Mythic sais Feature GoA says bug. Poisonspike issue

[Azathrim]

There's a chance it'll stay like it is until 1.80 is live in Europe, or its possible Mythic may send us a fix earlier.

Many, many small problems and bugs are hotfixed by our techs (not by the GM team as you seem to assume) every week. These people are fully competent and more than capable of changing a database field without supervision. Some of them have even been on courses you know.

One day they are "more than capable" to introduce a change. The next day they cannot remove the very same change on their own?

Sorry Requiel, but that just seems a bit confusing.

It is ofcourse a purely technical manner, right?
Because, it would be very childish to simply postpone a proper implementation as a way to keep a change ingame which you think is better than what Mythic implemented. And a "more than capable" company like GOA would never belittle itself to those kind of methods.

I hope I won't be disappointed on this one Cylian.

 

[Cylian]

first time ever that GOA changes something before Mythic does, then don't revert the change when it turns out it was intended as a feature.
Wild guess, someone got owned by Poisonspike once to often

 

[Azathrim]

first time ever that GOA changes something before Mythic does, then don't revert the change when it turns out it was intended as a feature.
Wild guess, someone got owned by Poisonspike once to often

Are you suggesting that GOA allow their employees to affect the game beyond what Mythic intended out of reasons from their personal playtime?

I don't think that's the case. But I can see how they have given that impression in this case. Which makes me wonder why they haven't fought hard to eliminate any reason to carry suchs harsh accusations. Forinstance, by removing the bug they introduced instead of allowing it to loiter around on the servers.

 

[Neffneff]

im gonna say it one more time for the slow uptakers.

the "bug" they introduced of not having PS in combat, was a side effect of fixing a genuine bug.

to begin with, they didnt realise they HAD introduced a bug, as the "bug" was actually the way it was originally meant to be.

SO they will fix the "bug" as soon as they can do WITHOUT re-introducing the GENUINE bug. it may be 1.80...OR it may be sooner IF mythic provide a hot fix that wont re-introduce the poper bug...

everyone with me on this?

 

[Cylian]

Poisonspike and Tanglesnare combo ... the horror!

how often do you run into that ?

 

[Tilda]

Nah, I am sure GOA will handle this in a professional and competent way.

Especially as it's a GOA only bug (no matter the reason of communication breakdown that was the cause of this).

Its not a bug, its a side effect of a bug fix.
You're starting to sound like a stuck record.

 

[Tilda]

One day they are "more than capable" to introduce a change. The next day they cannot remove the very same change on their own?

Sorry Requiel, but that just seems a bit confusing.

It is ofcourse a purely technical manner, right?
Because, it would be very childish to simply postpone a proper implementation as a way to keep a change ingame which you think is better than what Mythic implemented. And a "more than capable" company like GOA would never belittle itself to those kind of methods.

I hope I won't be disappointed on this one Cylian.

Goa fixed a bug with poison spike, lets call this bug A
As a side effect, the 10 sec disarm thing started working again, lets call this sideeffect B.

If goa reveresed B, which they can easily do, then A would start working again. Having seen what the bug is, its the kinda thing you really dont want people messing about with on live servers. Tbh, i'd say the 10 sec disarm, is preferable to having people exploiting this bug.

You seem to think this is some goa vs mythic fight. Thats a pretty purile perspective. Both are companies acting sensibly, but you're miscontruing information given to you, to make it look like some kids fight. I'm sure you're better than that.

Its nothing like that, but the fact is, yes, the side effect B shouldn't be there, however, both mythic and goa realise the seriousness of A.
Thus goa are waiting to see if mythic can sort a hotfix for A that dosn't result in B. If not, then B may have to stay until A is fixed next patch.

Comprend?

 

[Cylian]

Its nothing like that, but the fact is, yes, the side effect B shouldn't be there, however, both mythic and goa realise the seriousness of A.

where's the smily when you need one ?
there's far worse issues than a tanglesnare in this game

 

[Azathrim]

Uhm, now that's a hilarious rewritting of history Tilda and Neffneff.

