Shadowblade + Short Sword = Gimp?

[old.Caliria]

Hello!

I am creating a shadowblade in Midgard right now, and want to wield a short sword. However from all accounts I have read so far, thieves in this world are supposed to walk around with Great swords, Great axes, or an axe in left hand.

Call me boring, call me stuck to the old ways, but I have always imagined rogues with short swords and daggers. Could anyone help me in designing a rogue wielding a short sword + maybe a small shield. All guides I have seen forces me to wield big clumsy weapons.

...And someone ough to kick the programmers once or twice hard in the butt for not allowing dual wield swords and daggers...

Where should I place my points as I rise in level, has anyone created a successful short sword shadowblade in Midgard?

 

[Aeiedil]

i dont know about midgard, but for your traditional stabbing assasian look to the luri nightshade

uses 2 piercers as standard, or if you really want a piercer and a shield and we get nice curved daggers

 

[old.stabba]

there is no way you can make such a shadowblade on par with the other SB:s. if you had to make one id say go env weapon and do sword styles to kill stuff. i really do think this whould be the worse SB you can make tho, but if you dont care to much about that then go ahead

 

[Aeiedil]

stabba thats untrue, you could still make a good sb with a fast weapon, the damage output over time would still be the same, and the crit strike styles are very good at speed (coming from someone who has had to use speed 2.2 and 2.7 weps)

you dont need to use a huge goddam 2-hander just to make yourself good i doubt, its just the traditional method

 

[omen_darkstep]

If your planning on being any use in RVR at all I suggest getting a massive 2 hand bastard!

You can switch to 2 handed in mid battle, but IMO if u ain't killed your target with 1-4 CS hits your not going to win the fight.

 

[old.Caliria]

Aah, so twohanded sword it is then. How wrong this seems in my eyes. Would like to see the movie where a thief is sneaking around in the shadows with a great axe. Also, the programmers and I must have a whole different view about what backstabbing is, let me tell you... it is nothing that is being done with a great axe.

Imagine the thief sneaking up in a crowded street. From under her cloak she pulls out her well hidden 2m long great axe, which she stealthily snuck passed the guards with. She looks around... no one seems to have noticed her. With a quick sweep she cuts the victims head off (taking 5 innocent bystanders with her in the process who just happened to stand to close).... great.... still unnoticed... Caliria the thief disappears in the shadows again. A shadow moving invisibly from shadow to shadow... they wouldn't catch her... ever... she was just a whisper in the wind...

Seriously, this should have been noticed and fixed in the first patch... weak... really weak....

 

[old.chesnor]

lol Calira. I don't know where you get the idea that the shadowblade is a 'thief' style class. Its a label you have applied, then you moan because the class doesn't meet your own expectations.

Play the class to its strengths, it is very powerful if properly specced and is very versatile. Do not gimp yourself through prejudice

 

[old.Iunliten]

It's a shadowblade not a thief.

If you want curved daggers instead go to hibernia, if you want regular daggers go hibernia or albion but to be an effective shadowblade pull out that 2handeder

 

[Sarnat]

Well if you can get a nice short sword with high DPS, it won't gimp you. However, a 2hander might be better since the opening blow will matter much and you will deal a lot of damage with a 2handed weapon.

On the other hand, a fast weapon will be better against opponents with bladeturn (especially pulsing one). If you have bad luck the next pulse might just get in before your 2nd blow with that big damage dealer... But as SB bladeturn won't be a big problem to you since you should be killing your opponents in 1-3 blows, and your backstab styles will penatrate bladeturn.

There is nothing wrong with going for example Golden Alloy Short Sword in the high levels. You can always have 2 weapons and use the one best suited for the situation.

 

[old.Caliria]

Ah... and therein lies my mistake... Where could I possibly have gotten these weird misconceptions about shadowblades... believing that they were workers of stealth and lithe(lithe=gracefully slender; moving and bending with ease - from synonym word list)...

A few tidbits from the manual and official homepage...

Rogue
Since this class requires a certain amount of stealth for success, trolls are not considered suitable for the rogue class.

House of Loki: Shadowblade
Patron god: Loki, god of Trickery.
The Shadowblade creeps stealthily from one shadow to another and silently sows the seeds of death. His natural deftness and the gifts of Loki make the Shadowblade a deadly fighter, but devoid of any honor. Trolls and Dwarfs disapprove of such treachery and, while some Vikings are seduced by the cult of Loki, the lithe Kobolds come into their own and excel.

Kobold
Mischievous, quick, and small, Kobolds are natural at any task involving feats of dexterity, sneaking, and other Rogue-ish skills.

House of Loki
Loki, the ultimate trickster, makes Rogues into Shadowblades, masters of stealth and the magic of illusion. Kobolds make excellent Shadowblades, and human characters may also follow the House of Loki, but not trolls or dwarves.

-------------------

Seriously I will stop harrasing you all (sorry) and accept it for what it is. But I still don't believe that shadowblades were meant to be what they have become. Never will anyone with a great axe be stealthy.

 

[old.Caliria]

Thanks Sarnat... I will try to stick to my original plan...

