Religion fucks over the innocent once again!

[tierk]

EXACTLY!! an people think other countries are fucked up for standing by THIER laws an THEIR culture? lol...i cant help but laugh.
If you go to another country you gotta expect it to be different and respect an abide by their laws and ways no matter what...law of the land!
pisses me off so much the way you get muslims come over to the UK (i dont have anything against them for their beliefs btw) an they can build mosque's....reckon ya could go to pakistan or any islamic country an build a church? fuckin double standards.

Its really wierd this but when i first arrived in England in 1975 you know i had to put up with being spat on being called everything under the sun by people with shaved heads and DM's and guess what? I have never experienced this in any other country in the world and i have seen a decent amount of countries in the world.

 

[tierk]

If you go to Sudan and call a Teddy Bear Mohammed you get put in jail

If you're an Islamic extremist, you can come here, get housed, get £2000 a week in benefits, and you get to blow people up. Welcome to Britain.

The second part of that statement is true and the reason for it was a political decsion taken at the highest levels by the British government so that they could try and use these terrorists and keep a eye on them in the hope that they could be of use to the government.

I personal cannot understand how any country would like to play host to convicted terrorists, abu hamza is a classic example, how on gods earth did this muppet get to stay here in England when it was so clear what he did for a living prior coming to get asylum in the UK?

 

[Gorbachioo]

EXACTLY!! an people think other countries are fucked up for standing by THIER laws an THEIR culture? lol...i cant help but laugh.
If you go to another country you gotta expect it to be different and respect an abide by their laws and ways no matter what...law of the land!
pisses me off so much the way you get muslims come over to the UK (i dont have anything against them for their beliefs btw) an they can build mosque's....reckon ya could go to pakistan or any islamic country an build a church? fuckin double standards.

So if someone in the world does something wrong it gives us the right to do that aswell? Not doing that gives us the right to call ourselves more civilised.

What kind of people would we be if we made life harder for innocent people because we dont agree with their goverments?



But yes, i do agree that the PC shit has gone too far in the west. Canceling christmas celebrations because some muslims might get offended and all that is just wrong. These days you cant say anything negative about muslims or something that they have done without being labelled as a racist.

 

[Laddey]

She got 15 days, she's already served 5 of them.

They said its lucky for calling a teddy bear Muhammed (w/e you spell it)

Bollocks to that, and bollocks to religion.

Everybody will see if their god is true when they die, and so will we.

 

[Lollie]

But yes, i do agree that the PC shit has gone too far in the west. Canceling christmas celebrations because some muslims might get offended and all that is just wrong. These days you cant say anything negative about muslims or something that they have done without being labelled as a racist.

Thing is i have yet to meet a muslim that doesnt like christmas, the town where i live has a heavy muslim population but they seem to enjoy christmas, brings in more money for them.

 

[Gorbachioo]

Thing is i have yet to meet a muslim that doesnt like christmas, the town where i live has a heavy muslim population but they seem to enjoy christmas, brings in more money for them.

I did use the word "some".

 

[Raven]

Most of the muslims i know celebrate Christmas the same way i do, get your family and friends round and have a good time, its not really a religious festival anymore.
Not that it is a real Christian event anyway Its pagan

 

[Dukat]

BBC NEWS | World | Africa | Shoot UK teacher, says protesters

FH NEWS | World | UK | Nuke the fucking Sudan, says Dukat

 

[Rubric]

Bastards.

 

[Cemeterygates]

seems some people have misunderstood my point. fair play to people/counties standin for their views an laws......dont matter who ya are or where ya from...you abide by those rules. why should havin a british passport make you exempt (sp?) from laws....or why should cos your "johnny foreigner" not have to obey the laws...see shit in the press like "africcan rapes and murders in UK...but cant be deported cos it violates his human rights..he might get killed if he goes home" any reason there?? like...he's a bad fucker? but yea..the human rights of the victim dont mean shit.....its a joke.imo he gave up his rights by taking the life of another person in cold blood.
alright...maybe i aint right with everything...i can get things wrong...i just express my take on things...

