Very, very interesting read.

[Jjuraa]

To me that just read like an Aethist on an ego trip hehe. I'm in no way religious but i don't share the hatred for religion that a lot of people seem to be adopting these days.

i certainly dont blame all wars on religion thats just a scapegoat, sometimes you just have to face up to the fact that as a species we're pretty damn awful. along those lines i think religion does a fairly good job of controlling us. I'm can only base this on my own thoughts obviously, but manys the time i've stopped myself doing something i know to be wrong simply because im not quite prepared to risk the fact that their may just be a God judging me.

i think if you suddenly provided proof that religion was a hoax, and removed the fear of god from the worlds population as a whole, well then i wouldnt give us much of a chance of survival. (for example, a man suddenly realises that there would be no divine intervention if he took up his gun and shot his controlling boss. the fear of the proper authourities wouldnt stand a chance.)

and lastly i think people have to beleive that theres some sort of universal justice system. that the bad guy gets whats coming to him, and that when youre having a hard time, salvation is round the corner. if you start beleiving that noone is going to bail you out when things get really tough, well you may as well give up now.

 

[Tasslehoff]

To me that just read like an Aethist on an ego trip hehe. I'm in no way religious but i don't share the hatred for religion that a lot of people seem to be adopting these days.

i certainly dont blame all wars on religion thats just a scapegoat, sometimes you just have to face up to the fact that as a species we're pretty damn awful. along those lines i think religion does a fairly good job of controlling us. I'm can only base this on my own thoughts obviously, but manys the time i've stopped myself doing something i know to be wrong simply because im not quite prepared to risk the fact that their may just be a God judging me.

i think if you suddenly provided proof that religion was a hoax, and removed the fear of god from the worlds population as a whole, well then i wouldnt give us much of a chance of survival. (for example, a man suddenly realises that there would be no divine intervention if he took up his gun and shot his controlling boss. the fear of the proper authourities wouldnt stand a chance.)

and lastly i think people have to beleive that theres some sort of universal justice system. that the bad guy gets whats coming to him, and that when youre having a hard time, salvation is round the corner. if you start beleiving that noone is going to bail you out when things get really tough, well you may as well give up now.

If people stopped believing in god, people wouldn't stop believing in justice. It's not like atheists are crazy fuckers running around shooting people, just because they don't believe in god.

Everybody else would stop a criminal, no matter their religional(?) believes, or that's what I think at least. There would still be authorities, maybe even more so, as god wouldn't be there anymore, they'd be higher authorities. Maybe they wouldn't, hard to tell.

 

[noblok]

and lastly i think people have to beleive that theres some sort of universal justice system. that the bad guy gets whats coming to him, and that when youre having a hard time, salvation is round the corner. if you start beleiving that noone is going to bail you out when things get really tough, well you may as well give up now.

This is exactly what Nietzsche meant when he let the madman exlaim that God has been murdered. He was referring to the god of Descartes (as the warrant that our knowledge matches the things as they are) and the god of Kant (the warrant that in the end a moral life is rewarded).

It's quite interesting a theory, but I don't agree. I think that it's possible to develop a morale without the need of a god backing it up. One thing is, that although many people don't believe in a god, they still believe in a 'human nature'. Sure, Sartre has - in my opinion - quite rightly pointed out that this doesn't make any sense, but people do. This 'human nature', as vague as it may sound, is for many people still a base for a morale.

I also think that it should be possible to develop a morale without needing the concept of a 'human nature' either. Well, not without anything common to all humans, but I myself am trying to develop a morale based upon the concept that every human is free. Add to this that we can have no certain knowledge (the God of Descartes being killed as well) and you end up with the golden rule quite easily. From here on, interpretation will be needed for every specific situation as with any morale.


P.S. Sorry if it feels like I'm namedropping in the first and second paragraph, but I didn't want to make it appear as all these ideas are my own. I also need some memory practice for my exams soon

 

[Jjuraa]

If people stopped believing in god, people wouldn't stop believing in justice. It's not like atheists are crazy fuckers running around shooting people, just because they don't believe in god.

because Atheisists are in the minority. im pretty sure that if deffinative proof of the non-existance of god was uncovered, there would be anarchy.

 

[Ashala]

Of course, this can also possibly kill us all. However, what was mentioned in this piece of text was that something like a simple thought or a very simple invention could do this. Also, it wouldn't even necessarily require huge resources or connections. Could be anyone. Your average joe, whom wouldn't be average by our standards in this future time, will not easily get his hands on a nuke. Not to mention it has to be used somehow.

well to be fair the things he mention are just thoughts as i see it, if we have the technology to make a little dice size object that we, one way or another need as humans during that lvl of evalution, that we can press and ahinilate the entire human kind with the push of a button, we would most likely also have some kind of backup if that, infact should happen, its not evalution to create something that destructive without thinking it through

 

[Ozilia]

so old i saw that eons ago loel.

oh yer if u beleive that you need help h0kay. if god wanted to waste his time speaking to a human being he would of chosen noam choamsky or leonardo da vinci or sigmund freud or einstein or socrates or plato [just off the top of my head], but this bufoon? give me a break, this god is apparently evolved from his own kind into a godly form, a very commonly accepted idea that anyone can become godly, omnisent maybe a strech to far but what the hell. this god enjoys meaningful conversation, with someone that cant even touch is fathomable comprehension, great yup this is so bogus from the day it was created, next god will be speaking to the paupers, that reign the street, that he has forsaken!

