Think about it....

[Aurelius LH]

Originally posted by Danyan
The relevance of gaming is that people attempt to say gaming isn't addictive, this paper provides evidence to the contrary.

The only question I'd have though is what form of enjoyable pursuit (and for some people, things that are not even particularly enjoyable), is not in some way potentially addictive?

I'd suggest that people who are drawn to computer games, and online MMORPGs in particular, can't really be a very valid control group for determining the 'addictiveness' of gaming in general - what part does the roleplaying have in the addictiveness, many of the reported addictions to 'computer gaming' that the press love to trumpet relate to games that have little or no role-playing element - although to some players they might have a strong element of relating to the character/animation/sprite/whatever seen 'on screen'.

The 'attraction factors' the article mentions are interesting, but the 'get the next best thing' and the vast, immersive atmosphere of the environment are increasingly features of the newer and better solo-play RPGs - and also of many aspects of the 'real world'. Surely many of us know people who 'must have' the latest new gadget, even to the point of buying things they can't really afford, which surely qualifies for the criteria of addiction.

The remaining attraction factor, the interaction with friends offered by online gaming, is something that could use more examination, as in terms of MMORPGs this seems the really 'unique' factor that could explain what (if any?) extra 'addictiveness' they offer.

Are MMORPGs 'more' addictive than other games, interests, or whatever? Is the 'addictiveness' in part the ability to present an 'idealised' version of you to other real people? I've no idea, and would love some more information about that aspect of the hobby...

 

[old.Dillinja]

Notice how it mainly makes references to EQ? There's something about that game... I personally thing DAoC is fine, but there is definately something about EQ.

 

[[Cerebus]]

Question :

Originally posted by old.chesnor
And why do you feel the need to personally insult me.

Answer :

Originally posted by old.chesnor
It really winds me up

Perhaps you shouldn't go around calling people's posts silly or a load of waffle just because it doesn't match your opinion.

I can have reasonable conversations with people who are decent enough human beings to acknowledge someone else may have a point other than their own. You sir can't do this, it's notable from a lot of your posts, so I have to resort to the only thing that you say annoys you, petty insults.

 

[old.Dillinja]

Originally posted by old.chesnor


These games are designed with the help of psychologists to make you addicted, thus swelling their paymasters coffers.

For some reason the thought of this makes me shiver.

P.S btw you should've put this on DAoC General Discussion to get more people's views.

 

[old.chesnor]

Originally posted by [Cerebus]

Perhaps you shouldn't go around calling people's posts silly or a load of waffle just because it doesn't match your opinion.

I can have reasonable conversations with people who are decent enough human beings to acknowledge someone else may have a point other than their own. You sir can't do this, it's notable from a lot of your posts, so I have to resort to the only thing that you say annoys you, petty insults.

When you post half-arsed, misinformed comments on a thread you obviously havn't taken time to even read, then you leave yourself wide open to people deciding your opinions are worthless.

I only said your post was silly, not you. You need to relax a bit.

 

[Sarum TheBlack]

Originally posted by Aurelius LH

The only question I'd have though is what form of enjoyable pursuit (and for some people, things that are not even particularly enjoyable), is not in some way potentially addictive?

Probably none. That isn't the focus of this report, they are studying addiction in MMORPGs, not addiction in general.

I'd suggest that people who are drawn to computer games, and online MMORPGs in particular, can't really be a very valid control group for determining the 'addictiveness' of gaming in general

Again, that's not the focus of this report, they. If you want to study addiction in people who play MMORPGs, people who play them are the kind of people you need to talk to.

Surely many of us know people who 'must have' the latest new gadget, even to the point of buying things they can't really afford, which surely qualifies for the criteria of addiction.

I know several people like this (I'm one at heart, but am too attached to my wallet to actually put it into action.) And yes, under their definition this possibly does classify as an addition.

The remaining attraction factor, the interaction with friends offered by online gaming, is something that could use more examination, as in terms of MMORPGs this seems the really 'unique' factor that could explain what (if any?) extra 'addictiveness' they offer.

The report does reference an addition section on the relationships formed in MMORPGs: http://www.nickyee.com/hub/relationships/home.html

Are MMORPGs 'more' addictive than other games, interests, or whatever? Is the 'addictiveness' in part the ability to present an 'idealised' version of you to other real people? I've no idea, and would love some more information about that aspect of the hobby...

It probably depends on the player to an extent. I should think each persons addiction to MMORPGs is very slightly different to the next, depending on how they perceive their real life, and their game life. They suggest that in a lot of people feel "freer to be themselves" in games, when hiding behind their avatars they are protected from the usual restraints of class, appearance, "station" etc. Whether or not your in game personality is more you than your RL one is probably a point for debate. I should think you are just as influenced by peer pressure to conform to the artificial social norms in games are you are to social norms in RL.

