In game CSR

[Alan]

Most E&E aren't listed as advisors, and there are no indicators that any advisors are E&E as well.

I know advisors can't change game settings, or reset encounters, but quite often they can be a first point of call for advice. (I wonder how many CSRs on US servers get asked in game directions or other stuff that could be answered by an advisor? :roll: )

How about the /advice system is "marketed" a little more, and ALL E&Es appear in there unless they're anon? Most of the people who've been playing for the same amount of time as me, have picked up lots of information and hints and tips about the game that could really help newer, or less experienced players.

Even being able to redirect people to better sources of information can really help - e.g someone asks what to spec in as a cabalist - you've never played a cabalist before so you suggest that they look on www.cabalist.org, or talk to <insert friendly level 50 experienced cabalist's name here (I usually use Belcar ) >.

Just some musings anyway

If i recall the /advisor flags dont traverse the zones, so someone flagged as an advisor in ToA wont be visable to someone leveling in avalon city

may be wrong tho. apart from that... nice idea.

 

[IainC]

Your reply really answered my initial quesiton - thank you

Is there any way to know which servers the GM's are likely to frequent ? or is there a secret method we can use to test if a GM is online somewhere as (I guess this is what the E&E channel is for anyway)

/who 100 is the instant way to see if a GM is online. I try and split my time fairly evenly between the servers so as not to favour one over the other. The other GMs do the same and in the course of an evening we may switch servers several times as we get reports from E&Es or Rightnow cases.

 

[Kami]

SWG costs $15, which is about £7, is it the same about daoc' cost, well it's actually lower.

Actually it's £8.30p

 

[Kami]

One thing that most people seem to have missed is that they have CSR's on the states partly to quickly identify any bugs that have made it past pendragon. These bugs generally don't make it to the GOA servers as they're sorted before hand.

Cheat wise I'd love CSRs on the english servers, far too many of them around but no I still say Rightnow is perfectly adequate alongsite Requiel and co.

 

[Zenythe]

This is going to sound really odd however it's something I have noticed since I've lived in Europe. The US tends to be very 24 hour oriented and it is part of the culture Europe for the most part is not (at least outside really large cities) not having support after 11 at night falls into that as well. I have run into very few cases of 24 hour support in any field in the 6 years since I moved out of the US.

Just a different perspective... oh and for info purposes I have been sitting on Prydwen for the last 4 hours and answered all of two questions...

 

[Daedalus]

*hugs Zenythe and Requiel*

 

[Nimah™]

This is going to sound really odd however it's something I have noticed since I've lived in Europe. The US tends to be very 24 hour oriented and it is part of the culture Europe for the most part is not (at least outside really large cities) not having support after 11 at night falls into that as well. I have run into very few cases of 24 hour support in any field in the 6 years since I moved out of the US.

Hehe, that's actually true. America seems to be one of these places that never sleeps (not been there myself, but you know, it's general knowledge)

Just a different perspective... oh and for info purposes I have been sitting on Prydwen for the last 4 hours and answered all of two questions...

Well. Yeah, ok, for now I changed my mind that it would probably be better to stay with the current support. Maybe it will be a good idea for catacombs as everything will be new to eu, let's just wait and see.

 

[Yussef]

Regarding the comments about the subscription cost we pay being the same/higher than what Mythic charge:

Didn't we used to pay less until that VAT + Internet policy change or something? Also need to consider royalty fees being paid towards Mythic, so GOA most likely receive less profit in comparision. Which would be a decent enough reason for the lack of a constant CSR team.

 

[Cavex ElSaviour]

Mythic manage to provide in game CSR, and a whole host of other things for the same price...... maybe its true they really do hire chimps <giggles>

the answer is easier. minimum wages are much lower, no social benefits has to be paid, and who knows. Maybe the ingame csr's has been outsourced to india like a truck load of other customer services in the US.

 

[old.Whoodoo]

As the US spans a number of time zones (5 is it?) when one side goes to bed, the other side is getting up, hence the more requisit of 24 hour support for anything available statewide. Europeans on the other hand span a normal +-2 hour timezone, so our off peak hours tend to be shared. Even Requiel has to sleep sometime .

I do advertise myself as an /advisor, but most people either dont know it exists, or have long forgotten. Can we have it advertised on the friday news sometime, most ppl know of the existance of the E&E, some may not be fully aware of the roles we play (all those chomping at my heals on tues night about the lag, i cant fix it ). When anyone asks me in game for help, I dont give my normal FH replies, but try and be as helpful and polite as possible, but thats something anyone in game can do. If not, i try for one of the GOA team, and /who 100 is the first place I look.

It would help having CSRs, but at what cost, both in money and the effects on the current GMs time and resources as well as taking them away from the work on patches and fixes.

Im with Tears on this, even before I became E&E, I had no problem with Rightnow, yes slow, but they did exactly what it said on the tin. Even though now I am E&E, I still Rightnow when its called for, and have always been happy (except once grr!!) with my replies.

