Football The 2011/2012 Season Thread

[Scouse]

I don't think chanting "you're not incredible" at him is very offensive. Christ, if you start banning chants for being "unsporting" where will it end. It's no worse than Stevenage fans chanting about Gareth Bale looking like a chimp.

Gareth Bale does look like a chimp. Don't hear much about that chant tho 'cause he's white. If he was black and people chanted it then there'd be uproar - despite the fact that he does look like a chimp.

I personally wouldn't chant it if he was black. But that's only because of the potential for someone to take offence - not because I would want to give it.

I couldn't give a fuck if he was black or white - I'd just want to call a chimp a chimp

Banning what people say is retarded. Any law that determines what words are "offensive" is retarded because offence, by it's nature, is taken, not given.

 

[Wazzerphuk]

It is possible to stop racist abuse without impinging on a society where free speech is allowed you know.

Free speech is acceptable, regardless of the abhorrent views being aired. Going to a location where families, children gather on private property is not an acceptable place to be airing racist, homophobic abuse, coupled with threats of violence. Eradicate it from the stands because it's inappropriate, vile and stupid. That doesn't mean we end up with a culture of "censorship." It means people can go to football grounds without fear of abuse.

 

[Calaen]

More lolwhat - Frazier Campbell is in the England squad.

In 18 months he's scored ONE league goal and not played 90 minutes since August 2010. Stuart Pearce is fucking mental.

He has looked very good since his return from two very bad injuries. I dislike Pearce, but im happy to see he is going to be giving an opportunity for some new blood to get on the pitch, because lets be honest, apart from Rooney who is suspended, Bent, Crouch, Defoe, Heskey Zamora are all out of form when it comes to scoring goals.

So it makes sense to look at others, sturridge, welbeck, campbell, cleverley. I thuoght the Ox deserves a spot as well tbh, we know what we are going to get from Barry, Milner, and co

 

[DaGaffer]

http://www1.skysports.com/football/news/11679/7539763/Porto-prepare-Hulk-complaint

Lolwat?

Its only Porto doing stupid tit-for-tat stuff after last week's (legitimate) complaints from City players. Unfortunately there is a UEFA regulation that allows the complaint: 11.2, “the use of gestures, words, objects or any other means to transmit any message that is not fit for a sports event”. Hopefully UEFA will treat this with the disdain it deserves though.

 

[Calaen]

The wolves situation is a PR disaster, whoever they get in knows they were 5-6th choice. It's not looking good for them at all!

 

[Wazzerphuk]

So it makes sense to look at others, sturridge, welbeck, campbell, cleverley. I thuoght the Ox deserves a spot as well tbh, we know what we are going to get from Barry, Milner, and co

It makes sense for all those people bar FC. He's not even properly fit. So many more, like Ox, have done so much more than him this season and look likely to actually be of international quality in the future. FC is never going to cut it.

 

[Scouse]

It is possible to stop racist abuse without impinging on a society where free speech is allowed you know.

This I agree with 100%.

However, the next bit, whilst on the face of it is seemingly perfectly sensible, has problems:

a location ..... is not an acceptable place to be airing racist, homophobic abuse

Are there acceptable places to air racist or homophobic abuse?

Of course not. And just as banning saying words leads to a slippery slope, banning words in certain places leads to a slippery slope too.

Racist or homophobic words are a fact of life. Better to educate children how to deal with these people non-violently and tell them why they're wrong, than attempt farcical bans.

People don't like things that they take offence at. Period. So they want other people to stop and back bans on all sorts of things for, deep down, no other reason than they don't like it.


For example: I sometimes get shouted at by people in pubs because I often use coarse language whilst out with my mates. Few beers, game of pool, harming no-one:

Bloke: "Oi - my kids can hear you".
Me: "So what? I'm in a pub - an adult drinking hole. And your kids hear worse at school"
Bloke: "I don't want them round that sort of language"
Me: "Leave then. It's a free world...."
Bloke: "You carry on like that and I'll hit you"
Me: "So you don't want them to hear bad language but you'd use actual violence in front of them?"

