News flash - pr is sucky o_0

S

StormriderX

Guest
http://vnboards.ign.com/message.asp?topic=55785171&replies=5

Highlights:

"Perfect recovery.
Our "best RA" ya its nifty sometimes but way overpriced for what you can basically do with a full rez. Lowering the cost to 10 is one suggestion. I favor keeping it at 14 and moving the timer to 15 minutes. "

"PR on a 15 minute timer would still probably not be worth it.

So much more a healer can do with those extra 14 points"
 
F

froler-mid

Guest
why bother with the n00bs on VN boards~ ? :m00:
 
J

Jiggs

Guest
probably the best RA in game along with SoS

it basically negates any advantage you get from BoF

(ie u BoF and kill support which just PR each other and you are back to square one except no BoF)

its the one RA which i pray isnt up when we fight a good mid group.
 
P

phule_gubben

Guest
Let us atleast keep all buffs if we get ressed with PR, that would be cool. :)
 
F

Flimgoblin

Guest
tis a good question though - I'd assumed it was someone important you were quoting, not just some random VN whiner
 
I

infernalwrath

Guest
pr is fine atm
imo givf to healer self dex/quick buff in aug spec line and they are fine
 
G

Gewny

Guest
I have p and I dont find it that good, the bugs around it are annoying, (eg. very often u get "not in view") then u have to wait 5 sec to try again.

In 90% of the cases PR wont do any differance :(

Scenario 1. Other healer dies
I PR he gets up but if the groupe was bad enugh to let him die hw will die anyway.

Scenario 2. I rezz somebody else
Well without buffs many classes are almost worth less today, sad but tru, how much differance can a tank make today without end regen ?, how much dmg will pass resists without brain buff ? how long will a supporter survive without af/con/dex ?

I have had PR since day 1 one when RA´s was released and I relly want it to be usefull and good cuz I like to fully recover a member of my groupe. And sometimes it has made a differance, but almost only in very small battles (like when me droder and that SC berzerker run in eman and faced 4 enemys then a PR of the zerker was relly a big change).

If I had a respec I would prolly try to get MoC instead today as I personally relly think that one would make more of a differance :(

(note that I am mend healer (40 in mend for 100% rez) and good suite with much dex, thereby lowering the casting time of the rezz)
 
S

schinkaar

Guest
jiggs, if support keep PR:ing eachother it means they use multiple RA:s so it whould be fairer to compare 3 PR:s to 2x BoF and 1x SoS. But i agree it whould be more fun to make RA:s cost less (30% decrase across the board(?))so you could have the essiantals on lower RR chars aswell, but i dont think it whould add to the fun with reduced timers.
 
A

Arnor

Guest
Originally posted by Jiggs
probably the best RA in game along with SoS

it basically negates any advantage you get from BoF

(ie u BoF and kill support which just PR each other and you are back to square one except no BoF)

its the one RA which i pray isnt up when we fight a good mid group.
Click to expand...


heres 5$, get a clue
 
F

Forau

Guest
Well, reducing PR isn't a question of PR "not being worth it". But the 3 mainhealers class specific RAs are among the most powerful in the game. GP: 14 pts, PR: 14 pts, BoF:10 pts.

The most powerful one out of the 3 is the least expensive. I'd have PR if it cost 16 pts, but I feel that a lesser RA shouldn't cost almost 50% more.

The timer however, is just fine, 15 minutes would be overpowering no doubt.
 
N

Negura

Guest
"probably the best RA in game along with SoS"

lol
Don't mind me for asking, but what game are you playing mistar?
If Daoc is the answer, then it must be the crack you're on.


PR isn't a group RA like the other realms' healing classes have, and it's hardly ever decisive in a fight.
 
C

Carlos Bananos

Guest
yea cos rezzing 1 person > keeping a whole grp alive (BOF).
 
F

Forau

Guest
Originally posted by infernalwrath
pr is fine atm
imo givf to healer self dex/quick buff in aug spec line and they are fine
Click to expand...

Absolutely _no_ use whatsoever. With the current conc-situation in mid groups means you always have a buffbot, without it, no group. To get the same level of dex/qui as from bb you'd have to spec 45+ aug giving up all your utility. Augline needs something, but it ain't another useless self buff.

My latest suggestion to Moller_ was a self-castable 50% absorbing ablative shield. Would be given to Healers in augline, Bards in Nurture and Sorcs in Mind. Giving 3 defensively-suffering classes a boost in that area.
 
P

parzi

Guest
well another vnboard thread ;)
pr is ok, i would like bof more atm in dark age of tankalot, but well i wouldnt trade healers vs clerics, smiteline4tehloose !
 
