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[gohan]

its because of the amount of foreign people coming to live here the rate they come in is faster than the rate they're building houses.. common sense would say to stop them coming in if theres a shortage of housing? not rocket science really but then again the gov is rather thick in that respect.

more like scared to act cos people will scream rasict or facist or anthing else ist


people are kind of retarded sheep and cry outrage at the smallest thing the the paper brings to their attention

 

[Ch3tan]

Ok, in Manchester we have around 10,000 apartments in and around the city centre that are vacant. They were built during the property boom. The people who would have bought those places can no longer get the mortgages so they are staying where they are in rented accomodation. This lack of movement in the rental and housing market is the problem, there are lots of empty places but people can not move up the ladder and so the bottom end of the system is totally clogged up. Ireland has exactly the same problem, no empty public housing and fuckloads of empty private places that no one can afford or get mortgages for.

It's compounded by the problem that the governments and councils can no longer afford to buy the empty housing to let to tenants. Both because there is no money available, and because they'd be buying at such a high price, that the lower rent they charge would offer no return at all.

Still, in my opinion, this is what happens when you have short termism in every government. Making things better for those living today does not equate to a better future. Hard choices and some suffering now could mean a much better UK in the future. It's my main reason for disliking Labour, out of all the parties they are the worse for losing sight of the big picture.

 

[BloodOmen]

more like scared to act cos people will scream rasict or facist or anthing else ist


people are kind of retarded sheep and cry outrage at the smallest thing the the paper brings to their attention

aye that aswell, if I was in charge of the country i'd simple say "Right no more coming in until this shits sorted out" if they whined i'd say "see this =) <---- its the face of fucking care"

 

[cHodAX]

Cho, can you provide proof of that please. Everything I've read says that he'd have to be the offsrping or spouse of the sitting tenant to inherit the tenancy. As her brother, living there or not, he does not have that right.

Oh and I'm sure the Daily Mail will pay his legal bills with the money they've made of this story

I will go digging when I get a chance but from personal experience I know this to be the case, my old neighbours had the same issue but in a private rented place. The landlord wanted the old lady out when her younger brother (the tenant) passed away as she was struggling to meet the rent and was waiting on housing benefit which the landlord did not want to entertain. The old lady go on to some charity and they fought her case as she had lived there for 4 years, in the end the court ruled that as a sitting tenant she was entitled to stay as long as she could meet the rent by whatever means.

As you said before, it may well have to go to court to get sorted. I don't object to peoples opinions saying 1 person should not be hanging on to a 3 bedroom place, the logic does not escape me. What doesn't sit right is the council bullying the old man out, tricking him into signing a shorthold tenancy when he already had rights but with the intention of getting rid of him in the medium term.

It just isn't right.

He shouldn't be forced out of his home and it is his home, under law.

 

[cHodAX]

It's compounded by the problem that the governments and councils can no longer afford to buy the empty housing to let to tenants. Both because there is no money available, and because they'd be buying at such a high price, that the lower rent they charge would offer no return at all.

Still, in my opinion, this is what happens when you have short termism in every government. Making things better for those living today does not equate to a better future. Hard choices and some suffering now could mean a much better UK in the future. It's my main reason for disliking Labour, out of all the parties they are the worse for losing sight of the big picture.

When I was in Ireland that was a massive issue, they have vast amounts of empty private flats in places like Dublin and Tallaght and yet they have 8 year waiting lists for council places. The developers who built the private flats own 100's of millions, hell probably billions of euros to the Irish government and the banks which very little chance of ever seeing a decent return. There have been calls for government to seize these empty places and make them available at fair prices to easy to housing shortage, personally I don't see a problem, if some fucker owes millions in tax and VAT then seize thier assets and use them for the public good.

 

[Ch3tan]

What you have just said is different from the situation here though if she had only been at the property 4 years then she'd have been on a shorthold tenancy from the start, it's also a courts decision - the landlord was well within her rights to give notice. Sounds like she was served notice to quit and then had papers filed against her by the landlady. That could have gone either way to be honest, I've known tenants to be evicted for missing one rental payment, and others to be allowed to stay even though they are shit and miss loads. (work in property btw)

Also I object very much to your second paragraph, again, we don't have the facts. I know that you are more intelligent than to believe anything the mail prints.

