The annual 9/11 discussion topic.

[Sigurd]

Because its not everyday that 10000+ dies in one strike stupid... Its a reminder on how bad it can go, and a reminder why there have to be done _something_ against the powerful terror'ist in the world..

Antiamaricans = dead farts...

Hmm, looks to me like the other way round...

And yes I know more about this subject than most of you nazi sheep, worship capitalism if you so wish but it'll come crashing down in the end, and the result will be one hell of a bloody mess.

 

[Sissyfoo]

Secondly, could you even imagine the dilema of having several hundred of your own citizens in the air and having to make a decision on whether to blow them out of the sky or not.

Tbh, I don't think the US government would see that as being a 'dilema'. 150 innocent lives vs. national security/1000+ lives/el prez's weekend getaway doesn't leave much room for debate.

Sure, they may beat themselves up about it later on but when it is crunch time you had better believe they are gonna sacrifice the few for rest and it wouldn't take much soul searching for them to come to a decision like that. I'm not saying I believe in conspiracy theories...I just believe in the harsh reality of patriotism.

So, Comrade Sigurd, I presume you think that your bolshie ways are better? Look at N. Korea, the ex-Soviet Union or China and see how well the population is living under the rule of communism. Capitalism may not be perfect but it is better than the alternative.

...but as you know so much, perhaps you would be willing to educate us? I'd be interested in hearing about your vision of utopia.

 

[Ctuchik]

i'm not saying terrorism is a good thing, BUT if America would kindly fuck off from things that really dont concern them then maybe, just MAYBE ppl wouldent be so pissed at them?

the general american attitude is, they are biggest they CAN do something, thus they WILL do it. and it doesent really matter if the country asked for help or not. USA just barge in and starts to make ultimatums... (and even more if said country have oil or any other natural resourse they have use for)

and when they FINALLY realize they fucked up (selling missiles to iraq?) they try to cover it up by declaring war on that country and hope they look like angles....


yes, i'm anti american. I'll gladly admit that 9/11 was a fking sad thing. but in my book, they had it comming.

 

[Wij]

Hmm, looks to me like the other way round...

And yes I know more about this subject than most of you nazi sheep, worship capitalism if you so wish but it'll come crashing down in the end, and the result will be one hell of a bloody mess.

Not believing your brain-jizz is Nazism now is it ? Why do you feel the need to tell everyone who doesn't subscribe to your idiotic views that you have a mega-intellect ?

Chill out, get some friends, lose your cherry and put things into perspective.

 

[Sissyfoo]

Brain-jizz! ~adds that to teh Sissy vocabulary~

 

[Wij]

Brain-jizz! ~adds that to teh Sissy vocabulary~

np. The Wij Quote-Machine rolls on

 

[Cyfr]

Hmm, looks to me like the other way round...

And yes I know more about this subject than most of you nazi sheep, worship capitalism if you so wish but it'll come crashing down in the end, and the result will be one hell of a bloody mess.

You knew more about new frontiers than us too

*bow*

 

[old.Tohtori]

*would like to point out that calling people nazi might be a bannable offence*

Anyway, let's try and bring this puppy back on track.

My main point in my original question wasn't about if america bad, japan bad or whatnotwishnot. I was curious in peoples opinions about the "fact"(using it loosely here) that american lives seem, not only in american news coverage, to hold more value then, let's say sauri-arabic. Talking purely about civilian lives, not going into militarism here.

 

[fionnel]

They are because everything is subjective.

As there are good dictators like Pinochet and bad ones like Saddam.

If it suits the american interests, we exaggerate, we twist the truth, we lie, we bomb, we find excuses. So the dead Americans are tragic figures, it was a massacre without excuse or logic, but the Iraqi dead or the Japanese or or or- the list can go on for hours- are just accidents on our divine quest for justice and freedom. If it doesn't help american interests, we do our best to cover it up, we lie, we twist the truth and hope noone finds out about it pr just blame the evil terrorists who exist everywhere and can hit anytime.

Simple as that tbh.

