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Damon_D
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- #31
Yeah so basicly mid's hit like an unspec'd 2Hander..because we cant spec in 2H weapons....thats even worse if you ask me...
Yeah so basicly mid's hit like an unspec'd 2Hander..because we cant spec in 2H weapons....thats even worse if you ask me...
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Solid
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- #32
well its pretty much a basic flaw.
Base damage IS 140% on 2H but styled damage has NOTHING to do with base damage at all, and so is a constant, only effected by Weapon Delay (2H being obviously slower therefore Style damage seeming to be bigger).
Base damage IS 140% on 2H but styled damage has NOTHING to do with base damage at all, and so is a constant, only effected by Weapon Delay (2H being obviously slower therefore Style damage seeming to be bigger).
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old.Dorac
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- #33
I doubt that's the case, since she says: "All two handed weapons" and "plus an extra amount based on their specialization level".
Isn't Swords/Axes/Hammers for both one and two handed weapons? I think so.
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scarffs
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- #34
The thing is, we dont get the styles for 2handers, and thus many chain off block for instance, which is rather hard when you wield a two-hander.
But if Mythic would just add a 2hander spec list, one would have to choose, just like in the two other realms. Only fair.
But if Mythic would just add a 2hander spec list, one would have to choose, just like in the two other realms. Only fair.
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aveh
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- #35
Do you notice i said '... generally mids ...'
While you said '... clever warrior ...'
See, in my book, any clever warrior stands near the healer/nuker spamming slam, buts thats just a difference of opinion isnt it?
B
Blood
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- #36
that was in beta, hunters havent been able to equip a shield since the game went live
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ilienwyn
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- #37
Well, in my arms i would trade the fooking double specc thing anytime for either the mid way or the hib way. As for your "bad" 2h, wanna imagine a minstrel or a bard with a 2h weapon like skalds? Tbh, skalds hurt with the 2h. Or, how ofte do you see mercs or bm with 2h? Never cause they can't use it like zerkers/savages. Would you like infils have 2h and hit you with one after dragonfang? Don't think so
As for skalds not using 1h and shield cause they don't specc shield, lots of classes use shield even when they don't specc it cause they don't have the advantage of choice. And don't tell me hunters are bad cause atm they are the best archers around with increased weaponskill and a fooking instant pet which is silly. Maybe remove the instant pet and give good pets near mtk in borders for them to get.
p.s.: Might sound a little frustrated but i am a little pissed from the regular zerging of the zergserver. I try to keep in mind how the situation is but i keep getting pissed of
As for skalds not using 1h and shield cause they don't specc shield, lots of classes use shield even when they don't specc it cause they don't have the advantage of choice. And don't tell me hunters are bad cause atm they are the best archers around with increased weaponskill and a fooking instant pet which is silly. Maybe remove the instant pet and give good pets near mtk in borders for them to get.
p.s.: Might sound a little frustrated but i am a little pissed from the regular zerging of the zergserver. I try to keep in mind how the situation is but i keep getting pissed of
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Wij
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- #38
Sure give minstrels and bards 2H. Just so long as Skalds get a decent support skill in return.
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ilienwyn
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- #39
well, maybe skalds should get some instruments to use too
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Wij
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- #40
Yeh - I can really see a Troll delicately plucking a lute :/
A drumkit maybe ?
A drumkit maybe ?
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ilienwyn
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- #41
Well a firbie can (if i remember correct) why not a troll too
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Harm
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- #42
Could you please tell me from where you got that statement? To me it looks more like combat rules of 3rd ed. Dungeons & Dragons.
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Solid
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- #43
aye Harm, think that statement is incorrect.
I believe its 15% + 0.5% per spec point extra aka for a midgardian its 140% if you spec to 50 weapon, for a Hib its 140% of you go 50 CS/LW and for an alb its 140% if you go 50 Poles/2H.
NOTE it DOES depend on spec btw, so a 50 +XX LW Champion will obviously hit harder that a 39 +XX Thane using his 2H because the Hero has a higher 2H Spec bonus.
And it HAS been tested in US extensively and the 140% Bonus DOES hold true for Midgard 2H Weapons.
I believe its 15% + 0.5% per spec point extra aka for a midgardian its 140% if you spec to 50 weapon, for a Hib its 140% of you go 50 CS/LW and for an alb its 140% if you go 50 Poles/2H.
NOTE it DOES depend on spec btw, so a 50 +XX LW Champion will obviously hit harder that a 39 +XX Thane using his 2H because the Hero has a higher 2H Spec bonus.
And it HAS been tested in US extensively and the 140% Bonus DOES hold true for Midgard 2H Weapons.
