Paladins in RvR

[[PS]Venom]

Originally posted by Arthwyr
As for offensive paladins if you are thinking of making a 2h paladin role a friar instead. Friar stick hits harder and more frequent with the self haste buff, you get to buff yourself you get evade AND you can heal a bit.

But they don't look shiny in plate Plus, a Paladin's AF buffs means insane damage absorb

Originally posted by Genesis_of_Ak
My Paladin chr has 8000+ odd bounty points. Anyone got any hints on how to spend these for a 50th lvl RR5 2H slash offensive Pally ?

RR5?? If you got RR5 you shouldn't need to ask that question ;P

Get Faith Heal, then Aug Dex/Quick/Str, Mastery of Parrying, Mastery of Pain, Tireless 1 (No more, for faster end regen) Long Wind 1 (Massive sprinting after next patch) You may want to consider getting Ignore Pain as well - think you have enough RP. Up to you however.

 

[Arthwyr]

...but if a Friar gets hit, the damage he takes will be more than a Paladin in AF100 plate. In RvR where a healthy whack by a 50th level Troll can cut your average cloth wearer in half, its 6 of one and half a dozen of the other IMHO.

IF he gets hit the damage isn't even as bad as the armour would let you think ... evade, some dodger, self AF buffs more then compensate for it. Ask any hib who they would wrather face an offensive paladin or a friar.

 

[[PS]Venom]

Originally posted by Arthwyr

IF he gets hit the damage isn't even as bad as the armour would let you think ... evade, some dodger, self AF buffs more then compensate for it. Ask any hib who they would wrather face an offensive paladin or a friar.

No, I know that friars are quite tough in combat. However paladins have chants, which are pretty much always usable in battle. Although I'm not saying paladins are quite as good as friars, because I know they aren't, they're still an underrated class.

Being an offensive paladin surprises the hell out of a lot of players - especially stealthers.

 

[busty]

Originally posted by *Hienrich*



RR5?? If you got RR5 you shouldn't need to ask that question ;P

Get Faith Heal, then Aug Dex/Quick/Str, Mastery of Parrying, Mastery of Pain, Tireless 1 (No more, for faster end regen) Long Wind 1 (Massive sprinting after next patch) You may want to consider getting Ignore Pain as well - think you have enough RP. Up to you however.

he sed BOUNTY points not REALM points

 

[[PS]Venom]

Originally posted by busty

he sed BOUNTY points not REALM points

Bugger, now I feel like a muppet.

The watery stones heal a little bit, I think about 1/4, so they aren't too bad, the eathern stones are pretty damn nice as they do a near-full endurance heal - good for a 2h paladin. However they are very annoying as you can't use them in combat, have to key them to your QB somewhere, and use them that way.

 

[Kagato.]

I heard BP's will let you buy houses eventually when they finally implement them, don't count on it for a very long time though.

 

[SilverHood]

2H pallies are a joke

With block/parry, they can't hit very often, and parry doesn't work as well as block for some reason.

1H pallies can't kill much... they just stick on a caster with guard and intercept and slam anything that comes close.

And friars > pallies

 

[Apathy]

I have a 2h paladin and a friar. 2h paladin sucks! HAHAHA...so gimpy.

Friars rock though. Very versatile group class with lots of handy things. Friars are a little like leathery non-pulsating effect paladins.

But better.

a.
*

 

[[PS]Venom]

Hm..

Personally, I like my paladin as 2h. Not as ineffective as most people think, but you're not going to change your minds so.. I won't bother trying to tell you otherwise.

 

[Trinilim]

a lvl 50 friar with dodger 2, best self buffs, and lvl 50 epic armor (along with a few DF items and such) will have 49ish % evade (49.1% myself). With stately quarterstaff (best dropped friar staff in the game to my knowledge), high dex = very hard hit, high quick = fast hit, 70% haste as well, so all these together = a staff hitting you for 4.0 spd worth of damage every 2.5 seconds + near 50% evade + high af buff + self absorb buff + endurance regen chant + endurance reduction buff + heals + all the base buffs.

Now tell me again why you wanted to make an offensive pally instead of a friar?

 

[[PS]Venom]

Originally posted by Trinilim

Now tell me again why you wanted to make an offensive pally instead of a friar?

Because Friars used to be even more gimped than any type of paladin?

Sigh, what's the use, I never said I was better than a friar, I'm just fed up with people saying an offensive paladin is stupid. It's not as damn bad as people say it is.

 

[Genesis_of_Ak]

To all anti 2H Paladin players...

Gimped or not gimped. Your point is ? If you're not playing it what do you care ? My Pally may not be uber, but I have fun playing it over 50 levels and enjoy its unique characteristics in RVR. And seeing as I dont play much, he's done OK to get to RR5 for a fucked up character class.

