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[old.Tohtori]

Actually in the UK the Police do need s reason to stop you..it could be anything...including a shed load of things at their discretion..but they do have to claim something for the stop...they cant stop you and say..we think you might be an asshole.

I think that they have to inform you the reason only if you ask for it, but it could be anything. They would literally just have to say "random sobriety check" or some such.

I don't think Scouse was stopped 22 times and every time he asked for a reason the cops went "Oh no reason."

 

[soze]

Because it's against the law.

They have to have a reason. Period. Otherwise you can have your life interfered with unnecesarily - and as long as you're not breaking any laws you have a right to a private life without interference by the state.

Being pulled over 22 times in 10 years for no reason is the perfect demonstration of why it's illegal to stop someone for no reason. I have the right to go about my business without undue interference.

If I'm commiting a crime? Fair enough. If I'm not then the state can cunt the fuck off - because that's what the law says the state should do.


Bend over and take it from the state like a good little obedient plebian if you must Moriath - however, as a law abiding citizen myself, I get really fucked off by routine illegal action by the police...

Like I said they do have to give you a reason and they have to give you the bit of paper with it on. I have never not had this bit of paper which says why you were stopped. If they do not give you this you can make a formal complaint. If you have never been given this over 22 stops you must be refusing to accept it. I fail to see how 22 separate officer have left themselves open to a complaint based on paper work they have to fill out anyway for turning the sirens on.

 

[Job]

They do and always offer a reason..you were weaving..your car matches description etc..only roadside random checks are allowed to stop you to see if you are breaking the law..but of course any copper can say he has reason to believe you may be intoxicated.

 

[Lakih]

I know nothing about @Scouse driving abilities, but if you have been pulled over by the coppers 22 times in 11 years, you might want to rethink your driving habits

As for a reason, it's not really that hard to make one up.... "we perceived the driver swearving and pulled him over for a sobriety test, upon closer inspection we could clearly see the driver sober without the need of a breathalyzer test". Done.

 

[soze]

The fact they can give you any reason weaving, erratic driving, too close to car in front, too fast, too slow, your wheel looked wobbly, or a million other reasons I do not see why 22 times they would refuse to tell you why they stopped you.

Given how Scouse seems to hate coppers though I do believe he has been pulled over and I do believe he becomes argumentative and when offered the paperwork with the reason for the stop he politely tells them to poke it and drives away.

 

[Scouse]

As for a reason, it's not really that hard to make one up....

The fact they can give you any reason

Apart from the fact that you guys are totally ignoring that it's illegal to stop you for a manufactured reason I'll humour you.

I mentioned the "red seats". I've been stopped twice for that.
"Mr Scouse, I notice you have red seats in your Type R. When did you have your Type R modified"
"Never. It came with red seats. Why did you stop me?".
"They don't come with red seats".
"This one did. It's the 30th anniversary edition. Why did you stop me?"
"My brother has a type R of the same plate, it's not got red seats. Nice cars tho eh?"
"Yes. Nice cars. Why did you stop me?"
...

I've been pulled over countless times just to "check my tyres". Pretty funny that I've never been pulled over to "check my tyres" in any other car I've ever driven.

I've been pulled over "you were speeding". No I wasn't. "Oh, sorry. Off you go then".

I've been pulled over "what you doing out so late"? (Twice).

It's happening less now. My grey hair must be standing out more...

Like I said they do have to give you a reason and they have to give you the bit of paper with it on.

I didn't know that, and I've never had a piece of paper, ever.

But then - if they stop you for no reason why would they record it?

 

[Scouse]

On the other hand - when I was 17 I was stopped and given a producer on the A55 in North Wales just outside Conway.

"Have you stolen this car sir?"
"Of course fucking not you fucking idiot - unless I also stole the 50 year old woman in the passenger seat, the 13 year old boy in the back seat, the two cats in the cat carriers and all the camping equipment and duvets that are filling up every other available space in the car."

