death of pc gaming

[sanchez]

I don't really think it matters if a game is originally developed for a pc or console, if its a great game and its ported to the other formats then all the better (as long as its done well). All this stuff about exclusive content for particular platforms seems a bit silly to me though, i'm hardly likely to go out and buy a 360 just because the the latest version of gta won't have some of the 360 levels on the pc version - it really doesn't bother me.

Btw fana it's perfectly feasible and just as comfy to play pc games from the sofa. Output pc to big ass TV, sit on sofa with wireless keyboard and mouse.

 

[Fana]

I'd rather have the game developer be more creative and be ground breaking than be contricted to the technology found in a console.

There is only so much you can develop given the "static" nature of a console.

Whereas PC's are being innovative in their design all the time which means a game developer has more scope for being creative and breaking new ground.

The reason there are so many games for consoles is because they are so easy to make (compared to a PC game). The engines are going to be similar or the same. Thats why you get Vice City 5 and Metal Gear Solid 20. You can't push the limits with the graphics cos you are limited to what the console can handle while there are always new developments for PC video cards.

Oh and if you were into real flight sims (which I'm not) you could never ever get anywhere near that sort of thing on a console.

So better gfx = creativity and groundbreaking game design? In my oppinion limited hardware is what drives creativity because you cant just say "looks its super shiney and has billions of polygons!", instead you must offer something your competition doesnt, meaning different gameplay, story etc.

 

[sanchez]

In my oppinion limited hardware is what drives creativity because you cant just say "looks its super shiney and has billions of polygons!", instead you must offer something your competition doesnt, meaning different gameplay, story etc.

This is why the wii outsells the xbox and playstation, i wish developers for those platforms could take the hint.

 

[Spookie]

INC huge post.

Owning a Xbox 360 (and a previous owner of a PS3 sold it because the games are frankly lacking at the moment and not worth it.) and a reasonable PC while saving for another to play MMOs. I can say while the PC broke ground with online gaming and such features the consoles are sure catching up. Though live is lacking in many features like mods and such (the PSN isn't on the other hand they have a infrastructure there ready). They are going to be rectified by the release of Unreal Tourny III. So the gap is only getting smaller each time.

While I use to send HOURS playing PC games they are drying up fast. I can't name a game other than Half Life 2 and Crysis this year that I am really looking forward to. But on the other hand would need 2 sheets of A4 paper for the console games. I find the PC is suffering a lack of fresh titles and some of them being shitty ports from the console.

What's causing the dry up? Likely the rising cost of making games and the fact it's such a receding market in the retail stakes. You can walk in GAME and be bombarded with console titles and have to walk to the back to see a small shelf of PC games. It doesn't help the titles are nothing fresh. Bar the odd original game it's catalogue is made up of purdy shooters, RTS and MMOs. Not to say the consoles aren't any better but for every Halo 3 there is a Darkness, Forza 2, Crackdown, Dead Rising, Guitar Hero II and Bioshock.

Talking of Bioshock, IGN recently showed the differences between a high end PC (we're talking £1.5k PC) and a Xbox 360. The differences, which shocked me, looked minimal at best. I don't doubt it will look better at resolutions touching the 2k mark. But I couldn't justify the price my self.

It really doesn't help that a PC is such an anti social beast. You sit in the corner of a room usually with head phones on to play the game shouting orders down a mic as a bunch of clueless f-wits whos only role is to run round in a circle and they fail at that (*glares at Warcraft*). To address the Wii it's a run away success, not only because it's a fantastic gimmick, it also does what every other console and PC has yet to address. Introducing the casual market. You can pick it up and play tennis in seconds. While with Virtua tennis you need to learn how to move quickly and position your self while selecting the correct button to return. But I'm sure you get the idea any way sliding back on topic...


Don't get me wrong as I said I like my PC hell I'm buying a new one for Warhammer Online: AoR and Conan. But the PC market either needs some kind of rejuvenation much like when Valve came along with Half Life.

Now for some points directed at people.

Crackdown and Dead rising looks like Halo which was really dull. They are not really very exciting and they don't require any real skill. You just use what you know already from previous titles

PC Games:
Company of Heroes
F.E.A.R
ARMA: Armed Assault

I have not really looked into a great many titles as I'm still playing CSS...which beats any console game ever made.

Seriously did you even look at the gameplay or just looked at a screen shot and deemed it shit because it isn't on the PC?

Crackdown is about a super hero cop which combats crime in a unreal city, jumps over buildings and blows more things up than Arnie in his back catalogue of movies.
Dead Rising is about a journalist reporting on a zombie outbreak who uses what ever he can lift as a weapon to beat down the slowly amassing horde.

