Farmers, CMs and just generally about ripoff Midgard

[Nausilus^^]

Think how many GOV's have been farmed since TOA came out.. Now think what % of those the three you are moaning about actually is. Now engage brain and realise that the three that you considered overpriced on the CM isn't the reason you don't have it!!

Well put tbh

 

[Melachi]

Seems to me like 90% of peopel reading the thread arent understanding what hes saying..

He has no problem with SM's farming the artis and even goes on to say its a good thing because it encourages most effciecny of repop timers.

Hes not complaining that he cant get it either.

Hes complaining about people who have had them on their cm's for atleast a week when this is a very sought after item. Yet it remains on that persons CM, why? Because its overpriced.

The only problem I see with lowering the cost of a GoV for example on the CM, is that some other idiot will come along, buy it for cheap and then sell it on his CM for a high price again.

[Edit] Actually, I am after this vest myself, but I may have to do without it, despite getting the "Guildy price" from a guildy of 20plat, still tought that was a rediculous ammount to ask for, especially someone who just reactivated 2 weeks ago

 

[Nausilus^^]

Seems to me like 90% of peopel reading the thread arent understanding what hes saying..

He has no problem with SM's farming the artis and even goes on to say its a good thing because it encourages most effciecny of repop timers.

Hes not complaining that he cant get it either.

Hes complaining about people who have had them on their cm's for atleast a week when this is a very sought after item. Yet it remains on that persons CM, why? Because its overpriced.

The only problem I see with lowering the cost of a GoV for example on the CM, is that some other idiot will come along, buy it for cheap and then sell it on his CM for a high price again.

[Edit] Actually, I am after this vest myself, but I may have to do without it, despite getting the "Guildy price" from a guildy of 20plat, still tought that was a rediculous ammount to ask for, especially someone who just reactivated 2 weeks ago

Who cares if it's overpriced, it's not like you can do anything about it anyway. The guy choses the price that he wants to because he farmed them and it's on his CM. If it doesn't sell, then it's up to the seller to reevaluate if the price may be wrong. I wouldn't even be concerned how long the item has been on the CM unless it's mine, in which case it would be nobody else's business.

 

[Melachi]

Who cares if it's overpriced, it's not like you can do anything about it anyway. The guy choses the price that he wants to because he farmed them and it's on his CM. If it doesn't sell, then it's up to the seller to reevaluate if the price may be wrong. I wouldn't even be concerned how long the item has been on the CM unless it's mine, in which case it would be nobody else's business.

And today on Mastermind we have Nausilus^^ with his speciality stating the fncking obvious!

Ehh no shit mate, I dont think you will see anywhere in this thread anyone proposing that other people should control the price of items on others CM's. All he is saying is that its pretty dumb, and ignorant of those people.

 

[Nausilus^^]

And today on Mastermind we have Nausilus^^ with his speciality stating the fncking obvious!

Ehh no shit mate, I dont think you will see anywhere in this thread anyone proposing that other people should control the price of items on others CM's. All he is saying is that its pretty dumb, and ignorant of those people.

I think you're the one missing the point here. Nowadays everyone whines about what ppl do, what classes they play, how they spec, if they do too much pve, if the do too much pvp, if they farm this, if they farm that, if they price their stuff like this or like that etc and it goes on and on, and quite frankly I'm getting pretty tired of noobs who don't know how to just let it go and get their own stuff it they don't like the prices in housing.

I usually don't comment on how other ppl play, what they do or how they play unless they're doing something wrong on purpose. The fact that someone felt like he had to go to FH and write a thread about how stupid he felt prices are, is something I really can't relate to.. if you find an item in housing you want, but the price isn't what you wanted to pay, just let it go and check again later.. but don't expect to get sympathy because you don't wanna pay what the seller is asking.

 

[Melachi]

I usually don't comment on how other ppl play, what they do or how they play unless they're doing something wrong on purpose. The fact that someone felt like he had to go to FH and write a thread about how stupid he felt prices are, is something I really can't relate to.. if you find an item in housing you want, but the price isn't what you wanted to pay, just let it go and check again later.. but don't expect to get sympathy because you don't wanna pay what the seller is asking.

Tbh Nausilus^^ I think you took a very quick glance at this thread and decided you were going to be against it without much rational tought, because all you have proposed is that he not look for sympathy, which he has not done in my opinion. And what else you have said is not to dictate how people should play whislt trying to dictate how he should think which is very ironic.

