Shadowblade 1.66 TL report feedback

Archeon

Fledgling Freddie
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Dec 29, 2003
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Agreed, some interesting prospects for SBs in there. Especially the bit about CS skills and swing speed - Mourning Rage fortehwinz0rinthid ;)

One thing i don't get though...

Weaponskill - The paradigm of a dex based class still being force to used str based weapons while our counterparts do not still remains an issue.

Start a TL thread on this and let's get some weapon skill tests done to identify what, if any, discrepancy exists.
Maybe a read it incorrectly, or i don't fully understand - but from my point of view its as simple as this...

Problem:
Infs = Dex Based Weapons
NS = Dex Based Weapons
SB = no Dex Based Weapons
Solution:
SB = Dex Based Weapons


Or have i read it incorrectly?
 

stubbyrulz

Fledgling Freddie
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Dec 23, 2003
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you read it correctly just that mythic seems to be a little bit slow to catch onto these things
 

solidus

Fledgling Freddie
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Dec 23, 2003
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Some nice stuff in there for sb's. Although with ToA, frontiers, and the ra review i guess its gonna be a while before they start to do anything :rolleyes:
 

Jox

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If they would try to fix sbs by adding a dex-based line I would throw Jox in the garbage can(I took norse and added +15 to strength just to maximize my damage output with the only option I had; slash).

My view on that solution for sbs; :puke:
 

Runolas

Fledgling Freddie
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Jan 16, 2004
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I think the TL report looks fine, at least there is light at the end of the tunnel. Making 2H more viable would be real nice. Other than that it is perfectly clear that they want to slim the numbers of Assassins in RvR, with reagards to ToA, thats ok with me.
 

Mabs

J Peasemould Gruntfuttock
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Archeon said:
Problem:
THRUST Infs = Dex Based Weapons :twak:
NS = Dex Based Weapons
SB = no Dex Based Weapons
Solution:
SB = Dex Based Weapons


Or have i read it incorrectly?
SLASH Infs = Str based weapons :p
 

Archeon

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Mabs said:
SLASH Infs = Str based weapons :p
I was using it in terms of who had access to what type of weapon, as such SBs don't have access to a weapon type who's damage/weaponskill is based on dexterity.

Besides, everyone knows all Infs are evil FoTM thrust weildling pig-dogs! Even the one i saw the other day with a big stick and a baked bean tin attached to his head. He was totally FoTM thrust ;)
 

Whisperess

Part of the furniture
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Archeon said:
Problem:
Infs = Dex Based Weapons
NS = Dex Based Weapons
SB = no Dex Based Weapons
Solution:
SB = Dex Based Weapons
That's no solution for reasons that Jox stated for instance, and the fact that it doesn't fit with Norse mythology at all.

Apart from infils/ns's gaining WS with primary and tertiary stat, while SB's gain it with only tertiary; they can debuff our WS with poisons with 100% effeciency. ( str-debuff or str/con debuff - or both :( ) while SB's in return can only debuff their opponent with 50% effeciency apart from the rare occassion when the blue moon is aligned with jupiter and venus turns black and we face a slash infil/ns. ( so no smart-ass comment that ).

I won't even mention the fact that our clothes are slash-vulnerable which our opponent can spec to get a bonus against if they want - while our opponents are neutral/resistant to both our slash and our slash, not to mention our slash, choice of weaponry.

Fix 2h weapons into being a viable option for critblades and that should probably be a good start. SB's are after all quite decent as it is, but they're not really on-par.
 

Loxleyhood

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Anything that would make various vaktens attack me with 2h weapons would be splendid. :m00:
 

Herjulf

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I would LOVE to see some serious attention given to 2-H use.

The gift of the ability to use 2-H weapon is supposed to be an advantage and not the opposite.

Ofc it must have some disadvantages, everything must.

But it must have superior damage wise advantages to any1 who dual wields.
If not something is wrong imo.

There must be some reason, dual wielding gives so many more advantages vs 2-H like dual poisons, less chance of evade/(block?)

Thus 2-H should make a helluvalot more CS damage then it does.

But as it is at my 2-H weapon PA damage can be matched by Inf/NS 1-H, if not in all cases matched but never more then 50-80 dmg away.

I am currently working on a somewhat extensive logging of PA damage.

And Hamstring + leaper combo damage between the 1-H DW/LA vs 2-H.

PA dmg diffenrence is low in comparison but Hamstring dmg varies more.
I suspect we have found a bug there.
 

Negura

Fledgling Freddie
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Jan 23, 2004
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I see it as a positive report, as they finally understood that the sb class has issues.

But from here until a proper fix, there is a long way to go.
 

