News Good News for Throddy! :)

[rynnor]

BBC NEWS | Science/Nature | Badger cull proposals 'rejected'

Go Badgers!

:england:

 

[Chilly]

~coughs up bloodied lungs~

 

[rynnor]

~coughs up bloodied lungs~

How could it have worked though? Youd have to basically wipe em out if you thought they were a vector of the disease and you'd still have a reservoir of TB in existing cattle stocks plus more arriving from imports - just not doable...

 

[Chilly]

you need a critical number of a host species to cause an epidemic of a given disease. Badgers are at/are approaching this population density that would allow TB to suddenly explode throughout the countryside having a pretty nasty affect on livestock and potentially humans.

You dont need to kill them all, just enough to keep away from the threshold.

 

[rynnor]

you need a critical number of a host species to cause an epidemic of a given disease. Badgers are at/are approaching this population density that would allow TB to suddenly explode throughout the countryside having a pretty nasty affect on livestock and potentially humans.

You dont need to kill them all, just enough to keep away from the threshold.

The biggest survey showed that culling made things worse and the badger population got more infected - its not a single vector disease - farmers are responsible themselves for moving around cattle with TB.

 

[Tilda]

Agree with rynnor, Badger culling has been shown to have no affect on the spread of TB so culling is utterly pointless.

 

[throdgrain]

Agreed, complete waste of time from what I've read. Some species need to be controlled, for example magpies, but badgers dont, it's a knee-jerk reaction by farmers imo.

 

[Trem]

Every reaction from farmers is knee jerk.

They are the smuggest most arrogant bunch of self righteous wank stains this country has to offer.

 

[taB]

every Reaction From Farmers Is Knee Jerk.

They Are The Smuggest Most Arrogant Bunch Of Self Righteous Wank Stains This Country Has To Offer.

Spoiler

Wanker.

Hmm, did write more. Will leave it at that

 

[rynnor]

I cant help but agree with Trem - its a massively subsidised industry (the last one left) that gets very special treatment out of proportion to its real importance.

The impact of the big foot n mouth outbreak that closed most of the uk countryside was far greater to Tourism than farming.

Every time we see farmers on the news its a sob story - if its not paying do something else - thats what everyone else has to do - its called economics!!!

 

[taB]

The statement may have some truth but was inflamatory and tbh insulting to a lot of people I know, so I responded suitably.

Farmers are a minority, they do shout loudly because they have to. Fifty years ago rural communities would be centred on land, a farm that would feed, support & essentially look after hundreds of people is now run by 2 guys and a shit load of machinery. Machinery that costs fuck tons of cash. With the fluctuating prices of food it is a brave person who takes on farming. I could and I won't.

The government is to blame for farmers making so much noise. They fuck them around like nobody's business because they have no fucking clue how to distribute the EU's money in any way resembling sense. We are currently residing under a scheme called the single farm payment. Most people I know had to seek specialist / legal advice on how not to get screwed over by this when it was introduced a couple of years ago. How long will it last till the next change? I have no idea but won't hold my breath.

I firmly believe that this country should attempt to be as sustainable as possible for energy, food and the like. It's cheaper to buy lamb from New Zealand and it's travelled half way around the world. That is a depressing thought imo.

 

[rynnor]

The government is to blame for farmers making so much noise. They fuck them around like nobody's business because they have no fucking clue how to distribute the EU's money in any way resembling sense. We are currently residing under a scheme called the single farm payment. Most people I know had to seek specialist / legal advice on how not to get screwed over by this when it was introduced a couple of years ago. How long will it last till the next change? I have no idea but won't hold my breath.

Fundamentally I oppose subsidies to any private enterprise - if the farmers do well and make a good profit do they give it back to the government?

Of course not - so why the hell are we subsidising them???

Either the farms are publicly owned and operated or privately owned and operated - mixing the two is a very bad idea...

 

[Raven]

You townies have absolutely no idea do you?

 

[Trem]

Spoiler

Wanker.

Hmm, did write more. Will leave it at that

Write more it might make you look less of a complete cock.