With regards to dictating how people play. Its absurd and contradictory to tell somebody to not tell others how to play. I think its much more logical to simply ignore it.

And sorry I usualy don't mud sling but this, "I usually don't comment on how other ppl play, what they do or how they play unless they're doing something wrong on purpose." first off I have to say im new to ToA and therefore all my knowllege from anything ToA related is second hand information, but I was at your FFA SoM raid a week ago, and I volunteered to do the whole suicide thing and then was told to pickup the cloak when the mob died, but you picked it up and said "oops" when someone pointed out that you did this on purpose for the MLxp.

Anyway im not sure if that means anything because I have no idea on how that encouter or getting MLxp from it works.

 

[Nausilus^^]

And sorry I usualy don't mud sling but this, "I usually don't comment on how other ppl play, what they do or how they play unless they're doing something wrong on purpose." first off I have to say im new to ToA and therefore all my knowllege from anything ToA related is second hand information, but I was at your FFA SoM raid a week ago, and I volunteered to do the whole suicide thing and then was told to pickup the cloak when the mob died, but you picked it up and said "oops" when someone pointed out that you did this on purpose for the MLxp.

If you wanna sling mud, make sure to do it properly. I didn't say "oops" when I picked up the cloak, I did it on purpose because we would just tank 2 mobs instead of dragging the whole thing by you picking up cloak and pulling them 1 by 1.. I didn't do it for the ML xp, as I was getting it from the mobs we killed, but by the action of picking up cloak. And furthermore I believe I was pretty fair since I went through the trouble of getting ppl together and let everyone lotto for the artifact.

 

[Belomar]

What happened to this thread anyway? And what's this Melachi on about? It's not rocket science, no one can tell others how to play the game. Just let it rest and go without GOV if you can't handle it.

 

[Melachi]

What happened to this thread anyway? And what's this Melachi on about? It's not rocket science, no one can tell others how to play the game. Just let it rest and go without GOV if you can't handle it.

I never said anyone should tell others how to play, how about reading my posts first?

Why did I have this idea that you were usualy a pretty decent guy Belomar? Seem to be just blindly siding with your guildy here who is against me for some reason even though im not disagreeing with him, im just trying to point out that hes not really argueing with the orignial poster, but has misunderstood what he said.

If you wanna sling mud, make sure to do it properly. I didn't say "oops" when I picked up the cloak, I did it on purpose because we would just tank 2 mobs instead of dragging the whole thing by you picking up cloak and pulling them 1 by 1.. I didn't do it for the ML xp, as I was getting it from the mobs we killed, but by the action of picking up cloak. And furthermore I believe I was pretty fair since I went through the trouble of getting ppl together and let everyone lotto for the artifact.

As I said, I dont know much about ToA I was merely going along with what Kraka said at time (which could have been in jest) which was something along the lines of "No, you picked it up so for the MLxp "

 

[atos]

Oh, well if you want to burn all the money you earn go ahead..
I myself always farm the stuff I need myself. Sure it takes longer but it's much more rewarding.

Oh and I used to sell my abla procs for 280g. Thats prob the reson why if your procs havn't sold good lately.

And since I'm so economic I have roughly 60p i pure money and like another 30 or 40 plats in depts and items.


Want to earn money? Well do stuff yourself and use your friends. ><


Need a loan? Visit Trollum the bank. xD

 

[foreing]

time 2 make 30p? or time 2 get gov?
pick you'r choice, end of story

 

[Anarch]

only thing thats bother me abour farming is that the Farmers makes it impossibul to get encounter from the artis since alla mobs usaly are down..

Been camping the Band of stars for a week now and never seen it up tho ive seen same people log bots etc at enc and checked..and its the last encouter i need for my template so kinda frustrating,and ive had alot of bad luck never seen anyone killing it either so havent been ale to ask i could join for encouter either :C

 

[Golena]

only thing thats bother me abour farming is that the Farmers makes it impossibul to get encounter from the artis since alla mobs usaly are down..

