ToA

[evzy]

I don't have a single char past ml1 bar my main who is ML5 - nearly ML6, I play mostly after 9pm of an evening or later, and rarely weekends - that has made it almost impossible to get ml's and certain arti's - I have been playing games for 15yrs+ and I think I am a decent gamer in general - so yeah I kinda feel annoyed that someone with no RL commitments can get ahead in a game - not through skill but simply by being online.

 

[Zebolt]

I absoutely hate PvE, I don't enjoy a second of it, but I loved what ToA made to RvR. And nowdays the artifacts isn't what makes casuals worse than dedicated gamers, it's the speed and experience of the ability use.

 

[Gear]

Quite frankly there are loads of things one can still do pve-wise (warlord alpha bracer anyone?). Some of the best items are and will still be there to be farmed, however it will not be a necessity that was created with artifacts and MLs.

Doing toa once is ok, I even thought it was fun. Having to do it again and again is no longer fun, it's a pain in the ass. I mean come on, we all know how to do MLs, arti encounters etc, what needs to be done, what's the best set-up. There is no challenge anymore, it's just a time-sink.

At the moment I have an unactivated gov which will stay like that as I cba to farm LS3. Is there any fun trying to farm a scroll? Hm... I can't say so. Is there any fun camping an arti? Nah, not really, the scenery is not that good to worth seeing for hours.

At the end of the day, TOA had it's share of peoples' time for over two years now. As normal XP eventually became easier, was about time they'd do the same thing with TOA.

For me TOA is not such a big fuss anymore, ML10 chanter and fop-bot mean I can do almost everything I want. Add on that my best friends ML10 chanter and a mana mentalist and there you go. However imagine how a new (if there are going to be any new) player must feel! XP to 50, grind toa (aye, huge argument there that one can starts grinding at 40 but let's be realistic) while not having the resources to do it or the people to help you....

Nerf toa to hell and back imo, won't be missed.

 

[Bubble]

If TOA was THAT good, why are you playing Glast?

Alot of my friends moved back from WoW to have a go on The classic servers, so i joined them

This made me laugh sooooo loud after that ToA-advertisement you posted....

Thanks... <chuckles>

If i made someone laugh, then i'm happy enough with the effects of my post

I don't have a single char past ml1 bar my main who is ML5 - nearly ML6, I play mostly after 9pm of an evening or later, and rarely weekends - that has made it almost impossible to get ml's and certain arti's - I have been playing games for 15yrs+ and I think I am a decent gamer in general - so yeah I kinda feel annoyed that someone with no RL commitments can get ahead in a game - not through skill but simply by being online.

Then why not do what alot of people do, arrange raids to suit yourself, my IRL dad was in the same situation, he can't play daoc between 6pm and 9pm due to putting his disabled child to bed (takes a long time etc) so instead i arranged raids when he told me he was free. Theres no point of being annoyed at other people that you are unable to play the game during the prime hours of most peoples playtime, i work 9 to 5 myself most days etc, i have to arrange things around my social life too...

I took it into my own hands..

This goes some way to supporting the argument that you don't want other players to have what you've got.

I know thats why i put i know i'm being selfish
All through SI, my characters didn't have a single piece of Sidi equipment etc, i couldn't attend these raids, i saw people like Yussef/Flesh running around in full sets of sidi gear, i knew it was my own social life that ment i couldn't do the same, this didn't make me hate the expansion. Infact i thought Sidi and SI in general were great, best thing since dartmoor

What TOA meant to me.. I had to shelf my RR6 minstrel, RR5 paladin and RR4 infil so that I could get them TOA'd. Then realised tanks were useless so had to get my Cabalist TOA'd. After over a year of TOA I finally got my cabby to RR6. I can honestly say I hated nearly every minute of PvE I was forced to do because without XYZ ability or artifact you could not compete.

Are you going to unshelf your characters in 1.81 since you can now finish them?

 

[Zede]

Mythic are making DaoC more and more rvr-centric. ( we are W.Hammer Beta testers after all, expect more changes)

I think making arties and MLs easier is a bad thing, along with the x 5 rps.

Just who are mythic appealing to ??

its the hardcore players that are getting shat on, be in pve or rvr.

Come the 1.81 & 82 patch, i think alot of people will seriously consider is it worth playing at all.

all hail the casual gamer

 

[evzy]

Casual gaming rules!!! Leaves more time for RL !!!

 

[Bubble]

Think of it this way.

Would WoW be better if they just Opened the Flood Gates to all instances, you need need keys/getting atuned etc.

(Maybe a bad example as most of you hate WoW)
This is what 1.81 was for me.

 

[evzy]

Go to WoW then if you like hardcore PvE - that and EQ2 do that better I guess, but DAOC merges RvR in there as well, and is making it more available to all to be able to compete - how is that a bad thing???