Hell. They aren't even in first person mode. If you're worried about the skill required (and lets not beat about the bush here. Using a mouse and keyboard doesn't make you more skilled than the next person but it does give you a god complex apparently) go play Forza 2.

CoH & FEAR were both released in 2006. Doesn't it alarm you thats the only game the PC can write home about?

Still it's not all doom and gloom. When the PC sees a good titles it usually dwarfs every console game on the market at that period of time. The only problem is there hasn't been any such titles for a good while.

Sorry for the long and no doubt incoherent post.

 

[dysfunction]

So better gfx = creativity and groundbreaking game design? In my oppinion limited hardware is what drives creativity because you cant just say "looks its super shiney and has billions of polygons!", instead you must offer something your competition doesnt, meaning different gameplay, story etc.

Tell me what innovation has there been in a console game that wasn't there in a PC game first?

It all starts with graphics like the ragdoll effects...it just adds to the extra enjoyment of the game.

 

[gmloki]

The common argument is comparing the price of a console to the price of a top spec PC. In most cases that is unfair. New PC>Cost of Console=Death of PC Gaming. Its bollox. Most people can run the latest games with a upgrade here or there. Be that the cost of some faster memory or better graphics card. Also to really enjoy Console games you need to have a fairly decent LCD TV.

Heres an example for you if you are new to gaming and the first game you buy is Bioshock.

Console Experience

Xbox 360
+
LCD (Half Decent PC)
+
Bioshock (Direct x 9 only, max resolution of 720p)

Approximately £700.00-£800.00

PC Experience

Half decent gaming rig (better controls)

+

Full internet access

+

Bioshock (DirectX 9 & Direct X10, Max Resolution 1080i)

+ Mods when they get made

Approx the same price or hell of a lot less if you upgrade. Better playing experience. Cost of software is less and potentially more play time for your money if and when mods are made available.

PC & Console gaming can live happily together if the distribution of software is sorted properly

 

[Spookie]

Heres an example for you if you are new to gaming and the first game you buy is Bioshock.

That doesn't seem a far comparison. Lets assume the Person doesn't already own a PC and wants to run it on high and at 1280x1024. Oh and don't forget they need a decent 21" monitor. I can't see it coming to any less than £1000 with a steady frame rate on DX9 with AA and AF. While it would be nice to have a Keyboard & Mouse on a 360 it's something I've grown use to for the time being.

As I said before difference in a negligible even on DX10.

 

[dysfunction]

INC huge post.

Seriously did you even look at the gameplay or just looked at a screen shot and deemed it shit because it isn't on the PC?

Crackdown is about a super hero cop which combats crime in a unreal city, jumps over buildings and blows more things up than Arnie in his back catalogue of movies.
Dead Rising is about a journalist reporting on a zombie outbreak who uses what ever he can lift as a weapon to beat down the slowly amassing horde.

Hell. They aren't even in first person mode. If you're worried about the skill required (and lets not beat about the bush here. Using a mouse and keyboard doesn't make you more skilled than the next person but it does give you a god complex apparently) go play Forza 2.

CoH & FEAR were both released in 2006. Doesn't it alarm you thats the only game the PC can write home about?

Yes and the gameplay looks like every other FPS (in non first person mode) made for the console. They all look like clones to me.

Read you own comments about Crackdown and Deadrising. They sound exactly the same only in a different environment.

No I'm not alarmed that CoH and FEAR were released in 2006 because there is not 1 title in the history of consoles that vaguely interests me (that wasnt stolen from the PC Version like Medal of Honor - which is still better on the PC.) (also excluding games machines pre 1981)

 

[Ch3tan]

gmloki, buying a hdtv exclusivly for gaming is pointless and expensive I agree. The point is that epople are naturally buying hdtv's as the centre of their home entertainment. You use it for TV, DVD's and gaming.

 

[Ch3tan]

Yes and the gameplay looks like every other FPS (in non first person mode) made for the console. They all look like clones to me.

Read you own comments about Crackdown and Deadrising. They sound exactly the same only in a different environment.
)

go play them then, or read a review. Crackdown can be compared to GTA, dead rising is more akin to resident evil games. Neither are anything like Halo, and the only similarity they bear to each other is the 3rd person view.

 

[Spookie]

go play them then, or read a review. Crackdown can be compared to GTA, dead rising is more akin to resident evil games. Neither are anything like Halo, and the only similarity they bear to each other is the 3rd person view.

See what Ch3tan said, it's clear you have no interest in trying a console and are trying to argue a hugely biased and uninformed view.