...it was a Blue 1.3 Astra hatchback. I was doing 65 because my mum is a very nervous passenger.

 

[soze]

I didn't know that, and I've never had a piece of paper, ever.

But then - if they stop you for no reason why would they record it?

Every time they turn the blue lights on it is logged and they have to report why they turned them on. For a traffic stop it has to be one of these forms normally with your signature on it. And by the way to check your tyre is a reason. If they said your wheel was wobbly they could pull you over yo check that it is safe. No one says it has to be a good reason.

I do remember reading about about a group of traffic officers that were sacked years ago for playing snooker. Red Car, Black Car, Red Car ect. One guy in a red Fiesta got pulled over 14 times in a night. It is the reason being the myth you get pulled over more often in a red car. http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/422651.stm

 

[old.Tohtori]

Apart from the fact that you guys are totally ignoring that it's illegal to stop you for a manufactured reason I'll humour you.

It's not though. Checking road worthiness is a valid reason (checking tires for example, or making sure you're street legal in your racer car), asking why you're out late(especially depending on part of city) etc etc.

You at first said "no reason at all", when in fact you mean "not a worthy reason in my opinion".

Different things those.

Then again since...

"Have you stolen this car sir?"
"Of course fucking not you fucking idiot.

...is the way you treat the police, no wonder you (rightfully) get f*cked with

 

[Scouse]

Toht - stopping someone for a manufactured reason is illegal. And I've never sworn at a cop, but I've been sworn at by one.

 

[Gwadien]

My dad kept getting pulled over when he were a yout when he had a Ford Cortina MK3 - There was a spate of people stealing that particular car, so he got pulled over dozens of times over the course of a year or so.

He complained a lot, but as the copper rightly said, well, you should be happy we're pulling you over, what if this was stolen, and it was your car?

 

[old.Tohtori]

Toht - stopping someone for a manufactured reason is illegal.

Yes and like i said; plenty of legit reasons in your examples alone.

 

[Madmaxx]

Just got home, that was a long day, but stood about 20ft from the runway and watched the whole display finishing with the Spitfire, which makes a lovely sound.

They euro fighter is deafening

I miss the Southend airshow but the old WW2 planes flying on the wings of a bomber was always a great sight, and the Euro fighter sounds its going to tear a hole in the O-zone layer

 

[Edmond]

I miss the Southend airshow but the old WW2 planes flying on the wings of a bomber was always a great sight, and the Euro fighter sounds its going to tear a hole in the O-zone layer

The Vulcan was amazing but it's not got long left, it's cost £20 million to get it back in the air. It's had lottery and public funding, also BAE, Boeing, Airbus and others have helped, but has no business funding so it relies on donations. It's costing £38,000 a week to keep it going atm and it's flown 60 hours more than they thought they could in it. It has the same style of engine as Concorde had and is based on the same design too, it just looks the nuts, and sounds awesome

 

[soze]

The Vulcan was amazing but it's not got long left, it's cost £20 million to get it back in the air. It's had lottery and public funding, also BAE, Boeing, Airbus and others have helped, but has no business funding so it relies on donations. It's costing £38,000 a week to keep it going atm and it's flown 60 hours more than they thought they could in it. It has the same style of engine as Concorde had and is based on the same design too, it just looks the nuts, and sounds awesome

That is my second favorite plane after the jump jet. I always throw a few quid in the donation pot for the Vulcan at the Clacton Air Show but I can't see that it is coming back this year. Plenty of time for it to be confirmed though.

 

[Urgat]

Scouse is correct.

In the uk, the police have to suspect you of a crime to stop you. Fabricating reasons for a stop is also illegal.

Its because most people don't know their rights that they continually get away with it.

If you are stopped by police in the UK for no reason, the first question you ask is...

"What crime do you suspect me of committing"

If you do not get a valid answer immediately, the next question is...

"Am I detained, or am I free to go"

Those are the only two things you say.

They either arrest you on suspicion of a crime, or they tell you your free to go.

