Clerics are overpowed

[old.chesnor]

Got a Cleric to 20, and can safely say they are one overpowered class.

NERF CLERICS

Oh, wait, they have been nerfed. By 20ish%.

NERF CLERICS MORE

No wait, that will mean I will suck.

OMG SMITE ROCKS!!111

 

[censi]

aye, but I think Mystic are well aware of this now.. I think the nerf sounds about right....

I mean a healer class, with chain armour, with insta mezzes and lethal smite damage..... Cant believe it took them this long to realise it...

They will still be a gr8 class, but hopefully not too gr8.

Now lets see them give BM's a bit of a boost.

 

[Troryn]

I´d just like to point out drunken clerics isn't overpowered

no hard feelings Chesnor can happen to the best

 

[Meatballs]

it sucks for non-smite clerics who have crap enough smites already :|

 

[old.chesnor]

Yes I must say that although Clerics are overpowered, I was hit by the almighty nerf stick that is Stella Artois last night

This is the foulest of nerfs, and turned a competant smiting killing machine into a reckless fool. Apologies to Troryn and Nimas and anyone else unfortunate enough to be anywhere near me during my drunken rampage in Keltoi....

Woke up with a hangover, res sickness AND precisely 0 xp for my 20th level.

Kids, don't drink and smite !

 

[old.Alliandre]

lol. I'd have loved to of been there

 

[old.LandShark]

dmg nerfed by 20% (slightly more in fact) and the final DD is reduced to 43spec and the equivalent dmg for a 43spec spell. Double-nerf.
Triple if you could the PBAE mezz going onto 5min timer

but hey
IT WAS TEH CHiANE-WAErIGN WIZARDXF WITHHY 15 INSTUNTHAELSLZ>??!£%¬
^%

 

[Sarnat]

Baseline smites were not changed AFAIK. Nerf bat swings where nerf bat should swing. Feel it's pain clerics!

 

[klavrynd]

albion , where support classes kill everyone in 1 vs 1...

 

[Turamber]

Albion ... where the most numerous tank type, the Paladin, owns in PvE but provides guaranteed realm points in RvR.

 

[Troryn]

Barrysworld, where no thread will be left without at least a single highjacking <sigh>

 

[Aeiedil]

Cabalists, Mythics answer for the lack of jesters in Camelot

 

[Danya]

Originally posted by Aeiedil
Cabalists, Mythics answer for the lack of jesters in Camelot

LMAO

As for the cleric nerfs, smite was maybe ok, but the mez nerf was just stupid. They nerf one support classes CC but leave the healer with it's completely stupid amount of CC, WTF were they thinking with that?!

 

[Damon_D]

Bahhh as a healer all you can do is mezz/stun , its not like we can do some dmg instead " hint hint nudge nudge " What wouldnt my healer or shaman give to be able to stun someone and then nuke the shid out of them, and then actualy be able to use styles to finish them of if the nukes didnt do it. A cleric is way overpowered compared to the healer and the shaman , the two classes who he should have most in common with in Mid

 

[Troryn]

clerics dont get styles

they do NOT have speccable weapons

 

[old.Emma]

well i think smite is overpowered and should be nurfed, but increasing the insta stun to 5 mins, that is gonna suck. that is pretty much the life line of a group if the group insta`s are gone and there all taking a beating, atleast it gives us a chance to run or even get a few extra hits now, but when you compare it to the other true healing classes in the game, it is a spell clerics shouldn`t of had in the first place.

 

[Damon_D]

Originally posted by Troryn
clerics dont get styles

they do NOT have speccable weapons

Hmmm sorry bout that, was quit sure I had seen, that they where able to train in staff, somewhere

And smite was still over powered for a class that can insta stun peopel, ok 5 min may be a bit long, but you can have it back as iy used to be , when my shaman get a repetable dmg as smite

 

[Troryn]

friars can train staff

but then again friars are not as good healers as clerics

(a rejuv friar does not get any instants or any such thingies) and only 2 baseline resurections, totally sucks

should make rejuvline for friars and clerics the same

 

[elijahsunrise]

For a start clerics do NOT have insta stun you idiots!! For gods sake please actually read up on a class and find out what abilities it has before you come to these boards screaming someone should be nerfed or you are glad they are nerfed because......