 

[dysfunction]

go play them then, or read a review. Crackdown can be compared to GTA, dead rising is more akin to resident evil games. Neither are anything like Halo, and the only similarity they bear to each other is the 3rd person view.

Yes thats the game I was trying to think of...GTA. Can't stand that game either...or Res Evil for that matter or Halo. Played them on Consoles in game stores and I can't say it filled me with any joy.

I'm getting bored of this now and We're not going to deviate from our views so prob best to stop here...

See what Ch3tan said, it's clear you have no interest in trying a console and are trying to argue a hugely biased and uninformed view.

if you say so

 

[Jupitus]

I reckon it's all looked at from the arse end to be honest.

It isn't the 'death of pc gaming', it is the merging of media of all forms into a common platform.

The equivalent of our home pc's in the near future will be multi-media and multi-capability machines running games, films, music, hdtv and everything else.

Is a sky digi box a 'television' device or mutated pc?

Is my pc a mutated DVD player?

Who is to say???

So, as the boundaries between the technologies continues to blur and erode we still argue about the death of 'pc' gaming... the death of 'gaming' I would worry about, the migration of gaming to newer technology (as yet undefined in terms of it's final look and feel) is something to be welcomed in the long term.

 

[Malecheon]

Well according to IGN, an american market research company called DFC Intelligence reckons the PC gaming market is going to grow from $4.5bn in 2006 to $13bn in 2012.

IGN: PC Game Market to Reach $13 Billion by 2012

 

[DaGaffer]

It isn't the 'death of pc gaming', it is the merging of media of all forms into a common platform.

The equivalent of our home pc's in the near future will be multi-media and multi-capability machines running games, films, music, hdtv and everything else.

Absolutely. There's already a lot of talk about this gen being the last 'console war' before the incumbents agree on a common format. Fact is, if most PC players were given a mouse and keyboard instead of a controller, they'd hardly notice the difference between a console and a PC these days.

And I don't care what anyone says, the cost of graphics card upgrades has turned into a ridiculous death spiral for PC games; I have a 2 year old card - X850 - and when I tried to play the demo of the new MOH, it says the card isn't supported! There was a time when min specs for PC games would be realistic, but now developers are just using PC games as technical showcases for high-end rigs.

I also think the other big killer for PC games is, ironically, the biggest PC game of all; WoW is a time and resource suck for a huge part of the PC gaming community, without necessarily growing the overall PC games market.

 

[DaGaffer]

Well according to IGN, an american market research company called DFC Intelligence reckons the PC gaming market is going to grow from $4.5bn in 2006 to $13bn in 2012.

IGN: PC Game Market to Reach $13 Billion by 2012

Yeah but its not going to grow in revenue because of a bigger variety of PC games. The growth forecast is almost entirely down to MMO subscription growth at one end and the burgeoning casual games sector (PopCap etc.) at the other. And as I said in the last post, events may overtake this if the console boys agree to a common format. Then the line between PC and consoles will blur anyway.

 

[dysfunction]

I think its more that Console gaming is dying out because the latest consoles (esp the XBOX) are actually becoming very much like a PC.

I bet sooner or later the so called console will have graphics cards which you can swop out for a better one...and bigger hard drives and what not...

Oh wait they have started that already!

 

[Mazling]

Computer gaming is a very young, very rapidly growing and technologically rapidly developing industry that is likely to be very patchwork - and very expensive -for the forseeable future. Which is probably only a decade or so :E
I suspect there is a level of hardware that will present a minimum level of capability/realism at which point development will either slow down or at least only release products once every few years, as opposed to what we have today

 

[Tom]

For the last few days I've been filming this CGS thing in Birmingham, I'd say that PC gaming is very much alive and kicking, and that its not going to go away any time soon.

These kids are as competitive as any athletes I've seen. Some of them should cut out the pies though.

 

[Aada]

The problem with PC gaming is it's too expensive to keep up with for the LACK of quality PC titles coming out.

Lets face it in the last 2 years Crysis is the IT game for the PC and it isn't even released yet.

Now for a person with say a year old PC they are going to have to upgrade to play it a 7900 GT graphics card will NOT cut the mustard with Crysis you are going to need poss 3 gigs of ram now even if you had 2 1 gig sticks your depending on how old the motherboard is your going to have to buy more RAM that in itself is possibly £150+ depending on how much you need.

Then we move onto the graphics card an 8800gts 320mb is roughly £200 including VAT BUT will you buy 2 of these? if thats the case another £200

So that's £350 or £550 (depending on if u buy 2 cards) before you have even bought the game.