Don't put up with anything less, we do not live in a police state!

 

[ileks]

Scouse is correct.

In the uk, the police have to suspect you of a crime to stop you. Fabricating reasons for a stop is also illegal.

Its because most people don't know their rights that they continually get away with it.

If you are stopped by police in the UK for no reason, the first question you ask is...

"What crime do you suspect me of committing"

If you do not get a valid answer immediately, the next question is...

"Am I detained, or am I free to go"

Those are the only two things you say.

They either arrest you on suspicion of a crime, or they tell you your free to go.

Don't put up with anything less, we do not live in a police state!

I didn't know this. What about the whole "stop and search" thing?

 

[Urgat]

Stop and search is a whole different ball game.. Valid reasons for stop and search are...

• as part of anti-terrorism efforts

• if there has been serious violence or disorder in the area

• if we are looking for a suspect who fits your description

• if we have reasonable grounds to suspect you're carrying a weapon, drugs or stolen property.

As you can see... this covers a large number of possible fabrications. It is basically the state making up legal excuses to stop anyone they like in an area that the policy has been authorised. Frankly... i think they realised that people were getting wise to their rights, so... they gave the police more power.

I was mainly referring to being stopped In a car. If you get stopped under the section 44 S&S policy... your best bet is to understand the process.

The power to stop and search under anti-terrorism powers should only be used when there is evidence of a specific terrorist threat. It should not be simply an addition to the day to day powers of officers policing protests.
YOUR RIGHTS UNDER SECTION 44:
• The police can only give you a pat down, remove outer clothes (eg jacket, hat), search your bags and have you empty your pockets
• You do not have to give your name and address
• You do not have to explain why you are there
• You are not allowed to flee the search, but you are not required to be actively compliant. You are allowed to ‘go limp’ as passive resistance during the search if you wish not to comply
• There is no permission to collect DNA data during the search
• You do not have to comply with any attempt to photograph or record you
• Women cannot be touched by male police during these searches
• Make notes about the officers searching you – name, number and police force
• Note the time and the events preceding the search
• Note the specific wording used by the police to explain their authority to search you
• Ask the police for the reason that they are searching you. Specifically, are they searching for terrorists or are they simply trying to deter, delay or inconvenience you?
Afterwards:• Hold on to the Search Record or any other documentation the police give you (or note if you don’t receive one)
• Make brief notes about the search while you still remember all the details
• Do not write anything down on the day that you don’t want disclosed to the police. Police may search you again and be able to read anything that you have written down
• Consider making a complaint to the Independent Police Complaints Commission
• Write to Lord Carlile, the independent monitor of the implementation of anti-terrorism legislation (Lord Carlile of Berriew QC, The House of Lords London SW1A 0AA)
• Consider pressing charges if the officers used unnecessary force during the search

 

[old.Tohtori]

Or you could, i dunno, not be a dick about it and not mind a stop

Nothing is so damn important that you can't afford it.

 

[Urgat]

Or you could, i dunno, not be a dick about it and not mind a stop

Nothing is so damn important that you can't afford it.

It's not about being a dick, its about exercising fundamental freedoms. We don't live in a police state, this isn't Nazi Germany, therefore we are free to go about our business without unwarranted hassle from the police.

We have the RIGHT to NOT be stopped by PUBLIC SERVANTS for no reason.

It is THAT simple.

 

[Moriath]

T

Because it's against the law.

They have to have a reason. Period. Otherwise you can have your life interfered with unnecesarily - and as long as you're not breaking any laws you have a right to a private life without interference by the state.

Being pulled over 22 times in 10 years for no reason is the perfect demonstration of why it's illegal to stop someone for no reason. I have the right to go about my business without undue interference.

If I'm commiting a crime? Fair enough. If I'm not then the state can cunt the fuck off - because that's what the law says the state should do.