N

nalistah

Guest
PR is overrated

would change it for BoF/SoS/GP anyday.
 
I

infernalwrath

Guest
Originally posted by Forau
Absolutely _no_ use whatsoever. With the current conc-situation in mid groups means you always have a buffbot, without it, no group. To get the same level of dex/qui as from bb you'd have to spec 45+ aug giving up all your utility. Augline needs something, but it ain't another useless self buff.

My latest suggestion to Moller_ was a self-castable 50% absorbing ablative shield. Would be given to Healers in augline, Bards in Nurture and Sorcs in Mind. Giving 3 defensively-suffering classes a boost in that area.
Click to expand...
why ? why should healers have to rely on bb or on shaman of the group (if he dies no dex/quick)
i love healing class i play cleric and i dont like healer casue he does not have a dex/quick buff and i dont want to rely on anyone and cba to make a bb and pay mroe money to mythic cause they are morons
btw group haste is a maijor advantage of aug line imo
 
P

parzi

Guest
think about the fact that pr = all buffs gone. in mid this includes endregen/mana regen.
ok for support classes its nice with a new 100% powerbar but casters and tanks unbuffed with no resist buffs etc is really not that great.

sure its worth its points, but i like sos and bof more, better ppl dont die at all then let them die and resurect them unbuffed :p
 
F

Forau

Guest
Originally posted by infernalwrath
why ? why should healers have to rely on bb or on shaman of the group (if he dies no dex/quick)
i love healing class i play cleric and i dont like healer casue he does not have a dex/quick buff and i dont want to rely on anyone and cba to make a bb and pay mroe money to mythic cause they are morons
btw group haste is a maijor advantage of aug line imo
Click to expand...

Maybe read my post next time? If I didn't want to be dependant on other people I wouldn't have rolled one of the key support-classes, I would've been a stealther. Healers should "have to" rely on their shaman/bb because the healer, unlike the druid and cleric, are not the primary buffing classes of their realm. I've yet to meet an aughealer using his own str/con buff. I consider the aug/mendhealer a good solid character, but _if_ we need help as you implied, I would be very disappointed if they gave us a self buff that's useful in solo PVE at best.

Since aug isn't a viable spec at the higher levels(you can max get 44 and retain spread heal), you need somthing that is useful all through the spectrum of spells. The str/con buff I have I never use because a buffbot one gives me 200hp, self damageadd I use but I might as well not. More for kicks than anything. Self damageshield is only good in solo PVE. In rvr all it does is break your shamans roots, dealing damage to an enemy that hits you, freeing him.

What Aug is to me is:
#1: Resist buffs, without these there would be no aughealers.
#2: Celerity, nice but marginally useful, the difference in haste isn't that great on a zerker with conc haste. H2H-savages cap 1.5 spd without it. So basically what it does is that it increases slam-speed, skald damagedealing and marginally effecting zerkers damage.
#3: Baseline buffs, unspecced baseline buffs are useful. You need aughealers to avoid having to use 2 buffbots + group shaman.
#4: Conc haste: Once again, nice thing but trivial at best. Not exactly a battle-turner.

All of these have a purpose for all the healers that don't spec 44+ aug. As stated above the key to adding augline spells is to "add something you will use even if you have the L10 aug version of it". Something that helps at lower levels, i.e something another class can't do better already (and perhaps something that had a use from the beginning). Specbuffs the shaman will always do best, the speed a skald will always do best, damage the savage will do best.

What I would like to have is a trademark ability, that no other class can do better. I would say that the Healer's Augline is not that unlike the Warden's Nurture line, both being main basebuffers(along with bards ofc), lacking specbuffs, and getting the same setup of resistbuffs. In this line the warden gets PBT where healers get celerity, now you tell me which you would prefer. In short, give me a reason to skip the L39 Spreadheal and spec 44a/30m.

PS. Damn, promised myself I was gonna keep it short :(
Out
 
I

infernalwrath

Guest
Originally posted by Forau
Maybe read my post next time? If I didn't want to be dependant on other people I wouldn't have rolled one of the key support-classes, I would've been a stealther. Healers should "have to" rely on their shaman/bb because the healer, unlike the druid and cleric, are not the primary buffing classes of their realm. I've yet to meet an aughealer using his own str/con buff. I consider the aug/mendhealer a good solid character, but _if_ we need help as you implied, I would be very disappointed if they gave us a self buff that's useful in solo PVE at best.