Let's look at what the GOAt have to say on the subject:

The fact that you could drop these abilities in combat was reported to us as a bug. We checked documentation and found that, as designed, they weren't supposed to work that way. We double checked with Mythic who confirmed it - we never make changes like that without reference to Mythic as it's their game. Apparently there was some confusion regarding the check, perhaps they misunderstood our query, perhaps we misunderstood their response.

.

- The level 6 and 8 master abilities of the Spymaster path have now again a cast time greater than zero.

Their intention was not to fix the double cast of Tanglesnare and Poisonspike. Their intention was to fix the incombat cast of Poison spike.

The Tanglesnare Poisonspike bug is a 1.80b change. It may have been part of the miscommunication with Mythic. But GOA's goal was to fix something interely different.

Whatever the historical reasons or the words you chose to describe it and explain it away, the current implementation on EU is a BUG.

The fact that GOA introduced this bug (for various reasons, some might argue some very dubious reasons) should be a tell-tell sign that it's important to correct this error FAST.

Just the mere fact that Mythic had to publicly correct GOA, a business associate, before GOA had the chance to correct their error is a showing sign something is terrible wrong in this situation.

 

[Fenderon]

why drop both on some bridge when you can drop spike during the fight?

 

[Neffneff]

Uhm, now that's a hilarious rewritting of history Tilda and Neffneff.

Let's look at what the GOAt have to say on the subject:

to begin with, they didnt realise they HAD introduced a bug, as the "bug" was actually the way it was originally meant to be.

it really aint that hard to grasp tbh.

 

[Neffneff]

Just the mere fact that Mythic had to publicly correct GOA, a business associate, before GOA had the chance to correct their error is a showing sign something is terrible wrong in this situation.

just had to comment on this one too.

i REALLY REALLY REALLY doubt they were correcting GoA publicaly on their board.

to be quite frank, the reason they posted it up for people to read was due to the extreme shit they got from the childish gaming community over it. they needed to post something to shut people up. i somehow reckon they might have communicated with GoA about it alrdy, settled it in house etc before that was posted. just because mythic was giving feedback to the gaming community doesnt mean they were having a slanging match with GoA on official channels.

fgs take a step back, yes its a bug, okay so it needs correcting, but there is also another bug that needed correcting. atm, they conflict until 1.80 or a hot fix from mythic, jsut cos you dont mind the other bug doesnt make it any less important.

 

[[GOA]Erivoss]

Their intention was not to fix the double cast of Tanglesnare and Poisonspike. Their intention was to fix the incombat cast of Poison spike.

I'm sorry but that is wrong and what Requiel said is wrong too (nobody is perfect).

The original bug was the fact that you could place several mines at the same time. We fixed that.

Later, we got reports that since our "fix" you couldn't place mines while in combat. We checked this and it was indeed the case. Since that was how the ability had worked originally, and that the change in this ability (the change allowing you to drop them in combat) didn't appear in the patch notes - we decided to keep the fix in.

So for the last time - our "fix" is not to make these mines not usable in combat, it's to prevent several being placed at the same time.

At the moment we are waiting for Mythic to decide what we should do next. 3 choices seem apparant:

1. Keep it as it is and in 1.80 when the bug about placing multiple mines is fixed, we will remove our fix.

2. Get a hotfix now which prevents multiple mines being placed and then remove our fix.

3. Remove our fix now and allow the ability to be exploitable until 1.80 where it will be fixed.

Again that is up to Mythic to decide and we will not touch anything until they have made their decision.

 

[Cylian]

Again that is up to Mythic to decide and we will not touch anything until they have made their decision.

"A lesson learned" comes to mind, should've considered that approach before messing with a hardly used "exploit".

like Fenderon said, "why drop both on some bridge when you can drop spike during the fight?"

 

[Corran]

"A lesson learned" comes to mind, should've considered that approach before messing with a hardly used "exploit".

like Fenderon said, "why drop both on some bridge when you can drop spike during the fight?"