...

It means people can go to football grounds without fear of abuse.

If people are afraid of bad language then they need to man up tbfh. Sticks and stones.

However, if people are threatening violence it's a different matter altogether...

 

[Calaen]

It makes sense for all those people bar FC. He's not even properly fit. So many more, like Ox, have done so much more than him this season and look likely to actually be of international quality in the future. FC is never going to cut it.

Sorry I disagree, he had a brilliant goal scoring record at Antwerp, and carried that on when he was loaned to Hull, scoring the goals that got them promoted into the premier league. When he first moved to Sunderland he was played largely out of position on the wing as part of a 4 man midfield Because Bent was up top on his own. At the end of the season when they switched to a 4-3-3 formation Campbell started to show what he was capable of infront of goal. The lad knows where it is!!!

He then suffered his injuries, but is looking like he has come back as strong as ever. So while yuo might have a case based on the number of minutes he's played this season. I will have to disagree when yuo say he will never be an international player, because I think he has the attributes to succeed.He's fast, his work ethic is brilliant and he knows where the goal is, what he needs now is an extended run in the sunderland team, and I think he's playing for the best manager possible at the moment in order to take his game to the next level.

 

[Wazzerphuk]

A whole ream of nonsense.

It's private property. Free speech is a public thing. The people who run the property have the final say on what they want - and they want racism and abuse OUT of THEIR grounds. It's not up to you to decide or claim that people should "man up." So while IMO nowhere is acceptable to spout racist abuse, if there is a place it's in the public field - NOT a private place of business.

Also, you really think it's ok to spout such vile abuse in front of kids? What would you really think/do if you were a black man, with your son, and some cunt was shouting "fucking useless nigger" at a black player on the pitch. Would you simply "man up?" Such a retarded viewpoint, it really is.

Sorry I disagree.

You're more than entitled to disagree, however, you're wrong and he will never be a quality international footballer. He'll be average premier league at best, most likely Championship level.

 

[Calaen]

You're more than entitled to disagree, however, you're wrong and he will never be a quality international footballer. He'll be average premier league at best, most likely Championship level.

I'll come back to this when he's retired and we can evaluate his career I'd have him in my team over Walcott every day of the week. And he's a regular international.

 

[Aoami]

Campbell may be a surprise but at least he picked Richards. No idea what Capello had against him.

 

[soze]

I would of taken the OX over Theo.

And FC is not that shocking rather than bringing another players who has failed to impress he gets to give him a go and see if he is up for it, makes sense really.

 

[Wazzerphuk]

I'll come back to this when he's retired and we can evaluate his career I'd have him in my team over Walcott every day of the week. And he's a regular international.

You'd have 1 goal in 18 months Frazier Campbell over 5 goals 10 assists Theo Walcott (just this season)? Really? Are you that mental? FC not exactly going to do well at right wing is he? If he plays there he's certainly not going to come close to Walcott's contribution.

 

[Calaen]

Adam johnson should be playing ahead of lolcott, yes he hasa decent assists record, but he only ever sets up van persie He goes missing in big games, the amount of times he gets caught offside for someone with his pace is shocking.

Yes I would have FC over theo, because he deserves a chance, because the old school players are not doing it, so he's worthy of a shout for an experiment. I'm going to disregard your stats sheet, because FC has been fucked for 2 years with injuries. I mean if you want we can see what they have done in the last 3 games? he's started 3 games snice coming back from injury and he has 2 goals and 2 assists IN JUST 4 GAMES OMFGGGG best player ever clearly!

We've been crying at England managers to give others a chance and Pearce is doing that. Campbell can be judged after his performance, but I'd rather he be on the bench over heskey, agbonlgahor, Owen, Zamora, crouch, defoe. Because we need to give them a go!

 

[Scouse]

It's private property.

Again, I don't disagree with you there. See that I can agree and disagree with different parts of your post?

