New caster speed introduced in 1.75 and how it affects the main speed classes

Zoia

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This is just another pointless "fix" from Mythic to something that never needed any fixing in the first place.
The improved runspeed in PvE is great. It will make it faster to do quests and get around for classes with no speed.

I can't remember seeing anyone wanting faster caster/healer speed, so i have no idea why Mythic suddenly felt like boosting it.
They often make these pointless fixes without thinking about the consequences.
I think their intentions are good but i doubt they even thought about skalds/minstrels when they did this, and how it would affect them in RvR groups.
Fine, SoS1 is nice, so is AotG2-3 if you run with a tank group, but not every skald can afford 15-30 RA points in one RA.
The main reason to group a skald/minstrel is speedz, but if you can run almost as fast and have a more usefull class in the group, do you really want a class just for SoS1?
A BD would be a better interrupter/damage dealer and most mids already have 3 sojourners in a group.

This will be nice for hib groups with lazy bards though.
No need to twist end/speed, just run on caster speed and let bard run end and you'll run faster than you would with only bard speed. :p
 

Chimaira

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Zebolt said:
Ppl are focusing too much about that caster speed + sprint will be the same as mincer/skald/bard speed.. You can sprint with those speeds too if ppl didn't know ^^

Was about to post the same.

only good post in this fokin thread.

zebbe rox ;d
 

Chronictank

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Zebolt said:
Are you even reading the post? It's not the same speed it's still lower than mincer speed. So you can't keep up ^^
Are YOU reading the post, potentially runemaster+sprint can keep up with a skald. And once again why have a mincer when sorc speed is only just off
Erm.. how many thane banelords do you know? lol xD
what a stupid reply,
mid - berserkers/bonedancers/warlocks
alb - merc/reaver/heretic
Now would you take a mincer/skald over them if u have space for a the dmg dealer slot

Kinda funny how you all crying about mincer will not be wanted in grps etc. How many other stealthers do you invite in grps? You often running with infils/scouts? I doubt it tbh..
why should they?
battlemincers are specced to join non-stealther grps
 

Outlander

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can my infil and wiz get speed boost too please would make things a lot easier :)
 

Zebolt

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Chronictank said:
Are YOU reading the post, potentially runemaster+sprint can keep up with a skald. And once again why have a mincer when sorc speed is only just off
Mincers can allso sprint you know xD lol

Chronictank said:
what a stupid reply,
mid - berserkers/bonedancers/warlocks
alb - merc/reaver/heretic
Now would you take a mincer/skald over them if u have space for a the dmg dealer slot
Stupid reply? rly? The quote you did was me discussing that skalds what not worse than thanes in grp even without speed and then you mention banelord when I was talking about thanes.. I guess you're the clever one then ^^


Chronictank said:
why should they?
battlemincers are specced to join non-stealther grps
I can spec my hunter for non-stealther grp, do you think I will get any? x<
 

Zoia

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Zebolt said:
Mincers can allso sprint you know xD lol<
Of course they can, but they wont sprint much faster than one with casterspeed.
There's already plenty of groups that run without a skald. Do you think increased casterspeed will make them change their mind and invite a skald?
People invite minstrels and skalds for speed, but when that speed is only a little bit better than the 2nd best, why invite them?

I can spec my hunter for non-stealther grp, do you think I will get any? x<
Comparing this to your hunter is stupid. Most people make an archer/assassin to sneak around solo or with other stealthers.
A lot of people make minstrels/skalds to get into a visable group. They are classed as support by many as well.

I know there's lots of other classes that doesn't get a group either, but speed was what gave skalds and minstrels a group.
Take that away (that's what they have almost done) and you don't need those classes in a group.

Skalds and minstrels are frustrated because there was no need for this change.
All it does is make one class less wanted. Is that so hard to understand?
 

Outlander

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the fact that a skald/mincer would have to sprint in order to remain with the faster speed says it all really, badly thought out idea all this imo.
 

Thegreatest

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Yeah yeah we know skalds and minstrels can sprint too, but tell me what use does endurance have for casters? Right, sprint.

Now also tell me, what use does endurance have for minstrels/skalds (tanks)? Right, now I would like to suggest this change:

"Casters now lose an additional 10pp every 5 seconds while sprinting, this change was needed to add a small penalty to a caster that sprints to keep them on par with tanks which lose vital endurance they need to perform styles when they use sprint"

hope you got the difference between a sprinting caster and a sprinting tank now.
 

Zebolt

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Outlander said:
the fact that a skald/mincer would have to sprint in order to remain with the faster speed says it all really
they don't ^^
 

Zebolt

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Zoia said:
All it does is make one class less wanted. Is that so hard to understand?
If they add something on a class, how can you say all it does it to make one class less wanted? How about speed casters more wanted? Is that so hard to understand?
 