 

[Uncle Sick(tm)]

We are all in denial!! Sad fuckers the bunch of us.

 

[ButaneBob]

Originally posted by Aurelius LH


Well the tone of your post was extremely aggressive, condescending and annoying

thanks for the complement

Thanks for the advice to read things properly, however I never said you HAD to have an addictive personality in order to become addicted, or that you can only become addicted if you have such a personality type - only that if you have such a personality, it is easier to become addicted to many things.

..hmmm, an addictive personality means you are more likely to become addicted...

cant you see this is just meaningless semantic nonsense - there is no addictive personality type - research evidence backs this up. This is a fact not an opinion hence my conclusion you dont know what you're talking about.

However I do know something about English, and the word you were looking for is naive, not the made-up nieve.

well thats one thing i spose

 

[Uncle Sick(tm)]

Butane aer teh doctar freud!!1

 

[ButaneBob]

Originally posted by Uncle Sick(tm)
Butane aer teh doctar freud!!1

naah he would have spelt naive correctly

(or is it spelled?)

Bob

 

[Aarnie]

Deeply deeply disturbed

Firstly, I thank you Saturnine for posting the link to that website. It is something anyone playing DAoC should read.

I am not entirely surprised that the thread has been hijacked by lowlifes, it merely confirms my suspicions of the escapism from admitting they have a problem.

I had a problem. I played this game too much, I was addicted. Having read that webpage very thoroughly, and taken much time to think about it, I felt I could no longer play DAoC. I have quit the game, you will no longer see Aarnie anymore. A significant reason is the fact i am being inundated with uni work atm, however...

I cannot emphasise enough just how much that webpage shook me. I thankfully took a neutral view whilst reading it, not the automatic dismissal with which I would have given it a month ago. I have thought about the way me playing has affected people around me in RL. It was not good for my health, it was not good for the people around me, see me get excited about typing a few sentences to people I have never even met.

I dont want this thread here to continue to get hijacked. Please listen to what Saturnine is trying to tell you, what that webpage is trying to tell you, what I, from years of mmorpg experience am trying to tell you.

THINK about what the game is doing to you. OK, fine, it may not be doing damage to some of you, fair enough. I very much doubt i am the only one who played the game too much. Im not asking you to quit, just to think, even if its just for a few minutes when waiting to port.


Moderation is the key here, as with so many things in life. I cant take the game in moderation, i had no option but to stop playing.

A quote from those wise HIBS adverts : "Think About It."

 

[old.chesnor]

Can a moderator move this thread to General Discussion please ?

 

[Jiggs]

gah i haven't got time to read this i've got to get back to emain!!

 

[Aurelius LH]

Originally posted by ButaneBob

..hmmm, an addictive personality means you are more likely to become addicted...

cant you see this is just meaningless semantic nonsense - there is no addictive personality type - research evidence backs this up. This is a fact not an opinion hence my conclusion you dont know what you're talking about.

Would you prefer 'if you have addictive traits in your personality' then, instead of defining a whole personality as addictive? Or could you tell me what YOU actually think, rather than just sniping? You seem, from what you say, to have some knowledge about the subject, so try sharing it rather than being proud of being irritating.

Incidentally, there is a large group of people who consider that, as you say, there is no 'addictive personality type', and it's fair to say their opinion has gained a lot of ground in recent years - but there are also some who do not agree, so you can call it a 'fact' if you want, it's certainly not universally accepted. There are very few 'facts' in psychology, and the history of the subject should warn that what is considered 'fact' now could well change before too long.


Sarum - the point I was trying to make - and clearly failing! - was that I'm not convinced there is any fundamental difference between 'addiction' to games than there is with addiction to anything else - so while the report is interesting, particularly because it's about one of our favourite hobbies, I'm not that sure it actually advances anything too much. The section about relationships is extremely interesting, but even the conclusions section does not actually 'conclude' much, rather it raises a lot of issues that need further consideration.


In practical terms, the most useful comment to date is by Aarnie - "THINK about what the game is doing to you". If the article makes folks do that, then excellent, it is well worth while for them. Personally, I do that anyway, so although I found it intriguing, to me it was not much more.

 

[old.chesnor]

Deleted in order not to fan the flames

 

[Sarum TheBlack]

Originally posted by Aurelius LH

Sarum - the point I was trying to make - and clearly failing! - was that I'm not convinced there is any fundamental difference between 'addiction' to games than there is with addiction to anything else - so while the report is interesting, particularly because it's about one of our favourite hobbies, I'm not that sure it actually advances anything too much. The section about relationships is extremely interesting, but even the conclusions section does not actually 'conclude' much, rather it raises a lot of issues that need further consideration.