 

[Gear]

RightNow is a nice tool and gets problems solved. However, having another 15 people in Necropolis doing ML5 g/steps and realising that 6-8 are not spawn and the time is something like 10 PM (normal playing time), RightNow is not really what you're looking for rigth then. Advisors and E&E are a good thing, but they cannot reset encounters.

How much would it cost to employ 3 people? I'll tell you 6,000 euro for all of them (and that's a bit too much but let's be generous). Now, take into consideration the customer numbers, and do the maths.

 

[scorge]

The GM's are more visable than they were a few months ago, i dont expect them to be at my beck and call, they are human too (Well maybe not Requiel, anybody that looks like a haggis can't be (thats what Zenythe said, honest!!! :eek2: ))

Although i do think it is a good idea for Eyes and Ears to get a tag after there name [E&E]. That way people can do /who and see if anybody is on, if a GM is not around and feeding the hampsters. Am sure Mythic could come up with a simple bit of coding since we do not have CSR's like them. Or instead of having a crafting title. e.g. journeyman alchemist it has Eyes & Ears.

 

[Mojo]

Wud be better if the E&E played more, not sure if they do on my server/realm i know 2 do but the others im not sure about, out of those 2 i have asked both questions in the last few weeks, 1 was really helpfull but no GM available the other i felt was not interested and was a tad condescending, enough so that i would not bother to ask anything again. That's not what i expect, i expect help and information, not sarcastic and condescending comments, if they were paid they would be accountable, as volunteers well its hit and miss.

I would be happier knowing these people got paid and that they were accountable and that a level of service would be expected and delivered in a professional manner. Not a don't be a n00b u shud know that, who cares and stop bothering me attitude.

 

[Tilda]

Wud be better if the E&E played more, not sure if they do on my server/realm i know 2 do but the others im not sure about, out of those 2 i have asked both questions in the last few weeks, 1 was really helpfull but no GM available the other i felt was not interested and was a tad condescending, enough so that i would not bother to ask anything again. That's not what i expect, i expect help and information, not sarcastic and condescending comments, if they were paid they would be accountable, as volunteers well its hit and miss.

I would be happier knowing these people got paid and that they were accountable and that a level of service would be expected and delivered in a professional manner. Not a don't be a n00b u shud know that, who cares and stop bothering me attitude.

If you can't find an E&E online, you can, as has already been stated, try #E&E

Tilda

 

[Mojo]

If you can't find an E&E online, you can, as has already been stated, try #E&E

Tilda

Ah yes very usefull i guess, but why do i need to install another third party program to get help ingame?

I generally don't use irc so would have to install it for this purpose and run it if/when i needed help

haveing E&E available on irc is better that not, but it's not quite up there with ingame CSR's

i would call it a workarround, not a solution

 

[Daedalus]

GoA should add a java chat applet on the E&E site.

 

[Firebirth]

Flim, hes one of the best E&E on Excal

 

[Cavex ElSaviour]

How much would it cost to employ 3 people? I'll tell you 6,000 euro for all of them (and that's a bit too much but let's be generous). Now, take into consideration the customer numbers, and do the maths.

6000 is way too low. Maybe thats the sum they will get but the costs will atleast be double that amount if not more. And just 3 for the english servers or for all servers? If you want 3 for all servers you ned personell that is qualified enough to speak/write/read 3 languages fluently (expensive) and the average waiting time per request will be high. If theres one thing ive learned then its better not to offer a service then to offer a poor service.
In the case of 3 csr's per english server Goa needs to allocate the english customers. Say there are 8000 paying accounts who can be flagged as english, then you cn expect a price increase of atleast 4 euro + vat/tax per month per account. absolut wise 4 euro + vat/tax isnt much, but percentage wise its a price increase of atleast 25% . 25% extra for a service that only works a tad better then the current service is an awful lot

 

[Alan]

Just make all E&E 51

/who 100 & /who 51 - sorted

<bring on the whine>

 

[Corran]

How much would it cost to employ 3 people? I'll tell you 6,000 euro for all of them (and that's a bit too much but let's be generous). Now, take into consideration the customer numbers, and do the maths.

What sort of times are you talking about wanting them?

Going by British Salaries here. This would come under customer support job. If it is a full time job (8hrs on avarage a day/5 days a week) then the salary for each person would have to be at least £10000. If you want them out of hours working through the night (say a 11pm-7am) as well those people would be on a higher wage to compensate the inconvience of the time.

If you add into it that the people will need technical skills in order to do the job (dont know what tools the gm have available but if it takes any coding or similar of any sort) then the salary will be increased even more.

So even if you only have 3 CSR's working 8hr shifts, That is a minimum of £30000 a yr increase in their costs. Then you got fact 2days arent covered by these 3 people. Remedy it by making it 12hr shifts, some days you got 2 people on at same time overlapping mind you with that, then you got to pay higher salaries due to the longer shifts (unless they work less days which is actually a plausable idea) yet longer shifts may mean they have to pay higher wage.