 

[Cemeterygates]

So if someone in the world does something wrong it gives us the right to do that aswell? Not doing that gives us the right to call ourselves more civilised.

What kind of people would we be if we made life harder for innocent people because we dont agree with their goverments?



But yes, i do agree that the PC shit has gone too far in the west. Canceling christmas celebrations because some muslims might get offended and all that is just wrong. These days you cant say anything negative about muslims or something that they have done without being labelled as a racist.[/QUOT

you kinda have the wrong idea of what i'm sayin...should i be allowed to come to your country (finland?) an live by UK law? or should i live by finnish laws?....what ya reckon?

 

[Dukat]

you kinda have the wrong idea of what i'm sayin...should i be allowed to come to your country (finland?) an live by UK law? or should i live by finnish laws?....what ya reckon?

Your arguing that laws are laws, when in rome do as the romans do, etc. I get that.

However, the laws are blurred fairly when religion comes into play, as we have seen in the UK with people wanting to wear full body robes and other bloody stupid things to work.

This is the case of an English teacher going to Sudan to teach thier children. During the course of doing this the teacher broke a law unintentionally due to a misunderstanding on religious grounds. It wasnt maliciously done, it was done during the course of her job as a teacher of Sudanese children, a mistake.

Now if Sudan decided to execute the teacher for this, I would expect the foriegn office to intervene in the situation. Not because "havin a british passport make(s) you exempt (sp?) from law". More because having a british passport makes you a british subject and under the protection of Her Majesty's Government and the Crown itself. Just as the arabs would and have used diplomatic channels to stop "discrimination" of thier own "citizens" within our own country.

If the government cannot protect British subjects overseas then it would be a pretty sorry state of affairs, there was a time when the harassment of a British subject overseas would result in a British warship arriving in short order to ensure matters were settled swiftly. Now we merely 'express concern' and even this is considered too much.

 

[Jeremiah]

IMO the right action to do is the Sudan government to recognize she made an innocent mistake AND she is from a culture that has a more relaxed view towards any blasphemy.

But equally, some sort of apology be given because we all know (THE WORLD KNOWS) she didnt mean to offend. That way, we are all friends, no "beliefs" are infriged.

We should not seek to change their laws any more than they want to change ours. But equally, they should recognize that she meant no disrespect. Let her come home and start anew =)

 

[kiliarien]

When you posted she was under investigation so stop twisting my words, she wasnt charged till a day after (post 41)

Nope. She was already charged before the post I made (#42). Check the date. It would be nice to see this 'storm in a teacup' as the Sudanese Ambassador put it make the Sudanese judiciary (if only a little) reflect on the moderation of the interpretation of an article of law. The embassy spokesman said it would be dealt with as a 'minute complaint' - I'm sorry but 15 days in jail is not f*cking minute to me. Especially when she will have on her offical records that she is 'insulting religion and inciting hatred.'

People have said in this thread "well, she lived there, she should know this stuff". She'd been there less than 4 months. Maybe she didn't - ignorance is no defence but it is a mediatory factor.

If this law is religion-based then the fundamentals of the problem must be cultural, after all, many British Muslims have condemned the Sudanese govts actions - hence the cultural differences on how the Islamic faith is viewed seems the issue.

And let's not forget (taken from Bloomberg):

A report published in June by the International Commission of Jurists identified "gross human rights violations and breaches of international humanitarian law'' in Sudan.

Nice

 

[Dukat]

Front of the sun made me laugh today.

Machete's, burning newspapers it was a proper islamic riot all right!

Bloody stupid country, bloody stupid people, bloody stupid religion.

Oh, and before you reach for the quote button a massive fit of iRage, I dont care if people think its "not ok" to call an entire country, population and religion stupid.

I was sick and tired of this kind of bollocks last year, its just getting silly now. The UK is a civilised developed nation and we give god only knows how many millions to these troglodytes in aid and support, and they respond by jailing one of our people for frankly fucking ridiculous reasons. I have to wonder why we allow this to pass.

