How Viable is a 50 Polearm, 50 Thrust, 26 Parry, 8 Shield Armsman...

[Solid]

...???

 

[kinag]

or just: 50 Pole, 42 shield, 39 thrust/crush/slash (auto train for more parry) and rest parry?

 

[Solid]

That is not the answer to my question Kinag, I know the various spec options of most classes in DAoC, i want to know if a 50/50/26/8 spec is viable, and maybe if anyone has that spec on Prydwen/Excal they can share their evaluation.

 

[kinag]

Well I dont have any armsman with a pole, but it has to be viable imo, a bit more dmg with the polearm due to the higher base dmg..

But still you will miss the slam tho, wich I think can be a good thing to have...

Dont flame me about this, its just an opinion, but it sounds like an ok spec if your not hooked by the need of slam..

 

[Jiggs]

its good....

its not a noob's character tho, without full buffs, a merc /assisting and pala end chant you suck like shit

 

[Solid]

Kinag I have not flamed you my friend, you have taken offense at something thats not there.

Jiggs Alb has 4 classes that cna spec for Slam, 2 Classes ALWAYS get it and 1 (armsman) usually does.

A Paladin is an essential member of any RvR group and so I think missing slam is not a life threatening issue for a Polearmsman.

Q is how does the damage compare between a 50/50 Poler and a 50/39 Poler?

Defenders Rage>>Defenders Revenge is a Style chain endign in a 9second stun and triggered by the Armsman being styled, pretty handy on paper, how's it fair in RvR?

 

[kinag]

Originally posted by Solid
Kinag I have not flamed you my friend, you have taken offense at something thats not there.

:uhoh:

I was thinking about future posts Solid

You are too kind to flame me lol

 

[Cavex ElSaviour]

Originally posted by Solid
Kinag I have not flamed you my friend, you have taken offense at something thats not there.

Jiggs Alb has 4 classes that cna spec for Slam, 2 Classes ALWAYS get it and 1 (armsman) usually does.

A Paladin is an essential member of any RvR group and so I think missing slam is not a life threatening issue for a Polearmsman.

Q is how does the damage compare between a 50/50 Poler and a 50/39 Poler?

Defenders Rage>>Defenders Revenge is a Style chain endign in a 9second stun and triggered by the Armsman being styled, pretty handy on paper, how's it fair in RvR?

I got 42 (ish) crush, 37 parry and 50 pole. The dmg varriance is pretty big, it goes from 190 to 450 (without crit), by doing 50 thrust your dmg variance should be very low so thats a big plus, the max dmg should be the same and will depend on str etc, another thing is that parry is rarlely usefull if you're not in a 1 vs 1 combat. (that is if mythic doesnt change the code). the rage --> revenge style is also highly usefull in 1 vs 1 (or small grp vs small grp) but will rarely be usefull in fg vs fg or bigger battles.

 

[old.TeaSpoon]

A guildmate has that spec. He seems to do well, damage varience isn't that huge and still has good parry.

And its more viable than my spec of:

48 Pole
44 Thrust
25 Parry
10 Shield
30 Xbow

 

[old.anubis]

Originally posted by Solid
Defenders Rage>>Defenders Revenge is a Style chain endign in a 9second stun and triggered by the Armsman being styled, pretty handy on paper, how's it fair in RvR?

well, if some1 is hitting an arms, then you already lost the fight, isnt it?

 

[old.mattshanes]

50 thrust 50 pole 28 parry highlander 50 base quick.

Or wait for and see what half ogre has to offer

The option i said above with a good crit can near enough 1 shot casters buffed.Only thing is pbt... need a fast damage dealer with you.If you go slash pole though you can get a 5.8 spd pole or crush has 5.9 spd

 

[Fightersuntzu]

I play an armsmen with a very similar spec- 44 thrust, 50 polearm, 35 parry 7 shield rest xbow

Its good...i get good damage on tanks at times (For some reason i hit malevolencia for like 200 damage, which is incredibly low. Nerf :\ ), but i get very high hits when i can get rage or the positionals off(aegis isnt exactly annihilation, but 32 second ~70% snare in 1.62 == RAR). Buffs help lots, you wind up hitting for close to cap damage each swing, and on low resists targets you can do it without

Rage >is< difficult to get off in big zergy rvr, but ive done it quite a few times and it hurts, only problems being thrust resistant mid armor

Hope that helps.

 

[froler-mid]

go 2h, got some anytime stun style

 

[Easy]

*whistles*

 

[Kagato.]