Been camping the Band of stars for a week now and never seen it up tho ive seen same people log bots etc at enc and checked..and its the last encouter i need for my template so kinda frustrating,and ive had alot of bad luck never seen anyone killing it either so havent been ale to ask i could join for encouter either :C

I used to PL with my cabby at the mau nomads just next to the tomb and seen it pop 3/4 times a night. Either your not spending any time there, got very unlucky or are at the wrong tomb

 

[Anarch]

I used to PL with my cabby at the mau nomads just next to the tomb and seen it pop 3/4 times a night. Either your not spending any time there, got very unlucky or are at the wrong tomb

camped it for 16 houers whit no PoP and i contacted a GM and he said it was pure unluck :E and i said QQ zzzz

 

[Ctuchik]

U should bear in mind, that ppl (including me) just might have the CM as a secondary vault holder?

then dont stick a price on the item in the first place. if u REALLY intend on using it urself, dont put a price on it when its on a CM.

and even if u COULD afford to loose it for that price, THATS the price most ppl are gonna think "cool, that shit sold for 50p, then i can probably sell it for that to, if not abit higher!" its ppl like you thats skyrocketing the prices, ppl that put insanly high prices in crap just so they wont sell. but sooner or later they WILL sell, and then more of the greedy ppl will charge more for their items.

they MIGHT have been worth 20, 30, 40, 50 plat when ToA just came out. but now when ppl know how to get them easy they aint even worth half of what most ppl are asking. problem is that even tho they are easy to get the farmers have most likly already been there and are selling it as high as they dare without getting TO much of a bad rep.

 

[Belomar]

and even if u COULD afford to loose it for that price, THATS the price most ppl are gonna think "cool, that shit sold for 50p, then i can probably sell it for that to, if not abit higher!" its ppl like you thats skyrocketing the prices, ppl that put insanly high prices in crap just so they wont sell. but sooner or later they WILL sell, and then more of the greedy ppl will charge more for their items.

Well, if it sells for that over-the-top price, then there is a sufficient demand for the item. Thus, there is nothing wrong with supplying that demand and putting up your next such item for the same price. Why would you go lower if it does sell for the price you put it up for before? This will work until the seller notices that the item no longer sells, i.e. that the demand has been decreased (due to increasing supply), and thus is forced to reprice the item until he finds the right level again.

Note that the above is an extended version of my previous post in this thread. All you really need to know are simply the two words "supply" and "demand".

You can fight it all you want, but the DAoC market follows the same rules as any market, and no invisible hand threads like this will ever sway this fact.

 

[Melachi]

Well, if it sells for that over-the-top price, then there is a sufficient demand for the item. Thus, there is nothing wrong with supplying that demand and putting up your next such item for the same price. Why would you go lower if it does sell for the price you put it up for before? This will work until the seller notices that the item no longer sells, i.e. that the demand has been decreased (due to increasing supply), and thus is forced to reprice the item until he finds the right level again.

Note that the above is an extended version of my previous post in this thread. All you really need to know are simply the two words "supply" and "demand".

You can fight it all you want, but the DAoC market follows the same rules as any market, and no invisible hand threads like this will ever sway this fact.

While I agree with you on things like this thread not changing anything. I say you are totally wrong with your Economics "Laws" applying to Daoc.

I dont do Economics in school (because its bs imo) but I can point out some things that differ that make a massive difirence.

We dont have printing presses, all the money that exists soley exists from monster bashing or trinketing(which you could say comes from monster bashing cause the salavage droops from them or seals do, get me?).

Ok, so what does that mean? Well up until recently enough in the game it had no affect, but now it does have a massive one. How do people these days make money? Farm Scrolls or Artis, do they get alot of cash drops from these mobs? Yes not much but a little. Does the profit from the scroll massively exceed the ammount of cash drops? Yes.

So whats this mean? The arti/scroll farmer, farms some scrolls ane makes a little money from loot/cash drops. But he then the real money comes from selling the scrolls to other people.

Ok so lets talk about money, money has two values in this game, its real value for purchasing merchant bought stuff (houses, repairs, weap/armor, con restore) and then it has its trading value which is decided by the players.

What difirence would it make to its trading value if GoV's cost 30gold on CM's and Regarding shades3 cost 10gold? None wouldnt have an affect on the trading value, but it would impact the the real merchant value.

Money these days comes from very few sources, mainly Moderna, Ebay, trinketing, and a little from Arti/Scroll farming (in comparison).

Where does this money get 'disolved'? Merchants, Horses, Tickets, repairs, consitituion, house deeds, ect..