Since aug isn't a viable spec at the higher levels(you can max get 44 and retain spread heal), you need somthing that is useful all through the spectrum of spells. The str/con buff I have I never use because a buffbot one gives me 200hp, self damageadd I use but I might as well not. More for kicks than anything. Self damageshield is only good in solo PVE. In rvr all it does is break your shamans roots, dealing damage to an enemy that hits you, freeing him.

What Aug is to me is:
#1: Resist buffs, without these there would be no aughealers.
#2: Celerity, nice but marginally useful, the difference in haste isn't that great on a zerker with conc haste. H2H-savages cap 1.5 spd without it. So basically what it does is that it increases slam-speed, skald damagedealing and marginally effecting zerkers damage.
#3: Baseline buffs, unspecced baseline buffs are useful. You need aughealers to avoid having to use 2 buffbots + group shaman.
#4: Conc haste: Once again, nice thing but trivial at best. Not exactly a battle-turner.

All of these have a purpose for all the healers that don't spec 44+ aug. As stated above the key to adding augline spells is to "add something you will use even if you have the L10 aug version of it". Something that helps at lower levels, i.e something another class can't do better already (and perhaps something that had a use from the beginning). Specbuffs the shaman will always do best, the speed a skald will always do best, damage the savage will do best.

What I would like to have is a trademark ability, that no other class can do better. I would say that the Healer's Augline is not that unlike the Warden's Nurture line, both being main basebuffers(along with bards ofc), lacking specbuffs, and getting the same setup of resistbuffs. In this line the warden gets PBT where healers get celerity, now you tell me which you would prefer. In short, give me a reason to skip the L39 Spreadheal and spec 44a/30m.

PS. Damn, promised myself I was gonna keep it short :(
Out
Click to expand...
i did read your first post
my point of vew in support is different i beleve
i never wait to get healed by second cleric if i get atacked and i want to rely to myself to be effective 1 and half year in alb made me think this way
I agree with u that healers needs lov in aug line but they are solid in other 2 lines so giving more things maybe get them 2 good :) (like cleric have 2 good lines and got their third nerfed long long long time ago)
dont mind reading whole post despite it was a bit long its allways good to share opinions with ppl who play primary healing classes
 
H

hellraisermk2

Guest
Perfect Res is so amazing! Why would anyone ever say otherwise?

I mean really, it's so good that in the middle of a battle, once someone has died and lost all their buffs that that one person can be brought back to life unbuffed. That's such an amazing skill to have, especially when it isn't overwritten by a crappy first teir res, or when teh healer has had enough time to stop healing the rest of the group to get the PR'd character rebuffed and ready for combat (the fact the rest of the group, if not yourself will have died in that time is irrelivent! UBAR!).

Who needs amazing group RA's like SOS/ GP/ BOF/ BAoD that actually help keep your entire group alive as soon as they're used? PR is godlike! In fact I think it should be nerfed into the ground!
 
C

Carlos Bananos

Guest
Originally posted by infernalwrath
3 clerics in a group ? :rolleyes:
say teh words GIMP GROUP ktnx
Click to expand...

2 is enough


2x cleric
sorc
friar
mincer
pally
2 arms/merc


comparing 3 PRs to 1 BoF is kinda retarded "omfg if u use your RA 3 times its better than mine!!!!" :rolleyes:
 
G

Gewny

Guest
Originally posted by infernalwrath
why ? why should healers have to rely on bb or on shaman of the group (if he dies no dex/quick)
i love healing class i play cleric and i dont like healer casue he does not have a dex/quick buff and i dont want to rely on anyone and cba to make a bb and pay mroe money to mythic cause they are morons
btw group haste is a maijor advantage of aug line imo
Click to expand...

lol have u tried to use Celerity in rvr, its almost time to get a smack on ure head if u have, cuz as a healer you have a bunch of other things do to that will affect the battle more.
But yes its good in pve.

What relly ticks me of is the fact that we are discussing what is (according to many) the best RA in mid... and yet the discussion tends to lean towards, pr being not worth the cost.
 
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Carlos Bananos

Guest
Originally posted by Gewny
What relly ticks me of is the fact that we are discussing what is (according to many) the best RA in mid... and yet the discussion tends to lean towards, pr being not worth the cost.
Click to expand...
 
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infernalwrath

Guest
Originally posted by Carlos Bananos
2 is enough


2x cleric
sorc
friar
mincer
pally
2 arms/merc


comparing 3 PRs to 1 BoF is kinda retarded "omfg if u use your RA 3 times its better than mine!!!!" :rolleyes:
Click to expand...
i am not the once comparing them :d
tank group is the best but i whould not take a friar imo ... low hp no determ no pf
 
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