Originally posted by Solid
...???

Very viable, my own spec is 50 pole 50 thrust, 28 parry, I havent bothered with any in shield, its a waste as I never, ever equip it, the only use for the shield and 1 hand weapon is to hold charges I may wish to use during fights.

With this spec theres few classes that can deal with your damage out put and the Defenders Rage/Revenge combo, but as jiggs said, its not a noobs spec, you need to be familier with your enemies and use your styles/back up styles wisely. In zerg combat again your best use is to either be assisting another tank to deal out the heavy front load damage yourself have someone assisting you. In one on one dueling siturations you shouldn't have a problem with any enemy classes, and in your own realm only a shield/sword paladin or a good friar can pose a challenge.

The hybrid spec is a warriors game, they don't have to spec a base damage type like we do, its a waste, the lower weapon skill due to the spread out points will hurt you far more in the long run as its only Weapon skill that modifies an enemies chance to block/parry/evade your attack, and by the time you've slammed and switched to a pole your lucky to get one shot of before there free or the battle has altered, and as for duels, all that does is leave you open to return the Rage/Revenge combo right back at them.
Do what you do best and deal out heavy front load damage, s/s is for paladins, and hybrid is a mugs game.

 

[Fightersuntzu]

^^ his post is better

 

[old.Mitsu]

Having no real stun must be annoying.

I think you'll miss the slam. And your variance with 39 +11 will be better with each rr.
Unless you play in a good assist group you you are gonna get kited by every hib support.

 

[Flimgoblin]

a test (with far too little data to be conclusive really) me and Bleri did suggested a 30% difference between 12 base spec and 44 base spec...


so assuming that it applies with +ve over 50 on the base spec you'll be doing 10% more damage with 50/50 than 50/39....

but that's a very shaky conjecture

 

[Balbor]

first thing, when 2 large forces (ie zergs meet) hardly any skill is used (mainly due to lag etc) and the side with the most people should win. When meeting in small groups, teams etc, the way you play your character will make a huge difference.

Being able to run up and stun someone for 9sec is very handy, even if you are a 2handed weapon user. Unlike Mids and Hibs our only Stun caster is the cleric and there stun is hardly ever used to the same effect. Unlike mezzes and roots, stun is not really intended for CC. You stun someone you intend to be dead a few second afterwards. Hit a caster than is mezz and he may QC a CC spell on you, use MoC and PBAE you to death etc.

44/50 - Advanced Weapon (Two Handed or Pole)
42 - Shield (Get MoB L3+
39 - Damage Type (Slash or Thrust)
rest in Perry (get MoP L3+)

spec Crush to L40 autotraining slash/thrust for extra points for Perry

 

[The Kingpin]

Well getting max weapon skills is needed and with the so called fix to block&parry in 1.62, Weapon skill will be even more important.

You should also have max damage with 50/50, and with all the paladins am sure you can find someone else to slam.

 

[Balbor]

appart from not getting the styles is there much difference between 39+11 and 50+0 with slash/thrust/crush

also does take a damage skill over L50 with RR and item bonus effect damge on all targets or does it work the same way as spell DDs?

 

[Flimgoblin]

bonuses over 50 work on the polearm skill...
not sure on the base weapon damage - though one would assume so.

 

[Solid]

50 + 15 >> 39 + 15

And yes spec over 50 on both Poles and Base weap have an effect, close to 2% per level over 50.

50 base weap over 39 = a much higher damage floor (read min damage) ie much better variance as mentioned by some of the Polers in this thread already.

Again I am not asking for spec advise, I am asking about the viability of a 50/50/26/8 Poler. I know all about slam, what its used for etc.

Assuming the Armsman plays the /assist role for a Paladin/Reaver thats slamming, the Poler would be the biggest damager in the group (Melee wise and frontload wise).

Paladin swings his 1H to break bubble, Slams and Armsman /assists for a 600+ hit at zero delay (aka frontload).

Some info on the difference between say 50 Pole 50 Slash and the more Hybrid Arms spec of 50 Pole 42 Shield 39 Slash would be interesting to have a look at.

So do any Armsmen have such info on damage caps and damage variance of both these specs?

 

[Fightersuntzu]

My variance is rather small on the same target, but switching between targets can mean jumps depending on armor resists, etc.

