Realm Architecture and NPC flesh-out issue..

[svartalf]

I posted this on VNBOARDS, but here it is for you also...

I have been playing in EU since it started on Midgard.. I never played a different server to my own, and really enjoyed the beautiful scenery around Midgard, wonderful sunsets, snow, etc.

I found that my realm was being outnumbered by Albions in RVR very frequently.. and while my realm could muster just enough people to defend our realm's borders, Albion had enough to attack both the Hibernian and Midgard frontiers quite effectively. This was about the time I got mad one day and went to make an Albion character on another server.

How stunned (mezzed, debuffed,) and heartbroken I was to find that Albion was amazing. Awesome, beautiful towering monoliths and spires stretch into the sky, I had never seen anything like this. No wonder so many people play the Albion realm.. now you might be rubbishing me and saying that it isn't a factor, but remember what people say about first impressions (e.g. job interview 1st impression made in 30seconds).

How very denied I feel. Now.. I can't speak for Hibernia, but Midgard's capital is dwarfed by Camelot.. and I know Camelot is supposed to be the capital of all 3 realms, but how about there being a patch where ancient dwarven carved caverns are discovered underneath jordheim (a chance to make some beautiful halls) or something to even up the realms in this respect.. this way Midgard could have a capital of equivalent proportions to Camelot, but without having to say it is as important.

I know Mythic is spending all it's time balancing the classes at the moment, but I seriously wish people could see the realms as equal from the start, at the moment they go to Midgard and say, "yep, nice sunsets..", then try Albion and say, "Whoa, this is the realm for me". With it's groups of NPCs standing in a crowd ready to talk to players, rather than the odd one standing around awkwardly waiting to give a quest. Albion just seems more complete in this department.. much time has been spent making realm ranks, realm abilities etc.. maybe it's time to finalise the other realms?

I heard some say that Hibernia is even worse, with copy-cut-pasted towns..

I see this as a serious step along the road to equality.. [etc]

Your thoughts please...

 

[- Pathfinder -]

I agree that Albion is the best looking realm, really. It's fleshed out, and towns etc simply look more planned than their hib/Mid equivalents. Tincans aren't known for excessive intelligence though, so it might factor in

 

[[Cerebus]]

You've said what most people are thinking. The first time I wen't to Camelot, I was just amazed at the place.

The developers stated that Albion was the first realm they created, meaning they where still finding out how to use the engine. Meaning the whole team was working on the realm. Meaning more detail and varied landscapes.

Midgard was second, Hibernia last. At the time of creating these realms, the Mythic team was used to the engine and could use less people to create the realms in the lesser times.

It is very unfair that people in Albion get a deeper playing experience but apparantly Mythic say the realms are equal, it's just the players that think they're different. Go figure......

I was in our top level dungeon the other day and it was hilarious at one point because our group realised it was actually our mid level dungeon in reverse. It's sad because we weren't even that amazed, just a little dissapointed.

Svartalf, go log onto a french server or something and take a look around Hibernia and our capital Tir Na Nog. Prepare to be amazed and feel sorry for us.

 

[Uncle Sick(tm)]

Hibernia has its beautiful spots... but only a few.

It is blatantly obvious that Hibernia was a rush job to get the game released...

But they could at least add changes in their patches.
Nerf Mythic!

 

[- Pathfinder -]

Originally posted by sickofit...
Hibernia has its beautiful spots... but only a few.

It is blatantly obvious that Hibernia was a rush job to get the game released...

But they could at least add changes in their patches.
Nerf Mythic!

How to nerf mythic? They're more gimped than the cabalist!

 

[Verena]

My first realm was Hibernia in beta and later on in retail and I felt the exact same way.

It's really sad that such a realm as Hibernia which does have a lot of potential looks so amateuristic(SP?). Tir na Nog is a joke compared to Camelot and even to Jordheim. A 12year old quake player can design a better map. The towns are all the same and there's no real feel other then the feeling you're playing on a golfcourse and you'll bump into Tiger Woods monsters somewhere.

The original design was that Midgard&Albion would fight over Hibernia in the same way as the Darkness Falls dungeon. Cerebus explained it even better why they look so different and I can't add much to that.

Who knows what the expansion will bring us but I'm afraid that Albion will again be their favorite realm. After all the game _is_ called Camelot.

 

[old.Max Payne]

Albion is indeed the most awesome looking realm. I spend alot of time in Camelot just cause I like it so much. You even got doors to open! we don't have that

 

[Uncle Sick(tm)]

I could live with curtains if they just made Hibernia look a wee bit more attractive - in matters of architecture/quests/OTD's (ffs Hibernian OTD's are a joke... especially for caster types *grumble, rant*).