Add to that they need to be fluent in at least three languages if they are to do all servers means that the cost to higher such people is greatly increased due to the more demanding nature of the job and the necessity to have a much higher degree of schooling.

You look at the idea of CSR's as a good cheap option, but it is a good yet expensive option. The only way in which to get around it at a low cost is if they give the E&E access to things they wouldnt have as players, give them a small wage, and in return they will do the job when they play. But this means they need to be highly trusted people so as to know they wont be abusing this.

Ah well i think i typed enough crap now

 

[Gear]

Mates, I was on about a montly salary / expenses. 6000/3 = 2,000 per person cost. Now, assuming they dont have to be terribly quallified (1 for each language, replying only on important bugs, not on questions like where tnn is), and working on a 8-hour shift that will include a couple off-hours (that are peak hours in gaming terms, 4pm-midnight would be a good choice I guess), is something feasible. I'm not sure about taxation and social insurance costs in France, but I wreakon that would come up to a 60% extra on top of the employee's salary. Hence the employee would receive something like 1,300 euro per month net, with a total cost to GOA of around 2,000 euro per month, per person. Calculate that in BPS and it comes down to an annual pre-tax salary of slightly over 10,000 quid AFTER taxation. Not a bad deal for a not such a demanding job now, innit?

 

[Cavex ElSaviour]

no, but the costs for GOA will be much higher. About double the wages before tax to take care for social securities etc. add you standard costs (pc, desk, room, heating, electricity, secundairy wages like drinks and maybe a free account) and add some schooling + sofware costs and the bonsu they will need to be paid for after office hours and it will be around 10000 euro's a month / CSR



and with social security i mean the part the employer needs to pay, not the part the employee needs to pay

 

[Gear]

I can make you proper CSR for 2,000 euro per person per month TOTAL cost. France is not Denmark regarding taxation and social security. For heaven's sake we're talking about a customer base exceeding 10,000 people, surely they can put in 3 persons catering for that!!!

 

[Zenythe]

Uh Hem might I just suggest that you throw in the fact that we are in Paris, which while not as expensive as London is still fairly pricy to live in...

Figured I would throw that in since you seem to be number crunching.

 

[Corran]

How about the /advice system is "marketed" a little more, and ALL E&Es appear in there unless they're anon? Most of the people who've been playing for the same amount of time as me, have picked up lots of information and hints and tips about the game that could really help newer, or less experienced players.

Hey ya neatha old timer.

1) Seems you got your wish. /advice is the tip of the week

2) I think i need some advice from you! How do i avoid all the zerg's when im solo in emain (dont think there is an answer to that other then "dont leave the pk" )

 

[Alan]

The idea is that we have a presence on at least one server at most times of the day from around 10am till 11pm CET and if we aren't ingame, then an E&E can contact us quickly to get us there.

Not one to bump an old thread (well this isnt that old)

Last night 100+ people went from Prydwen Albion on a ML7 raid, first stop was erinys charm - within a few minutes all the named from the towns were killed and the charms in formation at the edge of the lava, but Samut refused to come over and play with us..... no GM's online.... looks like the E&E channel was idle...

Saddended the raid moved on to actualy do ML7, things went fine getting in and passing Flames, but then the dreaded Karorii was bugged, once again no GM's online... and no activity in the E&E channel, despite this ML7 raid being posted on fredyshouse for around a week, and knowing that Katorii is the most bugged encounter in the whole game - we were unable to find ANY help at all, rather than canceling the raid and leaving 100+ customers disapointed, the raid leader managed to convince a group of brave players to try training Katorii back into her maze, eventualy this worked but.....

It took around 2hrs to get past this one step,
2 members were unresable before autorelease and missed out on the rest of the raid.

This was not at a weekend, but within the times listed above on a week day.

This is not directed at the nice GM's who come and post here from time to time, but at GoA as a whoe for running DAOC - the support system currently is not working if 100+ customers are left in the shit twice in one session

 

[Brannor McThife]

GOA Roxxors!

<coughs>

Sorry.

<blushes and wanders off back to sleep in the corner.>

-G

 

[Darzil]

It may be worth rightnowing a plan to do ML7 in it's current state. Otherwise you are relying on GM's coming here to guess what you are doing.

Darzil

 

[Alan]

It may be worth rightnowing a plan to do ML7 in it's current state. Otherwise you are relying on GM's coming here to guess what you are doing.

Darzil

The previous raid did this - in the time from a GM reseting the encounter - to ML7 being run, Katorii was bugged again.

I could understand it if one or two people needed a little help and had to wait, but were talking over 100 customer here.

 

[Sarumancer]

Hey, since I now live in the US and am 7-8 hours behind GMT (arizona doesnt change times), how about Goa hires me to be an "overnight" watchdog

Ive done tech support for 5+ years, certs out the eyeballs, can fix pcs just fine, coded for muds, I've a smattering of french and german and if nothing else, I can use babelfish.

c'mon, you know you WANT to !