Damage caps with a 5.5 speed partisan and 50 qui(modified speed 5.61) - 44+13 thrust 50+13 pole, base damage cap 417:

Defenders rage: 840
Defenders revenge : 770
Crippling blow : 568
Mangle : 699
Phalanx : 666 >
Defenders Aegis : 742

Im not sure how having 6 more base thrust would help (someone said 2% per point, but <shrug>)

 

[old.Vae]

Originally posted by Solid

Jiggs Alb has 4 classes that cna spec for Slam, 2 Classes ALWAYS get it and 1 (armsman) usually does.

5 classes actually but admittedly Mercs never spec it.
...
Armsman,
Paladin,
Scout,
Reaver

 

[Kagato.]

Originally posted by Fightersuntzu
My variance is rather small on the same target, but switching between targets can mean jumps depending on armor resists, etc.

Damage caps with a 5.5 speed partisan and 50 qui(modified speed 5.61) - 44+13 thrust 50+13 pole, base damage cap 417:

Defenders rage: 840
Defenders revenge : 770
Crippling blow : 568
Mangle : 699
Phalanx : 666 >
Defenders Aegis : 742

Im not sure how having 6 more base thrust would help (someone said 2% per point, but <shrug>)

Do you have any aug strength?

I havent got any aug strength, 195 base unbuffed, and also use a 5.5 polearm with no +quickness at all, just basic highlander quickness.

With my 50/50/28 spec and +15 to all 3 from items and RR my damage caps are a bit higher though I havent got the figures with me at moment.

Im pretty sure my crippling blow is about 590 I could be wrong though, and Rage about 870, i'll test it again soon as I presuade someone to style me with no armour on lol.

 

[vindicat0r]

As long as ur in a grp with pally for end and a Reaver / merc yes its a very viable spec capalbe of dealing huge amount's of damage. < Reaver is my fav to /assist with as he has absorb debuff and hits bloody hard >

the Hybrid spec is also a good spec. Takes more thought to play than just Pure Poler though. A Hybrid has to think of all his Pole styles as does a Pure poler but he has slam to consider 2. Hybrid played right is excellent AND so is a Pure Poler who will get more damage < not loads > in return for losing slam.

I only have 39 slash + 7 < waiting on 1.62 for decent SC suit > and my cap's are very near the 1's listed above, dont have exact figures sorry. Both specs are viable but if I knew I was going to be in a grp with a pally + reaver all the time I would reroll Highlander arms with Full Pole yes. You dont need slam when ur /assist tank has it.

Originally posted by Kagato.
, I havent bothered with any in shield, its a waste as I never, ever equip it, the only use for the shield and 1 hand weapon is to hold charges I may wish to use during fights.

Thats a good use but another great use for ur s/s is it's speed. If u find ur self only tank left and only a warden left, normally most Pole'ers just keep trying to whck through that 6sec pbt . gl, equip s/s swing .... equip Pole stlye ...... change to s/s ... etc etc. Something I know Kagato knows but something some arms dont know and use as is reflected in the quote that some ppl may not get. Shield has ALOT of use more than just slam.


I know your not asking for a spec but have a look at this spec and tell me what u think.

50 Pole
44 crush / thrust / slash
23 shield < 6 sec rear stun >
30 parry < with auto-train >

You wont notice dmg diff from 50 -44 at all. + you have good parry to defend when gone 2h. As for the shield, when u swing at a caster < to break pbt > what does he do ? run away. When ur chasing a tank to get off a caster / healer wher do u mostly hit him when chasing ? The back. Played correctly its very Ubah spec and at RR10 u can have 50 parry .

Any spec is vialbe, depends on play style and ppl u grp with.

 

[Fightersuntzu]

i have 200 str with no aug str;

Most of these damage caps were calculated using the following formula :

Modified Weapon Speed * Polearm spec * Style Modifier (Wyrds style sheet) + base damage cap

When i did the calculations i also checked in-game and received similar results (2-3 points off on some, exact on others)

Played correctly its very Ubah spec and at RR10 u can have 50 parry

Remember that mastery of parrying adds another +6 parry behind the scenes, so despite having 35+13 parry i wind up with 60 parry spec(Mastery of Parrying 2)

 

[vindicat0r]

Originally posted by Fightersuntzu


Remember that mastery of parrying adds another +6 parry behind the scenes, so despite having 35+13 parry i wind up with 60 parry spec(Mastery of Parrying 2)

Dont get MoP imo. You should be getting RA's that help your grp rather than ur sefl. Deter 4 / Purge / PF / Soliders barricade etc etc. Parry over 50 is useless anyway.

Anyway if ur getting hit as an arms then something is wrong. Let them beat on u while the rest of the group does it's job.