Pity..

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Shocko

Guest
Yes, PM/Email an admin, since they can login as you and read it...

Saying that Cage and Perp were banned because the forums were becoming a bit shit is stupid... There have probably been many "shit phases" during the life of the forums; I can think of one time as bad this, in my shortish time here. The forums aren't shit because Cage is posting semi-amusing pictures everywhere, or because people are calling yoo a fascist... The shittness happens: You've just gotta sit through it, and wait for more funny stories from Wij, Someguy or Damini or something....
 
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nath

Guest
This is meant to be a lot less confrontational than it sounds, but what *was* the major problem with putting people who were abusive/rude consistently on ignore?

It's not like there was loads of different people who did it all the time, there's a quite obvious group of people who do it. If you dislike that humour, ignore them. Problem solved, surely?

Before anyone says anything, I know now that's not an option: it's a commercially owned forum now and Game don't want to be associated with that sorta stuff at all. But ignoring that for a moment, surely being free to say what you want, and being free to put people on ignore if you find what they say offensive, would have otherwise been the best way to do things?
 
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Xavier

Guest
Originally posted by nath
This is meant to be a lot less confrontational than it sounds, but what *was* the major problem with putting people who were abusive/rude consistently on ignore?
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Barrysworlds customer base starts quite young (under 12 I'm guessing) - why should parents have to go through a forum and search for all the wankers just to compile an ignore list and make it safe for little johnny?

IRL when two 'adults' are talking they generally kerb their language around the young, on forums it's not that easy - for one, it relies on people putting their right ages to start with, and secondly it relies on us checking and becoming aware of every new face... even then it doesn't stop someone reading over something later...

The only solution is to tone it down, are you really telling me that being able to swear, insult and look at the odd bit of ghey pron is your number one reason for posting here? If not, if you're a little more mature than that and can manage to resist the temptation to look at huge c0x0r, then let Ted and co get on with cleaning things up so others can enjoy it too.
 
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bodhi

Guest
Well, these forums were getting along fine, pretty much every person with at least half a brain cell took comments in the spirit they were meant. Then certain people learnt how to goose-step and anyone with a personality was history. I always thought that one of the key things to remember about having built up an excellent gaming community was not to try and destroy it. But maybe that was just me.
 
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Xavier

Guest
at first that was fine, things occasionally got out of hand, but overall it all ticked over.

just to cover themselves, the disclaimer went up - it was exactly that, a disclaimer for the general level of behaviour at the time...

of late however certain people have really gotten out of hand... and whenever someone objects to 'gh3y pr0n' or racist abuse they jump up and down behind that disclaimer... believing it covers them for making such posts, a little dose of reality - it doesn't. BW gave people the chance to revert but it seems noone is interested in playing fair.

before they expected us to behave and just get on with it, and now because that's been spoilt they're stepping in and telling us to tow the line or leave...

credit to you bods, you've toned down of late, the likes of Dime, cage and Perplex seemed to think that by bashing at the newly visible walls they could topple them - and they've been proven wrong.

tbh, the sooner people quit bitching about this whole matter the sooner they'll see how little has actually changed round here. Contrary to popular belief Ted and co haven't sworn allegiance to the Gestapo, and if everyone plays fair and stops giving them reason to step in and protect their customers, things will settle back down...

remember, ted and co had to add themselves as moderators because of recent events here, not because some suit at Game demanded it - they wouldn't have to do it had we not given them reason.
 
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kan

Guest
blah blah blah

they used to be good blah blah blah isnt it a pity blah blah blah.




get over it ffs people, move on and get some fresh air
 
L

lynchet

Guest
Whats especially funny is that most (note the most) of the people complaining about the changes and demanding their own forum are the clique who wanted to post whatever they liked and tell anyone new to get lost because they were here first and it was "their" forum.

If you want a sub forum where only a few people are sllowed in -- then go start on on your own site ;) -- you talk about what this place used to be -- what Barrys always was, and I hope still is, is a welcoming community with expertise that nonetheless welcomed new people of all standards and knowledge -- and its people like Ted who made it that.

As can be seen from my registered date and post count I have been around ages, but don't post that often. I have continued to browse and post when I wanted to as 1. Ive been around ages and 2. I dont care what the cages and dimebags of this world think about me.... but had I been a newcomer to Barrys their attitude would not have persuaded me to stay and I believe they and their ilk made the forums a hostile place.

Also of course, over the years ive seen so called forum regulars come and go -- you start a mini forum and it will die -- new blood is always needed to keep things going.