Jesus I thought FH had gotten rid of the retards.

Edit -

The statement may have some truth but was inflamatory and tbh insulting to a lot of people I know, so I responded suitably.

Oh wait you did write more and I would never of believed it but you know farmers, so you gave the answer that proves my original point which is they are arrogant. If someone doesn't agree with farmers then they are wrong, no ifs and no buts they are wrong.

Thank you for totally proving my point.

*slightly less smug than a farmer now*

 

[Dukat]

I live in rural Norfolk, in a village miles from the nearest town, surrounded by farmers. I have a few friends who's parents are farmers, and while I get on with them and find them to be generally decent people, I do find it difficult to see them complaining one moment and then driving around in brand new ranger rovers the next.

 

[taB]

I don't know about lifestock but with arable farming a fair chunk of the subsidies is actually spent on paying people to not to grow stuff.

I don't agree that subsidies are right either. However in it's state it is an industry that won't survive without them. What do you suggest is done with all that land? Better to grow something is it not?

This kind of shit is what I mean.

You think those lorry driving gob shites on 42k a year moan less?

its a massively subsidised industry (the last one left) that gets very special treatment out of proportion to its real importance.

Northern Rock bailout?

 

[taB]

Write more it might make you look less of a complete cock.

Jesus I thought FH had gotten rid of the retards.

You made a shit, sweeping statement and I responded in kind, I have since elaborated. How is this attitude by you any better?

edit edit

Oh wait you did write more and I would never of believed it but you know farmers, so you gave the answer that proves my original point which is they are arrogant. If someone doesn't agree with farmers then they are wrong, no ifs and no buts they are wrong.

Thank you for totally proving my point.

*slightly less smug than a farmer now*

And knowing more about a situation than you do makes me a bad person why? (this is obviously arrogance)

 

[Trem]

You made a shit, sweeping statement and I responded in kind, I have since elaborated. How is this attitude by you any better?

edit edit


And knowing more about a situation than you do makes me a bad person why? (this is obviously arrogance)

Why was my statement shit? and responding in kind is not to simply call someone a name.

If a farmer thinks for one second that they will lose a penny through absolutely anything, and in this case badgers, they go all red faced and send their big earred, buck toothed son to fetch his shooting stick. If there is any danger of them losing a thing they go apeshit.

You know more about what than me?

You having friends who are farmers means that you see the complete picture does it?

I see your point and your second post was much better and it wouldn't of made me react as I did, I see your point from a friend of a farmers point of view, but this country sees another side that people close to farmers may not see.

(red diesel anyone???)

 

[taB]

Why was my statement shit? and responding in kind is not to simply call someone a name.

If a farmer thinks for one second that they will lose a penny through absolutely anything, and in this case badgers, they go all red faced and send their big earred, buck toothed son to fetch his shooting stick. If there is any danger of them losing a thing they go apeshit.

You know more about what than me?

You having friends who are farmers means that you see the complete picture does it?

I see your point and your second post was much better and it wouldn't of made me react as I did, I see your point from a friend of a farmers point of view, but this country sees another side that people close to farmers may not see.

(red diesel anyone???)

It was a reaction that I then elaborated on. You've never seen someone write something and decide it's bollocks and to call them a nasty word?

Yes, the badger thing is balls. I was responding to your broader statement.

Red diesel - what? It's tax free for farm vehicles i.e. not used on a road. I don't know anyone who's used it in their car for about a decade. You get fucked on if found out and they test your cars these days.

The mistake I find people make is not distinguishing between farmers and landowners. The latter have a multitude of other ways to make money, through rent, shooting and all sorts. When the farming's good it's a bonus. I have a mate who grows Beet, he did more than break even this year, first time for three. He subsidises it with 2 other jobs. Should he give up? I'd hope not.

I see your point and your second post was much better and it wouldn't of made me react as I did, I see your point from a friend of a farmers point of view, but this country sees another side that people close to farmers may not see.

Oh, and thanks for this, it is a subject I get wound up about (you might have noticed).

