Speak Friend And Enter

[Roo Stercogburn]

Anyone ever felt that the parts of the stories and adventures they really like the best are the bits that they felt were really clever?
I've always liked when the uber bad guy is taken down by some act of inspired cleverness or a seemingly impossible obstacle is taken away by a clever protagonist.

I haven't seen this in DAoC at all. This post isn't a bash, but a suggestion where things might be improved. So far quests and tasks consist merely of finding the right monster and killing it, or delivering an item, perhaps harvesting certain monsters for a few items. All variations on a theme, which can be quite good fun, but... there's more to RPG's than hacking up beasties.

Anyone who's ever ran a paper 'n' dice rpg (or perhaps started setting up their own dungeons and quests in Neverwinter Nights) will know these are waaaaay the hardest things to do but when I used to run sessions for players in the past they find these things immensely satisfying.

Couple of points to this rambling:

1) In future DAoC add-ons or patches, it would be nice to see the NPCs in game hand out quests which are puzzle, rather than errand or kill based. (Finding monster doesn't count at puzzle, that's a hunt).

2) For kill based quests, the odd quest where you have to have a combination of certain profession types present wouldn't go amiss either. A common theme in fantasy is the Magnificent Seven type scenario where you have to get a team together before continuing. The lvl2 group quest is the beginnings of this, but it could be expanded on. Having a multi-step quest which requires each char to do their bit at a specific stage would be great, and in keeping with many of the best fantasy stories that inspire most of the RPGs.

Baldur's Gate and its ilk handle the limited chat issue between NPC and player by offering multiple choice questions for puzzles. Quite often Something Bad happens to you if you pick the wrong answer, so you can't blindly step through the options. This idea is worth shamelessly stealing

Yes some peeps will just go straight to a web site a check a reference for the solution, but many will get a lot of enjoyment out of solving genuine RPG problems.

I'm hoping that the Event Team will be doing some of these kinds of things and not just dropping a large amount of unexpected monsters into the three realms at random with a slight story to tie it together

All of this is just my opinion of course

 

[Brannor McThife]

Originally posted by Roo Stercogburn
...not just dropping a large amount of unexpected monsters into the three realms at random with a slight story to tie it together

BAH!

<goes back to the drawing board to re-write his reasons for being the dragon.>

Damn you.

Ok. I gotta agree with you. 99% of quests are nothing more than kill tasks with a bunch of babble behind them. You do them to get nice items and xp.

Now, events, are the types of things you're talking about. The event guys sometimes prepare for multiple storylines based on what players could chose to do.

Epic events, well, now we're talking. Ever make a choice that will forever alter your realm's faction to a specific faction? Can you handle that responsibility? How about giving up a relic to a mage that needs it in a spell? Could you do it, not knowing what could happen to it? How about, killing one creature that begged for mercy, and having the dragon pay you a visit? Or, chosing not to help someone, and have a L60 assassin stalk your guild for a week or two?

Makes it a little more interesting no?

-G

PS. None of the above are actual events nor have they been planned. This is just my usual random thoughts where I get to kill players.

PPS. I really like the assassin stalking your guild one...

 

[old.Hendrick]

While all this is very true, I must ask you one thing: Why not do it? Everyone can try to think of some things in-game and involve a couple of friends in some smallish role-playing event of their own. It is possible really. Of course, as a player you are somewhat limited, but you can pull it off and even have your friends believe it is a GM-run thingy.

We had two events recently where Templars were involved:

The first was a rescue-mission to find Ziera of the Utopia guild. Basically we all just ran around in Avalon a bit, then found two strange girls and after a while of talk we finally got it all together and rescued the damsel in distress. Very basic, yes, but good fun. And I honestly believed it was something organized by the GMs until we stood on the hermits Island and he just kept repopping and agroing the youngsters among us

The second was something I made up on the fly, using some riddles I had researched for a planned but never executed event. In short: Hendrick got caught by a evil wizzie, and entombed in the sunken statue in camelot hills. The wizard (one of my alts) then stood there waiting for some folks to come to the rescue, and challenged them to a riddle-contest.

Both of these events were very good fun and prove that it is possible to get something out of the game by putting something in as well. Of course, you also need people to play along, and as a player yourself you are limited in what challenges and adversaries you can present to the others. But if you have any really good ideas and require a little help, I dare say that it is worth giving right-now a try.

 

[Brannor McThife]

Just to add. Actually. It's a major point and should supercede everything else.