Gamah

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Yea because speed casters have "so much" trouble getting groups :/ ... If mythic did a pointless fix to threaten your class's spot in a group you wouuld be saying something as well, but it's ok as long as its in someone else's backgarden.
 

Zoia

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Zebolt said:
If they add something on a class, how can you say all it does it to make one class less wanted? How about speed casters more wanted? Is that so hard to understand?
You still don't understand.
People wont always invite casters because of speed, but when their speed is almost as good as that of a primary speed class, there's less need for a speed class in a group.

Alb groups already have a sorc. When their speed is nearly as good as a minstrel's, why invite a minstrel if you can put in another caster or merc for better damage?

The whole point is that the increased caster speed isn't needed at all!
 

Zebolt

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Zoia said:
You still don't understand.
People wont always invite casters because of speed, but when their speed is almost as good as that of a primary speed class, there's less need for a speed class in a group.

Alb groups already have a sorc. When their speed is nearly as good as a minstrel's, why invite a minstrel if you can put in another caster or merc for better damage?

The whole point is that the increased caster speed isn't needed at all!
Ofc I understand that ^^

And who says it isn't needed? I think it's needed, I run too slow :p
 

Zebolt

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Gamah said:
Yea because speed casters have "so much" trouble getting groups :/ ... If mythic did a pointless fix to threaten your class's spot in a group you wouuld be saying something as well, but it's ok as long as its in someone else's backgarden.
It happened before, when SI and Savage came I got no grps at all. RM's wasn't wanted. I wasn't whining then ^^
 

Zoia

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Zebolt said:
And who says it isn't needed? I think it's needed, I run too slow :p
That's why you can invite a skald/minstrel/bard. :p
 

Coolan

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Zebolt said:
It happened before, when SI and Savage came I got no grps at all. RM's wasn't wanted. I wasn't whining then ^^
you wernt wanted think of the poor hamsters :), maybe i should try speccing my hunter 40bow/50spear/41bc hell hes got a higher af than my zerker :)
 

Void959

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Zebolt said:
If they add something on a class, how can you say all it does it to make one class less wanted? How about speed casters more wanted? Is that so hard to understand?
LOL I knew somebody would say that eventually... but do you seriously believe that was the intention or are you just clutching at straws?

I don't know a single person who rolled a speed caster hoping to get groups spots for their speed. On the other hand, every battle-specced minstrel (50inst/44slash) and the majority of skalds had their speed as a primary consideration when they rolled, and are relying on it for groupability. So yes it did make speed casters more useful... fractionally more useful; and at the same time it rendered battle mincers and skalds almost useless for groups.
 

Jeros

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Just to clarify how utterly shite AE Mez is on a mincer

it is BAD! i mean so bad it should not even be considered a benifit, its AE Mez immunity for the enemy :/

A somtimes, REALLY wish i was a skald, ya mincers get a lot of tools.......but they arent much help when you have a 2h skald ripping through you, and your buffer and your 1h weapon usally wont save you against the damage, the DDs on a skald are the same damage as a mincers, and if the skald decides to put up a body resist chant......oh dear.
 

TheBinarySurfer

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Zoia said:
You still don't understand.
People wont always invite casters because of speed, but when their speed is almost as good as that of a primary speed class, there's less need for a speed class in a group.

Alb groups already have a sorc. When their speed is nearly as good as a minstrel's, why invite a minstrel if you can put in another caster or merc for better damage?

The whole point is that the increased caster speed isn't needed at all!
The minstrel was never designed as a primary stealth class - it was designed as a support class with some solo ability in the form of its melee spec and instruments line.

I get flamed by various assassins for not being able to beat them without most of my toys - IM NOT SUPPOSED TO BE ABLE TO, the mincer was designed as a support class with moderate fighting ability and high utility...NOT a primary stealth class with a massive damage output like an assassin/archer.
Only reason i can pull if off often is my RR and obscene amount of sneaky tricks and toys i have on her...
If all the high rr mincers on the server are honest about it theyll say the same too - skill is irrelevant when you have a class that can hit you for twice your melee damage and swing a lot faster than you with two weapons to your one.If you dont have the bells and whistles up its all over bar the shouting.

Its been one long nerf for the mincer the last few patches tbh, yes we were very powerful at one point, but if i had to pick the two weakest classes at the moment in terms of being needed in groups for rvr in alb i'd say minstrels and armsmen.

Go back two years they sure as hell werent at the bottom of the wanted list.
 

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