Of course when we're dealing with texts like these everyone is free to have their own opinion, just have to tell you how i see it.
As I read it, he says that humans are NOT yet advanced enough to have a meaningful conversation with this "god".


‘I can’t say this in any way that doesn’t sound callous, but how much time do you spend worrying about the ants you run over in your car? I know it sounds horrendous to you, but you have to see the bigger picture. At this stage in human development, you’re becoming interesting but not yet important.’

'ah but I can't have an intelligent conversation with an ant'

'precisely'


Just as we don't really care about the ants we run over, god maybe doesn't really care about us until we have become a more advanced and developed civilisation, compared to other species spread around the universe!
Problem is you have to open up your imagination... Maybe he was speaking with all those you mentioned, how can we know? Maybe this god can speak to this random guy on a train at the same time as he speaks to billions of other lifeforms on other planets!!
Until we know what god is we can't really discuss him, we might not even be able to imagine what he is or what he's capable of!

(for the record I don't really believe there is a god at all, but it's fun to argue about it sometimes )

 

[Conchabar]

okay, right, why do i not beleive this okay.. lets see, does he ask any of the, right questions, that we ask ourselfs each and every day?
1)what is the meaning of life
2)is there an afterlife
3)was jesus a stoner?
i was speaking to one of my friends about this awhile ago. we came up with aload of questions we would of asked, i forget most of them, but 1 and 2 are the only ones i can remember.

yer it makes sense, religion was an early form of government, i mean we could of made the entire human race extinct otherwise, or the crusades masacre may never of happened i dont beleive in all the religious tripe dont get me wrong, noam choamsky is still alive and considered one of the greatest minds still alive for all u peeps that didnt know lol... god would of done him self a world of good if he went to a true philospher instead of this fellow..

also you do realise, everything that is said you could just about realise, as common sense?

 

[Infanity]

Best i could, in my devine powers, come up with is:

"I'm not perfect, but willing to change."[/QUOTE

I`m going for : "I can lick my own eye lashes"

I'm going for: "learn to quote properly and try again"


=D

 

[Dukat]

It is rather a thought provoking piece of writing, you've got to give him that

Even so - and as much as I hate to admit it - Coch does have a point.

As interesting as it is, that text (in my opinion) has kinda just taken most of the sayings, philosophies, revelations, theories of life and sci-fi stories(Rama anyone?) from the past century or more and summerised them in a very clever form.

It's a nice idea, giving you something that can only be proved true or false in a far off future than none of us will live to see(excepting those of us present who are immortal ofc ). What gives it away for me is the pure atheism(SP?) of it, not to mention the corny jokes the questions asked are kinda conveniently put as well.

I hate to be a sceptic, I always tend to hate sceptics in threads like this but it just seems a little fake. had it of been passed off as a story, rather than a true story it would've been easier to take I think (that said, was it ? or was it meant to be true, not explored that site so cant say).

 

[Ezteq]

great stuff! so nice to read something like that that isnt trying to convert you, he just says i am who i am believe in me or not i dont care, and the bits about needing dangerous information to evolve was great.

/rep

 

[noblok]

I never actually tought of this as someone trying to convince us of having a conversation with God, but rather as an interesting concept to talk about some ideas. I didn't read it all though.

because Atheisists are in the minority. im pretty sure that if deffinative proof of the non-existance of god was uncovered, there would be anarchy.

You can't prove that there is no god anyway, so it's not that much of a problem. The problem I have with this statement is that you seem to need a reward for doing the right thing. I'm sorry, but I find that idea silly, you don't do the right thing for a reward, you do it because it is the right thing. A morale which is based upon hypothetical imperatives ("if you want to go to heaven, don't ..."), rather than categorical imperatives ("thou shalt not ..") is no real morale, it's egocentrism and nothing more.

Also: you say you are in no way religious, but your fear of God has sometimes stopped you of doing something nasty. That doesn't make sense at all: you don't believe in a god, but you are afraid of him? I myself am about as much of an atheist as the pope, I'm just a bit more consistent and belive in one god less than he does . The fact that something cannot be proven untrue just isn't enough to make me believe it's true.

 

[SFXman]

I never actually tought of this as someone trying to convince us of having a conversation with God, but rather as an interesting concept to talk about some ideas.

This is exactly what it is. Hence I found it immensly interesting. It really is though provoking as someone mentioned. Got to start reading more of this kind of thing. I guess philosophy could be a choice for further education now that the army is behind me.

Anyone have any good suggestions as to some philosopher who's theories could be of use today? Even in a conversation sense, in other words something that people who might not be that interested in too abstract thinking might find interesting?

 

[Conchabar]

dont take up philosphy its a very depressive state of mind, dont eat the sacred fruit as they say :touch:

 

[SFXman]

Ah, but what if one is used to depression and can live with it? :touch:

 

[[SS]Gamblor]

Ah, but what if one is used to depression and can live with it? :touch:

Stay playing Alb then

 

[Maxgirth]

I'm going for: "learn to quote properly and try again"


=D

I`m going for: "Rumbled, for not quoting properly, yet again"