 

[Platin]

way to over simplify a religion, eejit
having the name written down in itself is highly offensive, so, yeah calling a bear after him is kinda bad. It may be a shit way to carry on, but its how they live, so dont denigrate them cos of that

oh, and if she was living out there teaching, how can she be that stupid as to think she would get away with it ?

As long as those depraved values don't spread to Europe...oh wait, they already have. Yet another reason to put barbed wire around the borders of Europe.

 

[Mey]

Also the people saying about the naming of children, there are numerous spellings that sound the same, Muhammed and Mohammed, the later being the one used for naming.

 

[Dukat]

Also the people saying about the naming of children, there are numerous spellings that sound the same, Muhammed and Mohammed, the later being the one used for naming.

And the difference of one vowel is the reason the teacher is being put in prison? riiiight.

 

[Mey]

Yep. If u can't follow the rules/laws of that country leave, i'd say the same to anyone who didn't respect the laws of the UK.

 

[Dukat]

Yep. If u can't follow the rules/laws of that country leave, i'd say the same to anyone who didn't respect the laws of the UK.

Only they dont leave do they?

And as far as I am aware, the teacher was following the laws as best she could, it was a completely unintentional misunderstanding that started this, and according to experts in the UK; "intent is a key factor in determining if someone has violated Islamic rules against insulting the prophet" (source).

So basically she hardly really broke the law at all, its just more islamic "mob rule" bollocks. Getting overly offended over something that doesnt really matter at all. Acting like they're persecuted and hard done by. Ya right!

 

[Mey]

Actually if you want to question why they have done this (not that i really care) it is more of a chance for them to give the west the middle finger, hence why if they are going to let her free it'll be more likely they give them to those muslim peers that have gone over from the UK rather than the UK govt. as a whole.

 

[Dukat]

Actually if you want to question why they have done this (not that i really care) it is more of a chance for them to give the west the middle finger, hence why if they are going to let her free it'll be more likely they give them to those muslim peers that have gone over from the UK rather than the UK govt. as a whole.

Not sure I understand what you're trying to say there... Letting the teacher get off without the full sentence will mean that Muslims in the UK will get away with more as well? Is that it?

First, they already get away with quite a bit when it comes to minor things. Second, I really dont think that any muslim government is capable of putting pressure on the UK government enough to make us release someone for a serious crime. Bloody good job too!

Do you honestly believe getting "Mohammed" and "Muhammed" mixed up is worth going to prison? Do you really think they're justified to have such a law? (Not that I'm implying you actually care or anything)

 

[Wonk]

these topics can be discussed for years.

Ronaldinho > Muhammed.

 

[Mey]

What i mean is, it was a chance for the east to give the west the middle finger.

However it is a very bad political move to actually imprison her (will cause tension between an already fragile relationship), there is two Muslim MP's that have gone over to negotiate for the return of the teacher (they have gone of their own accord - apparently). If they do decide to return the teacher (very likely) they will be more willing to give her over to the Muslim MP's rather than the UK govt. as a whole (it will look better for them, more kind of they are being merciful at the request of UK Muslims).

No I don't think it's right to imprision someone over using a name, but, they are the laws/social values of that country and therefore need to be respected, both by ourselves and the people that chose to live in that country.

 

[tierk]

.....First, they already get away with quite a bit when it comes to minor things.....

With the greatest respect mate but you really do go on and on and on. What is it exactly that Muslims get away with in England? I have spent thirty two years in England and trying to fit into society as much as possible. Now every time i have been on the receiving end of racial abuse, be it from a policeman down to the mindless skin heads we had to put up with for years and years (as it was the cool thing to be at one time) i have put it down to the fact that there are always small minded morons out there that will do, say whatever they feel like because they have limited education /upbringing.
You have over a series of threads on these forums just gone on and one about how crap Muslims are in your opinion and how foriegners are runing your country. Give us all a rest.

.....Second, I really dont think that any muslim government is capable of putting pressure on the UK government enough to make us release someone for a serious crime. Bloody good job too!........

So why on earth should anyone listen to the UK when British subjects are in jail facing serious crimes and the government of the day is trying to get them released?