This is the reason why PC gaming is not what it used to be because to play the game how its meant to be played you have to spend stupid money now once you have completed Crysis there will not be a game out for a while that even comes close graphically to Crysis nice money for a 15 hour game eh?

 

[nath]

A) You won't need more than 2gbs of ram, that's just silly.
B) You won't need to buy 2 8800GTS cards, that'd also be silly.
C) Infact, chances are crysis will work on a 7900, as I understand they've made the graphics extensively scaleable. Sure it won't look as good as it absolutely can but so what? You can't bitch about having to pay loads to get the best looking games when they offer options for lower specced systems. Consoles just work, but they have an upper limit on what they can do and Crysis' visuals shit all over anything a console can do.

The arguments you're making are the same arguments people have been making since consoles became popular, PC's aren't going anywhere.

 

[DaGaffer]

Min Specs and recommended for Crysis:

CPU: Athlon 64 3000+/Intel 2.8GHz; Graphics: NVIDIA 6600/X800GTO (SM 2.0); RAM: 768MB/1GB; HDD: 6GB; Internet: 256k+; Optical Drive: DVD; Software: DX9.0c with Windows XP

Recommended Requirements

CPU: Dual-core CPU (Athlon X2/Pentium D)
Graphics: Nvidia 7800GTX/ATI X1800XT (SM 3.0) or DX10 equivalent
RAM: 1.5GB
HDD: 6GB
Internet: 512k+ (128k+ upstream)
Optical Drive: DVD
Software: DX10 with Windows Vista


I've got plenty of RAM for this but my CPU and Graphics card (2.5 years old) are on the minimum

 

[Aada]

Min Specs and recommended for Crysis:

CPU: Athlon 64 3000+/Intel 2.8GHz; Graphics: NVIDIA 6600/X800GTO (SM 2.0); RAM: 768MB/1GB; HDD: 6GB; Internet: 256k+; Optical Drive: DVD; Software: DX9.0c with Windows XP

Recommended Requirements

CPU: Dual-core CPU (Athlon X2/Pentium D)
Graphics: Nvidia 7800GTX/ATI X1800XT (SM 3.0) or DX10 equivalent
RAM: 1.5GB
HDD: 6GB
Internet: 512k+ (128k+ upstream)
Optical Drive: DVD
Software: DX10 with Windows Vista


I've got plenty of RAM for this but my CPU and Graphics card (2.5 years old) are on the minimum

My point is that you wouldn't really want to buy Crysis if you can't run it on max settings because it just wouldn't do the game justice.

1.5 ram? i highly doubt that will run the game silk smooth.

 

[Louster]

So your whole argument in fact hinges on "well if it's not run at maximum settings and smooth as silk then it's TOTALLY POINTLESS WTF".

Yes, if everyone really was upgrading their machines to run every new game on ultimate maximum super awesome settings, you might have a point.

Luckily most people aren't quite that fucking stupid/shallow.

 

[Raven]

Talking of Bioshock, IGN recently showed the differences between a high end PC (we're talking £1.5k PC) and a Xbox 360. The differences, which shocked me, looked minimal at best. I don't doubt it will look better at resolutions touching the 2k mark. But I couldn't justify the price my self.

Hmm....no, my PC which cost around the 700-750 mark plays bioshock at max settings without breaking a sweat, thats without overclocking it. Only stupid people pay over £1000 for a PC.

Anyway, as someone said its pretty much down to preference. The kinds of games I play just don't work on a console, RTS/MMO/FPS with a control pad? er no thanks, the only fps to ever work properly on a console was Goldeneye. for MMOs and RTS games there are just far to many buttons to fit onto a control pad.

As for graphics there haven't been any DX10 games yet, just DX9 games that also work with DX9, not counting shitty Halo 2 which could be made to work easily on XP if Microsoft wanted it to.

 

[Fana]

Well, as i predicted in my post in august in this thread i bought a HD-ready LCD tv a couple of weeks back, and been enjoying my 360 more than ever since Playing Mass Effect on 1366x768 (i.e. 720p) with a wireless controler comfortably in my lap is great. My old but upgraded pc will have to serve for a while yet before it is replaced, and when it is it will likely be built with modest specifications that can handle RTS's basically, since thats the only type of game that i dont want to play on a console. MMO's, well, its better not to play them tbh, and not having a machine that can play them is a good way of avoiding them. In any event, im sure there will be more MMO's on the consoles in the future.

Looking at the list of upcoming PC games at the webstore i usually use to buy games i find only one PC game next year that i know i want to play - Starcraft 2, and knowing Blizzard i wont have any trouble playing it on my current PC anyway.