Are there unique Firbolg/Lurikeen structures? No...
I actually like the landscape.

I think the Tiger Woods mob is part of the Golfmaster epic.
Good thing Mythic will nerf crush... he wields a golf club the size of a Cornish Giant. Scary.

 

[[Cerebus]]

pppffftttt....we have about 4 giant mushrooms scattered around the realm.

............nuff said.

 

[Uncle Sick(tm)]

But hey! See the positive side, Fonzy!

We.. we have the highest density of toadstools in all the three realms! Rejoice!

 

[Ardwan]

I always thought Hibernia looked better than Albion, but I have only play an alt in Hibernia.
And Midgard...its white, and grey, 'nuff said.

As for OTDs etc
You complain about caster OTD, I can't think of any caster OTDs in Albion, and I know people who have spent 5+ hours killing mobs that are supposed to drop cloth, without a single piece dropping.

The only thing I find noticeably better in Albion is finding your way around, the places seem to be better organised

 

[[Cerebus]]

The entire Hibernian realm is along one big road. It's virtually impossible to get lost.

The only crossroads we have both lead to the same place.

 

[Ardwan]

Originally posted by [Cerebus]
The entire Hibernian realm is along one big road. It's virtually impossible to get lost.

The only crossroads we have both lead to the same place.

Aye, thats what I don't like about it...it probably cos I can't be bothered exploring the place, with Albion I have spent countless hours exploring every place, with the other realms I just don't feel like it

 

[listepik]

i have played all 3 realms, and these are the differences i find.

Scenery:

Midgard is gry/brown/white and very Gloomy.

this gives a nice dark athmosphere, but it gets depressing very fast.

Hibernia is the golf course. everything is just a shade of green.
Your eyes water, after a few hours.

Albion is everything.
You have dense woods, with gloomy lighting and dark undergrowth. you have vast green plains. you have snowy mountains. you have Camelot hills, a nice stretch of green too.


reason albion looks best, is not that its more complete/pretty/whatever. its simply that the midgard and hibernia worlds, are not varied enough.


Playability:

for me, personally, race matters a whole lot. its what i look at all the time. the big ones, i dont like. they run funny and they take up too much screen. the small ones are a little better, but only slightly. Lurikeens for example, streeses me, with their 8 paces/meter compared to a celt/norse/<insert albion race>.
so i prefer playing the normal size race. altho, the variety of Other people's race, is better in hib/mid.

Classes matter too, obviously.
I find the hib classes to be the most fun, in every aspect, except for the healing part. QUITE alot of them can heal. I am simply not that type. Albion coms second here, in terms of variety. oddly enough, we have the most caster classes.
Midgard comes dead last. only find 2-3 classes worth playing there, and none of them really do anythng for me.

Completeness:

I think they did Albion first. I agree, it seem more finnished all in all. so of course albion has more difference in mobs, items, quests etc.




All in all:

Albion wins. Hib comes second, while midgard comes in dead last.
this is mainly because i prefer to have my eyes watered over being depressed

 

[old.chesnor]

Criticisms that Camelot is more 'fleshed out' than Jordheim is pointless. Why increase the size of the city ? Everything you need is in Jordheim, it is compact and easy to navigate. Camelot is too large and mazelike, with many empty rooms and pointless embellishments. Perhaps some people like this stuff, but I would rather the resources of my machine and the developers are put into things that actually make the game play better rather than look better.

I think Mythic could read the VN boards and look at some of the criticisms players from Hibernia especially make about that realm. There was a huge thread on the Hibernia main board moaning. Most of it was hysterical nonsense ("its a golf course" etc) that didn't stand up to any reasoning. My guess is Mythic looks at figures and stats we can't see. How quickly people level, what % of population is 50, rp earners etc. Then decides that Hibernia isn't broken at all, and its not.

 

[[Cerebus]]

Originally posted by old.chesnor
My guess is Mythic looks at figures and stats we can't see. How quickly people level, what % of population is 50, rp earners etc. Then decides that Hibernia isn't broken at all, and its not.

Yeah, Hibernia isn't broken too much. It's damn ugly though, which is what we're mad at.

 

[ImLestat]

Check the last sentence in my sig. It is quite universal in this game. :/

 

[Farnis]

Not spent much time in Camelot, but I seem to remember it being cack for tradeskilling coz all the merchants were too spaced out in the city...i may be wrong here...im going off my notoriously bad memory.

I just remember thinking when I started tradeskilling in Jord that it was much quicker to get your materials.

Laters.

 

[Brannor McThife]

Albion landscape SUCKS. I can't believe none of you have bitched about how blocky their frontier is? The hills...Straight up, and change at straight angles. Well, a lot of it anyway.