Glad to have some comfort

 

[Gekul]

Midgard is the fighter realm, so the weps are bigger

Do what you want, I'm sure there are viable alternatives to the 2handed user (maybe Stabba could help you with the info on this, I remember him posting a lot on the old forums about SBs )

With my SB I use a 5.5 delay 2h axe, but then I haven't got above 20 with that one

 

[Aeiedil]

*what i wouldnt do to have a speed 5.5 100% qua high-dps speccable weapon*

 

[old.stabba]

aiediel (sorry for spelling it wrong)

well this might be a double post in that case ignore it (my mouse define driver bugs).

first off i never said that he whould be a total gimp, i said he whouldnt be on par with the other SB:s, and i stick to that.

the reason for this being that you dont want to use any of the advantages we have (except only being able to use slash, dunno if you can call that an advantage or not and other passive ones )
first off ill do some 1h vs 2h, as a 2h user you will recieve a "hidden" 15-20% bonus (this is cause it doesnt show up, but it will in later patches). you will also take advantage of the game engine (assuming a 1h and 2h whould be exactly equal in all stats and there was no bonus) due to the fact that you get the first swing "for free" and this free swing will do more damage with a 2h than a 1h, thus leaving the 1h behind right from the start, however if you whould go towards eternity they whould be equal. in reality if you kill in 2-3 swings a 2h will be the better chice, always. however the disadvantage come if the opponent isnt hit by your attack, this however does not hold true if you assume an eternal fight, tbh it isnt true for a 2-3 swing fighter either, as chances for this to happen will be the same. the drawback of using a 2h all the way is that you may overkill (you will) dealing out more damage than what is required (if he has 10 hp and you take 5 sec to hit him 1 whould give the same result in less time) so the best thing to do whould be to use a 2h as an opener and then switch to a 1h -i know someone pointed that out. this is just the 2h over 1h arguement, and to a SB that can deal a shitload of damage in the FIRST hit a 2h whould be the choice (assuming its pure dmgs vs hp fight) however a faster weapon will allow you to follow up with your creeping death faster, and this of course is an advantage. so there is more to it than just dealing out a shitload of damage fast .

the second thing whould be to use a LA, i do hope everyone agree with me that a LA specced SB can outdamage any 1h sword user (let alone dagger). the suggested reason for making up for this whould be poison, altho a LA user will apply to poisons (at the cost of specc points i agree) and still be able to get there poison high if the put down CS and you whould need to get CS so a LA wielder with poison will outdamage you aswell, hence you will not be on par with this class. still damage isnt everything you will get your stun, so you wont be a total gimp.

so to conclude: you will never deal as much damage as those who chose to use their natural benefits (i doubt you will come close) and perfing with a dagger isnt a good idea, however if you could go asfar as a long sword (AD&D max bs weapon) id say you are viable. not good but not a total gimp .

aeiedil: "*what i wouldnt do to have a speed 5.5 100% qua high-dps speccable weapon* " i whould too

 

[old.stabba]

Sarnat:

PA will not only go threw BT, it will take it down aswell.

 

[old.HiredGoon]

The reason why 2h on assassins is possible, is because midgard is bugged.

2hander should be specced as we all do in hib and alb



Personally, i dont give much for 2h . If i dont 1 or 2-shot my enemy, im dead. simple. with a 2h, i would only get the 1st shot.


what i would _really_ like, was some kind of indicator, that this certain target has BT

 

[Aeiedil]

Re: aiediel (sorry for spelling it wrong)

HiredGoon, did i hear you calling me a gimp

My BS is getting better, if i ever find a crafter for a diamond guarded rapier then it will get better still As it is though i will win in straight-out melee against a SB because they usually miss the odd hit which has a huge effect. one SB shot is about 3 of mine normally

when the pvp server comes though i will probably be a kobbie\norse SB because of the 2-h 1-shots, the reason i wasnt one was that i really dont like midgard, but on the pvp server i can move out to hibbie

just cause i pa for a lil less dont make me a gimp just means i make it up in other places (and i cant use a blade really cause im pierce specced, when respec comes ill try blades though, and itll be a bastard sword ill use, slowest one)

 

[old.chesnor]

Well, there are many ways to spec a shadowblade. I am specced in LA, Axe and envenom. I am not speccing CS at all. I carry a 2h axe (only for applying a snare poison if I need to escape). This template is commonly called a shadowzerker. Critblades ( specced in weap + CS ) generally will do more dmg on critstrike with a v.slow 2h sword or axe. This is because the dmg dealt is calculated on the opening hit is derived from the weap speed. The slower the weap, the more dmg will be done. Neither spec is 'better' than the rest. I personally didnt like my critblade for PvE, and I'm not obssesed with 1-hit kills.

I personally think the only way to gimp an assasin is to spec half-heartedly into envenom and CS. I really feel that you should pick 1 line and spec solely into that.

And as for middy having to spec into 2h weaps....pah!!! We are the melee realm, and to my knowledge every fighter class can inherently wield 2h weaps. This is our realm skill, if you like. Albs get those deadly polearms, Hibs get those frightening spears. We get to wield 2h weaps without speccing......it all evens out.

 

[Olgark]

I have just started a shadowblade Norseman now at level 7.
I have a steel dagger with a shield and a two handed sword.

I must say in PvE the dagger sheild combo is hard to beat. But for first strike capabilities the two hander will out strip the dagger in damage.

I am going to make turn it into a crit blade for the one hit kills, like you a axe weilding rogue does not seem right in my eyes, so this sword combo is the one I am looking at getting. Not sure what it will be like at higher levels but then I do not like to follow the pack on spec lines, and will try a few things along the way that may seem to gimp him. But I figure what the hell. I got my main and second main going the way I want them, going to have fun with this one.

Good luck in what ever you choose to do.

 

[old.Caliria]

Ah, but advice from a true Keeper of Bifrost. This is advice one should listen to. What are you doing in these forums Olgark, back to Himinbjorg with ye and do some good...

/Caliria
- Friend and Alternative Char of Butcha

 

[Olgark]

Originally posted by Caliria
What are you doing in these forums Olgark, back to Himinbjorg with ye and do some good...

/Caliria
- Friend and Alternative Char of Butcha

SShhhhh I am trying to fool the Albs into thinking I am working for them . You know get their trust then one night say in a few years creep into the place where they sleep to cut off their fingers . THEN SHOVE 'EM DOWN THEIR THROATS.