TV new star trek series!

[Fweddy]

On this I disagree tho. I think what he did for Star Trek will be perfect for Star Wars - as Star Wars was always just a fantasy in a space setting. There's no rules for him to break and his direction of action will fit it perfectly.

I don't consider them very good action films though. Every film I've seen of his I've been disappointed by. They seem to start off well and then there always seems to be some missing element that stops the ending being particularly satisfying. I'm not sure what exactly, I've never been interested enough to think about one in detail. But couple that with a history of not respecting franchises and not making good science fiction and even with Star Wars being much simpler thematically than Star Trek I reckon he could easily mess it up. This doesn't seem too far off my opinion: http://www.nerve.com/movies/jj-abrams-is-the-most-overrated-director-of-our-time

Back on topic, I'm still excited by more Star Trek. I'm going to have to go watch the old ones some more.

 

[DaGaffer]

Because they treat it as fantasy rather than giving even cursory lip service to science fiction.

It's not really an SF versus fantasy argument, although I see what you're getting at, its just a failure in the internal logic of the story. If you think about it for even a second, they've created the ultimate weapon which has no real defence. You deliver annihilation to your enemies, anywhere, without leaving your desk and at no risk to yourself. It's God Mode, which doesn't make for an interesting story.

I remember Larry Niven writing about this issue, creating a "cool" technology which ultimately made future stories impossible (I think he was talking about stasis fields or something). The problem for the writer is the solution to every story becomes "well just use x"

 

[Tom]

Star Trek has done that for years though. TOS had a barrier around the galaxy that turned people into supernatural beings. They had a tiny robot that could sterilise entire planets. TMP had a huge probe that vanished into thin air. The Genesis device was never used again. In TSFP we learned that Vulcans can be brought back from the dead, no problem. The Voyage Home re-introduced time travel by flying a bit fast and then braking, which makes no sense. TFF said that God lived at the centre of the galaxy, a 25,000 light year trip they somehow made in a day or two. In TUC an exploding moon somehow broke the laws of physics and sent a shockwave that moved faster than the speed of light.

It's all bollocks, really. What makes Star Trek good is that at the root of the best stories, they're about humanity, not the technology. The latter is just a means to an end.

 

[Syri]

I'm with Tom on this, there's been a lot of seriously powerful stuff cropped up in Trek before, and likely will again, and they all get brushed out of the way for the next big thing to come along. All they need to do really is say something like "It was experimental and we found a glitch" or "it uses a rare fuel that we couldn't synthesise any more of". Really powerful living probes? It's OK, it went to hibernate for another couple of centuries. There's a lot of things could easily be explained away, if they tackle it right.
I much prefer to see what they come up with, and then decide if it's any good or not based on whether I actually enjoyed it, rather than keep thinking about what might have been more of a threat in the past.

 

[Deebs]

This thread reads like a bunch of old men whining that everything was better in the old days

It wasnt, move on!

New trek and new ideas yay

Only have this to say

 

[Scouse]

Nice

 

[chipper]

thing is trek has done really well over the years with tech hell they even predicted some of it which is down right freaky. yes they've made some monumental cockups with some stories but when all is said and done its a fictional show sometimes its gonna fall short and sci fi fans as meticulous as they are will go actually thats not possible. but it doesnt mean they didnt enjoy the episode etc. as long as its not mission impossible in space im good.

 

[Scouse]

as long as its not mission impossible in space im good.

That's really what it is now.

 

[Ormorof]

Tom Cruise as Captain Pirk

 

[DaGaffer]

Star Trek has done that for years though.
1. TOS had a barrier around the galaxy that turned people into supernatural beings.

2. They had a tiny robot that could sterilise entire planets.

3. TMP had a huge probe that vanished into thin air.

4. The Genesis device was never used again.

5.In TSFP we learned that Vulcans can be brought back from the dead, no problem.

6. The Voyage Home re-introduced time travel by flying a bit fast and then braking, which makes no sense.

7. TFF said that God lived at the centre of the galaxy, a 25,000 light year trip they somehow made in a day or two.

8. In TUC an exploding moon somehow broke the laws of physics and sent a shockwave that moved faster than the speed of light.

It's all bollocks, really. What makes Star Trek good is that at the root of the best stories, they're about humanity, not the technology. The latter is just a means to an end.

1. Like I said, if it was in TOS, doesn't really matter because they weren't trying to create a legacy.
2. Which I seem to remember they dealt with by giving them a planet and putting it off limits or something?
3. Doesn't matter to future stories
4. Which they kind of dealt with by killing all the people who created it.
5. Well no, they didn't. Vulcans dropped on to the Genesis planet, while it was growing, which no longer exists
6. Fair point, but then FTL itself is probably bollocks anyway. It doesn't actually matter as long as its internally consistent and doesn't create more problems with future stories
7. Also fair point, although it wasn't God and I assumed whatever it was helped them get there (It was a terrible film and I can't remember)
8. This one I will give you; it was a rubbish Soviet/Chernobyl/Perestroika analogy, but once again, it didn't break the logic of the show.

You're right that there's a ton of things in Trek that don't bear close scrutiny as technology or science, but very few of them actually fuck up the logic of the Trek Universe, certainly not since TNG anyway, but the nuTrek stuff does.

 

[Tom]

1. Like I said, if it was in TOS, doesn't really matter because they weren't trying to create a legacy.
2. Which I seem to remember they dealt with by giving them a planet and putting it off limits or something?
3. Doesn't matter to future stories
4. Which they kind of dealt with by killing all the people who created it.
5. Well no, they didn't. Vulcans dropped on to the Genesis planet, while it was growing, which no longer exists
6. Fair point, but then FTL itself is probably bollocks anyway. It doesn't actually matter as long as its internally consistent and doesn't create more problems with future stories
7. Also fair point, although it wasn't God and I assumed whatever it was helped them get there (It was a terrible film and I can't remember)
8. This one I will give you; it was a rubbish Soviet/Chernobyl/Perestroika analogy, but once again, it didn't break the logic of the show.

You're right that there's a ton of things in Trek that don't bear close scrutiny as technology or science, but very few of them actually fuck up the logic of the Trek Universe, certainly not since TNG anyway, but the nuTrek stuff does.

<nerd hat>

2 - the robot was trapped in a logic loop and blew itself up
3 - TMP established that Kirk was now an admiral so it does matter.
4 - Carol Marcus created the Genesis device and she wasn't dead
5 - Sarek told Kirk that Spock could be brought back to life well before they knew about his new body

</nerd hat>

 

[Raven]

Am I the only one that understands that the new Star Trek films have nothing at all to do with the original series, original films, or the new(ish) shows? The ships and tech are completely different for a start, the only thing that is the same is the names of the characters and that it has space ships in it.

They are a separate reboot and we don't even know if the new Star Trek will be based in the original universe or the new one.

Yes, old Spock is in it too but that's irrelevant. More to get the fanboys interested than anything else.

 

[Scouse]

very few of them actually fuck up the logic of the Trek Universe, certainly not since TNG anyway, but the nuTrek stuff does.

Aye.


@Raven - it's the nature of the changes they've made. The changes have been so drastic (yet subtle) as to make it not star trek any more. It just looks like it.

 

[MYstIC G]

I'd quite like a Trek series that moved between factions more. I'd love to see the Romulans infiltrating the Klingon Empire for example. That or key moments, what happened at Khitomer or the Klingon Civil war.

 

[MYstIC G]

Oh or mirror universe. Also if it's set in the TNG timeline hopefully they'll pick up on some of the story from the MMO as a lot of it makes really good use of lots of trek ideas.

 

[CorNokZ]

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0VuIShM5kAQ