Bend over and take it from the state like a good little obedient plebian if you must Moriath - however, as a law abiding citizen myself, I get really fucked off by routine illegal action by the police...

hey have to have a reason. Just cause you don't like the reason doesn't mean it's not valid. You live I a small world they see other thigpngs outside.

Might be that 5/10 traffic offences in Liverpool are done I type-r cars. Or that you fit the profile. White Middle Ages sporty car etc of drug dealers in the area you are driving through.

There are lots more misses than hits with street searches and car stops. You have to fish to find the crims.

How do they know you don't have about of hash before they stop you.

Live in the Thames valley and have a nice car and don't get stopped. Live I a poorer area with a good job and a nice car get stopped but they are only fishing. Why get upset if your innocent? They obviously don't intend to stop innocent people but you fit a profile that's indicating you might be. Ragging the car.. Single white male in hot hatch.... Dodgey area your driving in. Twice a year isn't exessive. Except to you cause you have a bee up your arse about it.

I been stopped before. I been questioned when my car is stopped still. I didn't care cause they have to cross investigate where there might be a good explanation but there might not. I prefer to understand that for the 22 times you got stopped they stopped 1000 other people and 10% were illegal.

You see the small picture. Like the small minded person you are.

 

[Moriath]

On the other hand - when I was 17 I was stopped and given a producer on the A55 in North Wales just outside Conway.

"Have you stolen this car sir?"
"Of course fucking not you fucking idiot - unless I also stole the 50 year old woman in the passenger seat, the 13 year old boy in the back seat, the two cats in the cat carriers and all the camping equipment and duvets that are filling up every other available space in the car."

...it was a Blue 1.3 Astra hatchback. I was doing 65 because my mum is a very nervous passenger.

No excuse. There is no excuse for speeding in law

 

[Moriath]

The Vulcan was amazing but it's not got long left, it's cost £20 million to get it back in the air. It's had lottery and public funding, also BAE, Boeing, Airbus and others have helped, but has no business funding so it relies on donations. It's costing £38,000 a week to keep it going atm and it's flown 60 hours more than they thought they could in it. It has the same style of engine as Concorde had and is based on the same design too, it just looks the nuts, and sounds awesome

Vulcans were the ones that went over fro here to the Falklands. Awesome planes

 

[Urgat]

T

hey have to have a reason. Just cause you don't like the reason doesn't mean it's not valid. You live I a small world they see other thigpngs outside.

Might be that 5/10 traffic offences in Liverpool are done I type-r cars. Or that you fit the profile. White Middle Ages sporty car etc of drug dealers in the area you are driving through.

There are lots more misses than hits with street searches and car stops. You have to fish to find the crims.

How do they know you don't have about of hash before they stop you.

Live in the Thames valley and have a nice car and don't get stopped. Live I a poorer area with a good job and a nice car get stopped but they are only fishing. Why get upset if your innocent? They obviously don't intend to stop innocent people but you fit a profile that's indicating you might be. Ragging the car.. Single white male in hot hatch.... Dodgey area your driving in. Twice a year isn't exessive. Except to you cause you have a bee up your arse about it.

I been stopped before. I been questioned when my car is stopped still. I didn't care cause they have to cross investigate where there might be a good explanation but there might not. I prefer to understand that for the 22 times you got stopped they stopped 1000 other people and 10% were illegal.

You see the small picture. Like the small minded person you are.

"fishing to find the crims" infracts on innocent citizens rights. It is ILLEGAL.
Stopping someone in the HOPE they have hash is ILLEGAL. Reasonable suspicion of an offence must be present in order to stop someone.

YOU are the small minded person here, you are oblivious to your rights and are enabling the authorities to control you in ways they are NOT allowed to.

let's try this one more time...

Outside of the stop and search designated areas...

It is ILLEGAL for a police officer to stop a UK citizen if they do not suspect them of committing a crime.
It is ILLEGAL for a police officer to fabricate a reason to stop someone.

It's that fucking simple. Wake up!

 

[old.Tohtori]

Wake up!