Events will be and are Roleplaying. If you cannot roleplay, then I ask as a player myself, that you please not attend them and use d00d talk, etc. The people that write the events put quite a bit of effort into them, and having you run up to the NPC and the players saying:

"Hey m8, is this an event?"

is IMHO, sad. If you have to ask, ask in a PM. Don't immediately run up to the NPC and try to attack them. Most of the time you're not going to be able to and will just look like a twit. Later on, in Epic Events, you may find that the NPC's are killable, but killing them, or merely striking them could have dire consequences for you and everyone else.

When attending an event, if you can't roleplay and still want to watch, do so, but please, don't use non-roleplaying speech. Like, "m8, I got here L8 cause my mutha made me clean my room dude." If, all you want to do is "kill stuff" (Yes you, the trolls in the back row), then wait until the command is given and stand there like the dumb trolls you are.

Often, important things are said or done, so spamming the MAIN with emotes and "lol", "pld", etc. means you may miss important things. Oh, and most of the time with smaller events, you're really not going to get anything (items), maybe a few gold pieces, but that's about it. And, play fair, don't cheat somebody else out of their fun because you think you're so cool (points at a hunter lurking at the rear).

Other than that, they're there to enhance your experience (No, not XP) and for you to have fun. Everybody has fun if the players RP the event too, and by doing so you make the events worthwhile. I guess, that after a while, if there was little to no RP from the players, the events team would start targetting the RP'ers amongst us for events, and just leave the rest out. That is, of course, just my opinion and in no way reflects the feelings of others.



-G

 

[Roo Stercogburn]

Hehe yeh, something that personalises the game for players and makes it seem more 'their own'.

The assassin scenario would be perfect for a multi profession-based quest. Certain NPCs (or event team players??) with crucial info won't respond unless skald there to sweet talk them. Perhaps to get some info on assassin, a healer type has to rez a previous victim to get info. Assassin remains invisible (but inactive) without hunter or SB in group (or other realm equivilent) when they eventually catch up with him.

Quests that let each type of character do their own special thing to advance the quest would give a genuine team feeling to it all and make it that bit more special than just getting a bunch of tough hombres together to hack up some beastie.

To answer Hendrick, we already have some things like this going on in guild. One of our players has lower level players collecting ingredients for 'potions' for him. They harvest the items from beasties around their level, and then get paid for it. Helps our newer guildmates without overtly having to simply give them gold to help them along. No argument though, the game system is flexible enough that you can do a good chunk of these kind of things just by knuckling down to it with a bit of thought.

 

[kemor]

*sneaks into the shadows of the room and listens to the discussion*

 

[old.Revz]

Events for their own sake are all well and good. I know they will be popular, but you can never beat the turnout you would get if there was some incentive for completing them in the manner intended. I don't mean an earth shattering reward but something unique to that player that marks them out as having done something worthwhile. Adding a title to your name (as promised a while back I think), giving you some visible item to wear at special occasions or whatever.

Anyway bring on the events

 

[Sortbane]

Aye!

Been planning some events myself these past days while being away from daoc due to vacation and I've come up with some that I intend to use in a little while when I come back from my vacation and I really hope to get the players with me

and events can be just some small little things that make the other players get a little feeling in the game, as for an example if someone asks me for money in "non-leet" way I will give them a little quest and then give them some money as a reward for doing that little task for me

anyways, would love to see more events both player and GM-run and I hope to be around when the events happen

 

[old.Hendrick]

I myself will draw great satisfaction from kicking the butt of a certain "Ewlena of the Pact". What I would also like to see is maybe a connection to certain epic-quests. Maybe as a sort of starting point for bigger scale events. For example, the lvl 40 guild of shadows epic has a very fascinating plot leading you deep into the Tepoks Mine where you find out certain disturbing things are to happen in Lyn Barfog soon. (Won't go into detail not to spoil the quest). Yet, I have never seen Lyn Barfog threatened. Maybe a simple call out to the guild of shadows for help? Given out to the trainers there. When you come there to train the trainers will give you the usual training talk, but also call for your help in a specific matter. Setting a time and place ("tomorrow at 8pm UK time, be in Lyn Barfog to help", a bit better paraphrased maybe ) and then waiting for people to show up. The trainers would give out this call to anybody who comes to train say wednesday from 3-11pm, maybe limited by level or class to reduce the amount of people involved to something that can still be handled. Shortly after the people arrive at the location of adventure, hell breaks loose and the goblins invade the Barfog, or a secret army of dwarfs wreaks havoc.

 

[Brannor McThife]

Guys, a question for those posting/reading here.

Looking back at the EoB event, and how people responded. At first, the greater proportion of people in Midgard wanted nothing more than to kill the Prophets and the Stones, not really caring about the event as such. A few took part completely, to the point that they emersed themselves in the roles as messengers of The Chosen (I recall a few running off to bring friends to see me).