Jox

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Herjulf said:
I would LOVE to see some serious attention given to 2-H use.

The gift of the ability to use 2-H weapon is supposed to be an advantage and not the opposite.

Ofc it must have some disadvantages, everything must.

But it must have superior damage wise advantages to any1 who dual wields.
If not something is wrong imo.

There must be some reason, dual wielding gives so many more advantages vs 2-H like dual poisons, less chance of evade/(block?)

Thus 2-H should make a helluvalot more CS damage then it does.

But as it is at my 2-H weapon PA damage can be matched by Inf/NS 1-H, if not in all cases matched but never more then 50-80 dmg away.

I am currently working on a somewhat extensive logging of PA damage.

And Hamstring + leaper combo damage between the 1-H DW/LA vs 2-H.

PA dmg diffenrence is low in comparison but Hamstring dmg varies more.
I suspect we have found a bug there.
Its just silly to try to make 2-hander viable, it wont work. There are way to many backdrafts;

The evade bug.

The sc-utility.

Only one poison.

5-years to cd.

Even if they boosted the damage with 50% it wouldnt be worth it. I remember when I dueled Ztyx a couple of times as cb. Sometimes I went down without scoring a single hit, lol.

I think they should focus on the damage disparity we sbs feel these days instead of bable about some 2-hander-fluff.

And there is no bug regarding pa/hamstring. PA aint a ordinary style, the damage is fixed. The only thing that makes pa differ is;

cs, weaponsskill, strength, weaponspeed, Lvl against the victims armor/af, resistance bla bla bla whatever.

Hamstring is a ordinary style with a build in random factor.
 

Mabs

J Peasemould Gruntfuttock
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Using slow 2h weapons against high defence - shield spec, evade 7 - is suicide, always has been , till they fix that basic problem.

with 1h and slow 2, identical weap skill, the 2h is always blocked, parried and evaded more, but also procs more often.. doesnt help when u die but you you get nice graphics :touch:
 

emma

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Jox said:
If they would try to fix sbs by adding a dex-based line I would throw Jox in the garbage can(I took norse and added +15 to strength just to maximize my damage output with the only option I had; slash).

My view on that solution for sbs; :puke:
That would put you at an advantage over norse Blades who only did +10 to str ;p

For me (+10 str/con/dex) at start dex based weapons would have zero effect on my weaponskill apart from when debuffed, but for you, your weaponskill would get a very slight boost (talking 1-2%).

Sure your dex will be lower but with the evade cap in-place even a Troll with dex as a primary stat would cap evade. That and the fact it seems Qui has a greater effect on evades rates than Dex means pretty much every single SB will have 250 Qui meaning there already capped.
 

Herjulf

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Jox said:
Its just silly to try to make 2-hander viable, it wont work. There are way to many backdrafts;

The evade bug.

The sc-utility.

Only one poison.

5-years to cd.

Even if they boosted the damage with 50% it wouldnt be worth it. I remember when I dueled Ztyx a couple of times as cb. Sometimes I went down without scoring a single hit, lol.

I think they should focus on the damage disparity we sbs feel these days instead of bable about some 2-hander-fluff.

And there is no bug regarding pa/hamstring. PA aint a ordinary style, the damage is fixed. The only thing that makes pa differ is;

cs, weaponsskill, strength, weaponspeed, Lvl against the victims armor/af, resistance bla bla bla whatever.

Hamstring is a ordinary style with a build in random factor.
i dissagree babbling about 2-h is a must, there just have to be some alternative to shadowzerk, that can compete.
 

Whisperess

Part of the furniture
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Herjulf said:
there just have to be some alternative to shadowzerk, that can compete.
I never liked SZ, found it rather sucky tbh. Did much better as CB and even better with my current spec; so please don't make it sound like SZ is the only viable option.
 

Runolas

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Messages
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Whisperess said:
I never liked SZ, found it rather sucky tbh. Did much better as CB and even better with my current spec; so please don't make it sound like SZ is the only viable option.
Imho - SZ are only good vs other assasins, but lack the ability to take down casters fast enough (that is if you solo). CB really lack in-combat-stun in case CD does not land. I've been both SZ/CB, but after lowering EN to 24 I ended up with a template that is by far the best I've ever had. At least for me fixing 2H would be a nice utility. Either land PA on cloth caster for 1-shot or 2-shot with a quick switch to 2H on CD. In addition when figthing Tanks it is often better to only do a 2H PA, skip CD, switch to duelwield mode and still have FG for a stun b4 they IP etc.
 

Skeggi

Fledgling Freddie
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Yay! Fixed 2H will be nice, atm I'm running around with a shield cuz of the imbue points =)
 

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