If your a reaver.. or thinking of making one.. pls remember

[Waok]

/Whine

Do you find it annoying how you have no Decent anytimes?
All your styles use lots of end?
SoulRendering is useless (after 30+),
Slow flew weps?
No Determination (although most other hybrids have it),
No grp qualities,
Low hit points,
Crap ra's - uToS, PBAOE Lifetap.. useless....
Your AOE's break mezz, and normally resist in PvE.

-

It's no wonder hardly any reavers are on excal/alb due to this.

Mids/Hibs complain and constantly moan about nerfing us cos of the damage leviathian does...

We get no love next patch afaik either.. wtf is going on?

If you in your 30's with your reaver, I suggest you stop now.
If your thinking of starting a reaver, I suggest you don't.

/end Whine.

 

[zlair]

hmm, and here I thought reavers were S.I.s FotM ?!?

 

[old.LandShark]

Originally posted by Waok
/Whine

Do you find it annoying how you have no Decent anytimes?
All your styles use lots of end?
SoulRendering is useless (after 30+),
Slow flew weps?
No Determination (although most other hybrids have it),
No grp qualities,
Low hit points,
Crap ra's - uToS, PBAOE Lifetap.. useless....
Your AOE's break mezz, and normally resist in PvE.

-

It's no wonder hardly any reavers are on excal/alb due to this.

Mids/Hibs complain and constantly moan about nerfing us cos of the damage leviathian does...

We get no love next patch afaik either.. wtf is going on?

If you in your 30's with your reaver, I suggest you stop now.
If your thinking of starting a reaver, I suggest you don't.

/end Whine.

-Flex is far from the only specline with no good anytime style.
-Also, you don't HAVE to spec flex, you know.
-The damage boost my friar gets from hitting a PBAE-abs-debuffed target says otherwise, but I'm sure you know better than I.
-I don't even know what you mean by 'slow flex weaps' but I can only assume it's fixed by the new weapons craftable in 1.64.
-Absolutely no hybrid in this game has determination, you oaf. Nor any caster, healer or rogue.
-Shield spec, excellent aggro-holding and very respectable damage output are not 'group qualities'? What, you want to have what you have already and then maybe some instamezz or something?
-You have as many hit-points buffed as a rogue or any other hybrid, which, I agree, is poor for a class essentially devoid of long-range firepower.
-UToS is a damn sight better than a lot of other unique RAs.
-I was under the impression that only wrack broke mezz, and not the debuff chants. Seems to me a reaver I grouped with in avalon city explained (and demonstrated) that to me, but I may be recalling incorrectly.) As for normally being resisted, I imagine that's true if you're fighting purples; such is life when you're fighting purples.

I see a lot of reavers around, actually, both RvRing and up-n-coming. Not hordes, but a respectable number, certainly.
I have not heard mids or hibs "constantly moan" to nerf leviathan or indeed reavers at all.
That reavers get no love in the next patch is somewhat sad as you could make some soulrending spell lines a lot better without overpowering the class, but then you're far from the only class with unfixed issues that could be fixed without breaking balance.

I agree with your last two points; roll a group-friendly hybrid (friar/paladin/minstrel) or roll a pure tank, i.e. mercenary/armsman. On the other hand, it's a game played for fun, not an on-paper comparison of one group setup vs another. If people enjoy their reavers, let them enjoy the class.

 

[Waok]

Play a reaver.. you'll see what I mean.

 

[Pin]

Okay... quite a lot of drivel here, so...

Originally posted by Waok
Do you find it annoying how you have no Decent anytimes?

No. Who needs them? I fail maybe 5% of attempted styles.

Originally posted by Waok
All your styles use lots of end?

Firstly, no they don't. Only one crappy style uses lots of end and it's not on my bars.
And if you run out of end, try grouping with a paladin or carrying end pots like any smart person.

Originally posted by Waok
SoulRendering is useless (after 30+),

SR is not useless at all. It's a very nice specline, but falls short at high RvR mainly due to resist levels (which will be changing in coming patches). The debuffs don't get effected much by this anyway (just duration reduction).

Originally posted by Waok
Slow flew weps?

3.3spd swinging at under 2s when buffed and at 1.5s cap when grouped with Theurg is slow?

Originally posted by Waok
No Determination (although most other hybrids have it),

Paladins, Thanes, Champions, Friars don't get it. Savages are the only 'Hybrid' which has Det (due to Mythic being confused about what to class them as).