In practical terms, the most useful comment to date is by Aarnie - "THINK about what the game is doing to you". If the article makes folks do that, then excellent, it is well worth while for them. Personally, I do that anyway, so although I found it intriguing, to me it was not much more.

I don't think the report was trying to say there was a difference (I agree that there is very little difference between various forms of addiction, at least in the psychology of it, and how serious addiction can affect your life in general terms) in fact, they cast the whole thing in terms of other addictions at the start, and make the point about various substance addictions being interchangeable without withdrawal even though the substances themselves are not substitutes chemically for each other. They weren't saying they had found a new form of addition.. they were attempting to prove that games are the same sort of addition, which previously some people had denied. At least that's how I read it.

It is important to be aware of what you are doing (as Aarnie said), and exactly how the game (and your other hobbies/pastimes) affect you and those around you. Acceptance is the first step towards a cure, as they say in all the addition things you see on the telly. (while I'd never admit this to my parents, who are very worried that I might be addicted to computer games) I would say, without any doubt, that I was seriously addicted to DAoC at one point. I'd say I'm less addicted now (party due to a forced leave of over a month, and the fact I have far too much work for uni atm for me to really get back into the game as much as I was). Ask yourself... Could I erase DAoC from my computer, and break the CD, and never look back? If the answer if definitely no... you are addicted.. if the answer is "yes.. but I don't want to even though I find the game boring".. are you any less addicted? And are you being truthful to yourself?

 

[Saturnine]

I think the point is that while alchohol/drugs/smoking all have physical elements: online games are intentionally designed to wriggle into your head and compell you to play.

(P.S - wise words "poster above this post")

 

[Sarum TheBlack]

A common ground between most addictions is escapism.. for a little while, the addict can escape from their own sad little life, with it's pressures, stresses and failure to live up to expectations.. be it with the aid of chemicals, immersive environments such as games, or a hobby/pastime where they forget all about the world while they're doing it. The danger is when they'd rather be in the perceived freedom of their addiction than the real world, even when it is personally harmful to do so.. If you are bound by your addiction to your escapist world.. you're no freer there than in RL, but perception is the key, and you feel freer there. A little escapism isn’t a bad thing.. when you start considering it more real, or more essential, to you than RL, it's bad.

 

[ButaneBob]

K Aurleius sorry if I gave you grief - Ive had a chill pill (well a couple of glasses of wine hehe) and realised this is far too serious a subject for point scoring

The thread has been moved to the general forum, cya there

Bob

PS Sorry to hear of your trouble Aarnie, I think it was brave of you to be so frank here - hopefully such admissions will help other people with similar problems to be similarly honest about theirs

 

[Euthanasia.]

(disclaimer: this post is my oppinion and it is not intended to offend anyone) (clause: if you flame me you get beaten within an inch of your life with a twig )
i think that there's generally two types of people that play this game: 1) those that only play a few hours a week, like to have a bit fun etc
2) those that play this game every single day of the year(excluding days of pc failure/net problems etc) and play it for at least a few hours everyday and pretty much incorporate the game as a part of their life
every single person will have different reasons for playing this,
some people are just lonely etc and play for company
but in my oppinion if everyone gave the honest truth as to why they played this game (if they come under the 2nd type of player)
the biggest reason would be because this game helps them escape the problems of real life.
i myself am fully aware that im addicted to this game and i dont particularly want to quit and as alot of people in pryd/alb will know (pc/bt permitting) i play this game every damn day of the week.
and yes i realise this thread is completely open to flames ..so go ahead ...but read disclaimer first

 

[Saturnine]

as bob said the thread is now in General Discussion: please continue the sociological debate here -

http://forums.barrysworld.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=39828

 

[SFXman]

Yes MMORPG's are extremely addictive and have already caused me trouble education-wise.

 

[old.Normengast]

I stopped smoking but now I am hooked up to DAOC

Well, my house smells nicer now...

 

[Milkshake]

I eat well, sleep at the right times and do my studies.

I go out when people ask me, or I wanna see my friends.

I play DAoC at nights when I have nothing better to do, The TV is crap (BBC), and my dad won't pay for Sky. I do however play DAoC alot, and get all my work done in time for me to get, say, 2-3 hours a night of DAoCing in if I'm not doing anything else. Weekends, I play more.

So, I'm play just about 20 hours of DAoC a week. When i total that up, I think fuck...that's alot of time I could be spending doing other things...

But when I think about it, really think about it, I have a nice life, alot of friends and a family who loves me. I have a job as a barman in a local hotel, I have a car, I play Basketball for a local team.

My question is...am I still addicted? By the definition given, it's an unhealthy or self destructive thing that I can't let go. I don't think I wanna give DAoC up just yet, but it's doing me no harm. Is it?

*confused*