To: Garcal / Draconis Alumni

[Tyka]

There is no secret command, just that it would not make a big well establishled guild like DA look so bad, if they could have solved it in game, but what do i know. If you want to make a whine thread about everything in game, go ahead.

 

[Lessurl]

Originally posted by Ziva



But somehow people sometimes seem to forget they deal with humans behind the computers in this game. People are not allowed to make mistakes it seems and if they do they are flamed in public on this board.

Oh, so he accidentally came and ruined a nights xping for a grp of people? That's ok then, all forgiven.

 

[Lessurl]

Originally posted by Tyka
There is no secret command, just that it would not make a big well establishled guild like DA look so bad, if they could have solved it in game, but what do i know. If you want to make a whine thread about everything in game, go ahead.

I also agree with tyka on this, anything relating to the guild should have been done in game. You shouldn't flame a whole guild on a public forum over the actions of one member. Fair enough flame him but deal with the guild side in game. There wasn't any need to say Garcall of draconis alumni (who we now will boycot...blah blah). If u wanted to discuss the incident here then only his name should have been brought up.

 

[Ziva]

Originally posted by Lessurl



Oh, so he accidentally came and ruined a nights xping for a grp of people? That's ok then, all forgiven.

Did u hear me say that? No, i said people can make mistakes and when they are pissed off they make even bigger ones. If u don't wanna forgive that's fine, not judging u on that issue.

Maybe my view on this is different, i get pissed at people too sometimes, try giving them hints or talking to them and if that doesn't work i put them on my personal shitlist. But no need to drag a guild down, involve people not involved or anything.

But then again, for me it's just a game and for some people it seems like a daily job or lifework

 

[freemem]

On my behalf im sorry for guild mate's actions.

On other issue, as flaming the whole guild like this based on one single bad event, without even contacting any guild masters, i dont give a flying fuck, get a life!

I mean ... really, think about this, shees uke:

This message is my personal opinnion and not the official opinnion of Draconis Alumni.


I only wished that we could of heard this somewhere else than this flamethread against DA.

 

[old.Tzeentch]

<munches popcorn>

 

[old.Xanthian]

lol Tzee

 

[Lessurl]

Originally posted by Ziva


Did u hear me say that? No, i said people can make mistakes and when they are pissed off they make even bigger ones. If u don't wanna forgive that's fine, not judging u on that issue.

Ok, so he mistakingly came and ruined a nights xping for a grp of people? All is forgiven.

 

[Arakiel]

hey tzeench m8 pass the popcorn over i like watching this Forum fight too

 

[elerand]

Re: ARRGGHH!

Originally posted by Novo
/rant on
Never normally post this kind of post and try and keep well out of it but what has just happened made me lose my cool. So here is some background to the post above!

Garcall (lvl 50 Hero) brought himself and 2 of his guilds lvl 50 friends to disrupt and eventually stop xping at the Cursed Forest fins tonight…. The reason being that as a Nightshade he was not allowed to join as a Tank replacement.

As far as I was told the fins group rules give that there should be:-

1 Stalker (Ranger/Nightshade)
2 Tanks (Hero/Blademaster/Champion)
1 Bard
1 Druid
1 Pber
1 Nuker
1 Warden

Garcall has a lvl 48 Nightshade alt called Garcal (not confusing is it). Garcal (alt) was after me on the fins list today. I waited 8 hrs for Eriu (lvl 45 Nightshade) from 10.30ish (GMT) this morning to finish his turn and joined the group. We xped happily for a few hours till it was time to replace Culanan (Champion I think) with next on the list Caleth (Hero)…. At this point Garcal showed up and spent the next few minutes arguing he should have the next Tank place…. This continued for some time till he left.

The list holder and Group had a short discussion with him in a chat group to try and solve the problem but he didn't agree… SO he brought his lvl 50 Hero and 2 lvl 50 guildies to CF … and basically disrupted the group till we all got tired and left. I died once due to the distruptions he brought to the group, he spoilt what was a happy and ordered fins group for his own amusement.