And if Reavers had access to Det they would be seriously overpowered.

Originally posted by Waok
No grp qualities,

so increasing all your group's melee damage by 30% is not a group ability?

Originally posted by Waok
Low hit points,

1800+ buffed at level 50. 2k+ next patch. Hybrid hps. Hardly low when you have lifetaps and lifetap procs to gain you back 400 or more per fight.

Originally posted by Waok
Crap ra's - uToS, PBAOE Lifetap.. useless....

UToS is certainly not useless. Just situational.

Originally posted by Waok
Your AOE's break mezz, and normally resist in PvE.

Only the DD breaks mezz, and anyone hitting that (except for stealther hunting) while in a group with CC is a complete n00b. However, they do all interrupt all casters.

And they are almost never resisted in PvE (except epic-level mobs)

Originally posted by Waok
Mids/Hibs complain and constantly moan about nerfing us cos of the damage leviathian does...

No, they don't moan about reavers due to Leviathan (except complete n00bs). They could moan about being a versatile hybrid who adds lots to a group, has great offense and great defense though.

Originally posted by Waok
We get no love next patch afaik either.. wtf is going on?

What love do we need? None. Give us mcl and that's about it. Anything else would completely overpower and break the class.

Originally posted by Waok
If you in your 30's with your reaver, I suggest you stop now.
If your thinking of starting a reaver, I suggest you don't.

And if you are level 50 and posting utter bollocks like this, I suggest you get a clue.

 

[Waok]

Re: Re: If your a reaver.. or thinking of making one.. pls remember

Originally posted by old.LandShark
-Flex is far from the only specline with no good anytime style.
-Also, you don't HAVE to spec flex, you know.
-The damage boost my friar gets from hitting a PBAE-abs-debuffed target says otherwise, but I'm sure you know better than I.
-I don't even know what you mean by 'slow flex weaps' but I can only assume it's fixed by the new weapons craftable in 1.64.
-Absolutely no hybrid in this game has determination, you oaf. Nor any caster, healer or rogue.
-Shield spec, excellent aggro-holding and very respectable damage output are not 'group qualities'? What, you want to have what you have already and then maybe some instamezz or something?
-You have as many hit-points buffed as a rogue or any other hybrid, which, I agree, is poor for a class essentially devoid of long-range firepower.
-UToS is a damn sight better than a lot of other unique RAs.
-I was under the impression that only wrack broke mezz, and not the debuff chants. Seems to me a reaver I grouped with in avalon city explained (and demonstrated) that to me, but I may be recalling incorrectly.) As for normally being resisted, I imagine that's true if you're fighting purples; such is life when you're fighting purples.

Speccing anything other than Flex as a reaver is pointless.

UToS, on a 30 min recast for what it does and costs is rather lame.

Paladins hold aggro, reavers dont, take a look at what the reaver is doing the next time you grp with one, I can almost guarantee he is behind the mob doing leviathian, while the paladin holds aggro.

 

[old.LandShark]

I can assure you that a reaver keeps mobs off your ice wizard better than anything else in the realm apart from a paladin.
Furthermore; I never said UToS was the all-conquering pinnacle of pween. I said it wasn't THAT bad compared to the majority of melee-oriented classes' unique RAs (champ's, thane's, skald's, merc's, warrior's, savage's, zerker's, hero's, blademaster's.. they're all worse than UToS.) and that a class doesn't need an ownage unique RA to be viable anyway.

If flex is so useless, why is it pointless to spec anything else? Don't answer that; flex isn't useless.

And, please, if you have any real points to make, please use them to reply to Pin, who you'll notice has posted much the same as I have but with numbers and infinitely more actual experience to back it up

My final words on this thread: reavers have no problems not shared by absolutely all spell-possessing hybrid classes.
Also Pin I think you might, possibly, just be exaggerating reaver's defence. Excellent offence I'll buy, but excellent defence... nah. Mediocre defence maybe.

 

[Pin]

Originally posted by old.LandShark
Also Pin I think you might, possibly, just be exaggerating reaver's defence. Excellent offence I'll buy, but excellent defence... nah. Mediocre defence maybe.

Large Shield ability. 42+XX Shield spec. MoBlock X.
20+XX Parry spec. MoParry X.
305 Dex buffed on my Briton - 180 unbuffed.

