.

Cheaper car insurance which...again, is sexist.

Usually get majority of a couples stuff in the event of a divorce if there is a kid involved... shady area but I'm sure everyone knows of someone who has been completely unfairly broken by a divorce.


Basically, all of the problems aren't with women its with societies overcompensation for a negative past. Hate to bring the old dog back to life for another slapping but DAoCs character 'balancing' is a classic example of what seemed to happen in the modern era when race and sex balancing for equal human rights came about. All of a sudden, in an attempt to 'balance' society, rights were given in relation to the existing society of rules (not really sure how better to word that bit...) and yet when you step back and look at it, it's quite easy to recognise that in some areas, things have gone way too far leading to resentment and that's where the problem lies. That resentment shouldn't be pushed upon the people who benefit from this, it should be pushed upon the people who decide what's right and wrong for us... the puppetmasters. Hence why I can still say everyone is equal in my eyes while I may still disagree with certain privileges some groups get.



I still question why a survey was ever done in relation to sex and number of accidents incurred when that in itself shouldn't be a baring on tariffs. If the same was done for peoples skin colour there'd be uproar. Far as I'm concerned it should be one rate dependant on your car and years of no-claims...simple and fair. Okay so women could argue that they aren't as likely to crash but then I can say I'm sensible so I'm less likely to crash then some stupid 17yo bint who drives like a moron...or say okay, so why isn't skin colour taken into account, hair colour, colour of your eyes etc etc...it's plain stupid.

You clearly don't see irony when it pats you on the back But still, your beef is not with us 'men' and to treat em like crap because you think it is right is not a good call. The people you fought against to get your right to vote etc in the first place is where your focus should be. Start winning over the populus than kicking it in the teeth. Power in numbers right?

 

[kirennia]

You clearly don't see irony when it pats you on the back But still, your beef is not with us 'men' and to treat em like crap because you think it is right is not a good call. The people you fought against to get your right to vote etc in the first place is where your focus should be. Start winning over the populus than kicking it in the teeth. Power in numbers right?

Is this the point where I should show a mug shot of my bearded self holding a Kirennia sign?

 

[Imgormiel]

Is this the point where I should show a mug shot of my bearded self holding a Kirennia sign?

Depends on ur panties

 

[Imgormiel]

Right i've highlighted the negative aspects as you can see...........

Some positive aspects wouldn't go amiss but it's fine you saying blah, but you are missing the issue, what's your perceptions, ok kiren had a stab but what of the rest of you. How does it affect you irl and i am talking both ways - men and women (note my reply to aminata).

NB Kiren, you are blessed with a life that's not burned by women, thanks for the comments - I wish i was but that's not my point. Would be nice to see a lot of different view points and why

Women have changed so much to us older generation of men that all we see is the bad side, understanding all of it is something we do naturally as we get older because we become more inquisitive and knowledgeable and wanting to grow in the only way we have left to grow.

I've not been unfortunate enough to have had children, I hope one day that's going to change and soon but to understand today I have to understand today, tomorrow and not yesterday But like I said, it's open ended and I want to see what it's all about - not my issues I am just trying to open up a debate about what the real state of play is between men and women today and hopefully will be tomorrow and then perhaps where us oldie consonant vowel ....rest mofo's fit in that are still single

 

[Imgormiel]

Is this the point where I should show a mug shot of my bearded self holding a Kirennia sign?

Haha! you know what i meant kiren

 

[kirennia]

NB Kiren, you are blessed with a life that's not burned by women, thanks for the comments - I wish i was but that's not my point. Would be nice to see a lot of different view points and why

I'm not going to pretend I'm hard done by in comparison to others but to say I've not been burned by women wouldn't be completely true, I'm just not stating individual cases as your original post didn't so tried to keep it in scope!

That said though, I know not to judge a person by someonelses merits; to pidgenhold (sp?) all women because of incidences you've had with them is folly. I presume your a straight man, correct me if I'm wrong, but that leads you to generally being more emotionally involved with women then to men. With your friends you talk a lot and if you've known them for a long time and they screw you over, it's harsh but nowhere near as bad as if it's a lover, spouse or whatever because of emotional attachment.

These incidents thus prey closer to the forefront of your mind. I've had a lot more fallings out, fights etc etc with men then with women yet while I'd struggle to remember all of the arguments with men, I'd remember much more vividly the arguments with women.


Men and women are different yes and you could debate over which was the worst until you're blue in the face but how often do people in general come away from a relationship saying 'I hate men/women' compared to a fight or argument with their good friends saying the same thing. You can know a friend for longer than a lover and even know them better but in most cases you still wouldn't end up saying the same. Out of interest, It'd be nice to hear the viewpoint of a gay person to see if they've ever come out of a relationship and said that before... honestly wouldn't know as it'd be a bit of a double edged sword.

It's built into us and until we evolve out of it, it'll remain.


Sorry if this was a bit off-topic, just thought it was worth a comment.

 

[Imgormiel]

I'm not going to pretend I'm hard done by in comparison to others but to say I've not been burned by women wouldn't be completely true, I'm just not stating individual cases as your original post didn't so tried to keep it in scope!

That said though, I know not to judge a person by someonelses merits; to pidgenhold (sp?) all women because of incidences you've had with them is folly. I presume your a straight man, correct me if I'm wrong, but that leads you to generally being more emotionally involved with women then to men. With your friends you talk a lot and if you've known them for a long time and they screw you over, it's harsh but nowhere near as bad as if it's a lover, spouse or whatever because of emotional attachment.

These incidents thus prey closer to the forefront of your mind. I've had a lot more fallings out, fights etc etc with men then with women yet while I'd struggle to remember all of the arguments with men, I'd remember much more vividly the arguments with women.