Now, the question is, would you guys simply respond to the event if you happen to be there and only as it happens? Or would you, like these people did, change your character to emerse yourselves in the event? Like, running around with the staff permanently, not slaying anything, maybe even forming a "Children of the Chosen" guild. That kinda thing.

I mean, isn't that true RP'ing? Not just RP'ing when the event is on, but carrying through with it so as to change your character?

Dunno. Just tossing thoughts about...Standard Friday afternoon stuff.

-G

 

[Sortbane]

As Brannor said there's always those that aren't into the "hardcore" roleplaying but I love the idea that some people can get specific (spelling?) roles and be something more than just running around on the XP-mill over and over again..

I for one is willing to do such tasks, and being a avid PnP roleplayer this is the final piece that can make daoc to an (almost) perfect game

anyways, really good idea Brannor

 

[Roo Stercogburn]

I've not been around at any events so far. One of the problems with roleplaying is that it is difficult to consistantly roleplay a character and even harder to do it in an environment where not that many people roleplay at all. (c'mon, my main is a Spirit Master. In theory I should be sizing up everyone I meet as a potential pet (looking forward to next time Glauthrong dies, yesssss, Hel has promised me muhahaha)).

However, for events, I agree completely on the roleplay thing. They should be roleplayed (my own roleplay abilities are fairly low but I'm up for fun). I've noticed though that the more people that roleplay their part, the more others are willing to do the same and join in.

I'm betting that the roleplay level will be low as events start (and people figure out what is going on), and increase as the event continues as people get more into it.

 

[Old Nicodemus]

Indeed!

Having the chance to take the event even further by creating guilds etc is a very good idea.

That's what Roleplaying is all about.

There are a lot of possibilities that can be explored. The idea of an assassin stalking the guild is a good one, but if you were to kill him too quickly maybe the assassins guild or friends come to take revenge? Would make life difficult for a high level Guild knowing that they have a number of assassins stalking them... are you truely alone out there when you are soloing?

Or how about a realm event where one of the relics goes missing? Where is it? Who took it? Do the Albs have it or the Hibs?

I quite like the idea of low level events as well. How about the impending wedding of a bride to a relam faction that is aggressive? Get her to the wedding in time and alive and it effects everyones faction standing for a while. If she dies or is late then the reaction could be adverse. Plus you can also get to see the wedding (and the beer tent).

It makes it all the more apealing to make a new character so you can partake of the events at lower levels.

Nicodemus
Spiritmaster
Fedaykin

PS Hiya Kemor Hope you are taking notes.... questions will be asked later

 

[old.job]

Last week I dug out my old N64 and slotted in Zelda-Oricana of Time, what a class game , I'd forgotten how good it actually looked at 320x240.
Mythic, I suggest all your game designers play this game for a week and see what real gameplay is!

 

[Brannor McThife]

Originally posted by old.job
Mythic, I suggest all your game designers play this game for a week and see what real gameplay is!

Hehe...to use one of my oldest quotes...

GOA doesn't write the game, and I'm pretty sure Mythic doesn't read the forums either... Glad to see you're still getting value out of your N64 though.

-G

 

[Brannor McThife]

Originally posted by old.Nicodemus /Pryd
are you truely alone out there when you are soloing?

/wave

"Who's there?"

/wave

/g Help!
/y
/y
/y

/wave



-G

 

[dittytwo]

Originally posted by Brannor McThife

Now, the question is, would you guys simply respond to the event if you happen to be there and only as it happens? Or would you, like these people did, change your character to emerse yourselves in the event? Like, running around with the staff permanently, not slaying anything, maybe even forming a "Children of the Chosen" guild. That kinda thing.
-G

OT nice Thread for a change i donno is it me or have the threads GOA sucks all the time SNOre anyway

this does sound like a cool idea
the only problem i can for see with this is the xping..
now dont get me worng the problem i forse is for people like me i try to get on as much as i can but RL always itseems gets in the way but i cna not get on enough to be the uber char my two main chars are only 13 and 11 (see sig below) but i would love to take part in events like the ones that have been mentioned
but for the quest mentioned above it would only be avialable in the areas that i can progress through safely (ie act as a mesenger)
but on saying that obviously being a chosen char would mean that you fit into the role assigned and if that is the case then cool


my god i am waffeling

the multi-level, specific group events sound cool


also about the puzzle quests now they sound fantastic and they could be rewarded with a sheild/ cloack with a puzzel embelem on it for instance with or with out dosh and XP

anyway
i would like to see events that would alter the course of battles forinstance, (ok this is a long one mind is going for a long walk in the realms of fantasy) if a huge NPC battle were commenceing as an event forinstance, and a messenger comes out of the front line and selects a target to go off and deliver his message and the quickness of that message getting there and talking to the other NPC at the other end would change the outcome of the battle ie you had to go and give mulgrat a message and he would rase huge army of undeads to come ad assit in the battle.. that kind of thing would be impressive

if you failed then some of the npc arround camalot would be missing in action for a while and the prices at the merchants increase because the trade route were effected that kind of thing. the rewards for doing that !!!!