Id say that the incoming/outgoing money rate is pretty static(only massively changed with Housing zone because of house deed prices), which means moneys real value hasnt changed much, but its trading value has changed massively.

So lets put your out of context Supply and Demand theory on money in the game!
The demand for cash is very high, look at all the Consignment Merchants..
The influx of cash is not very high after you consider its disolving on merchants.
What does this mean? Moneys Supply is small, and its demand is massive, therefore items should be being sold for low ammounts of coin, but they arent.

Why? Because the trading value of money is absurd, and this is only down to peoples ignorance.

So DAoC's market system is not at all compareable to a real market, because first off it has "Money blackhole's" while the real world has the opposite.

If people would comprehend, that for the majority of us, we sell items in order to be able to purchase the ones we need, and we only use money really as a trade middle man. If you think about it, the average daoc'er will only spend around 10plat in his whole time on blackholes (healers/horses/ect,) which means any above that is for trading purposes only.

So if people werent so deluded into thinking having 200plat really makes you rich, when infact (with coin's real value) 10plat is really really rich. So, if everyone reduced their CM's price from its equal plat price to gold (i.e. 10plat -> 10gold, 30plat -> 30gold) while everyone keeping 10plat on their char for blackholes, the market would be exactly the same for those who were rich, and would allow everyone to participate.

But no, every dumbass and his dog is off quoting Supply and Demand "laws" and a rediculously low value of coin, and screwing the system for everyone.

 

[Nausilus^^]

Here's a little story about how I see it.

4 ppl got the same item and want to sell it.

Seller 1 was unlucky, because he was the first person to put it on his CM and he didn't know what it was worth. He set it at 5p.. not too high, yet he'd still be happy with 5p for a drop he farmed himself.
Seller 2 saw one for sale for 5p and thought "hey this might be good", checked forums and guides and found out it's a pretty rare item. Sets it at 15p
Seller 3 already had the item before and knows it'll never sell for 15p, but the median is around 10p, sells often at that price, and it's a nice reward for an item he got himself.
Seller 4 is a housing shark, he buys items with low price and sells it at a high price. He buys the scroll for 5p, and sets that + his own for 11p to push the price.
Seller 2 checks back after a few weeks and hasn't sold his. He will now set it at 10p because the others at 10p are gone.
Seller 1 is happy cos he got his 5p, but now realizes after checking prices again that he could've had double - next time he will try to sell at 11p.
Seller 3 sold his for 10p and is happy.
Seller 4 made 6p for the resell and 11p for the one he farmed himself, and next time he'll try to push it to 12p.

Who sets the price? What's the "right" price, and are anyone really being scammed or ripped off?

This is of course just how I see it.. others may disagree.


About what money is worth ingame, I think you're right, the overall amount of cash ingame may be relatively low due to high prices in housing, but remember that ppl still salvage and hinge, they PL in moderna and kill mobs when farming scrolls, doing ml's, killing dragons and all mobs drop bag of coins. 1 bag of coin containing 1-2g doesn't sound of much on it's own, but multiply it by thousands of mobs being killed everyday by the realm population and it'll add up in the end.

And again, when ppl spend money in housing, it's merely a transfer, the money doesn't disappear.. only way it disappears are to healers restoring con, crafting supply merchants and other npc's ingame.. otherwise the money are just being transferred from person to person.

 

[Melachi]

Who sets the price? What's the "right" price, and are anyone really being scammed or ripped off?

The right price, is the price that allows this guy to sell the item he doesnt need for enough to buy the item that he does need.

but remember that ppl still salvage and hinge, they PL in moderna and kill mobs when farming scrolls, doing ml's, killing dragons and all mobs drop bag of coins. 1 bag of coin containing 1-2g doesn't sound of much on it's own, but multiply it by thousands of mobs being killed everyday by the realm population and it'll add up in the end.

As far as I can remeber when I hosted my DR's back in the day, the dragon droped about 900g to one group, now lets imagine most of those people suicide out, 24*16g = 360g, so the dragon has given the realm 600gold, lets compare that to the trade value of what he drop 50respec stones that sell for average of 4plat(? thats what they sold for when i ran them) 200plat.

Now lets talk about Moderna, I pl'ed my SB from 5 to 50 there using an SM so I was getting double loot and cash, I earned around 10plat for around 2days /played, would have made a little more if I salvaged my stuff but i didnt have that ability so i just sold to merchants.