Would take a 50Shield Pally/Arms to have better defense, and then they'd have poor offense.

I also have a Sidi hauberk with Heal procs which helps lots too. And some ablatives.

edit: oh, and evade 1 (which Pally/Arms don't get - "makes up for the lack of plate")

 

[old.LandShark]

I'm sorry, I should have been clearer. I am not denying reavers have as good a set of frontal-arc defences as you could ask for.
You can't block DDs. You can't parry crowd control. If enemy melee is beating on your shield then I can only assume your CC and healers are dead already.

I would consider IP and purge at a significantly lower realm level, along with considerably higher hit points and access to determination, the reason why reavers have inferior effective RvR defence to a pure tank class. You might argue that you have a PBAE lifetap, which does offset the lack of pure tank goodies a little, but...

 

[Pin]

Originally posted by old.LandShark
I'm sorry, I should have been clearer. I am not denying reavers have as good a set of frontal-arc defences as you could ask for.
You can't block DDs. You can't parry crowd control. If enemy melee is beating on your shield then I can only assume your CC and healers are dead already.

Yup, all defense is useless except for guard (assuming you meet groups who go for the support - 90% of groups I face go straight for me when pop abs debuff in the middle and they all get me as first target )

And well, putting Determination to one side, Mercs have advanced evade 1 and errrr... That's it for non-frontal arc defense in Albion.

 

[old.LandShark]

I can only assume you didn't catch the edit to my last post, for which, apologies
And, frankly, if groups you're fighting all attack you first because the PBAE hits them and you pop into their target box... then you are fighting monumentally stupid groups, quite frankly.

 

[kenshee-himura]

LoL i once grped with whyp and he took out 3 brehons on his own while we were eating dirt so dont say reavers suck cause they dont

 

[old.LandShark]

Don't butt into mine and Pin's conversation, damn you!
(I assume you're talking to the original poster cos I never said reavers suck )

 

[Pin]

Originally posted by old.LandShark
I can only assume you didn't catch the edit to my last post, for which, apologies
And, frankly, if groups you're fighting all attack you first because the PBAE hits them and you pop into their target box... then you are fighting monumentally stupid groups, quite frankly.

Well, the high-cost ip is the same issue as all hybrids. Anyway, my opinion is that a Reaver is an excellent class with very good tools and is easily capable of making a difference in RvR groups even without Det. BUT it does take a good player to make hybrids work well, and some people clearly aren't that.


As for attacking who pops into the box, you'd be surprised how many experienced, high RR groups do it, and even if they don't attack it only takes a second of distraction like that for the battle to turn.

 

[old.LandShark]

Never mind surprised, I'd be flabbergasted if a good group was not /assisting a designated main-assist and if that MA didn't already have a target by the time he was in 250 range of you.
And I'm not saying any of these things are specific reaver probs - if you look at my posts to Waok I distinctly say that reavers' problems are common to all hybrids.
However, the point remains valid; until RR6+ a pure tank has significantly better effective defenses than a reaver.

 

[NightyP]

Waok told me ingame that he does not enjoy the class, told him I loved it. Roll a new class if you dont like it Waok, but please dont say reavers are rubbish when they clearly arent.

 

[acei]

Originally posted by Waok
Do you find it annoying how you have no Decent anytimes?
All your styles use lots of end?
SoulRendering is useless (after 30+),
Slow flew weps?
No Determination (although most other hybrids have it),
No grp qualities,
Low hit points,
Crap ra's - uToS, PBAOE Lifetap.. useless....
Your AOE's break mezz, and normally resist in PvE.

Erm, if you spec high in shield/parry then it doesn't matter if you have no decent anytime styles.
No, only Python uses alot of end cause it does STR debuff
Agreed
No, it depends which one you use (most crush are slow) and how high your QUI is
As pointed out, no Hybrids have it
The damage output of Leviathan is high and we have high damage output in our positional styles, they're group qualities.
No argument here
what's wrong with the PBAOE lifetap? I've never seen it used
Dunno, i've never risked trying it out.

 

[Waok]

Reavers are, aside from what ive said.

A very fun class to play.

Due to Pin's, and LS's replies, I can't really back up what I have said, Pin is far more experienced in these things, I apologise if i have been 'ignorant' in what i have said.