I guess Ill now be accused of sucking up to Ted etc etc Well so be it -- it was Teds, Dbs's and co's vision that made Barrys and persuaded me that it was a place I wanted to hang out, and frankly Id much rather be here than on Dimebagsworld !
 
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nath

Guest
Xavier, my question was not to do with the kids that could browse on to this forum, that angle I can understand. It's people who got narky about repeat offenders of abusive/offensive messages. It reminds me of a bunch of old women looking at late night channel five and saying how offensive it is because there's loads of pornography there. Why not just put the people on ignore?

This question has nothing to do with newcomers, that's a different issue. I'm just asking about the regulars who disliked the regulars who were abusive.
 
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Xavier

Guest
well, if we're cleaning up for the young'uns that's a real moot point, so if we're going to continue this thread lets at least talk about relevant matters, there's nil point in anyone putting anyone else on ignore if they're going to have to tone it down anyway...
 
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nath

Guest
The toning it down for youngsters wasn't an issue previously though. I think it mainly became an issue when Game took over. Could be wrong though.
 
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Embattle

Guest
Actually it had been considered before, although the recent reasons are more serious than previous ones.
 
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.Cask

Guest
Of course, Barrysworld could have turned things around and decided to cater towards older players (the ones with the money!) I know age doesn't necessarily bring maturity; there are a lot of very responsible under-18's around and there are equally as many immature 40+'s. Another forum I read was being terrorised but this spammer who eventually turned out to be an Ann of Green Gabels (or something) fan in his 60's!

Alright, that wouldn't happen now but as the UK gaming industry grows I expect someone will eventually target older players. And these people would be the only ones responsible for the viewing the content that is posted. So perhaps with a larger warning on the general forum, maybe a proper disclaimer to be accepted before entering, things could be become quite acceptable to all. That all sounds a bit seedy though.

I suppose it's a lot more socially acceptable to swear and make political statments in a pub then it is in a supermarket queue. But I don't really see how you can emulate the pub on the internet, without an age restriction disclaimer of some sort.
 
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Shocko

Guest
Originally posted by lynchet
If you want a sub forum where only a few people are allowed in -- then go start on on your own site ;) -- you talk about what this place used to be -- what Barrys always was, and I hope still is, is a welcoming community with expertise that nonetheless welcomed new people of all standards and knowledge -- and its people like Ted who made it that.
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It wouldn't be a private forum, it would be just like the current General, except that it would be called something else, and wouldn't be right at the top of the forums list. In the time i've been here, i've seen a relatively small amount of others join or leave... I don't think the current community would die in a more secluded spot. I'm not talking about the what the community should be, i'm talking about the community that does specifically exist on the General forum. It is something fairly unique, that i've grown to love, and i just think it would be nice if it could carry on.

Yes, someone could just host their own forum, but it just wouldn't work out. People like things the way they are, they way they should be, and have been since the dawn of time*. The subforum idea would solve both the problem with minors being exposed to the likes of Wij(don't take that literally, you pervert! :eek: ), and would also suit the people who claim to like the forums, but dislike the atmosphere on the General - They could have an entirely new General forum without the hostility!


*maybe
 
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(Shovel)

Guest
Originally posted by lynchet
Whats especially funny is that most (note the most) of the people complaining about the changes and demanding their own forum are the clique who wanted to post whatever they liked and tell anyone new to get lost because they were here first and it was "their" forum.
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I don't know how many people have been around since the days before UBB/vBulliten. But there were problems before. I should know, I was one of them.

I bring a tale of ye olde "Webboard". I don't know how many of your were here then - it was like... four years ago.

Basically, it was free for all with HTML code in posts. People put images in sigs and in the case of some even ran java applets. The forums became "shit" because people like myself thought it was dead cool to have various animating gif sig images and choose different ones. It came to a head when entire spam threads started coming up.

So, what happened? Well, the board was a little old anyway, and Barrysworld updated it. There were a few demo runs, then we got a nice green UBB. With it came controlling features - no more images in sigs. Problems solved.

Personally, I think that the solution to the current problems lies down the same route. Barrysworld programmers have the skill to customise vB, they have done before and will do again. The suggestions about automatic filters are very very good. But what is the problem now? People want to choose. Barrys does cater for different sorts now. So let people choose. As has been suggested, modify the forums to include filtering (on by default so kids know it's there) but let people turn it off if they want. Heck, even enable/disable the option to choose based on date of birth if you want... (13 seems to be an internet cut off year for some reason?).

Last time the forums were really threatened they changed big time to fix it, this time it just has to evolve a bit. And with web coding as good as it is now, you can give people the choice.

