See Hidden Nerf

[svartalf]

Here's initial testing tread;

http://vnboards.ign.com/message.asp?topic=49696951&replies=51

I'm still collecting data but by extrapolation at this point, an archer with 50 effective stealth would be detected around 800 units when non-camo'd. When you start comparing the range to what you would detect them at anyway, see hidden starts to look really poor vs a decent stealth target.

-Bog
-----signature-----

DAOC Shadowblade Teamlead

 

[Aoln]

and another 1 ....a better 1
http://vnboards.ign.com/message.asp?topic=49752945&replies=20

 

[Meatballs]

I wonder if camoflage will be kept in or if most will respec out of it anyway if they have a decent stealth level.

 

[Cybwyn]

Originally posted by Meatballs
I wonder if camoflage will be kept in or if most will respec out of it anyway if they have a decent stealth level.

Camo is still there as long as SH is I hope. You don't have to spec stealth to get camo, archers get it automatically at level 30, irrespective of their stealth spec.

Reading those threads though, was amusing to see demands for Truesight to get nerfed the same way though. Hmmmm... a passive RA that costs 8 points versus an active RA useable every 30 minutes that costs 10 points.... know which one I'd rather have.

 

[old.Cher]

depends on what the passive and 30 min timer effects are.

for example a skill that lets u see 3 classes when stealthed and won't even do that so much anymore, and doesn't show u the assassin zerg with them is kinda crappy,

a active 30 min skill that lets u see every stealther regardless of stealth skill or class is kinda good,

see hidden used to get me into more trouble then it helped, due to all the assassin back up the archer classes normally have.

truesight seems much nicer tbh

 

[Cybwyn]

Agreed, TS is a very nice RA when it's active but the 29 minute wait between uses is a killer.

2 viable solutions would be to remove SH, TS and Camo altogether or to remove SH and Camo and open up TS to assassins but with a lower cost or longer duration (say 2 minutes) due to the fact that they don't have the same range as archers.

 

[old.Cher]

i'd love it to dump camo truesight and see hidden, they are all pretty crappy tbh, but can't see mythic doing it

 

[Scunner]

Aye i agree remove them it kinda sucks. But tbh id rather have SH that TS. TS only works every 30 mins for 1 minute and say u nail one stealther uve then lost camo for ages so ur as good as dead anyway.

SH ruins the archer classes but instead of fixing it they introduce TS which upsets even more people. Probably be best to remove both TBH and base it on stealth level.


Thats just my own opinion though im not a games developer.

 

[Falcon]

SH got 0wned!

I especially laughed at this bit:

- Once an archer/minstrel is uncovered with See Hidden, they remain visible in shadow form until they clear the clipping plane of the assassin that uncovered her. According to one dev I mentioned this to, this is by design. If you unstealth and restealth, you are not visible in shadow form if you are outside their detection radius.

Decyphered for those that don't understand the language of Mythic, that means:

"Well our work experience kid who we use to code the stealth systems couldn't figure out how to make them depop when they go out of range, so we just left it in, claimed it as a feature and gave him a bar of chocolate. However if you still feel you want to depop when you get out of range you can do it manually by pressing your stealth key, waiting 2secs and pressing it again."

 

[midmaster]

Mythic loves mincers. Mythic loves albion. Mythic tolerates the existence of hibs. Mythic hates the name and characters in Midgard.

 

[the_smurflord]

Originally posted by midmaster
Mythic loves mincers. Mythic loves albion. Mythic tolerates the existence of hibs. Mythic hates the name and characters in Midgard.

Funny how every single realm rants that they are the worst off compared to all the other realms and that Mythic hates them. Grow up.

 

[Cybwyn]

Originally posted by midmaster
Mythic loves mincers. Mythic loves albion. Mythic tolerates the existence of hibs. Mythic hates the name and characters in Midgard.

Don't really see what you're getting at here. This gives Scouts, Rangers and Hunters (a Midgard class, last time I looked) something to be reasonably happy about. At the same time it's nerfing the See Hidden ability of Shadowblades, Nightshades and yes, Infiltrators (unless I misread and the changes don't apply to Albion and Hib).

 

[Meatballs]

Originally posted by Falcon
"Well our work experience kid who we use to code the stealth systems couldn't figure out how to make them depop when they go out of range, so we just left it in, claimed it as a feature and gave him a bar of chocolate. However if you still feel you want to depop when you get out of range you can do it manually by pressing your stealth key, waiting 2secs and pressing it again."

You generally wont know if you've been spotted or not though.

 

[Falcon]

Aye, depends on the situation. If the assassin unstealths to catch you up yet is a fair distance away you could get away with it. After I'd crossed a risky area solo, like an MG, I'd probably do it to be on the safe side. See hidden was one of the factors that made everyone want to role an assassin originally, the nerf to it hopefully means some of the unskilled newbies who just jumped on the bandwagon for easy kills will quit crying that they have to put a bit more effort into finding opponents. At very least it should cull the number of assassins with See hidden, much like See Hidden culled the archer population so many months ago.

 

[midmaster]

Talking generally about upcoming nerfs, and that the so called 'features' rarely lands in our realm.

 

[Aoln]

Originally posted by Cybwyn
Don't really see what you're getting at here. This gives Scouts, Rangers and Hunters (a Midgard class, last time I looked) something to be reasonably happy about. At the same time it's nerfing the See Hidden ability of Shadowblades, Nightshades and yes, Infiltrators (unless I misread and the changes don't apply to Albion and Hib).

well most of midgard are SBs

 

[Sarnat]

Originally posted by the_smurflord
Funny how every single realm rants that they are the worst off compared to all the other realms and that Mythic hates them. Grow up.

OMFG stop posting smart comments. Add some whine please. This doesn't feel like a DAoC board at all without whine!

 

[pudzy]

I persoanlly dont like RA's that intefer with the gameplay I think they should be removed SH/TS/IP/GP/PURGE/SOS/BOD/BAOD. I just think they interfer with the game too much and make it basically MORE unrealistic than the game itself.

 

[Dorin]

Originally posted by Sarnat
OMFG stop posting smart comments. Add some whine please. This doesn't feel like a DAoC board at all without whine!

some whine for you buffyboy

 

[Zappy]

I cant belive im hearing this...
Why does those abileties interfeer with gameplay? It adds to the gameplay TBH! What do you do when you get mezzed? You cant do SHIT if you dont have purge.

And what can all kind of meele classes do vs. eg. Asassins when they get in PA? not much, but when they have IP they have a chance to survive.

Dont you think people with high RR should be more powerful then lower?

 

[samildanachh]

destroy camo,see hidden and true sight

 

[<Wels>]

I don't get it why mythic added See Hidden, True Sight in the first place, instead of removing it they try to fix it with camo, nerfs to see hidden etc, wtf is that about? Assasins already have detect hidden, thats enough imo

 

[Cush]

Was hard enough to avoid the infs before the see hidden patch. After it was impossible and made me shelf my hunter.

 

[Arwen]

I havn't had much experience of this but when i read about it it seemed quite nice really for the person who has it

Please can someone tell me how far you can go to someone, with effective 50 stealth, without being seen, providing you don't have this?

 

[Arwen]

Also, if someone sees you does stealth automatically break, like if a mob sees you? And what if their pet hits you and noone else can see you, what about then?

 

[Falcon]

Stealth wont break they just see you in shade form. Pet will uncover you if it hits you.

Was hard enough to avoid the infs before the see hidden patch. After it was impossible and made me shelf my hunter.

Yep, and I became Prydwens first Elf blademaster because of it.