And now crafters, the big myth that hinging brings money into the realm, it doesnt, it only brings money from the other players to the crafter in the end. ok, lets say a crafter salvages trinkets then sells back to merchant loads of stuff, and makes around 5-10plat, took him awhile, but you can say, great theres an extra 10plat floating around the Mid/pryd economy, yes, until he starts crafting again, now he makes loads of stuff MP's and the like, and looses his money to the blackhole, but gains it back from people.

Id say the only 2 areas that are really bringing in any money to the realm are Ebay and Moderna, the rest is comming in and going straight back out again (house deeds are massive blackholes).

And again, when ppl spend money in housing, it's merely a transfer, the money doesn't disappear.. only way it disappears are to healers restoring con, crafting supply merchants and other npc's ingame.. otherwise the money are just being transferred from person to person.

Exactly, so why does the cost need to be so high on items that are merely being traded, I suppose the insurance part I can understand, I mean who would like to sell their GoV for 30g hoping to buy what they need for 30g and find everyone else charges 10plat+, the solution is simple, logical and helps everyone but is futile, that people set reasonable prices on their CM's.

Money in these days is massively undervalued and it punishes only the new and casual.

That being said, you dont need to spend 100's of plats on a suit to compete imo.

 

[Golena]

I think your COMPLETELY missing the point.

You talk about the value of money dropping but the simple truth of the matter is money is coming into the game much faster than it's going out.

A group in DF can farm 10p a night in pure salvage. That's 10p more in the realm, just from one group. Now lets say my MP suit costs me 20p to actually craft (i'm not talking about the CM prices here). That means that after the second day of money farming everything I make is pure profit! Now lets say I money farm for a week, that's 50p of cash with nothing to spend it on other than other items. You talk about money black holes, the truth is none of the black holes in the game even come close to the amount that's being earnt.

Now lets say GOV sold for 30 gold instead of 30 plat. Wow I can buy HUNDREDS of them! Instead of only buying GOV for my character that needs it, i'll have one for my level 23 char, he might need one some day and i've got enough to buy it having killed 7 mobs! Yay!

So now i'll go farm a GOV.. wait why should I bother selling this i'll get 30 gold for it but i've already got more gold than I could ever spend ever even in a million zillion years. The GOV is way way way more useful to me. So now what we've done is completely removed cash from the trading system.

Remove cash completely, it's worthless. Great you say, that means that GOV won't be farmed over and over again. WRONG!!!!! Campers can still trade the GOV for items, you've removed cash, but you'll still see.. want to trade GOV for belt of moirai.. So the same people are still going to farm them.

Awesome now we've made the trading so unless you know how to get the leet items, you'll never be able to trade for another item again. Think of it being much the same now but instead of just being able to get some items that are worth 30p you'll have to find the exact item the GOV farmer wants.
You have 3 mad tales 3 scrolls from your latest ML7 farm.. In todays world you could sell them on your CM and use the money to buy GOV... In the eutopia where GOV doesn't sell for 30p the guy with GOV doesn't want 3 mad tails scrolls, he's got no use for them, no GOV for you!

Lets try an experiment, set the maximum amount of money anyone can trade anything for to 3p. That's reasonable yeah... now try and buy something.. good luck, your gonna need it!

 

[snushanen]

ofc nobody would sell GoV for 30 g becuse killing 10-15 mobbs solo gives the same amount and takes lesser time and it can be done alone and is easy etc .. But lets say people had a little closer prices to the value of them calculated of work and time. Mad tales 3 goes for 40p+ today and lets say a random mobb for lv 50s dropp aproxemently 2g that meens that logical take the price on mt3 40 000g divide it on 2g the drop of 1 random mobb that gives 40 000 / 2 = 20 000 . this means that tha value of mad tales 3 is logical correct IF it dropps in 1 of 20 000 mobbs I doubt that.

Ofc people charge more then the mathematical correct price because it is harder with finding the mobbs etc .. but still imo NO scroll is worth more then 10p because 10 000 /2 = 5000 mobbs to earn 10 p , and i guess that every scroll is much faster to pharm then killing 5000 random mobbs but ofc people have to charge more or else nobody would have huntet scrolls because it is much easier to hunt random mobbs to earn the same amount .

But my point and opinion is that the prices on some scrolls and some items are far to high .

