Great news for archers (more or less official this time!)

[Hawkwind]

That is not great news, its a joke, they are nerfing us in our love patch while giving fluff which doesn't address core issues that affect us.

Don't worry you'll still be able to run away just as fast Or has the elevation thing upset you? Code as it stands right now is stupid. Although I think there should be some small bonus to elevation over target.

Look forward to whatever they do for bow spec'd scouts, could'n;t get any worse tbh.

 

[Ormorof]

hunters can wipe the floor with all stealthers, not only scouts

they can?

not from my personal experience tbh

if the other stealther isnt stealthed and im standing far enough away AND my pet is buffed... perhaps

but this wasnt a "nerf <insert class here> " thread anyway

i am looking forward to it though, could be like playing a whole new class without having to level it or template it again

 

[Hawkwind]

I can see scout coming out of this patch very happy, with the shield changes and now BOW spec bufs I'm assuming akin to pathfinding, I dont fancy meeting all those scouts that will now appear.

Shouldn't have much to worry about tho I guess I've not seen a hunter or scout for two weeks on EU cluster, on excal/pryd these changes will have little to no impact, no ones left

Archery love patch my arse.

Eble

I wonder why there are no scouts left, maybe coz they were a gimped archer class that were only getting really good RP's in big raids or camping towers. Those raids do not occur anymore and they are pretty crap to solo with being bottom of the stealther pile.

Hunters were fotm few months back when easymode but most of those have given up and many won't be played after the pet-stealth nerf.

I guess we have to wait and see what comes. Might even dust off the ol scout and give it a try.

 

[Ctuchik]

hunter is the most oped class in wow n has so many tools
i cant believe u can actually find anything good in wow pvp

having a 70 hunter in WoW i'm curious to know exactly wtf ur talking about with "op".... there isnt 1 class in wow that can easily negate pretty much everything a hunter has with 1 or 2 abilitys. i wouldent call that OP anyone with half a brain know how to easily kill a hunter in WoW, and those that dont, they deserve to die.

i'd say feral druids is beating hunters by miles and miles when it comes to OP...

but WoW isnt really what this discussion is about so......

 

[old.Whoodoo]

I wonder why there are no scouts left, maybe coz they were a gimped archer class that were only getting really good RP's in big raids or camping towers. Those raids do not occur anymore and they are pretty crap to solo with being bottom of the stealther pile.

Hunters were fotm few months back when easymode but most of those have given up and many won't be played after the pet-stealth nerf.

I guess we have to wait and see what comes. Might even dust off the ol scout and give it a try.

TBH I havnt found the pet/stealth nerf as bad as you might imagine, most of the time I am already spamming my fire button while casting pet > kill > buff anyway, or if I have a pet buffed in waiting somewhere, its usually rare that anyone will attack it rather than trying to find its owner.

I love my hunter more than any other class in the game, and I have played most in one form or another, I wouldnt call it easymode at all, comare our damage output and the amount of time spent choosing a fight, sizing an opponent, selecting the best form of attack and the right arrows/spear etc to get the job done, much the same as scouts and rangers.

All three have their merits, and tbh the hunter pet is a tad OP, but I think youll find after the next patch where 50 bow actually might mean something, the BC line will probably become obsolete.

 

[Flimgoblin]

My Crits can hit for about 1300 dmg and standard 650, you really think they will increase the damage I can do, I doubt it.

Take true shot from our RAS fine, but I dont think they will increase DPS, else I'll be hitting for 1500+ imagine the whine then.

They have stated that archery is getting a total overhaul, probably before someone realised the total code re-write was needed, this 'archery' love will take a few pacthes to sort.

Will have to wait and see what they cook up for us,

Eble

DPS, not damage per hit...

How often do you hit 650 on anything other than an unbuffed caster? Plus what's your firing speed on those 650 hits?

Compared to a DD caster the damage per second of an archer is massively reduced, particularly if it's not on a really soft target.... and a lot of it is tied up in that critshot - if that one misses you're in trouble.

Remove the gargoyle on a tower top and normalise the damage a bit (1300 critshot to 200 critshot is a bit of a variance...) and you can make archers an awful lot better over time, without making them one crit hit kill snipers of d00m...

 

[old.Whoodoo]

Even at 50 bow and capped kobbie dex Ive never come close to 1300 on a normal toon, buffed or otherwise unless hes a butt naked grey standing in front of me yelling "take meh!". 650 sounds like a reasonable crit against most toons, but normal 650, no way, if our damage was that good, we would be killing casters in droves!

Remove the gargoyle on a tower top and normalise the damage a bit (1300 critshot to 200 critshot is a bit of a variance...) and you can make archers an awful lot better over time, without making them one crit hit kill snipers of d00m...

well said!

 

[Kami]

remove the need for buffbots too so I can play a damn archer

 

[Fatload BoysDoCry]

Don't worry you'll still be able to run away just as fast Or has the elevation thing upset you? Code as it stands right now is stupid. Although I think there should be some small bonus to elevation over target.

Look forward to whatever they do for bow spec'd scouts, could'n;t get any worse tbh.