Mythic were involved in the original decision, you know this because they stated there was a miscommunication somewhere. So how is this different to the mannor they in communication now? I dont see one!

 

[dub]

I'm sorry but that is wrong and what Requiel said is wrong too (nobody is perfect).

The original bug was the fact that you could place several mines at the same time. We fixed that.

Later, we got reports that since our "fix" you couldn't place mines while in combat. We checked this and it was indeed the case. Since that was how the ability had worked originally, and that the change in this ability (the change allowing you to drop them in combat) didn't appear in the patch notes - we decided to keep the fix in.

So for the last time - our "fix" is not to make these mines not usable in combat, it's to prevent several being placed at the same time.

At the moment we are waiting for Mythic to decide what we should do next. 3 choices seem apparant:

1. Keep it as it is and in 1.80 when the bug about placing multiple mines is fixed, we will remove our fix.

2. Get a hotfix now which prevents multiple mines being placed and then remove our fix.

3. Remove our fix now and allow the ability to be exploitable until 1.80 where it will be fixed.

Again that is up to Mythic to decide and we will not touch anything until they have made their decision.

thanks for this clarification , now my question is easier to formulate , what made goa do a "fix" by themselves instead of waiting for for the 1.80 patch ?

is there special considerations you take when taking these measures ? , did mythic tell you to do it ?, in general im curious about this policy and what it might bring.

as we all know by now it easy to create more severe gameflaws fast than the one your trying to remedy , so in hindsight will you be testing effects of changes of what you implement before they go live ?

 

[[GOA]Erivoss]

thanks for this clarification , now my question is easier to formulate , what made goa do a "fix" by themselves instead of waiting for for the 1.80 patch ?

is there special considerations you take when taking these measures ? , did mythic tell you to do it ?, in general im curious about this policy and what it might bring.

as we all know by now it easy to create more severe gameflaws fast than the one your trying to remedy , so in hindsight will you be testing effects of changes of what you implement before they go live ?

We always try and fix bugs as quickly as possible.

Yes there are special considerations we take into account, which I won't tell you about.

We did test the changes - and the bug we were fixing got fixed. As the side effect was - as far as we were concerned - how the ability was supposed to work anyway (no where is it indicated in the patch notes that mines go from not being useable in combat to being useable in combat) we didn't realise it was a "side effect" until after.

 

[Cylian]

considering that the reaction of the players, both in US and EU got Mythic to reply to this through their Grab Bag pretty fast, do you really believe it's better to stick to this "fix" than just reverting it until you patch to 1.80 ?

btw, why no early fix for SoI+MoC for example ? that was more game-breaking than this.

 

[Penlid]

Some more answers in this thread on pryd.net

http://www.pryd.net/showthread.php?t=5833

 

[Corran]

considering that the reaction of the players, both in US and EU got Mythic to reply to this through their Grab Bag pretty fast, do you really believe it's better to stick to this "fix" than just reverting it until you patch to 1.80 ?

btw, why no early fix for SoI+MoC for example ? that was more game-breaking than this.

Actually the side effect of the soi+moc fix is much worse then the side effect of this fix imo.

Soi+moc fix = Moc or BoF become useless on alb as cant fire both at same time. Other realms dont have that problem and it can have a massive effect in high rr fights

 

[Corran]

Some more answers in this thread on pryd.net

http://www.pryd.net/showthread.php?t=5833

Haha, some people posting there have comments more stupid then most of teh FH posts. Didnt think it was possible.

 

[Cylian]

Actually the side effect of the soi+moc fix is much worse then the side effect of this fix imo.

Soi+moc fix = Moc or BoF become useless on alb as cant fire both at same time. Other realms dont have that problem and it can have a massive effect in high rr fights

design decision

 

[Corran]

design decision

If it a design decision then why dont all realms and classes suffer restriction? Especially all LT casters?

Oh wait, you aint got an answer for that one i bet. Or Probably something like "Albs are overpowered anyways!!!"

 

[Cylian]

seen any mention of this not being intended ?