CoC comments/feedback

Jupitus

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Seems a little bit familiar for some strange reason... ;)

Couple of initial thoughts:

1)
Forum Management
What Happens when you get banned?
If a Forum Moderator believes you have broken this code <snip>
Maybe drop the 'What happens when you get banned?' heading as this section refers not just to bans but disciplinary action in general. I think it would be worth considering a line at the end of this section thus:

'All such decisions will be at the moderator's discretion and their decisions final' ... having this 'moderator discretion' wording takes a bit of the pressure off the mods in terms of being absolutely even with every different situation, which in a practical world is impossible. Might also be worth adding a 'the moderators give their time here on a voluntary basis and should also be treated with respect' or something.

2) Swear filter. In the commercial world this is important, but is it really necessary in this reborn FH world? You have the 'please don't swear excessively' thing there and most if not all users know any number of ways around the swear filters anyway... (you may actually recall that one of my first ever posts on BarrysWorld concerned a mod using the c word in the DAOC forums after GOA dropped their official forums ... at the time I let my lad read the boards, I soon changed that when I realised what a rude bunch of wankers hang out around here :p)
 

Yoni

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The CoC are fine with the exception of one thing. The swear filter and I am a little torn with this one.

On one hand I believe that people should be free to express themselves and occasionally there is a need to say the "C" word, however I personally don’t find CFOADOA or any variations on the theme acceptable not because of the "C" its the wishing that people die of heinous diseases which I find offensive.

So if it is possible freedom to express yourself within reason I guess rather than slapping a swearfilter on.
 

bigfoot

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The C word will be banned still. There is no swear filter as such, the only other words banned are things like ****** and n*gger.
 

Jupitus

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Isn't it better given a fresh start to treat people in a mature manner but actively mod to prevent people thinking they can take the piss? Sure, at the start people will try and test the limits, then some will get warned, and if they don't listen they'll get suspended or banned, but over time it should settle down leaving the boards open to free discussion and users who have a reasonable feel for what will or won't be accepted.... [/2cents]
 

bigfoot

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I'm not sure how banning the words c*nt and n*gger is equivalent to not treating people maturely?

If you mean the CoC in general, well, it is needed because prior to it being introduced people were taking liberties and dragging the forums down. This was true of the General forum and the DAoC forums.

Perhaps it has taken the edge off things a little but to be honest I'm happy with that where the edge is people like Dimebah or Bodhi, or other idiots who think their extreme views are kewl to post, even if they don't really believe them. As I posted in the other forums I have suspended something like 6 "General forum" posters people in 3 months since the Code of Conduct was introduced, some for as little as a day, some for longer. I don't think 6 in 3 months is that many but the problem is that if we take even the slightest action people jump on it like we are hitler.

It's a fresh start so we'll see how it goes but I think we do need guidelines or people will take the piss.
 

Reubs

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Jupitus said:
Seems a little bit familiar for some strange reason... ;)

Couple of initial thoughts:

1)

Maybe drop the 'What happens when you get banned?' heading as this section refers not just to bans but disciplinary action in general. I think it would be worth considering a line at the end of this section thus:

'All such decisions will be at the moderator's discretion and their decisions final' ... having this 'moderator discretion' wording takes a bit of the pressure off the mods in terms of being absolutely even with every different situation, which in a practical world is impossible. Might also be worth adding a 'the moderators give their time here on a voluntary basis and should also be treated with respect' or something.

2) Swear filter. In the commercial world this is important, but is it really necessary in this reborn FH world? You have the 'please don't swear excessively' thing there and most if not all users know any number of ways around the swear filters anyway... (you may actually recall that one of my first ever posts on BarrysWorld concerned a mod using the c word in the DAOC forums after GOA dropped their official forums ... at the time I let my lad read the boards, I soon changed that when I realised what a rude bunch of wankers hang out around here :p)
I remember that post Jupitus :) I remember thinking this DAOC thing is going to end in tears, funny how it turns out eh? :)
 

Jupitus

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bigfoot said:
I'm not sure how banning the words c*nt and n*gger is equivalent to not treating people maturely?
Having no filter from day one shows that you intend to let people express themselves from the start, but having the CoC in place to remind them not to overdo it. Kind of sets the tone, if you like. You always have the option to introduce one if needed but as we all know they don't really stop people posting what they will anyway. Better to deal with the trouble makers through modding in my view.

If you mean the CoC in general, well, it is needed because prior to it being introduced people were taking liberties and dragging the forums down. This was true of the General forum and the DAoC forums.
100% agreed. CoC is a good idea to let people know the guildelines.

Perhaps it has taken the edge off things a little but to be honest I'm happy with that where the edge is people like Dimebah or Bodhi, or other idiots who think their extreme views are kewl to post, even if they don't really believe them. As I posted in the other forums I have suspended something like 6 "General forum" posters people in 3 months since the Code of Conduct was introduced, some for as little as a day, some for longer. I don't think 6 in 3 months is that many but the problem is that if we take even the slightest action people jump on it like we are hitler.
True - in general it's been pretty good but people will always push the limits on what is being too tough or not

It's a fresh start so we'll see how it goes but I think we do need guidelines or people will take the piss.
Exactly my point... let's see how it goes and tighten the rules if it proves necessary.