Ever thought one of the reasons i used to run away so much is linked to the reason archers in general are pissed at Mythics proposed idea's?

Oh wait, you want somebody with 9 points in melee to stand toe to toe with your paladin in melee....

As for scouts, they are in a much better position than bow specced rangers at this moment in time.

 

[eble@work]

Even at 50 bow and capped kobbie dex Ive never come close to 1300 on a normal toon, buffed or otherwise unless hes a butt naked grey standing in front of me yelling "take meh!". 650 sounds like a reasonable crit against most toons, but normal 650, no way, if our damage was that good, we would be killing casters in droves!

well said!

50 + 18 bow champ weapon or player made 5.9 spd bow or even new LOTM bow my current favorite, 434 dex against level 50 characters.

I'll try and dig up some screenies.

a good bow spec'd high RR scout could out damage me anyway.

Eble

OFC i'm talking maximum hits ever not every shot I make, but I can normally hit a caster for 500/600+ on a standard shot crits for 1000+ easy.

 

[Aiteal]

I posted that around 2 weeks ago, but some FH random told me I was talking shit. Nice to see I've been vindicated.

hehe
The random line, the inept insult of the self important.
If you think that some one else interpreting something the same way as you did is "vindication" never ever consider a career in law.

 

[eble@work]

I've dug one out, was at RR7 I know its only 1201 + 59 but you get the point have had shots now over 1300 but not uploaded those as yet. (oh 434 dex is aug dex 5 aswell)

as you see a lvl 50 char was lucky with both the crit and followup both effctively cap'd my damaged. Please excuse the childish gloating at the bottom.

 

[Moaning Myrtle]

What level was the character in that instance? You didn't get many RPs - did you add/were added on?

 

[Moaning Myrtle]

hehe
The random line, the inept insult of the self important.
If you think that some one else interpreting something the same way as you did is "vindication" never ever consider a career in law.

Not at all - just my way of putting someone in their place without getting banned for posting what I'd actually like to post about them.

Common sense rather than 'the inept insult of the self important'.

Oh, I had a career in Law for 14 years as a Police Officer - I am quite content in my understanding of 'vindication' thanks

 

[eble@work]

What level was the character in that instance? You didn't get many RPs - did you add/were added on?

Level 50 Mid, was grouped. no idea of his RR to be honest.

Eble

 

[Aiteal]

Not at all - just my way of putting someone in their place without getting banned for posting what I'd actually like to post about them.

Common sense rather than 'the inept insult of the self important'.

Oh, I had a career in Law for 14 years as a Police Officer - I am quite content in my understanding of 'vindication' thanks

Hehe
Putting me in my place?
So I disagree with your assessment of a vague description and you thoughts on me are likely to get you banned if you aired them?
Hehe, I think you take it all too seriously.

14 years as a police man
So you are in your thirties at least and yet resort to the "random" script kiddy style insult.
Show a little maturity and individuality, forums and FH especially is full of teenagers who think that calling someone "random" is some sort of cutting insult, when in actual fact it's usually just a sad attempt to fit in and be accepted by adopting the herd's lingo.

You obviously have no idea what vindication is in this instance.
If, the patch comes and hunters loose BC and Rangers loose PF like you claimed, then and only then will you be vindicated in your interpretation of the vague info that has leaked out, and I will quite happily admit your interpretation of the info was correct and mine was wrong.

Until that time, you have nothing more than another posters interpretation that is similar to your own.
That's not vindication, that's another posters opinion.


I hope that the structure of my counter-arguement wasn't too "random" for you.

 

[Phantomby]

Hehe
Putting me in my place?
So I disagree with your assessment of a vague description and you thoughts on me are likely to get you banned if you aired them?
Hehe, I think you take it all too seriously.

14 years as a police man
So you are in your thirties at least and yet resort to the "random" script kiddy style insult.
Show a little maturity and individuality, forums and FH especially is full of teenagers who think that calling someone "random" is some sort of cutting insult, when in actual fact it's usually just a sad attempt to fit in and be accepted by adopting the herd's lingo.

You obviously have no idea what vindication is in this instance.
If, the patch comes and hunters loose BC and Rangers loose PF like you claimed, then and only then will you be vindicated in your interpretation of the vague info that has leaked out, and I will quite happily admit your interpretation of the info was correct and mine was wrong.

Until that time, you have nothing more than another posters interpretation that is similar to your own.
That's not vindication, that's another posters opinion.


I hope that the structure of my counter-arguement wasn't too "random" for you.

he works(worked) in the police force Ait, you dont expect him to be mature and level headed do you? its the psychological factor of adding a uniform and providing a position of authority...it goes to many peoples heads.

On topic it sounds like the buff components will be added to the bow line (dex qui / af) while the charm / beast level will be BC specific.

big bonus for scouts, hunters will make BC line less worth the points and shaft rangers imo.

 

[MegaMaejter]

After reading that artical it just seems like they dumb down the class, hiding the cons the changes will bring with fluff like magical procs on arrows, be more WoW then that pleaseee.