 

[rynnor]

The mistake I find people make is not distinguishing between farmers and landowners. The latter have a multitude of other ways to make money, through rent, shooting and all sorts. When the farming's good it's a bonus. I have a mate who grows Beet, he did more than break even this year, first time for three. He subsidises it with 2 other jobs. Should he give up? I'd hope not.

If farming doesnt make money then its basically a hobby - should we spend billions each year subsidising a hobby?

It always makes me laugh when some farming rep comes on and says they are custodians of the countryside - either they are private farmers or we turn the lot into publicly managed land and people can actually enjoy what they are paying for!

Farming is currently ridiculous - cows dead - here have some public money - you imported some feed from a banned country and it caused a massive outbreak? here have some public money

 

[rynnor]

Too late to edit - but look at this -

'Fat cats' benefit from EU farming subsidies - Home News, UK - The Independent

 

[taB]

I dumped a similar link above. And as I said there: this is the fault of the government scheme. They do not have a clue how to allocate the EU's money. Those people aren't farmers they're just rich bastards who got richer through our usual civil service knob ups. Something like this should not reflect badly on farmers but on our legislative body and it's inability to do just that.

"Hey you guys at the bottom who were scraping by, guess what you're gonna have to keep doing just that cos you can't afford to spend thousands on getting advice as to how you should make adjustments to how / where / when / what you farm in order to maximise payments. You should be like these guys who're now even richer because they employ consultants. Sucks to be you."

 

[rynnor]

I dumped a similar link above. And as I said there: this is the fault of the government scheme. They do not have a clue how to allocate the EU's money. Those people aren't farmers they're just rich bastards who got richer through our usual civil service knob ups. Something like this should not reflect badly on farmers but on our legislative body and it's inability to do just that.

The whole thing is wrong - while subsidies exist people will use em.

 

[Bahumat]

I think they should be careful. Last time there was a Badger Cull, these guys came to their aid!

 

[DaGaffer]

Subsidies exist because farming is (rightly) regarded as a strategic industry. Yes, huge aspects of the CAP are fucked up, but that doesn't automatically mean that all farm subsidies are wrong. It can be better to keep land unproductive or in uneconomic production in order to stop the land being sold off for other purposes, like building, especially in land-constrained countries (e.g. most of Europe).

The economics of global food production are starting to change already, and will continue to do so as people realise high oil prices are here to stay. This will ultimately change the need for subsidies as we'll need to source our food from closer to home whether we like it or not.

 

[throdgrain]

Subsidies exist because farming is (rightly) regarded as a strategic industry. Yes, huge aspects of the CAP are fucked up, but that doesn't automatically mean that all farm subsidies are wrong. It can be better to keep land unproductive or in uneconomic production in order to stop the land being sold off for other purposes, like building, especially in land-constrained countries (e.g. most of Europe).

The economics of global food production are starting to change already, and will continue to do so as people realise high oil prices are here to stay. This will ultimately change the need for subsidies as we'll need to source our food from closer to home whether we like it or not.

Agreed.

 

[Raven]

To look at it from a farmers point of view, as in one that owns the land and not just a tenant, most of them are sitting on land worth an absolute fortune if sold to developers, they work fucking hard too. If it wasn't for subsidies half of them would just fuck it off and cash in then live comfortably for the rest of their lives. Its getting even harder for a farm to make money these days, especially livestock, everyone wants cheapo meat prices, the price cuts get passed to the farmer at the end of the line who is getting less and less for a ton of <insert meat>

If you want to blame someone blame the supermarkets and Johny consumer.

Oh and the badger cull is bollocks but it makes a headline which is all labour really care about.

 

[Sockstuff]

Presumably an infected spinal column in a bap has caused all of these disagreements.

 

[Trem]

Presumably an infected spinal column in a bap has caused all of these disagreements.

YES!!

After my rant I thought I sounded like Alan Partridge, at least I didn't mention giant chickens

 

[taB]

DaGaffer and Raven both have good points and I did go way ott with my response to Trem :wub:

Personally I blame

for everything that is wrong with the world.