 

[megadave]

lol the dailymail reader going on about immigrants

 

[Ch3tan]

When I was in Ireland that was a massive issue, they have vast amounts of empty private flats in places like Dublin and Tallaght and yet they have 8 year waiting lists for council places. The developers who built the private flats own 100's of millions, hell probably billions of euros to the Irish government and the banks which very little chance of ever seeing a decent return. There have been calls for government to seize these empty places and make them available at fair prices to easy to housing shortage, personally I don't see a problem, if some fucker owes millions in tax and VAT then seize thier assets and use them for the public good.

the problem is, that many developers file for bankruptcy, their assets are seized by the banks that were owed money and then sold at auction.

It's a UK wide problem, lots of empty new builds all over London, although the market is starting to recover. Lots of them were built with 2012 and the new transport links it is bringing in mind, so they may still work out here anyway.

The main problem is that housing was available to all, with no long term view of what would happen when the next 3 generations needed somewhere to live.

It's also down to a lack of family unity and people thinking they are owed a place to live. In my family we care for our own, no one takes off the state when there is a bed in someone's house. These are values that are in short supply in the UK.

 

[cHodAX]

What you have just said is different from the situation here though if she had only been at the property 4 years then she'd have been on a shorthold tenancy from the start, it's also a courts decision - the landlord was well within her rights to give notice. Sounds like she was served notice to quit and then had papers filed against her by the landlady. That could have gone either way to be honest, I've known tenants to be evicted for missing one rental payment, and others to be allowed to stay even though they are shit and miss loads. (work in property btw)

Also I object very much to your second paragraph, again, we don't have the facts. I know that you are more intelligent than to believe anything the mail prints.

The brother was the tenant, he was there for 15 years iirc. She was there for 4 years and was on the electoral roll.

As for beliving the Mail, you have a good point and I may be proven wrong if more details come out but I am totally honest and open when I say that it doesn't sit right with me that an old man can be forced out of a place he calls home. Especially given his history, the poor old bugger must be heartbroken with the worry.

 

[Ch3tan]

The brother was the tenant, he was there for 15 years iirc. She was there for 4 years and was on the electoral roll.

Still not long enough ago to be covered by the Rent Act. The first Housing Act came into force 1980, with the major changes in 88 and 96. She's not a sitting tenant under the housing act. It's a very different thing.

She's lucky that the court have ruled that way, could have easily gone the other. What the courts usually asses is whether the tenant is good, and whether the landlord will get the money, now if she had issues raising the cash even with housing benefit, then she must have been able to demonstrate another source of income or proof that the council would give her more money.

 

[cHodAX]

It's also down to a lack of family unity and people thinking they are owed a place to live. In my family we care for our own, no one takes off the state when there is a bed in someone's house. These are values that are in short supply in the UK.

Living in a council place is not living off the state though, the rents are very fair but still affordable for people at the very bottom. If you do the maths and figure 50 years lifespan for the average council house then the council actually makes at least 100% profit over the build costs during the lifespan of the property. The fuckers never reinvest in new builds though.

My local council gave public housing up and transferred it to New Charter, a housing association. They charge very fair rents, do quality maintance and still have enough money to put up a good amount of new builds every year. Local councils are crap, they rape the housing budget to pay for fancy team building weekends away at stately homes. Cnuts.

 

[cHodAX]

Still not long enough ago to be covered by the Rent Act. The first Housing Act came into force 1980, with the major changes in 88 and 96. She's not a sitting tenant under the housing act. It's a very different thing.

She's lucky that the court have ruled that way, could have easily gone the other. What the courts usually asses is whether the tenant is good, and whether the landlord will get the money, now if she had issues raising the cash even with housing benefit, then she must have been able to demonstrate another source of income or proof that the council would give her more money.