The reason for that is that people with alot of money buys stuff like GoV , MT 2 & 3 , malice 3 for the high prices and when people see that they try to charge the same amount and dont think that the one guy who buyed GoV for 50 p is a rich guy E-Baying money .

One rich guy can make the prices raise to the skys, because an object is worth what the highest bidder will pay for it

 

[Farbaute2]

this is how the game is now. everyone has to spend some time pveing or crafting now. sure prices might be high but you can always farm the stuff /scrolls yourself or trade/farm in a guild or with friends. and there is inflation since its a free market system. just dont try get stuff you dont really need is what i think, try sell that stuff so others can use it. i dont think prices are to high. just the "market" is unbalanced sometimes since there arent that many players, i think it will probably be better after clustering.

 

[Belomar]

But no, every dumbass and his dog is off quoting Supply and Demand "laws" and a rediculously low value of coin, and screwing the system for everyone.

I don't have to go on about this, it is a self-fulfilling prophecy, I am just trying to explain it to people who don't understand. It is happening right now and will continue to happen regardless of what you say or do.

Golena says it well, too.

 

[Melachi]

I don't have to go on about this, it is a self-fulfilling prophecy, I am just trying to explain it to people who don't understand. It is happening right now and will continue to happen regardless of what you say or do.

Golena says it well, too.

While im sorry for having a go at you belomar since your a decent chap, its just deliberatly not putting in effort to understand my posts frustrates me, like you have just done again, but I dont mind because i blew of my steam and made a good point imo.

Just for the record

While I agree with you on things like this thread not changing anything.

 

[mercury]

Melachi

Sorry Melachi, ole buddy but you couldn't be more wrong......You said it all when you said 'you didn't do Economics at school'. Economics sure don't have all the answers, but it does enable you to ask some of the right questions.
Stick to slaughter by all means, and leave trading for those who have the brain cells to make it work - it ain't that hard if truth be told.

 

[Melachi]

Sorry Melachi, ole buddy but you couldn't be more wrong......You said it all when you said 'you didn't do Economics at school'. Economics sure don't have all the answers, but it does enable you to ask some of the right questions.
Stick to slaughter by all means, and leave trading for those who have the brain cells to make it work - it ain't that hard if truth be told.

hehe, dont worry ill continue to just farm what i need, leveling up a SC'er atm too, prefare to be self reliant

 

[Belomar]

While im sorry for having a go at you belomar since your a decent chap, its just deliberatly not putting in effort to understand my posts frustrates me, like you have just done again, but I dont mind because i blew of my steam and made a good point imo.

I know perfectly well what you are trying to say; threads like this have been posted in the past and I have even been part of posting in them. It's just not worth it, however, the desperate people who do need GOV or whatnot will not understand anyway.

 

[Henx]

..... Note that the above is an extended version of my previous post in this thread. All you really need to know are simply the two words "supply" and "demand".........

fact.

Just a little note for you Belomar, and everybody else that think that the economic laws of “supply and demand” does apply to the game… They do NOT apply.

The fundamentals for using the theorem aren’t there, and therefore you can apply the rules to the game.

By using the mechanism “supply” you actually need people with goods (scrolls, artifact, ect.) that wish to sell them and need to sell them to keep their business going. If you don’t make the sale you won’t be able to pay for the basic costs that are a part of running a business – salaries, phone, office supplies, yield of investment.

You do not need to sell scrolls or artifacts to keep playing DAOC, and since you don’t, you can keep the prices artificial high. In the real world those that needed the cash most (due to lack of sales), and bills coming in, would lover the price to “keep alive” and by that putting the supply/demand into affect.

In this game you have no upkeep (house = 1h farm max) so you do not need to make the sale, and people are often looking for the “magic” sale that will allow them to make their cash go through the roof. But they do NOT NEED to sell.

Belomar – if you have studied economics – guess that better go back and dust off you books and read the chapter of supply/demand, or if want to read about it – I can give you 10-15 books that states what I listed above.

And just for the record…. Even I really would like the price to be lowered, it is sure up to the players of the game whether they want to sell the items at overprice or help out fellow mids by giving the realmmates better conditions for getting a good template together without needing to farm forever or robbing someone else.

Guess a patch where max prices of an item won’t be supplies by DAOC. That is the only way the max prices of items can be set in this game.

I still say – call you friends, guildies and alliance mates – and have them help you out getting the things you need – more fun too.