 

[Damon_D]

One thing I realy would like to see in these events , is being able to roleplay on the dark side, not just ruining the fun for others , but actualy being able to help the assins , or the goblin horde about to take over a city, not everyone likes to RP a good guy you know

 

[dittytwo]

Originally posted by Damon Doombring
One thing I realy would like to see in these events , is being able to roleplay on the dark side, not just ruining the fun for others , but actualy being able to help the assins , or the goblin horde about to take over a city, not everyone likes to RP a good guy you know [/QUOTE


very true had not even thought about that side

you could be the spy for the apposing team and have to go and kill a prodominate figure somewhere... cool

 

[Brannor McThife]

Damon, totally agree. Just look at me, I have a dark side... Gimme the dragon already.

Some of the events that have been allowed any choice for the players, be good to all, be good to one or the other, or just kill 'em all!!!

Ahem.

Take the EoB event. Some people flamed those that just ran around killing everyone, hey, the Children of the Chosen were a cult!!! Burn them all!!!

Good point to remember though. And as was mentioned, "ruin" the storyline IN character, most times, the storyline will actually have been prepared for that possibility, just don't spoil it just for griefing's sake, cause the GM's WILL remember you... (gimme the dragon, oh PLEASE gimme the dragon )

-G

 

[Old Nicodemus]

LOL!

Errr.... yes. I'd forgotten that you were now all on your trollsome Brannor!

Roo and I are always up for fun in game if you want some mayhem

The possibilities for events are never ending.. What would happen if the dragons left their lairs to team up together? You could have ALL the realms join up to do battle against a much great foe (especially if Camelot had been attacked and was burning). The decision is yours.. do you bash your enemies while you fight the dragons? Or finish the dragons and then turn on each other? Or celebrate with one another and trot home after the Dragons are dead? Oh and of course the dragons will be really really nasty!

Or how about a new realm relic (non magical) that is kept in the capital? You collect Various gem stones etc as part of an event that will allow you to enter another realm capital to try and steal that relic? (probably not feasible but could spawn other ideas)

Or an event where someone has to sacrifice themselves to help their friends? e.g taking on the dragon alone while everyone else flees after a rescue of sacrifice victims.. (Gandalf moment anyone?)

As for having a darkside, you could Roleplay it as though you have been posessed. Your actions are not your own but you are compelled to do them.... everyone else has to stop you!

Nicodemus

 

[old.Enflo]

I used to play a computer based rp game but i can't remember which it was. One of the creatures in it would sneak upto you and nick something (weapon, potion, etc) and run away, usually whilst you were fighting something else. You had to chase these little gits all over the place to get your items back, thats if you noticed. Now that could be fun at any lvl.

 

[old.Vae]

Trying to dredge the depths of my mind and I think the comp rpg Enflo's talking about with the theives was Dungeon Master (probably about 1990ish) on the Amiga and Atari.

You used to have to chase them and kill them to get them to drop the item they had stolen. They also had a really annoying giggle/laugh sound effect.

 

[Roo Stercogburn]

Ok then... some interesting points raised... lets do something instead of talking (typing?) about it.

I'll need 4 or 5 other players willing to spend some time out of game, perhaps using MSN Messenger to organise it together. We can create a few mini-quests which can get a load of peeps doing something different. We'll need to use alts that nobody knows about and/or be prepared to sacrifice one of our own if all your slots are used or guilded. Since I mainly play on Mid/Pryd, this is where I would be interested in organising something (mainly for practical reasons - I don't know my way around the other realms), but there's nothing to stop other peeps doing same on other servers. If successful, I can see a need for a further 5 or so peeps to play supporting roles in bigger more elaborate stories, but for now we keep it small.

Ideally, I only want no more than 1 or 2 peeps from same guild together so when we launch the quests we can get word to as many peeps as fast as possible at the same time. We will create a couple of specific quests for a level range then work out how we get peeps involved in it. If it works out and everyone has fun, we can do it again (if not, no harm done). The next time we do a quest, we set it for a different level range, and so on, so we can work it so we get as many of our realm buddies playing as possible and peeps don't feel left out.