Tbh, they are approaching this the wrong way.

Whats wrong with archers today is:

1) Bow dmg
2) problems penetrating enemy defence, such as PBT, shield, brittles etc.

3) Archers melee capabilities vs enemy defence.
4) Pathfinding for rangers.


Don't see how some magical and fluffy arrows and "one click one arrow fired" will fix this.

Scrap the whole idea imo, its useless to say the least.

 

[Moaning Myrtle]

Hehe
Putting me in my place?
So I disagree with your assessment of a vague description and you thoughts on me are likely to get you banned if you aired them?
Hehe, I think you take it all too seriously.

Perhaps, perhaps not. Your response to my initial post was a little strong IIRC, so you've brought it on yourself.

As you say, let's see what happens.

 

[Moaning Myrtle]

he works(worked) in the police force Ait, you dont expect him to be mature and level headed do you? its the psychological factor of adding a uniform and providing a position of authority...it goes to many peoples heads.

Who rattled your cage? If I wanted your input I'd ask - now do one.

 

[Azathrim]

Who rattled your cage? If I wanted your input I'd ask - now do one.

Plus points for trying to come up with a comeback, when so heavily outwitted.

Minus points for the result though. You could have done better, even taking your low potential into account.

 

[Tesla Monkor]

If, the patch comes and hunters loose BC and Rangers loose PF like you claimed, then and only then will you be vindicated in your interpretation of the vague info that has leaked out, and I will quite happily admit your interpretation of the info was correct and mine was wrong.

You won't be wrong. Pathfinding and Beastcraft will not be changed in this patch.. the 'buffs' as mentioned will be added to the bow line. I don't expect them to be Dex buffs, etc. They will be bow-specific buffs, like, 'shoot your bow faster', 'do more bow damage', 'shoot two arrows at once', 'Next arrow will ignore Bladeturn', stuff like that.

Of course this is my personal interpetation of the information Mythic released, but seriously, if you honestly expect them to remove the BC, Pathfinding line, I think you're over the edge. It has about as much chance of happening as Mythic removing the Shield spec from scouts.

I might be wrong, but I don't think so.

 

[Moaning Myrtle]

You won't be wrong. Pathfinding and Beastcraft will not be changed in this patch.. .I might be wrong, but I don't think so.

You were wrong, and so was he. As it turns out so was I about BC but 50% of a victory is good enough

 

[Tesla Monkor]

I stand corrected.

I couldn't imagine Mythic doing something as dramatic this. This change is going to have profound effects for melee hunters.

For as far as I can see, Scouts make out like bandits with this change - they get buffs at no extra costs in their bow line.

Rangers lose PF, but gain those same buffs in bowline, so lose nothing in the process, and have one less line to spec in with more spec points to boost so their melee will be better for it. The melee effect will be mitigated because they don't need CD to be very high to be effective.

That leaves hunters with the same number of spec lines as before, but a severely gutted BC line that contains only the insta-dog/charm and pet STR/CON. While this won't affect me much because I'm already full-bow, I can imagine that the melee-oriented hunters are less than happy with this change. It basically makes speccing that way a very bad idea if you don't have a bot to replace the buffs you won't be getting from bow.

Also, we end up with 12 attack buttons, instead of the 4 we have now.

 

[Moaning Myrtle]

I stand corrected.

I couldn't imagine Mythic doing something as dramatic this. This change is going to have profound effects for melee hunters.

For as far as I can see, Scouts make out like bandits with this change - they get buffs at no extra costs in their bow line.

Rangers lose PF, but gain those same buffs in bowline, so lose nothing in the process, and have one less line to spec in with more spec points to boost so their melee will be better for it. The melee effect will be mitigated because they don't need CD to be very high to be effective.

That leaves hunters with the same number of spec lines as before, but a severely gutted BC line that contains only the insta-dog/charm and pet STR/CON. While this won't affect me much because I'm already full-bow, I can imagine that the melee-oriented hunters are less than happy with this change. It basically makes speccing that way a very bad idea if you don't have a bot to replace the buffs you won't be getting from bow.

Also, we end up with 12 attack buttons, instead of the 4 we have now.

You're right mate - I've been digesting the notes and trying to decide how this will affect my Scout's spec and play style.

My initial conclusion is that there is now a real reason to stay Bow over melee spec, although how high to take Bow depends on how they space out the abilities in the Archery line.

For example, if I choose 45 Archery (as my Scout currently is) then I can have Slam, Amy Slash or the 29 Thrust spec equivilent, 50 effective Stealth at RR5 and still have great Bow damage. Obviously if 50 Archery offers some killer ability then I can always drop Stealth to 45 effective, accept the issues that come with that and see how I do.

Really this is a boost for Rangers as well, they obviously need to spec Archery now, but because they need put no points into PF they can have 50 Archery, 44 Peirce, 35 Stealth and something like 17 CD. As they ascend RR the points from Stealth can go into CD and they have capped Archery damage and still very good melee damage.

I am not sure how I will find the changes to the actual mechanics of Archery though, it'll take some getting used to I think