I'm fucked off that you can't be arsed to pay me the same courtesy tbfh:

Also, you really think it's ok to spout such vile abuse in front of kids?

Only a massive blinkered twat would read what I wrote and think I said that - especially since I explicitly say otherwise.

If I held that retarded viewpoint I'd have said something else.

 

[Wazzerphuk]

Only a massive blinkered twat would read what I wrote and think I said that - especially since I explicitly say otherwise.

Racist or homophobic words are a fact of life. Better to educate children how to deal with these people non-violently and tell them why they're wrong, than attempt farcical bans.

Sorry but how did you say that? You basically say here that's it's acceptable to be near as you can use it as an educational tool instead of banning the racist abuse from grounds.

Here's an idea - ban it from grounds and educate kids. You don't need to educate kids by throwing them into a frying pan full of racists. But please, keep trying to rescue your horrible statements with more reversals than Toht on a driving lesson.

 

[Scouse]

No reversal. I explicitly said that there are no "acceptable places" to air racist or homophobic abuse.

Is the issue or standpoint too complex for you to grasp?

Edit: Here's the quote, because you obviously can't be arsed to go check:

Are there acceptable places to air racist or homophobic abuse?

Of course not...

 

[Wazzerphuk]

So why do you keep saying banning the racist abuse would be farcical? You make no sense.

 

[eksdee]

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2012/feb/23/stuart-pearce-england-euro-2012

Quite simply, fuck off.

 

[Scouse]

So why do you keep saying banning the racist abuse would be farcical? You make no sense.

Makes perfect sense. It's a complex situation with a number of things to balance - something that "society" has been struggling with for a long time (making great strides) and unfortunately come down on the wrong side of only recently (say, last ten years with stuff like "incitement to racial hatred" laws).

I spoke of a "slippery slope" when it comes to drafting laws which ban what people can and cannot say. Just words. Not actions (i.e. I support the law that bans assault).

Yes, ideally people wouldn't use racist or homophobic language, in the context of racist or homophobic abuse, but they do. My opinion is that laws that ban the use of these words lead inevitably to injustices that are worse than the original problem and we should fight that problem using other means...

Sorry if that's "retarded".

 

[Lethul]

 

[Wazzerphuk]

Makes perfect sense. It's a complex situation with a number of things to balance - something that "society" has been struggling with for a long time (making great strides) and unfortunately come down on the wrong side of only recently (say, last ten years with stuff like "incitement to racial hatred" laws).

I spoke of a "slippery slope" when it comes to drafting laws which ban what people can and cannot say. Just words. Not actions (i.e. I support the law that bans assault).

Yes, ideally people wouldn't use racist or homophobic language, in the context of racist or homophobic abuse, but they do. My opinion is that laws that ban the use of these words lead inevitably to injustices that are worse than the original problem and we should fight that problem using other means...

Sorry if that's "retarded".

But this has nothing to do with public law, and everything to do with what people are allowed to do on PRIVATE grounds. It's not a law. It's not to stop people from banning words altogether, it's to stop abuse from crowds in sporting events. What you're saying there isn't "retarded" but your understanding of what is being discussed probably is

 

[Scouse]

Well, I was discussing the wider points of law, censorship and freedom. As soon as you said private grounds I conceded that point.

Gareth Bale still looks like a chimp tho. Black or white

 

[Wazzerphuk]

He's even more chimpish than Keown ffs

 

[Cerb]

Really happy to see Cleverly back in the lineup and a good game to get the likes of him/Jones some European experience even if it is in the TN cup.

Jones made captain aswell!

 

[Wazzerphuk]

Cally can't handle truthisms

 

[caLLous]

I didn't disagree I just disliked.

 

[Wazzerphuk]

Exactly - the truth HURTS you

If you'd disagreed you'd just been wrong

 

[caLLous]

We'll see who's smiling on Sunday.

 

[Ch3tan]

It won't be wazz that's for sure