 

[Karl]

yeha hate WoW sorry, to much grind and time sinks

See it asll to do with PvE Vs PvP... at the end of the day unfortunatly for the PvEers... there are more PvPers

I remember when i first started Daoc, and we were just getting first lvl 50s on the excal server... so many people into PvE and i used to waste days dieing to mobs and losing exp... i didnt mind it back then... i think daocs problem is that the end game PvP is SO good that nobody really gives a toss about the PvE aslong as they can RvR in good time.

Congratsz on an awesome post though, started of a bit rough but interesting convos going on!!

 

[Sendraks]

its the hardcore players that are getting shat on, be in pve or rvr.

While its not nice, these players hardly represent the majority so its not even remotely wise as a game designer to wholly cater to them.

Come the 1.81 & 82 patch, i think alot of people will seriously consider is it worth playing at all.

I think a few people will consider quitting, more people will come back, new players will come to the game and overall DAoC will be better off than it was before.

Seriously, it does seem to be the hardcore crowd who are turned off by the ToA changes and they are not in the majority.

all hail the casual gamer

Indeed. The world has changed. Game designers realise that MMOs are not the province of people who can slavishly devote days on end to a game. The market is people with money, some free time, but not so much time that they can afford to play a game all day.

 

[Sendraks]

Would WoW be better if they just Opened the Flood Gates to all instances, you need need keys/getting atuned etc.

Yes and no. Some of the key obtaining/attuning is very easy to do. So its hardly an issue really.

 

[Bubble]

Go to WoW then if you like hardcore PvE - that and EQ2 do that better I guess, but DAOC merges RvR in there as well, and is making it more available to all to be able to compete - how is that a bad thing???

Yes thats what i put in my first post that people tell me.
But why should that be the case, with ToA daoc had highend PvE.

Thats the reason for my posting etc
And why i hope theres still some hope for the future

 

[Bubble]

Yes and no. Some of the key obtaining/attuning is very easy to do. So its hardly an issue really.

Some Artifacts and ML's are very easy to do.

Some Aren't

Ps- Berserk rocks

 

[Sendraks]

Some Artifacts and ML's are very easy to do.

Some Aren't

Ps- Berserk rocks

There are very few dungeons in WoW that actually require some sort of attunement or key. There is only 1 key I know of thats hard to get, the rest is easy.

None of the MLs are hard to do but most them are very time consuming. Most of the artifacts can be done very quickly, but its having the time and the resources to hand to camp them so you can actually get the damn things and also have the time to spend farming the scrolls. Typically the artis that are easiest to get are the least potent/desirable ones as well and little more than a bone thrown to casual players to keep them interested.

The big improvement of ToA was all the nice qual drops with procs on them. Thats something I'd like to see extrapolated across all the game zones, especially for some of the older classic boss mobs like the ones found in Lyn Barfog, which really need their drops updating.

 

[Jeffery]

ToA was the biggest pile of shit mythic could have ever done and thats my opinion been playing since beta and the game went downhill from ToA go to usa servers and most populated server is classics same here in europe i think that says it all really.I saw so many people leave this game because of ToA.Alot of people have got a life and dont have time to do ML's and Arti's.

 

[Bubble]

ToA was the biggest pile of shit mythic could have ever done and thats my opinion been playing since beta and the game went downhill from ToA go to usa servers and most populated server is classics same here in europe i think that says it all really.I saw so many people leave this game because of ToA.Alot of people have got a life and dont have time to do ML's and Arti's.

As i keep saying, the same is true for me, it took me aaaages to get ML10 on a single character (some people had 3+ ML10's when i dinged Healu).

Why was there a big race? to be honest it didn't hurt the casual gamer as much as people say it did, it only hurt the 'wannabe' leet folk who were worried about powergamers (Greeks) really fast ML dings. Alo of casuals liked ToA and took there time to enjoy the experience.

 

[Sendraks]

Alo of casuals liked ToA and took there time to enjoy the experience.

I took my time, as I know a lot of others did, and guess what........

 

[Dorimor1]

ToA made casters way too OP. It made a bridge between casual and hardcore gamers and the community just... went.

Try telling me ToA didn't ruin the game.

 

[Bubble]

I took my time, as I know a lot of others did, and guess what........

I'm not trying to tell you what to think, just my opinion.

ToA made casters way too OP.

Because Banelord didn't counter anything a caster did right?
Before ToA, you got nothing but Tank groups, thanks to ToA theres now a mix.

Try telling me ToA didn't ruin the game.

ToA didn't ruin the game...it SAVED it

 

[Dorimor1]

Because Banelord didn't counter anything a caster did right?
Before ToA, you got nothing but Tank groups, thanks to ToA theres now a mix.

Casting speed is way too insane, casters shouldn't be able to hit for ~700 damage in under 2 seconds.

ToA didn't ruin the game...it SAVED it

I guess the content of the expansion itself wasn't too bad, I agree that the abilities added more tactic and content to the game but the influence ToA had on the gamers ruined DAoC, if you know what I mean. People just became too damn greedy and the community disolved.