"LoL i once grped with whyp and he took out 3 brehons on his own while we were eating dirt so dont say reavers suck cause they dont "

ofc Whyp would, he's an ownage reaver
but I guess so would any other reaver his RR with mp chain and sidi armor would

 

[Pin]

Originally posted by Waok
ofc Whyp would, he's an ownage reaver
but I guess so would any other reaver his RR with mp chain and sidi armor would

the clothes do not make the man

 

[Waok]

Obviously, take them off and lets see if you beat those 3 brehons

 

[Pin]

Originally posted by Waok
Obviously, take them off and lets see if you beat those 3 brehons

spend 5p and get 99% gear. you lose some +parry from MP

 

[Waok]

 

[StormriderX]

This discussion reminds of me vn forums.

The less experienced players whine that the class is crap and needs love. When they more experienced players go to explain that the class is in fact quite decent, the n00bs shout them down. "t3h cl4ss is gimpz0r, I d0n't c4r3 wh4t j00 s4y!!!"

 

[Sohan_THC]

Originally posted by Waok
Play a reaver.. you'll see what I mean.

Done to 50

and it is GREAT !!!!!!!

and yes also in rvr , 3L5 in no time man i luve stealthers

so either you can't play reaver or you are a crap player.

reaver aint an arms with plain hit , nor a paladin with easy end regen.

you need to be smart and slam protect youre casters , debuff tanks , unstealth sneak arounds. i got plenty group tasks to do.
while tanks and casters do their job.

Ohw hmm maybe it helps but im thrust with slamm and 45 soul
and yes livedrain for 160+ is fun every 30 sec. and dot casters for 40+ on 4 ticks is so annoying for them

reaver is cewl
but for the outside world yes they suck ( hope to prevent any furhter nervs)

 

[Tilda]

/Whine

Do you find it annoying how you have no Decent anytimes?
positionals >anytime

All your styles use lots of end?
no

SoulRendering is useless (after 30+),
at 41 its fine

Slow flew weps?
more dammage in /assisting grou

No Determination (although most other hybrids have it),
SUCKS FFS

No grp qualities,
er, do you play a reaver or an inf?

Low hit points,
get SC

Crap ra's - uToS, PBAOE Lifetap.. useless....
its not that bad, but yes it could be better

Your AOE's break mezz, and normally resist in PvE.
er, dont be a noob, use AF debuff chant in groups, that helps all your group, running aoe DD chant just breaks mez and s only handy against pbaoe groups.

-

It's no wonder hardly any reavers are on excal/alb due to this.

Mids/Hibs complain and constantly moan about nerfing us cos of the damage leviathian does...

and?

We get no love next patch afaik either.. wtf is going on?

If you in your 30's with your reaver, I suggest you stop now.
If your thinking of starting a reaver, I suggest you don't.

/end Whine.

get a clue. n00b.

 

[Tilda]

Re: Re: Re: If your a reaver.. or thinking of making one.. pls remember

Originally posted by Waok
Paladins hold aggro, reavers dont, take a look at what the reaver is doing the next time you grp with one, I can almost guarantee he is behind the mob doing leviathian, while the paladin holds aggro.

er
u need to play your class better then, i generally hold aggro better than a pally...

/brag/edit i once keeled 3 brehons solo too
/edit2 and i dont have any sidi stuff, MP chainfortehwin!!11
/edit3 i'd acctually like to have a slower whip, so im going to get a MP weighted flail, if only we could use 2h whips, that would be cool
/edit5 gif det please

 

[parlain]

Re: Re: Re: Re: If your a reaver.. or thinking of making one.. pls remember

Originally posted by Tilda
er
u need to play your class better then, i generally hold aggro better than a pally...

Wanna bet? ^^

 

[Tilda]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: If your a reaver.. or thinking of making one.. pls remember

Originally posted by parlain
Wanna bet? ^^

yus

 

[Aybabtu]

Originally posted by Tilda

No grp qualities,
er, do you play a reaver or an inf?

Hey!

 

[Sharp Thing]

Re: Re: Re: Re: If your a reaver.. or thinking of making one.. pls remember

Originally posted by Tilda

/brag/edit i once keeled 3 brehons solo too
/edit2 and i dont have any sidi stuff, MP chainfortehwin!!11
/edit3 i'd acctually like to have a slower whip, so im going to get a MP weighted flail, if only we could use 2h whips, that would be cool
/edit5 gif det please

even with that you'd stil suck tilda!