Men and women are different yes and you could debate over which was the worst until you're blue in the face but how often do people in general come away from a relationship saying 'I hate men/women' compared to a fight or argument with their good friends saying the same thing. You can know a friend for longer than a lover and even know them better but in most cases you still wouldn't end up saying the same. Out of interest, It'd be nice to hear the viewpoint of a gay person to see if they've ever come out of a relationship and said that before... honestly wouldn't know as it'd be a bit of a double edged sword.

It's built into us and until we evolve out of it, it'll remain.


Sorry if this was a bit off-topic, just thought it was worth a comment.

Sure was, but as we progressively blur the lines, where and why do we do it and where does it stop? For what purposes does it start and end and why do we need to do it? Seems a straight answer these days is either offensive or too upfront in my country (UK) whereas in the states it's if you don't have it gtfo teh face etc. What's wrong with being 'open' with what you need to say, this is a particular problem in the UK in real life, people are happy to say what ever they want with text and no face but seem to think of the social consequences not that in most cases there are any, of what it means to or in fact be open about what you need to say in any relationship.

So culture's is important in that respect but also 'the' culture of blur is also important.

Gay or straight we need to evolve, not that I am gay, my evolution ultimately lies with children and the need to have them and an intimate relationship with a woman. That process of evolution is viewed in different terms with everyone and that's the point of this thread being open ended.

But to me, what seems most perplexing is the way that women are evolving, it just doesn't seem to have a point or a process or even a solution save for whatever they want it to be. Yet they want to be equal or some some case even be like men :S yet have no direction save to destroy and yet create some paradigm that suits them as and when they want it - to create a different allignment of thinking without giving cause or understanding of effect of what the consequences or indeed the positives of that process, or even if there is anything at all to be learned from it. The whole thing is now a blur, and why? errrrrrr?????!!!?!!?!?

Yeah, i know, long answer :s

 

[Imgormiel]

I'm not going to pretend I'm hard done by in comparison to others but to say I've not been burned by women wouldn't be completely true, I'm just not stating individual cases as your original post didn't so tried to keep it in scope!

That was an overall observation, don't get me started on honey traps.. ><

 

[Amanita]

Your view of women as taken from what you've written here seems rather negative. The bits I understood anyway. Your writing style brought very much to mind of the art books my sister is trying to read - lots of fancy words that don't seem to convey any meaning. Not meaning any offence, its just I am finding it very hard to glean what you're trying to say.

If you're looking for a more insight into the way a woman's mind works - bear in mind that women are just trying to get through life just the same as men, and thanks tor my foremothers the method of doing that relies so much less on finding a 'provider' (thinking back to Jane Austin times), as providing for themselves, and brings the goals of the two sexes closer together.

 

[old.Tohtori]

Kirennia, this world needs a bit of chauvinism to be honest.

Sure, equal rights, pay, voting right and such, fine.

But this also brought the "girl power" along, which is a f*cked up concept for two simple reasons:

Females think that they can get away with more, which they do.
Females, DON'T have to get the added sh*t of being treated equal.

Example;

Women don't open you doors. You open them.
Women don't give up seats. You give them.
Women don't put the toilet seat up. You put it down.
You can't call a woman a ****, 'cause it's derogatory. Women can call you whatever they wish, and you just have to take it.
Being a feminist is a-ok(not withstanding feminist haters), being a chauvinist is NOT.

One big one, for you "married" types there: Your paycheck is the family paycheck, her paycheck is HER paycheck.

I could go on, but you get the point.

Women want the same privilages that they got when they were "oppressed", yet they deliberately and with zeal refuse to give any rights away and if you treat them as equal (Buy 'em a beer, call 'em a ho(instead of gay bro) and slap 'em on the shoulder for a laugh), they get in your face about it.

Equal rights(if taken literally) is a myth, it's take take and no give.

On the plus side, blowjobs have become more common.

 

[Imgormiel]

Your view of women as taken from what you've written here seems rather negative. The bits I understood anyway. Your writing style brought very much to mind of the art books my sister is trying to read - lots of fancy words that don't seem to convey any meaning. Not meaning any offence, its just I am finding it very hard to glean what you're trying to say.

If you're looking for a more insight into the way a woman's mind works - bear in mind that women are just trying to get through life just the same as men, and thanks tor my foremothers the method of doing that relies so much less on finding a 'provider' (thinking back to Jane Austin times), as providing for themselves, and brings the goals of the two sexes closer together.

There's nothing arty or bourgeois about any of the language I used in any of the posts I wrote there. Satirical yes, but arty, bourgeois and overstated colloquy - no.

 

[Imgormiel]

Kirennia, this world needs a bit of chauvinism to be honest.

Sure, equal rights, pay, voting right and such, fine.

But this also brought the "girl power" along, which is a f*cked up concept for two simple reasons:

Females think that they can get away with more, which they do.
Females, DON'T have to get the added sh*t of being treated equal.

Example;

Women don't open you doors. You open them.
Women don't give up seats. You give them.
Women don't put the toilet seat up. You put it down.
You can't call a woman a ****, 'cause it's derogatory. Women can call you whatever they wish, and you just have to take it.
Being a feminist is a-ok(not withstanding feminist haters), being a chauvinist is NOT.

One big one, for you "married" types there: Your paycheck is the family paycheck, her paycheck is HER paycheck.

I could go on, but you get the point.

Women want the same privilages that they got when they were "oppressed", yet they deliberately and with zeal refuse to give any rights away and if you treat them as equal (Buy 'em a beer, call 'em a ho(instead of gay bro) and slap 'em on the shoulder for a laugh), they get in your face about it.

Equal rights(if taken literally) is a myth, it's take take and no give.

So true