[/2cents]
 

Jupitus

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Reubs said:
I remember that post Jupitus :) I remember thinking this DAOC thing is going to end in tears, funny how it turns out eh? :)
Indeed - it was Sar wasn't it? Nice to see someone remembers my outburts :p
 

bigfoot

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Having no filter from day one shows that you intend to let people express themselves from the start, but having the CoC in place to remind them not to overdo it. Kind of sets the tone, if you like. You always have the option to introduce one if needed but as we all know they don't really stop people posting what they will anyway. Better to deal with the trouble makers through modding in my view.
It's a very thin filter, those being the only two words in it really. I don't think a filter it infringes on people's ability to convey their point, I know some people might use the c word daily but there are younger posters who will use it more than anyone would normally in conversation and I'm not going to get down to moderating based on the number of times you say a word in one day. I doubt anyone uses the n word in daily conversation in this country and if they do then they need their head examined.
 

Jupitus

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bigfoot said:
I know some people might use the c word daily but there are younger posters who will use it more than anyone would normally in conversation
... and do we want those posters hanging around anyway? That's my point... if people are going to use bad language, out of context and in excess, then let the modding/warning/suspension/ban system remove them and the best of the community will remain.... the filters just serve as a small but not insignificant annoyance to the more mature posters ( and I dont mean old :p) who would use the language appropriately and in moderation....
 

Salteh

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As long as the C-word will no be "cookie", I don't mind some words being filtered.


But dear bf, please lets us keep the cookie :poke2:

[edit] - the : poke2: doesn't work :(
 

Will

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I'm pretty easy about a filter being there. I can see both sides of the arguement, but having it in place now means there won't be a difficult transition later when it is introduced. The busier the forums get, there more need there is for some sort of filter.

It would be nice if the filter could be applied to all forums except General, but I don't think that is possible with the software being used.
 

Deebs

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Salteh said:
As long as the C-word will no be "cookie", I don't mind some words being filtered.


But dear bf, please lets us keep the cookie :poke2:

[edit] - the : poke2: doesn't work :(
I know, gotta fix it!
 

Deebs

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Will said:
I'm pretty easy about a filter being there. I can see both sides of the arguement, but having it in place now means there won't be a difficult transition later when it is introduced. The busier the forums get, there more need there is for some sort of filter.

It would be nice if the filter could be applied to all forums except General, but I don't think that is possible with the software being used.
It is a global filter at the moment. Maybe a hack will be produced....
 

TedTheDog

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Now we're no longer a commercial organisation does the bloody coc have to be so damn anal?
We need to have some rules, and we need to protect ourselves as publishers, but I cant see the need for such wallowing in bullshit.

I say ditch the fucking thing as it is, it doesnt represent who we are or what we're here for and replace it with something less far shorter and more to the point.
 

Will

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TedTheDog said:
I say ditch the fucking thing as it is, it doesnt represent who we are or what we're here for and replace it with something less far shorter and more to the point.
Something along the lines of "behave, or you'll be edited/deleted/banned as appropriate. You know where the line is already"?
 

gremlin

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TedTheDog said:
Now we're no longer a commercial organisation does the bloody coc have to be so damn anal?
I totally agree with Ben (blimey, I must be getting soft). The CoC is fine for a bunch of customer-friendly corporate ho's like game.. but it's not in the spirit of the original BW or by association, FH.

Put a standard disclaimer and "if we dont like your attitude you get banned" in and it'll be fine :)
 

bigfoot

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I'm afraid it won't be fine. People want accountability from moderators (even if they have no right to it) and in areas such as the DAoC forums it will be necessary to have this in the shape of a Code of Conduct. If you then get into the situation where you have rules on the DAoC forums but not elsewhere then the forums as a whole will become a complete mess.

It's alright taking the "we'll ban you if you fuck about" approach, I've taken that line myself in the past with regards to some of my early leagues, but it simply doesn't work once you get above a certain level of users. If we are looking at a significant percentage of the current GAME.NET forum users moving across then this will be nothing like the cosy little "BarrysWorld of old" and you cannot therefore moderate it like it was, even if you really do want it to be.
 

bigfoot

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I've tried a slightly different approach to the CoC (you can view it by clicking the link). Let me know if you think it is any better.
 

Jupitus

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I much prefer the new version... I particularly like the 'finish this sentence in not more than 10 words' competition :p

Posting should be done in English. Drunken English is also permitted so long as we can make sense of it without having to use a crack team of
.... crack team of language professors, perhaps?

Overall much much better :)
 

TdC

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Jupitus said:
I much prefer the new version... I particularly like the 'finish this sentence in not more than 10 words' competition :p



.... crack team of language professors, perhaps?

Overall much much better :)

or without using great big rocks of crack?
 

Yoni

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I like the new version of the CoC much better :fluffle:
 

Embattle

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Deebs said:
I know, gotta fix it!
Any time in the next 10 years will do ;)

The CoC doesn't need to exist in its original form but I do believe that some form of CoC should be tacked onto the registering stage, but I would remove it from general forum view.
 

Will

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The new version is much more in keeping with the non-commercial nature of the new site. I approve.:D
 

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