We can start a closed discussion to get the thing organised then spring it on our various realm buddies when we are ready. We might need items donated and a little gold perhaps to help things along. We keep the first few short and simple, but nothing to stop us linking the stories
Each member of the organising team plays a part in the 'story', and helps make sure things get shuffled along, effectively acting as a mini-GM for their part of the action.

Anyone up for taking the pain and putting their money where their mouth is, PM me. If I get spammed I won't reply to all, just pick out a few peeps so we can get it going.

One thing though: I have no pride - I'll take ideas and suggestions from anyone. Anyone who joins in be prepared to do the same

 

[old.Enflo]

Cheers Vae, thats the one. Can believe I forgot it was Dungeon Master, what a classic and my first game on my Amiga.

Roo: Nice idea but im in Albion/Prydwen (you middie scum ) so maybe next time.

 

[old.Darkan]

Why don't we set up a player run RP 'council'?

Say a member from 5 different guilds of your realm. It would be fun to be doing an RP event (e.g. deep in barrows trying to rescue a dieing friend - possibly a time limit to save him? Only then after resurrecting your friend, running off to frontier lands for the next part.......)

Which would probably consist of the successfull units from each realm racing to take a specific keep or something similar.

I haven't done that much RPing, but love the idea.

I would gladly lend a large portion of my time to support/run something like this.

The only problem is, if you're from Albion it's likely you know me, either as Eastern, Western, Northern and Southern, so no danger I can do any anonymous work.

 

[old.Sami]

I used to play Jumpgate before moving into DAoC.. the devs there run the game in a pretty intresting way (well, the game IS somewhat different, it has a continuing plot). They take all the time the players and make them part of the plot. One squad (=guild here) was told to patrol a certain area, speak some gibberish and kill evry1, and all the peeps took it pretty well, no1 started calling them griefers. One other squad (mercenary one) took a normal escort mission, but soon found out that they we're actually working for some sinister force behind all the bad that has been causing havoc in the universe. Things like this happen there all the time. Squads take part in politics, work together with devs, if someone comes up with an idea for a good event, he gets to script it and he's given the needed tools and manpower to pull the event thru (done that).

There are also mobs around, called sentients.. they look just like the normal ones, but are actually player/GM/OP controlled.

Im too tired to come up with any ideas after all this babbling Ive done here, but I hope someone does.

Would YOU be prepared to play that LVL60 assasin, stalking a certain guild for a week or two? You're lvl60.. imagine that.. could you still follow very strict rules what to do and what to do not? You're not supposed to show yourself to ANYONE.. could you keep yourself hidden for 2 weeks, even from your friends?

 

[Brannor McThife]

Originally posted by old.Sami
Would YOU be prepared to play that LVL60 assasin, stalking a certain guild for a week or two? You're lvl60.. imagine that.. could you still follow very strict rules what to do and what to do not? You're not supposed to show yourself to ANYONE.. could you keep yourself hidden for 2 weeks, even from your friends?

Sorry...couldn't resist...

Been there. Done that. Jorem, L75 Healer. Nobody knew who I was for 2 months. And believe me, it is VERY hard to stay in character for that period, AND play your "mortals" normally. I'd say that that specific example would be extremely hard, since you'd have minimal contact with people, except when you killed them.

And yes, following the strict guidelines is VERY important, no FFA stuff. You follow your role according to you parameters. Sounds fun, but is also a lot of work.

-G

 

[Sortbane]

And yes, following the strict guidelines is VERY important, no FFA stuff. You follow your role according to you parameters. Sounds fun, but is also a lot of work.

hehe, sounds to me as something I would do for free and have no regrets.. (I've never had a role like that, but I know myself enough to know that I would go trough with it)

as for the RP council mentioned by Roo, that would only work for one realm on one server, better that some people (guilds) start out with the work on creating some small events and let other pick up the trend.. think it would work, but it all adds up to how much YOU is willing to put up into the game

I for one is willing to go to great lengths to make this game more and more enjoyable both for me and for others..

Got a little idea for a event here also.. lets say that one realm got a quest to do something and they succed in it and the other day suddenly all the merchants in that realms capitol city disappeared... would've been interesting to see how it all worked out

Keep up the good ideas for events and you wont dissapoint martha (she got great believes in you guys)

 

[Blood]

Kemor next time we have a dragon raid on midgard, can you please let Zargar play the dragon? (i mean even as a Battle-Trained Bear he wasnt much of a match )