Help Legal advice re: downloads

[soze]

How did the "games" company get the persons details??

There is only one way I know and that's your ISP, even the BPI don't have the gonads to take on the legal system in the UK by illegally obtaining private & confidential information.

The data protection laws are there for a reason. Flagrant violation of those laws is not a wise move.

As you say legal or professional advice is always the best call.

How the artical describes it is these lawyers find your IP by watching the tracker find it belongs to. Then if the company wants to sue they get a court order (whatever it is in the UK) to force BT to tell them the owner of the IP Address. This was on The Register not sure if thats what happened here.

 

[Tay]

How the artical describes it is these lawyers find your IP by watching the tracker find it belongs to. Then if the company wants to sue they get a court order (whatever it is in the UK) to force BT to tell them the owner of the IP Address. This was on The Register not sure if thats what happened here.

These solicitors hire somebody "supposedly" more experienced than themselves, which is not difficult, to trawl Bit torrent sites for IP's the companies can then (and often for free through RIPE) approximate those IP ranges to ISP's. They need to then associate that IP with a username, they need provide proof that this person(s) have activily participated in "sharing" software, note: I have yet to see anybody prosecuted for simply downloading software, sharing yes, downloading now.

The mere fact that a company has an IP is neither here nor there, they need proof. BT or any other ISP in the UK is going to need pretty compelling reasons for handing over the details.

I recall back a few years and SCO were on their last legs and they started trying to con people out of license fees for software they said companies were using.

When a company is on its last legs they'll often do anything to try and intimidate people and get cash and I suspect that this is what is happening here. "lets threaten a load of people and see how many cough up cash".

Who really know until somebody gets one of these letters.

Having said all this, its one reason one I have moved away from torrents, there is no such thing as a secure one. No way to hide your IP and not much you can do if you get caught red handed. You have effectivly offered up software for download violating the IP of the software company.

 

[Manisch Depressiv]

Let's be realistic, two possible scenarios:

1. Seek a lawyer, don't know how much you have to pay for an entry discussion in the UK, but this is the only way (if the lawyer isn't a dumb shit) for you to be sure on this. The mistake has been done, now you can only limit the damage or keep it under control.

2. Ring them up and tell them to either stop it or to take this to court as you didn't do anything. Don't discuss with them about anything, just tell them that. You may come clean but you may pay more than they want.

Saying it was your connection but not you might not work, in Germany you're responsible for what's happening from your connection (WEP is considered as an open door since the medieval times, there is better protection).

(I don't support piracy of stuff that is used commercially, I think that this is just wrong, but I don't believe in the damage numbers the film / video gaming industries are making up either.

The whole copyright system is a joke, e.g. without William Gibson there wouldn't be any Shadowrun IP or Matrix franchise, yet I doubt that he got a penny from FASA or the Wachowskis. Gibson got influenced too, so where does theft start then?

If you can see, hear, smell, taste it then you can copy it. At least we don't have software patents in the EU and disassembling is allowed but the industry is working against it too.)

 

[Zede]

i can tell you in contract law that the letter doesnt need to be delivered. it just needs to be passed to the royal mail.
not sure how it applys here.

Thats absolute tosh.

It absolutely, utterly has to delivered and SIGNED for, or some other undisputable source. You can claim total ignorance until then. Ive been though a dozen court cases over the years, and one thing i have noticed - solicitors, authorities use fear as their primary weapon. Fear, and fanatical dedication to the Pope are 2 weapons..ah i digress. Recorded/special delivery wouldnt exist if nobody ever needed " proof "

Your friend could string this out for a long time if they want to. If they have just one infringment on your friend, they are on very shakey ground.

 

[Naetha]

Thanks for the additional replies - all taken on board

 

[Dukat]

I dont know much about legal stuff, however I would, as the others have said, not ignore it.

I would think seriously before phoning the senders of the letter up - If you phone them up unprepared it could well make things far far worse.

One of the best lessons my Dad taught me is: "Never admit anything, ever", it really seems work too, but dont deny everything either if you can get away with it, denying something you later admit could make things worse, from what I understand.

As someone else has said, approaching a solicitor might be an idea, the fact that you have a receipt for a copy of the game that predates the download should really work in your favour, seeing as if you have paid to own the thing legally then downloading it from a "dodgy" site shouldnt be so much of an offense (I think? can anyone confirm or deny this?).

Whatever you do, just think about it first - get advice from a solicitor in RL instead of just asking people on here (no offense to you lawyer types, but its the most sensible thing to do) because that way, if they give you give you bad advice they could be liable for it(again, I think) - you have no chance of that online.

Best of luck either way.

 

[Zede]

I dont know much about legal stuff, however I would, as the others have said, not ignore it.

I would think seriously before phoning the senders of the letter up - If you phone them up unprepared it could well make things far far worse.

One of the best lessons my Dad taught me is: "Never admit anything, ever", it really seems work too, but dont deny everything either if you can get away with it, denying something you later admit could make things worse, from what I understand.

As someone else has said, approaching a solicitor might be an idea, the fact that you have a receipt for a copy of the game that predates the download should really work in your favour, seeing as if you have paid to own the thing legally then downloading it from a "dodgy" site shouldnt be so much of an offense (I think? can anyone confirm or deny this?).

Whatever you do, just think about it first - get advice from a solicitor in RL instead of just asking people on here (no offense to you lawyer types, but its the most sensible thing to do) because that way, if they give you give you bad advice they could be liable for it(again, I think) - you have no chance of that online.

Best of luck either way.

that would work I reckon. Had a dodgy cleaner in a place i worked once. she used to ask us for receipts for clothes - she would go into the department store, find the item relating to the recepit, make a little hole with a knife, then take it to the returns section...hand it in and get a "new" one, seemingly legit !

 

[Lamp]

First games. What next ? Music & movies. Most people have illegally downloaded movies and music from torrent sites lets be honest about it...

 

[Dukat]

First games. What next ? Music & movies. Most people have illegally downloaded movies and music from torrent sites lets be honest about it...

A friend of mine got a letter from paramount on a similar thing about movies, he bought the film in question and sent the receipt to them along with a letter saying how sorry he was and how he would give them his firstborn son etc etc and that was the last I ever heard of it, he never got fined or taken to court as far as I know

Always best to play it safe I think.

 

[Tay]

One of the best lessons my Dad taught me is: "Never admit anything, ever", it really seems work too, but dont deny everything either if you can get away with it, denying something you later admit could make things worse, from what I understand.

This is typically what happens when you are being cautioned by the police...the Denying bit

I know first hand, I have had a lots of points in my time..