 

[sigh]

dont expet to get groups so easily then there is alot of bad press about 2h pala's, im sure this doesnt help you, i knwo i dont invite them to a group

Sighfi -BF-

 

[err0r]

Paladins are annoying buggers in RvR -.-

[edit]: This is a positive comment

 

[Genesis_of_Ak]

If people don't want to group Paladins because they are fully aware of their characteristics in RVR, fair enough. But the thing that gets my goat is listening to some twat (typically some scout who at RR4 thinks he's like RR9, or some caster with his head up his arse, or certain members of HB) refusing to group Paladins when they don't know anything about them. Ever heard of Faith Heal ? Chants ? I use mine to good effect generally. But if I fuck up I have the humility to put my hands up and admit it. Usually the problem is not with the Paladin but with the group leader.

/sorry for winge

 

[Stormm]

Paladin(intercept/guard/'I dont wanna be uber killorz') + Caster('I do wanna be uber kilzor') = death and pain and death for hibs/mids (hiddies)

...well sometimes

 

[Ckiller ofDust]

I love my paladin been playin him since february..

But to the point....

Paladins rnt good in RVR. Compare us to our fellow hybrids in midgard and hibernia.. then u see that paladins fall way short...

mids and hibs specc in less things(dont dual specc weapons) and get better things for it..

mean look at champs nobody can beat em 1o1 and they rule in big time rvr to... Thanes rnt so good 1o1 but in big time rvr they are alot better... And both have ranged DMG spells instas

And compare stat raising
Pally Con, Pie and Str
Champ Str, Int and Dex
Thane Str, Pie and Con ad to that troll with over 100 base strght

Sure pallys r the best PVE chars out there or atleast 1 of the best
But in RVR we r lacking and the end chant will not do that much for it....

I just hope that we get something that makes our dmg viable in the future like warriors and hunters got......

or just get a dex self buff or something like that cos sure we can go defense as ive done but since we dont get any dex raising during our lvling, which means to be viable at doin good blocking we need dex buffs. And blocking in rvr is still bugged as hell....

just my 5 cent

 

[Jiggs]

from a friar's perspective i know who goes down faster once you have 2 enemy tanks beating on you.

Gunnerr seems to be doing pretty well as a 2hd tank, alright so he isnt a pally and so does more damage, but its not _that_ much more...

 

[Flimgoblin]

ckiller...

Thanes scream that they're the gimpiest thing since sliced bread

Paladins are hybrids, they can't hit as hard as some people, can't take as much damage as others, can't heal as well as most...

Hybrids will often get class-envy (that armsman is hitting harder than me, that cleric is healing better), but a well-buffed 2h paladin will be doing a lot of damage come next patch - endurance chant will make those end-eating 2h styles that much nastier.

Friars do a shedload of damage because they're spec-buffed.... they get a self dex/qui buff which is the same as full enhance cleric buff.

Fully buff a friar and then fully buff a pure tank, and the pure tank will win... fully buff a paladin and they should be comparative in damage to a friar, plus they have those handy damage/heal/endurance chants


and the paladin can get himself two insta-heals... one of which is group

Jiggs what's your damage like without your self-buffs compared to with?

 

[Ckiller ofDust]

Fing mate i was comparing to other hybrids not other fighters

read the post....

 

[Flimgoblin]

Compare us to our fellow hybrids in midgard and hibernia..

being the thane and the champion
(and also the warden, bard, skald, technically but hey )

The champion is a premier duelist... and good at running down single targets...

the thane is a tank who loses fighting ability to be able to attack from range and do aoe damage (even if they're never allowed to)

and as I said above,

Thanes scream that they're the gimpiest thing since sliced bread

Paladins are tanks that lose fighting ability to gain group-supporting chants...

 

[Flimgoblin]

little note: I'm not saying Paladins are uber and need nerfing, or that they have no problems (the fact all their group-benefits die when they get mezzed is pretty crappy... they need to increase the range on the end chant you get next patch etc.)

I'm just saying that 'gimp in RvR' is a relative term. You can't run around soloing skalds, but a group that passes up a paladin because they're a paladin (and not because the group consists of 3 armsmen, 3 paladins and a mercenary and they desperately need something non-tankish) is being stupid.

And those that say "don't be a 2h paladin" really mean "I wouldn't roll one" - play what you want

Sounds like Hienrich cuts a swathe through whatever he meets and is happy enough

Given the crap range on the chants at the moment - an offensive paladin is great to charge in with the rest of the tanks, giving that damage add/af shield to them.

 

[[PS]Venom]

Originally posted by Fingoniel
And those that say "don't be a 2h paladin" really mean "I wouldn't roll one" - play what you want

Very true. You haven't played the class, and you haven't got to know it inside out so don't knock it.