And please, stop with the high visibility moderating. Bigfoot, I know you all want to make the moderators existence felt right now, but I can't see how it doesn't just enflame users? Same with naming "targets" (Bigfoot named Wij in another thread). Sure Wij has been banned in the past - deservedly I'm sure- but you should at least give everyone a chance to adhere to the new rules before you start hunting people down. I'm sorry if that is too blunt, but no one has a problem with rules as such, but the way in which they are being enforced at the moment - ruling by fear if you like - is really not going to get through in the way you want.

Thanks.
 
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bigfoot

Guest
The problem is that you warn people, you tell them to behave, and they just go and stupid things anyway, such is the way with certain individuals online, even myself perhaps in days gone by when I had posts removed from sites, BarrysWorld included.

Over the past months we've tried the softly softly edit some posts approach and it didn't work, people complained the forums were going shit so now we try something else and people call us Nazi's. I personally don't see why we should waste our time and resources on these people, most of whom are not even paying customers and the few that are probably have already violated the T&C's of their membership agreement and therefore their Subscription, in fact if anything their behaviour is to the detrement of the forums so their presence here is actually harming us.

On a personal note maybe it is just me but I'm not totally over the moon when people call me a Nazi, perhaps it is because I've experienced racism first hand when I was younger and because I've always tried to stamp out such behaviour in my leagues and other online doings. I'm sorry if you think I'm therefore taking a hard line when I put bans on people who say that kind of thing, but in my view it is appropriate.
 
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Kippa.

Guest
Originally posted by bigfoot


On a personal note maybe it is just me but I'm not totally over the moon when people call me a Nazi, perhaps it is because I've experienced racism first hand when I was younger and because I've always tried to stamp out such behaviour in my leagues and other online doings. I'm sorry if you think I'm therefore taking a hard line when I put bans on people who say that kind of thing, but in my view it is appropriate.
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so its ok to call you a cockbadger then? :D
 
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Nos-

Guest
I think it's more than that. I think that before anything pretty much went because most of the people using the General forum (were in my opinion) mostly adults, or at least 16+

Couldn't we just have an adult forum? And by that I don't mean one for porn :/
 
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bigbb

Guest
Fresh load lads, quick!

lorry.jpg
 
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(Shovel)

Guest
I'm certainly not condoning racist remarks of any kind. Be it cages love of Jews or the current Nazi fetish that people have to describe board politics.

I'm not sure I agree that adminning has to be visible. I mean, a ban only matters to the person who is banned. Yes so some people around here have a supporters club, but mostly once a person is banned the problem is solved.

Obviously I have no weight - time on Barrysworld means nothing - but might I suggest that a policy of "inform the user by Private Message" and remove offending posts (ban if necessary) would be a more productive way to keep control? As I say, editing a post to put a public "final warning" for all to see is quite offensive. Two wrongs wont make right.
 
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(Shovel)

Guest
I don't mean warnings necessarilly, sure, sometimes the line will get torched in one swoop and there's no space for warnings, but I just think the person being banned should get a full explaination (effort for the mods? Well, maybe that's up to them if they choose to moderate such a big board? It comes with the responsibility).

Warnings would be nice - but again, it should be done in private, between the mods and the individual. It's up to the individual who they go telling stories to. I can't see how it's in a moderators interests to draw attention to the banning of people without giving the reasons why in specific terms.
 
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bigfoot

Guest
Shovel - I did indeed do that with bodhi, however the other users either posted something that had already seen a user banned for posting or posted AFTER Ted made his announcement. If people cannot be bothered to read that, or they can but just do not want to follow what he says, then fine, but they cannot then claim they have not been warned.

Most people who have been banned will probably be unbanned in a couple of days, so perhaps suspended would be a better term, but I feel it is fair to ban them because they have received warning and for some people it is the only way to get through to them that their behaviour is not appropriate.
 
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kameleon

Guest
And to be fair, I did get an explanation and my counter-explanation was taken on board
 
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(Shovel)

Guest
Fair enough. I'm not against banning or suspending - it's a useful tool when you have rules to adhere too.

Now, in a final attempt to be concise...

I'm concerned that whatever your intents, that you are coming across as banning people zealously. It isn't always clear why someone has been banned, if you want to publicise "suspentions" then why not stick a good explaination (or referal to the new T&C) in with it? Get people aware of what's going on.

At the moment, I think you might not be giving the impression that you think you are/want to give.

Good night.
 
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kan

Guest
teds posted an announcement?



oh i must have missed that
 
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