 

[Bubble]

Casting speed is way too insane, casters shouldn't be able to hit for ~700 damage in under 2 seconds..

Yeah, most of that is sorted now tho isn't it. But thats the whole point of casters, massive damage if uninterupted, nil if interupted etc.

I guess the content of the expansion itself wasn't too bad, I agree that the abilities added more tactic and content to the game but the influence ToA had on the gamers ruined DAoC, if you know what I mean. People just became too damn greedy and the community disolved.

True, but the same could be said about the other expansions in that aspect, there will always be greed and people who love to try and control the market prices (like me )
The content and new totally different lands were what i loved, going underwater too etc. People tend to miss how cool ToA looked when it came out

 

[Dorin]

People tend to miss how cool ToA looked when it came out

toa lost his cutey factor at me when i was like camping CS - gov for the 2nd or so time or farming scrolls or getting fooked up on a 6hour pluuuuus ml raid

etc etc





q :d

 

[Bubble]

<throws a cloudsong at Dorins>

 

[Darzil]

My opinion, for what little it's worth :

The content of TOA - Great, wonderful, triffic, huge amount of top end content to an otherwise dull pve existance.

The powers of artifacts/some MLs - Horribly unbalanced, needs a blooming great whack with the nerf bat (along with a lot of RA's).

Darzil

 

[Coldbeard]

Oh, it's this discussion all over again.

 

[Dr_Evil]

It was a big mistake of Mythic to put the most boring MLs in the start. ML1-ML4 are just so boring and pointless they should be removed. If ML1-4 was a more fun encounter like ML8, then much more people wouldn't quit the game after a LD at ML3. Most of the people I knew in game has said about the ML3 raid they're never gonna do it again, and most of those have quit DAOC after not being able to complete it on the first try.

I was one of those who came to ML3 and stopped there, I didn't quit DAOC however, I'm one of the very few in my old alliance who kept on playing. I didn't set my foot in ToA before a year had passed atleast, and now I'm at ML7 waiting for a raid (need ML7-10 BG credit). Competing in rvr without MLs/artis was very tough until I got to higher RRs, although I'm apparently one of the few who enjoy a challenge instead of being a quitter.

 

[Ardas Nails]

I left the game shortly after ToA was released, slogged away for years to get to where I was, and it was for nothing, ToA made me void unless I spent hours and days and weeks completing it.. and after 2 years already wasted, it wasn't for me.. as others had said, for the casual gamer, it was a final blow in which the 'elitists' won..

2 years later, I've just come back and am playing on the classic server with a lot of old friends...

 

[Flimgoblin]

I like ToA - I wasn't keen on all the 1.81 changes at first but I don't think it's making it as "walk in the park" as I thought it was before - just you can probably make it through with less people/irritations.

The arti changes are good though, artifact camping was probably the worst bit of ToA they hadn't changed.

I don't like DR nearly as much though - there's almost nothing to it. Horses are nice, graphics are nice but I'd like something else to do now please It was fun for the three evenings it took and I like the new mini-abilities (and especially my Champ weapon charge) but I'm left feeling a bit "umm, was that it?"

TOA added stupid amounts of things to do - and more importantly it added lots of different things to do - DR you all do the same quest, ToA you would do different artifacts for different characters.

The one thing ToA did do though is make it that much more indimidating to make an alt - however come 1.81 levelling up will be massively easier than it ever was, toa will be much easier to get through - we're all being rushed into RvR, and don't get me wrong but as fun as RvR can be it'd be nice to have some PvE worth doing for when it's too zergy or not zergy enough out there - IMO - only having RvR to do is worse for the casual gamer. Sure when the gank groups were ML10 and had all their artis and the casual gamer didn't they were that much more powerful - but they're all RRumpteen in opted groups and running with voicecomms anyway the fact they can summon a power font is the least of your worries. (ok ok so banelords are oveprowered but that's just something in need of a nerf people laud catacombs but warlocks were far worse for 2 of the 3 realms than any ToA imbalance)

Gifv another expansion like ToA - but like ToA is now, not like ToA was at release

 

[blejs]

Well can tell my opinion even tho i have quit, i dont think the MLs was a problem for me atleast.

But i can understand it might be a problem for ppl that have family/kids or other stuff going for them, tho its possible to do a ML on a weekend.

And if noone is doing a ML on a weekend, you might have to try get someone do it for you, or you have to organise it your self.


Getting the artifacts sucked tho, i mean for example like cloudsong camp it for 20h without a pop i mean give a f*cking break?

But the incomming toa love patch makes stuff alot easier, and make more then 1 person able to get the arti if they have the scrolls or how it is.

"PVE:rs" can always still do mobs like kraken,levithan and other hard stuff.

 

[Bubble]

Gifv another expansion like ToA - but like ToA is now, not like ToA was at release

Couldn't agree more.
Alot of it was changed due to improvements or bug tweeking etc, so it might be difficult, but i would really enjoy another ToA like expansion.