Well I don't have the court ruling but she won and is still there, her rights were protected be it as a sitting tenant or something else. The charity fought her case an won, rightly so as it was her home and she made every effort to meet the rent.

 

[Ch3tan]

In London at least, housing association rents are far out of line with the private rental market. A council two bed flat in Streatham, south London for example is about £600 with the council - with a garden. That flat is worth £1000 easily privately. So you'll understand why I will say that's living off the state, it's a massive subsidy.

 

[Ch3tan]

Well I don't have the court ruling but she won and is still there, her rights were protected be it as a sitting tenant or something else. The charity fought her case an won, rightly so as it was her home and she made every effort to meet the rent.

Yes, and that is what this old fella could argue. However the judge may just as well take the view that his house is of much more value and importance to a family than it is to him - especially as the council will re home him. Your neighbour would have had to rehome her self, which sounds like it would have been difficult for her financially. The courts do not want to make people homeless.

 

[cHodAX]

In London at least, housing association rents are far out of line with the private rental market. A council two bed flat in Streatham, south London for example is about £600 with the council - with a garden. That flat is worth £1000 easily privately. So you'll understand why I will say that's living off the state, it's a massive subsidy.

No it isn't, you are looking at it the wrong way bud. The rent should reflect the build cost, not the average price in the rental market. Building places isn't as expensive as you think. Market prices in no way reflect actual build costs right now. Oh and there is no subsidy either, the state isn't being asked to pick up any percieved shortfall.

 

[Aoami]

lol @ all these 'facts' coming out.

 

[cHodAX]

Yes, and that is what this old fella could argue. However the judge may just as well take the view that his house is of much more value and importance to a family than it is to him - especially as the council will re home him. Your neighbour would have had to rehome her self, which sounds like it would have been difficult for her financially. The courts do not want to make people homeless.

I am eager to see how it turns out, if it goes to court he has a great chance as a paying tenant he is still afforded alot of protection under the law and his personally history will only help sway a judge.

 

[Ch3tan]

No it isn't, you are looking at it the wrong way bud. The rent should reflect the build cost, not the average price in the rental market. Building places isn't as expensive as you think. Market prices in no way reflect actual build costs right now.

These aren't new builds though, a lot of these places are very very nice old Victorian houses that are worth a fortune. You need to look at it from the view of a working person who can't afford that rent nor get a council place, so has to either move to another area, or settle for a lot less. ( £600 in London pcm will get you a studio, a one bed if you've got an incredibly generous landlord).

The council housing model only works where the councils have built the property themselves. All of those were sold off long ago under right to buy. What remains is largely properties that were purchased by the council.

 

[cHodAX]

These aren't new builds though, a lot of these places are very very nice old Victorian houses that are worth a fortune. You need to look at it from the view of a working person who can't afford that rent nor get a council place, so has to either move to another area, or settle for a lot less. ( £600 in London pcm will get you a studio, a one bed if you've got an incredibly generous landlord).

The council housing model only works where the councils have built the property themselves. All of those were sold off long ago under right to buy. What remains is largely properties that were purchased by the council.

London is an odd place, I don't live there so it is hard for me to get my head around those prices. Yes those properties the councils bought and didn't build will definately skew the market in London. It isn't something that really happens in the north to be fair but I can understand the frustration.

Up here a council place tends to be council/corporation built between 1930 and 1980, rent on a 3 bedroom place is about £100 a week at most. No subsidy there, those places were built donkeys years ago and have long since paid for themselves in accrued rents. Now that New Charter have taken over there is a large investment in modernisation alongside a sizeable new build program, rents are very fair and New Charter will recoup the investment over a period of 15 years afterwhich profits will be ploughed back into more new builds or more modernisation of existing builds.

 

[Azurus]

Of course it isn't reasonable for a couple to have more children than they can support however there is absolutely nothing you can do about it. If you punish them financially their children will suffer the most and surely no one would claim they deserve this.

 

[TdC]

Up here a council place tends to be council/corporation built between 1930 and 1980, rent on a 3 bedroom place is about £100 a week at most.

lol my flat costs > 1k euros :-(