So I’m a little cross at the moment and was wondering if this is acceptable behavour. I personally will never group with him again or his 2 Guildies … they joined in a disagreement they new nothing about and made no attempt to listen or justify there actions. SAD.

/rant off

I recall that day, although I left before stupidity ensued...
And I'm a BLADEMASTER novo, get your gimps right ;-)
Ok on to the topic at hand, having replied to a more recent post by garcal I find it even harder to swallow any statements about "elitism" when such bullyish tactics are employed, bang goes your arguement pal, whatever OPINION you may have on how you THINK you were treated you went a few steps further and took action, I'm sure you think you were justified but then it's easy to convince yourself of the rightness of your actions, very glad I wasn't there to see it.
Fin grps can run with 1 tank and 2 stealthers, so long as the stealthers are fairly high lvl, as anyone on that day will testify I worked damn hard to keep people alive and tanking 2 purp fins as a CD wielding BM is no mean feat... but if the list is already in place and running smoothly it would be grotesquely unfair to all those other people waiting for their spots, it's fairly simple if a tank leaves a tank comes in, dammit fins lists are great for one things, stealthers get a chance to earn some good xp and make a lot of money.
I have a couple of other characters to get to 50 now, hope I never see such a thing as novo has described...

 

[elerand]

Originally posted by Ziva
Personally i hate the fins, not the mob itself but these mobs seem to accomplish something feelings no other mobs can cause: greediness, arrogance and frustrated people. Pretty sad to see i must say.

But that's just the way it is and apparently people like to break up whole groups for them (and leave others behind who have no choice then waiting another 2 hours for someone to fulfill the open spot), spend 12 hours begging online and sometimes even fight over a spot for these. This considering i think u should be really carefull with promising a spot to people when u are listholder or even groupmember.

As far as i know Garcall waited like 12 hours to get a spot and when a tank finally left he did not get the spot because the list holder (Sebula) had to relog and when he came back the person that became groupleader had invited a fellow guildmember tank to come in the group.

Now i doubt if Garcall knew about the "rules" for the list. I never heard of the rules and from what i know a NS can tank as good as a lvl 44-45 tank because of evade. So if these rules applied for this group it would be nice if Garcall had known about them right?

To me it looked like another case people of not wanting a NS in the group. I see it happen all the time and people rather seem to make up lame excuses instead of beeing honest and saying "No sorry m8, we prefer to have no rangers or nightshades in the group".

The person who invited his fellow guildmember to come in group and was NOT the listleader because Sebula was, was just as lame as Garcall after he got pissed imho.

I am not saying that the way Garcall and his friends ruined the finshunt is okay, but it was a case of a DA guildmember and a spanish friend helping Garcall because they felt sorry for him. No need to judge DA on the whole for this.

Sure u can judge this and say innocent people had to suffer from this, but unfortunatelly it's always the good suffering from the bad. And in this case the person who invited his guildmate instead of Garcall could have left the group too but he didn't. So he's just as bad in this.

Like i said before... really sad to see people react when it comes to fins. It's just a game no need to flame eachother for a couple of mobs. There are enough other mobs to fight out there.

Well I have to say that Fins are not the cause of the problem, bad players are. Most the time fins run smoothly because of the list and so long as people who are not listholder don't try to fast track friends in and leave everything to the list holder it's fine, in this case I would have said "sorry the list holder is relogging, wait until he returns" simple...
I don't think the end justifies the means, you could stretch that definition till it snaps, take each act on it's own merit, someone should have waited for seb to get back, garcal shoul dhave insisted on waiting to speak to the list holder before assuming one persons actions were simply the actions of the entire grp, there are a lot of people I know who simply won't get involved in grp politics.

Rangers and NS are mana leeches at almost any level, but it's the job of the grp to keep the grp alive and make do. I've personally had to control aggro for benedict, lvl 46 hero cos the poor sod is LW specced and only has blades 6 but his shield has saved people from being hurt (mine too for that matter). A shield tank is not essential to a grp but I think the confusion occuring over who was next go in the way, I recall being told garcal was next up when I left, still I wouldn't have come back in a rage, god forbid you spill the mans pint...