 

[Driwen]

My main point in my original question wasn't about if america bad, japan bad or whatnotwishnot. I was curious in peoples opinions about the "fact"(using it loosely here) that american lives seem, not only in american news coverage, to hold more value than, let's say sauri-arabic. Talking purely about civilian lives, not going into militarism here.

but isnt for you the live of someone you know more important than someone you dont know?
I mean you have to make a choice, 1) your friend dies, 2) unknown person on other side of world dies and if you dont make a choice both die. Or replace die with winning 1 million dollars/euros/whatever. Than most people will choose to let the friend live/let the friend win the money. The same will go for foreigner/countrymen, allthough abit less (certainly for less nationalistic countries).
Basically people will have a higher personal value to their countrymen than to foreigners, as you share something already (well besides the world also the same culture). Unless you meant that they actually believe that being a US citizen means you are actually better than anyone else, which is something that I guess is around in the USA. And yes I do find such a level of nationalistic behaviour irritating, allthough with the arabs it is in some cases mutual (islamic arabs thinking they are better than others or I guess the zionistic jews in isreal).

edit: I assume fionnel you mean with pinochet/saddam that their truths has been manipulated to hide/highlight some parts of the dictators into making them look good/bad respectively?

 

[Sigurd]

You knew more about new frontiers than us too

*bow*

I see you've become a big fan of NF since disregarding my advice... oh wait...

 

[TeaSpoon]

Hopping on at the end of a thread.....

......its a great shame, as is every other thing that happens along these lines.

However, I do enjoy the Islamic quotes I've been reading saying "its the Islamic belivers against the non-belivers, or the 'infidels'.".

Kind of brave tagging everyong infidels

 

[Sissyfoo]

Waging massive underground wars are a lot easier when you see things in black and white!

 

[old.Tohtori]

but isnt for you the live of someone you know more important than someone you dont know?
I mean you have to make a choice, 1) your friend dies, 2) unknown person on other side of world dies and if you dont make a choice both die. Or replace die with winning 1 million dollars/euros/whatever. Than most people will choose to let the friend live/let the friend win the money. The same will go for foreigner/countrymen, allthough abit less (certainly for less nationalistic countries).

On a personal note, i wouldn't choose between an (to me)unknown US person or an unknown finnish person. Same amount of respect/care from me. My family and friends is a bit different thing, not going there now. What i meant is, why is it the same thing all around the world? I bet the 9/11 gets more news coverage in the UK, Germany and so on, then some bombing that happened in buenos aires.

Do ask if you're unclear and i'll try to explain more.

 

[Bunnytwo]

i'm not saying terrorism is a good thing, BUT if America would kindly fuck off from things that really dont concern them then maybe, just MAYBE ppl wouldent be so pissed at them?

the general american attitude is, they are biggest they CAN do something, thus they WILL do it. and it doesent really matter if the country asked for help or not. USA just barge in and starts to make ultimatums... (and even more if said country have oil or any other natural resourse they have use for)

and when they FINALLY realize they fucked up (selling missiles to iraq?) they try to cover it up by declaring war on that country and hope they look like angles....


yes, i'm anti american. I'll gladly admit that 9/11 was a fking sad thing. but in my book, they had it comming.

Interesting idea, but does that do for somewhere like Sudan, for example where the government have been quit happy butchering a section of the population and definately haven't asked for the US/UN or any other country to get involved?

Fact is that countries interfere in the business of other countries, always have always will. Can't think of one country that has a bit of power that hasn't, past or present.

As for the US selling Iraq missiles, erm though Iraqi primary missile was the Scud, which is Russian built, as were Iraq's SAMs. Iraqi main battle tank, also Russian, main small arm, good old AK47, main aircraft MIGs, all Russian. Not saying US didn't support Saddam's regime, but then so did most major countries, the British, the French and Germans, the Russians, and most of the countries in the region supported Iraq, so placing the blame on the US doesn't really work for me I'm afraid, as a hell of a lot of countries were willing to support him or at least turn a blind eye while he was giving the Iranians a kicking.

 

[Driwen]

On a personal note, i wouldn't choose between an (to me)unknown US person or an unknown finnish person. Same amount of respect/care from me. My family and friends is a bit different thing, not going there now. What i meant is, why is it the same thing all around the world? I bet the 9/11 gets more news coverage in the UK, Germany and so on, then some bombing that happened in buenos aires.

Do ask if you're unclear and i'll try to explain more.

9/11 mostly got news coverage as it was a terrorist attack on a western country, it probably got around the same amount of time as the recent bombing in madrid (possibly less as there is less explaining to do who Al Qaeda is and why would they do it). However Brasil is farther away from the netherlands and also not as important to us as the US or Spain is, both of those have more influence into the dutch lives.
Besides I dont think there was any real news coverage about 9/11 this year on the dutch news, excluding the possible short news item showing the memorial service as its news for us to know that the americans still have a memorial service for it.
Basically it isnt so much about the fact that americans died than the fact that it is influencing the direction where the USA is heading and that will influence what my country will have to do and that is less the case with Brasil.