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old.willowywicca
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- #44
rofl, well first up, spear gets thrust and slash damage, so it's got 2 like LW, and like LW you can't use a 1h with it, so so far spear is jsut as good as LW (OMFG huh?).
Large Weapons:
http://www.camelotherald.com/styles/line.php?line=104
Hunter Spears:
http://www.camelotherald.com/styles/line.php?line=26
now if you look at the two of them, LW has just as many penalties to defence, has slightly more bonus to defense styles but some are neer gonna be used (2nd in after your target parries you chain.. sure
)Funny how when the spear spec is nearly as good as LW spec (the only bonus being 9 sec back stun instead of 6) that you're still whining. You people want a 2h spec like LW? seems to me spear is it, and yet apparently there's still lots wrong with it too, which means LW is wrong too, so stop whining for it gimps!
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Solid
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- #45
I think my new found attitude is Contageous eh Malev hehe
eh Malev hehe
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Svartur
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- #46
Originally posted by old.willowywicca
rofl, well first up, spear gets thrust and slash damage, so it's got 2 like LW, and like LW you can't use a 1h with it, so so far spear is jsut as good as LW (OMFG huh?).
Large Weapons:
http://www.camelotherald.com/styles/line.php?line=104
Hunter Spears:
http://www.camelotherald.com/styles/line.php?line=26
now if you look at the two of them, LW has just as many penalties to defence, has slightly more bonus to defense styles but some are neer gonna be used (2nd in after your target parries you chain.. sure
Funny how when the spear spec is nearly as good as LW spec (the only bonus being 9 sec back stun instead of 6) that you're still whining. You people want a 2h spec like LW? seems to me spear is it, and yet apparently there's still lots wrong with it too, which means LW is wrong too, so stop whining for it gimps!
Maybe you are missing the point luri hunnybunny.
All other midclasses able to use 2h weapons have the option to switch to 1h weapon and shield (speccable or unspeccable). Hunters cannot. Didnt know how LW works and dont really care, wasnt comparing to LW.
Guess its the same thing in hib then with CS to?
Personally it dont matter for me, I would still go with 2h but many hunters would like this option and I understand them.
And when it comes to LW styles vs Spearstyles... well at least you have a usefull lvl 50 style and 9 sec stun > 5 sec stun(not 6)
But I am happy, but Hunters in general are not.
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old.willowywicca
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- #47
Originally posted by Svartur
Maybe you are missing the point luri hunnybunny.
All other midclasses able to use 2h weapons have the option to switch to 1h weapon and shield (speccable or unspeccable). Hunters cannot. Didnt know how LW works and dont really care, wasnt comparing to LW.
Guess its the same thing in hib then with CS to?
Personally it dont matter for me, I would still go with 2h but many hunters would like this option and I understand them.
And when it comes to LW styles vs Spearstyles... well at least you have a usefull lvl 50 style and 9 sec stun > 5 sec stun(not 6)
But I am happy, but Hunters in general are not.
well my comments weren't so much directed at you personally, but just at people who prior to this in the thread are saying they want a 2H specline in mid like hib's LW.. and I was just pointing to the irony that you already have one (the comparison to LW part just being to prevent people giving any "but all of spear styles suck blah blah blah if it was more like LW in hib it'd be great!! etc..") and because of the very fact it couldn't also be used as 1h like current mid 1/2h spec works, you were unhappy (if not for yourself for other hunters)
Oh and I've been hit harder by mid spear than I've ever hit a lvl50 hunter with my slash LWs..
(645dmg by arakasi, prob a near 50% crit, but still better than any I've done) <-- no idea what relevance this bit has to anything, but it's here anyway
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aveh
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- #48
Originally posted by ilienwyn
Well, in my arms i would trade the fooking double specc thing anytime for either the mid way or the hib way. As for your "bad" 2h, wanna imagine a minstrel or a bard with a 2h weapon like skalds? Tbh, skalds hurt with the 2h. Or, how ofte do you see mercs or bm with 2h? Never cause they can't use it like zerkers/savages.
Skalds don't hurt with a 2H tho. My 2H is regularly outdamaged by an Infs main hand which swings twice as fast as my 2H. As for minstrels & bards - they are hardly meant to be the melee class that skalds are, so why make this comparison? How would you like it if skalds had stealth, stun & ae mezz? How would you like it if they could heal & rezz? Don't be so utterly naive...
Are you kidding? A skald who doesn't purge dragonfang is dead regardless. Anyway, do you think Mythic would allow a class that has df uberstun to wield 2H'ers anyway? Maybe we should give skalds a style for long-duration stun that chains off a sub 200dmg, 2H hit?