 

[elerand]

Originally posted by Alrindel
Earlier that morning there was another dispute at the CF fins spot. One person logged on early in the morning, went to the forest, and started making a group, and holding a list. Another person logged on over an hour later, and despite the fact that he knew someone was already there making a group, he started making a competing group and holding a competing list for the same spot. After he managed to make his group first, he started pulling and then announced to the first group, "move on pls this spot taken we here for the whole day".

I have to say that I don't consider a spot camped by a few people, unless they are waiting for new members and have been xping already there, best to be sporting about it as you were, I have had a few races to claim a spot but no point fighting over it, we did send on some people ahead but since they couldn't pull they couldn't reasonably claim it so we went to the other all day spawn in CF, ok you can get less mobs but here's a tip for it, take a ranger, with the range they have a better chance of pulling linked mobs and bring in the xp daddio!
I've had more good times than bad at fins, not counting bored days, plenty of those but for the most part people there are good humored, kind and most importantly, patient, HIb has too few high xp spots for all the people xping at em these days, no wonder it's taken so long to roll out the 50's, think they should add in a couple of other spots to bring it up to par with realms that have less trouble (if indeed they do have less trouble but from what I hear it's less bothersome).

 

[elerand]

Originally posted by freemem
On my behalf im sorry for guild mate's actions.

On other issue, as flaming the whole guild like this based on one single bad event, without even contacting any guild masters, i dont give a flying fuck, get a life!

I mean ... really, think about this, shees uke:

This message is my personal opinnion and not the official opinnion of Draconis Alumni.


I only wished that we could of heard this somewhere else than this flamethread against DA.

I don't think it turned into a flame thread against DA, those were opinions held by those people they wouldn't group with Garcal and DA, their loss maybe but it still stands, I would love to be informed of inappropriate action by my guild members and be able to take action and as Novo already said he did try...

 

[Odon]

My My

I don't know - been at a Junior School all day log quickly onto the UNI Internet access and see more action than I did all day with a class of 9 year olds - but only just.

I have a critisim of you all - yes all.

I relise that I personally have not been on for the last 2 week (changes soon!!)... however:

IF you have an issue with one of our member's have the decency to at least ask a guild member on-line at the time who the GM of our guild is please. Then take the matter up with them.

We have 4 - why, because it means there should be at least 1 or 2 on most of the time.

I don't appreciate the name of DA being plastered all over the boards for anything .. well killing Albs/Mids and taking Keeps is fine...

I haven't read into this .. why: I wasn't on and also won't be on until next week - therefore I'm going to leave it upto the GM's who are on to deal with.

As for stating...

"Garcal is DA and his actions reflect the guild as a whole", that is almost true - if a member of CBH or CF or TD or your own guild, made a mistake would that mean that every member should live with the results - not very adult like really is it. Garcal will be dealt with - but I judge people on their actions, I do not judge Guilds on the actions of the few, or tbh there would be some very good guilds/players tarnished with the troubles of a select few - who might move on a few weeks later.

Just a different view and that does not mean I support/don't support or have judged other players/guilds.

SO I repeat:
Let the GM's of DA look at this and take it from there - matter closed on BW. If you have an issue bring it up at the time with the GM or Senior Officer please. That applies to all guilds/issues.

Some Useful commands using DA as example:

/who Draconis (lists all the non anon Draconis Members)
/send (High Level DA) "Hi, was wondering if your GM was on and name.
/send (GM Name) Can I have a minute please.
/cg invite (depending upon response).

No need to bring the name of a good (quiet!), guild down

Simple isn't it.

 

[old.Rahvinn]

Once again Odon digs into my brain and steals my posts....

But hes right
Garcals actions were bad, will be dealt with
Posting this kind of thread only cuases a merry go round of flames

Well said O and talk to myself, Cutrimson, Kalid, Athals , Odon, Jayce, Tba and any other gms/officers if you got a complaint/issue

Night all and I hope no mor unpleasentness's like this happen again