Sounds like Hienrich cuts a swathe through whatever he meets and is happy enough

Just ask the Strife group I was with last night. The first time we got wiped out in mid I made a (Albeit small) deathspam, and was last man standing.
I also hit hard enough and look scary enough to hold off 1fg+ of middies while the team makes their escape
The insane AF of a paladin (I hit my cap as soon as I buff up) means they can take more damage than an armsman sometimes - even if the arms has more HP.

Given the crap range on the chants at the moment - an offensive paladin is great to charge in with the rest of the tanks, giving that damage add/af shield to them. [/B]

As I stated above, with an AF that is well and truly capped why shouldn't I be standing toe to toe with the tanks? I add another 100AF to anyone I'm close enough to. That's like wearing one more piece of plate armour.

Finally, someone who doesn't knock the 2 handed paladin just because he doesn't know what the class is capable of. A lot of the time when I join groups in RvR the first thing I get when I tell them I'm a 2handed paladin is "You gimp!"
However a little further into the play when I'm Full Healing the group, and doing considerable amounts of damage and taking a LONG time to do down people start realising that I'm serious.

As already stated, those who don't invite a paladin - 2handed or otherwise - into a group JUST because they're a Paladin - or 2 Handed - really needs to think.
It's narrow minded, and to be honest, completely and utter stupid. Paladins of any sort add chants - if nothing else.

Last night in the Strife group we had 2 paladins - Myself and Siul. Siul is a defensive paladin, I'm offensive. It worked perfectly. I used AF chant constantly, he twisted and switched between Healing, Damage Add, and Resistance chants.

The only real problem I find at the moment is running out of Endurance. But that's going to be fixed next patch.

Originally posted by Ckiller ofDust

or just get a dex self buff or something like that cos sure we can go defense as ive done but since we dont get any dex raising during our lvling, which means to be viable at doin good blocking we need dex buffs. And blocking in rvr is still bugged as hell....

Well, I've been trying to cap out my dex. But with a good dex buff I rarely miss, and my parry rate shoots through the sky. Yesterday while levelling a Cleric at Ellys I was very shocked to chain parry an orange into the ground without taking a hit. Plus 2h has a NASTY high damage 2 style chain off a parry.

This isn't meant as a brag post, I just wish the narrow minded lot of albion would stop being such asses and realise offensive paladins aren't shite!

(Soz for rambling a little )

 

[old.Odysseus]

Originally posted by *Hienrich*

Just ask the Strife group I was with last night. The first time we got wiped out in mid I made a (Albeit small) deathspam, and was last man standing.
I also hit hard enough and look scary enough to hold off 1fg+ of middies while the team makes their escape

You do NOT want a group without a pala.
Their survivability is extreme, FH is awesome, resistchants, soon end regen, etc etc. And their damageoutput aint all that crappy either.
Hienrich singlehandedly held off 5-6 mids with more coming while the rest of us retreated so we could go back and rez.

It is a common misconception that all tanks should be defensive slambots. Take a brief look at wuren; runs in, slams a caster, pulls out spear and wham dead caster.

 

[[PS]Venom]

Originally posted by old.Odysseus

It is a common misconception that all tanks should be defensive slambots. Take a brief look at wuren; runs in, slams a caster, pulls out spear and wham dead caster.

If only I didn't have to spec chants, I'd be able to do that

On a sidenote, Bloody good last night Ody, that's the sort of RvR I've been looking for. Even if we did get our asses kicked, wiped, and handed back to us once or twice, we did good.

 

[Lusse]

oi was fun ye

I was impressed by heins deathmsg spam But still, i like my shield and my sword.

 

[starblade]

Having played both 2h and s/s, I can only say that both are even fun to play ... and even effective to play in the hands of a good player (but that goes for every class).

I never did and never will advice a young paladin against going 2handed. They are far from gimps and people saying that imo just don't know how to play one really.

Paladins in general have gotten a lot of bad press, 2handers even more. Till I was lvl 42ish or something, hell would freeze over before anyone would invite a pally in a group ... 2 months later we're gods of PvE .... and now everybody wants one
It doesn't matter if you are s/s or 2hander ... you can play your role as a paladin extremely well with any of the 2 styles, it just takes some intelligence from your group to realize what that role is.

 

[[PS]Venom]

(Although I think a couple of people in the deathspam were actually greys that I targetted, oneshotted and moved on in a bit of a murderous rage)

 

[Genesis_of_Ak]

Some intelligent reasoning here. Doubters take note !

BTW, I particularly like pulling off Sun&Moon (triple style attack combo causing continuous bleeding damage) - v nice.

 

[[PS]Venom]

I used to have sun&moon - respecced it however. It does less damage than Bone Breaker (FAR less) and a 3 style chain gets irritating to pull off sometimes.

Although the bleed that causes about 30ish damage IS nice, personally I like having higher chants and parry