Midgard and Hibernia have nice flowing landscapes. Good grief, every single Alb that has has run to Castle Sauvage - how about that ^ just after the guard tower... :/ And the hills around that keep south of Snowdonia Fortress...what about the dead straight drop outside of Snowdonia?

Please. Sure, the overall design may be a lot more varied, but damnit, Hibernia and Midgard are so much nicer to traverse. Albion is all angles. Looks more like it was designed with a ruler (not the king type. )

-G

 

[- Pathfinder -]

Noone spends time in the Alb frontier, so it hardly matters

 

[Ardwan]

Maybe Mythic put Camelot in the name, due to the fact that everyone should have heard of Camelot, whereas the other two cities aren't universally known...but what do I know, its obviously cos Mythic favour Albion the most, and hate the other realms, and go round putting bricks through the other realm's windows at night

 

[Kerram Darktyde]

Albion is not as great as people think its not as nice as midgard

Camelot is nasty to look at inside, and too big.

TNN is nicer to navigate but is still big

Jord is nice small, compact feels like a busy Viking city.

Midgard has the most atmosphere, Many varied landscapes , like volcanic, lakes, coast, woods, hills, Snow. Feels the most true to medievil Viking setting.

You can tell Hib was rushed which is a real shame they could have done good things with Hib...

Albion feels too Movie like..

but then everyone likes different things

 

[klavrynd]

I must say that i find Albion a terribly boring place to walk around in. It really has that "let's take a 2 day stroll in the mountains"-feeling.

And if you think about the entire architecture thing, it actually makes sense (at least to me)

Albion is a highly advanced society, so they spend ages embellishing their cities, building towers and majectic forts.

Midgard is a realm populated with savages and the more "brute force will get anything done" way of life (you cant expect trolls to build houses now can you?). Everything is built in a practical way.

Find two mountains, make a fence with the largest trees you can
find and stuff you city with some temples and build everything close together so we're safe... (Jordheim)
( i find haggerfell the most cosy village btw (the dwarven village for the non-middies))

In Hibernia "people" tend to live closer to nature and their elf architects really did some great work on the bridges and watchtowers. Tnn has some nice views tho : think of the entrance to the naturalist trainers (not the corridor one) with all the druids and stuff.


Another point touched was the remake of dungeons. Dungeons seem to been made from only a few components.

eg: the lords room in Varulvhamn is the exec room from nisse's backwards.

spindel's scavroom is the second room down in varulvhamn without that extra corridor where the lost hagbui and the kobold spawn. The spindel room in spindel is exactly the same as the spider one in nisse.

cross-realm then : Keltoi looks exactly the same as the cursed tomb (or the other way around). The only dungeon that's pretty unique (dont have too high chars in hib nor alb so correct me if i'm wrong) is The Muire Tomb in hibbie (which is pretty much thé most annoying dungeon ive ever been in)


One last thing : mob names in hibernia are hilarious. How can a boogieman or a granny possibly scare you?

 

[Brannor McThife]

Originally posted by klavrynd
The only dungeon that's pretty unique (dont have too high chars in hib nor alb so correct me if i'm wrong) is The Muire Tomb in hibbie (which is pretty much thé most annoying dungeon ive ever been in)

Wrong. Catacombs of Carvoda.

See this thread for a comparison of the dungeons.

-G

 

[old.Greggor]

Originally posted by klavrynd
One last thing : mob names in hibernia are hilarious. How can a boogieman or a granny possibly scare you?

i must agree on the pookha fgs

 

[old.Greggor]

Originally posted by Brannor McThife

Wrong. Catacombs of Carvoda.

See this thread for a comparison of the dungeons.

-G

U missed one the coruscating Mine (Hib) 35th+ lvl dungeon?

I have only been to mithra and all the hib dugeons

 

[Danya]

Don't think coruscating mine matches any alb dungeon, not played mid so can't comment on that... I has a vaguely tepoky feel to it though.

 

[Roo Stercogburn]

How can a boogieman or a granny possibly scare you?

When I was five my granny used to take her false teeth out and scare me with them.

I've never had a filling or bad tooth in my life.

 

[Garris-]

Last time I went for a wander though around Midgard if felt about 8 times bigger than Albion. Kinda intimidating really.

 

[Shike]

rofl Roo


And i really like muspel in Mid, thats one of the best areas imo...

Though Alb is nicer overall, since i dont need to turn my monitor to 100% brightness to be able to see whats going on
yes, alb has its curves but rather that than a looooad of dark woods and snow.... And who on earth would be scared of a Tomte? (santa claus in swe)
i have only played mid to lvl32 or so, so i dont know about malmoe or the other highlvlplaces...
Hib..well i really dont like the happy happy cute stuff... luris! <shrugs> hib reminds me of anime somehow and i hate anime