.....Do you honestly believe getting "Mohammed" and "Muhammed" mixed up is worth going to prison? Do you really think they're justified to have such a law? (Not that I'm implying you actually care or anything.........

I cannot speak for the rights and wrongs of laws in other countries then the ones i live in and as a foriegner i cannot change these laws regardless of what i think about them. For example in the UK if you get caught with a bag of weed it is considered a minor offence if anything at all and you will walk away with a slap on your wrist. Hence the reason i used to smoke weed like a chimney when i lived in London.

However, in Qatar, if you get caught with the tinest bit of any drugs (weeed coke etc) you will spend a loooong time behind bars and be deported if you make it out of jail, hence why i dont smoke weed or think about taking pills and /or any other drugs.

If you going to live in another country, esp a country that you know full well before you move out there has issues with a lot of things then i figure it would be in your best interests to find out exactly what you can and cannot do, what is considered legal and illegal before you go there.

You might think the laws suck, you might think that it is ok to call a teddy bear Mohammad, hell you might think it is ok to bumfuck you boyfriend in a park in front of twenty people with their families but insome countries this is not considered ok and you must abide by the laws of the land you live in. Ignorance of the law is no defense against the law.

 

[Dukat]

You have over a series of threads on these forums just gone on and one about how crap Muslims are in your opinion and how foriegners are runing your country. Give us all a rest.

Sorry 'mate' but this isnt the Sudan - theres a thing called free speech we're allowed over here. A series of threads? gone on and on? I could say the same for you and your drum banging about how islam isnt so bad.

uke:

I thought we'd gone over all of this in the 300 thread. gee what great fun that was, lets not go over through that fucking travesty again shall we?

Give us all a rest? From what I see it seems to be a very vocal minority who have a problem with what I say and no one else. I've been repped for a couple of my posts in this thread and in the 300 thread, so I dont see why I shouldnt voice my opinion when there are other people who agree.

As usual I've already answered what you've said in previous posts in this thread. If you cannot be bothered to read what I've said and instead want to pick everything apart and be as pedantic and obstinate as possible, then I cant stop you, but I'm not going to join in another slag fest that is no use to man nor beast.

I disagree with you, but that is something that isnt likely to change, is that really so hard to grasp that you have to follow me around on this forum and start this over and over again?

 

[Mey]

Give us all a rest?

Please don't use a plural when referring to yourself. Freedom of speech does not mean freedom from responsibility.

 

[tierk]

.......I've been repped for a couple of my posts in this thread and in the 300 thread, so I dont see why I shouldnt voice my opinion when there are other people who agree......

So what you got repped, so did i, on this thread and the 300 one, but what does that prove?? Who the fuck is talking about 300 anyway?

.......As usual I've already answered what you've said in previous posts in this thread........

You havent answered fuck all. Please tell me what it is that mean by comments like ....

....they already get away with quite a bit when it comes to minor things............

Minor things like what exactly?

.......If you cannot be bothered to read what I've said and instead want to pick everything apart......

Sorry but i know this will seem pedantic i would have to have read everything you say to pick it apart bit by bit. Also believe it or not i read everything everyone posts with great interest as it is a great way to find out what others think.

.......I disagree with you...........

Aye we do disagree about a lot but as i said on other threads i think you are full of shit.

.......that you have to follow me around on this forum and start this over and over again?

Trust me i dont follow you around on here and trust me i dont comment on a lot of the crap that you spout on these forums but i have repped a few people that have pointed out your bullshit factor5 posts on here as i couldnt be arsed to get into another flame war with a half wit like you.

 

[Tasslehoff]

Give us all a rest? From what I see it seems to be a very vocal minority who have a problem with what I say and no one else. I've been repped for a couple of my posts in this thread and in the 300 thread, so I dont see why I shouldnt voice my opinion when there are other people who agree.

Why don't you fuck off and gives us a rest?
You spout so much shit it's fucking incredible, that a lot of people disagree with you doesn't mean they can be arsed to write just to say they disagree.

 

[caleiach]

Hi there, i'm a fucking moron with idiot brains.