Siege Engine Discussion!

[rynnor]

1. Unpredictable length of time in targeting mode - not sure what causes this but sometimes its ages other times a few seconds?

2. Low Health - its just far too low currently on the weapons - a few casters can wipe them in less time than it takes to set em up rendering them pretty near useless unless the other side ignore them.

3. Low damage - considering how expensive they are and how easy to destroy they just dont do enough damage to be worthwhile with the exception of the flaming oil.

I guess Mythic have decided that siege weapons shouldnt be a big part of the game but its a little sad

Thoughts?

 

[dee777]

Classical example of a pre-nerf IMO. EvE online does this all the time. They implement new stuff already nerfed, so it wont unbalance things. If need be, they buff it later. This helps alleviating the nerdrage drama that follows nerfing something that was too strong at release.

I am pretty sure that either the damage they take or the damage they deal will be increased at some point.

 

[Dredge]

1. Unpredictable length of time in targeting mode - not sure what causes this but sometimes its ages other times a few seconds?

2. Low Health - its just far too low currently on the weapons - a few casters can wipe them in less time than it takes to set em up rendering them pretty near useless unless the other side ignore them.

3. Low damage - considering how expensive they are and how easy to destroy they just dont do enough damage to be worthwhile with the exception of the flaming oil.

I guess Mythic have decided that siege weapons shouldnt be a big part of the game but its a little sad

Thoughts?

Siege engines not meant for players for the most part. Meant to take out the other siege engines.

The single shot (rather than aoe-splash) do more than enough damage to finish off a player on low health.

Different weapons have different targetting times, only difference I have noticed otherwise is because of lag spikes.

 

[Ogen]

Abit disapointed with the current siege system. Would like to see destroyable keeps, and free placing of siege equipment (not being forced to use those wierd places on the ground to put it on).

Lets hope we get it later on.. Altho im pretty sure we dont get to destroy keeps..

 

[rynnor]

Siege engines not meant for players for the most part. Meant to take out the other siege engines.

Huh? Why bother bringing a siege engine to take out siege engines when by the time you set it up the casters have already destroyed it?

The single shot (rather than aoe-splash) do more than enough damage to finish off a player on low health.

They dont do enough damage to be worthwhile - especially considering the annoyance of targetting and long delay between shots plus massive variance on damage (300-1000 at tier 2). Asiege weapon should be usefull not a way to make youself less effective in a keep siege when they are already extremely limited.

Different weapons have different targetting times, only difference I have noticed otherwise is because of lag spikes.

I was talking about the control time when you are in targetting mode - from my experience its extremely random.

 

[rynnor]

Classical example of a pre-nerf IMO.

My money's on this one

 

[Enli]

in closed beta i remember more dmg done by siege
sometimes up to 2 shotting people, bit too much but now it's not worth it

 

[Dredge]

You are doing it wrong.

Huh? Why bother bringing a siege engine to take out siege engines when by the time you set it up the casters have already destroyed it?

Only the closest ones are in range of caster spells. I play a sorc, theres no way I can hit anything other than a battering ram from the keep walls with my longest range nuke, and to get close enough to fire on the engines on a keep, I am in range of the casters sitting on the walls, who promptly fry me. Assaulting a keep you take out the AOE damage ones, then the boiling oil

They dont do enough damage to be worthwhile - especially considering the annoyance of targetting and long delay between shots plus massive variance on damage (300-1000 at tier 2). Asiege weapon should be usefull not a way to make youself less effective in a keep siege when they are already extremely limited.

Here is a tip. As long as its red when you fire, you have scored a hit, even if they move. Dont follow them around with it, target, fire, move on. I can top damage done in scenarios or taking a keep just by manning a repeating ballista. It sounds as if you just having trouble using them.

I was talking about the control time when you are in targetting mode - from my experience its extremely random.

Well I dont find it that random, and have been using cannon, ballista and orc catapults in T2. In targetting mode you can fire as soon as its red, or wait til it shrinks for the highest damage. AOE is no use in waiting, the idea is to force the healers to heal multiple targets, with the single target weapons, its to either pick off the people fleeing, or just nuke the healer forcing them to heal themselves. 600 damage every 3 or 4 seconds will get the attention of any healer. And its a loooonnngggg range.

 

[rynnor]

You are doing it wrong.

Always possible but I have played around with it quite a bit

Only the closest ones are in range of caster spells. I play a sorc, theres no way I can hit anything other than a battering ram from the keep walls with my longest range nuke, and to get close enough to fire on the engines on a keep, I am in range of the casters sitting on the walls, who promptly fry me. Assaulting a keep you take out the AOE damage ones, then the boiling oil.

Ah I see where your coming from but I meant as a defender using siege engines these are very quickly ahnillated by casters - I faced an attacking force of 10-15 people and barely got two shots off before it was destroyed.

That seems a bit silly to me as it takes longer than that to build it lol

Here is a tip. As long as its red when you fire, you have scored a hit, even if they move. Dont follow them around with it, target, fire, move on. I can top damage done in scenarios or taking a keep just by manning a repeating ballista. It sounds as if you just having trouble using them.

I figured out the red bit as you cant actually fire the single target ones without a red target

Well I dont find it that random, and have been using cannon, ballista and orc catapults in T2. In targetting mode you can fire as soon as its red, or wait til it shrinks for the highest damage.

Oh - interesting you mention the cursor shrinking thing because from my testing it doesnt seem to work lol - targetting the siege pads outside a keep (an unmoving standard target) I often found damage was higher if you fire before the cursor shrinks - even managed shots over 1k damage from hitting it straight away for instance.

600 damage every 3 or 4 seconds will get the attention of any healer. And its a loooonnngggg range.

If only it were that constant but they arent - its currently quite hard to die from a siege engine alone unless you stand still

 

[Bahumat]

Abit disapointed with the current siege system. Would like to see destroyable keeps, and free placing of siege equipment (not being forced to use those wierd places on the ground to put it on).

Lets hope we get it later on.. Altho im pretty sure we dont get to destroy keeps..

I dont think they should be moveable because you just get all that crap like in daoc. Example being where you pull the ram through the door (whilst inside the keep) etc.

 

[Gogge^^]

my biggest concern is the collision detection, a warband with about 40+ people last night tried to raid at keep. we got the door down but just couldent do anything about the huge masive wall of bodys just in the doorway. we just stood staring at each others for 30minutes, noone could get in and noone could get out cause they all blocked each others

 

[dee777]

my biggest concern is the collision detection, a warband with about 40+ people last night tried to raid at keep. we got the door down but just couldent do anything about the huge masive wall of bodys just in the doorway. we just stood staring at each others for 30minutes, noone could get in and noone could get out cause they all blocked each others

Arent MDPS classes able to stealth _thru_ people? I never played one, but I somehow thought thats the way they should be designed and took it for granted.

 

[Ogen]

I dont think they should be moveable because you just get all that crap like in daoc. Example being where you pull the ram through the door (whilst inside the keep) etc.

Sounds like something easily fixed to me, even tho i never experienced any bugs with the moveable siege equipment in DAoC. (Exept maybe targetting people standing inside them with cursor could be hard, but who targets with cursor anyway?).

It opened up, many more tactical options, and i really miss that in WAR. Seems to pre-set to my likings.

I for one, dont want another Altarec Valley... I want evolving, un-predictable RVR.