Has nothing to do with waking up. I don't mind if the cops stop me every f*cking day to check my ID. I don't feel my freedom is infringed on, or that it's spooky "nazi germany" oooh. It's simply no bother and it seems that the only problem people DO have with it is created by their own issues.

"exercising fundamental freedoms", pfft. Fancy words to justify getting pissed off about absolutely nothing because there's no real problems.

 

[Moriath]

"fishing to find the crims" infracts on innocent citizens rights. It is ILLEGAL.
Stopping someone in the HOPE they have hash is ILLEGAL. Reasonable suspicion of an offence must be present in order to stop someone.

YOU are the small minded person here, you are oblivious to your rights and are enabling the authorities to control you in ways they are NOT allowed to.

let's try this one more time...

Outside of the stop and search designated areas...

It is ILLEGAL for a police officer to stop a UK citizen if they do not suspect them of committing a crime.
It is ILLEGAL for a police officer to fabricate a reason to stop someone.

It's that fucking simple. Wake up!

Driving a hot hatch in a high motor vehicle crime area is a reason to be suspect.

I'm saying that these reasons catch innocent people at times and if you continue with the same behaviour or mode of transport in the same areas you are going to get stopped more.

Don't think I ever said anything about fabrication.

You can be innocent and drive a suspect type of car and get pulled lots without it being illegal. You wake up numb nuts.

 

[DaGaffer]

Driving a hot hatch in a high motor vehicle crime area is a reason to be suspect.

I'm saying that these reasons catch innocent people at times and if you continue with the same behaviour or mode of transport in the same areas you are going to get stopped more.

Don't think I ever said anything about fabrication.

You can be innocent and drive a suspect type of car and get pulled lots without it being illegal. You wake up numb nuts.

Wow you're a fucking idiot. Profiling is illegal. End of story.

 

[soze]

Scouse is correct.

In the uk, the police have to suspect you of a crime to stop you. Fabricating reasons for a stop is also illegal.

Its because most people don't know their rights that they continually get away with it.

If you are stopped by police in the UK for no reason, the first question you ask is...

"What crime do you suspect me of committing"

If you do not get a valid answer immediately, the next question is...

"Am I detained, or am I free to go"

Those are the only two things you say.

They either arrest you on suspicion of a crime, or they tell you your free to go.

Don't put up with anything less, we do not live in a police state!

You honestly think it is easier to be arrested on suspicion of drink driving before blowing into a tube just to prove you know your rights?

Speaking from personal experience whenever a customer starts a call with "under distance selling regulations..... I know my rights so don't try anything" they get my slowest most obnoxious service. If you start every encounter with the police in that way you are starting every encounter in a fractious way.

 

[Job]

When I first passed my test I would get a producer every night( take your documents to police station in the days before wireless databases) sometimes I got three a night...I took twenty at once one time..the desk copper just rolled his eyes..after a couple of months they ignore you because they know you are legal...never once were they arsey with me..polite and reasonable..they are simply checking up on the latest boy racers...which me and my mates where with big wheels on 1.6 escorts...dont laugh.

 

[Urgat]

Has nothing to do with waking up. I don't mind if the cops stop me every f*cking day to check my ID. I don't feel my freedom is infringed on, or that it's spooky "nazi germany" oooh. It's simply no bother and it seems that the only problem people DO have with it is created by their own issues.

"exercising fundamental freedoms", pfft. Fancy words to justify getting pissed off about absolutely nothing because there's no real problems.

The law may be different in your country. I can't comment on the police powers there. If its the same as here, then congrats on being on of the mindless controlled sheep that states strive to produce.

For an example of "the problem" i would ask you yo watch an episode of a uk program called "traffic cops"

Not one episode goes by without at least one of the state sponsored thugs on uniforms saying something akin to ...

"This guy looks dodgy... Ill pull him over and see if i can nick him for anything"

Abuse of power is a crime. Not knowing your rights, and enabling this kind of behaviour from law enforcement, is just as bad. IMO