Your reasoning is descending into utter stupidity here. Which classes are you talking about here? Healers? Bards? Clerics? Please explain more pls. And don't even bother to go into Minstrels with their secondary dex stat kthx..
Well, actually, it is well-known that hunters have the least-effective bow skill in the realm. And when it comes to melee, it gets worse.
Rangers have a choice of blades, pierce, celtic dual & unspecced shield for their melee weapons. Scouts have a choice of slash, thrust and specced shield on their chars. Hunters can go with 2Hspearfor1Hdmg, or 2Hswordfor1Hdmg (which is a useless choice anyway given that sword is 100% str based and only has a choice of slash damage).
So you are saying that hunters running around with lvl 45 pets is that uber when you've got Alb & Hib classes charming lvl 50+ pets?
Originally posted by ilienwyn
p.s.: Might sound a little frustrated but i am a little pissed from the regular zerging of the zergserver. I try to keep in mind how the situation is but i keep getting pissed of
Well then, you should come back to Prydwen
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Svartur
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- #49
Actually they are lvl 41
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aveh
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- #50
Originally posted by Svartur
Actually they are lvl 41
Ah - I assumed that they'd be the upper end of blue con rather than the lower end D:
H
Harm
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- #51
I'm not asking for a mid 2h spec. I enjoy the current one very much as it is. Mythic claims it is 10% extra damage + an unknown ammount of extra damage per spec - for all realms.
I don't think polearms/twohanded/lw/cs hurt more than mid 2h. The variance(whine?) is probably based on hybrid classes not dealing nuff damage, and speccing lower weapon.
However I'm not sure if that formula of mythic is correct.
The truth is probably that mythic doesen't know it either (like practical tests about other calculations tend to be more correct than mythics stated ones).
I don't think polearms/twohanded/lw/cs hurt more than mid 2h. The variance(whine?) is probably based on hybrid classes not dealing nuff damage, and speccing lower weapon.
However I'm not sure if that formula of mythic is correct.
The truth is probably that mythic doesen't know it either (like practical tests about other calculations tend to be more correct than mythics stated ones).
S
Solid
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- #52
Harm I stated how I think it works based on a lot of reading on IGN and Mythics own responses.
1H = 100% Damage
2H = 15% bonus damage
Spec bonus = 0.5% per spec point in the 2H line.
for a Warrior you would get 140% 2H damage: 15% base bonus + (50 x 0.5) 25% Spec bonus (Spec in Midgard case is taken from the 1H spec).
for eg a 39 Weapon specced Thane you would get 134.5% 2H damage: 15% base bonus + (39 x 0.5) 19.5% Spec bonus
I can only assume +Weapon will increase this bonus by increasing the SPEC bonus (ofc Diminishing returns will kick in past 50)
This seems to make sense because 50 Weaponspec tanks in midgard DO hit hard and are generally happy with their damage potential considering the speed of weapons they have available.
Remember Alb has access to 6.0 speed Polearms and Hib to 5.9 speed Spears which will account for the greater per hit damage potential they get, Mids slowest weapon being a 5.7 spd TG sword and soon a 5.8 speed Dragon Hammer.
Now I have ZERO proof to all this conjecture but tbh it seems to make a lot of sense to me.
Kinda adds to why most Skalds and Thanes generally never hit as hard as LW Champions with their 2H weapons (most skalds and thanes being 44 weapon and most champs being 50 LW and ofc champs having access to slower weaps more often than not)
1H = 100% Damage
2H = 15% bonus damage
Spec bonus = 0.5% per spec point in the 2H line.
for a Warrior you would get 140% 2H damage: 15% base bonus + (50 x 0.5) 25% Spec bonus (Spec in Midgard case is taken from the 1H spec).
for eg a 39 Weapon specced Thane you would get 134.5% 2H damage: 15% base bonus + (39 x 0.5) 19.5% Spec bonus
I can only assume +Weapon will increase this bonus by increasing the SPEC bonus (ofc Diminishing returns will kick in past 50)
This seems to make sense because 50 Weaponspec tanks in midgard DO hit hard and are generally happy with their damage potential considering the speed of weapons they have available.
Remember Alb has access to 6.0 speed Polearms and Hib to 5.9 speed Spears which will account for the greater per hit damage potential they get, Mids slowest weapon being a 5.7 spd TG sword and soon a 5.8 speed Dragon Hammer.
Now I have ZERO proof to all this conjecture but tbh it seems to make a lot of sense to me.
Kinda adds to why most Skalds and Thanes generally never hit as hard as LW Champions with their 2H weapons (most skalds and thanes being 44 weapon and most champs being 50 LW and ofc champs having access to slower weaps more often than not)