Clerics have a single MEZZ its point blank range you have to be in their faces to actually cast it as the area of effect is tiny. It has always been a 30 sec recast timer and at high levels lasted about 30 secs. They have a stun also but thats a CASTABLE stun not an instant stun.

So the only real escape for a cleric is that instant mezz and now it is on a 5 minute timer. So when a cleric has to run into a group of 50 mids melee range to try an mezz a couple and it fails what happens then? Yep death.

Others like the CHAIN WEARING SPEED BOOSTED LONG RANGE MEZZING HEALER class can use a mass of stuns and mezzes area of effect and single effect which turn the tide of a battle in most cases where a single SMITE will never do.

I cant believe people like you guys actually got clerics nerfed with your whining yet none of you know what they can and cant do and have no idea about the class.

I think landshark hit it right on the head with his 15 instantheals remark showing what some of you idiots actually say on boards.

I deleted my cleric and quit albion because i was so sick of the mezz and smite nerfs that have totally ruined my fun playing the class and i had played my cleric since day 1 of retail.

Soon as star wars or shadowbane come out i will ditch this worthless nerf infested game in the bin where it belongs but untill then i need something to keep me going so i will have to hear your ignorant remarks about clerics a while longer i guess.

 

[old.Revz]

It is quite worrying the number of people willing to stick their oar in about why the cleric deserves to get nerfed when they are so badly misinformed about its basic abilities.

• Clerics CANNOT spec any melee weapons whatsoever.
• Clerics CANNOT quick cast.
• Clerics have a CASTABLE single target stun with a range of 1000 (one of the shortest range spells in the game). It costs a significant amount of power to cast this.
• Clerics have two instas which restore 55% and 50% of their HP and are on 15 minute and 20 minute timers respectively. However, they only get these by speccing at least 23 in rejuv.
• Clerics have a POINT BLANK AE mez with a radius of 200 (this is a smaller AoE than the Healers ranged mez). The duration is proportional to the amount of smite spec they have and is at its maximum of 30 seconds at 44 spec smite.
• Clerics "uber" smite is actually a 4 second (yes 4 seconds that is 33% slower than most casters spells) castable DD spell with a range of 1350 (again very short for a DD spell when you consider that Wizard bolt spells have nearly 50% more range than it).

Yes Clerics did need tuning because in my opinion smite was too effective. What has happend is that the tuning went too far in the nerf direction and it ends up breaking clerics as a class. This was mostly down to the uninformed masses who got beaten down by a cleric in 1v1 (at the cost of 75% of the clerics power bar for 1 target) and started complaining. As has been displayed here even 6 months after the game has been out most of the opposing realms have misconceptions about what a cleric is capable of.

I am pretty happy to swap a reduction in smite damage (although not as far as they have gone) for an increased healing range which I feel will be much more effective for me in RvR. The problem is with changing one of the spec smite DDs down from 48 to 43 spec AND reducing its damage you effectively double nerf a class because all those clerics who specced 48 to get it have their points wasted until they can respec. It's not as if clerics have points to spare since they only get 1 x level spec anyway.

My main gripe is the insta mez going on a 5 minute timer. As a balanced spec cleric I find most of my time in RvR is spent healing, stunning and mezzing (smite is too costly and slow to use much). Without my mez to keep me safe and able to cast (since I am unable to quick cast) I will not be able to perform my job. I've lost track of the number of times I've been spotted as a cleric and swamped with attackers because they don't want me healing my group. The only thing that saves me in that situation is being able to mez.

 

[- Pathfinder -]

Zzz

We've heard it before. Yes, the cleric has an awesome arsenal of skills, if specced "properly", but consider this:

As previously stated, the PBAE MEZ (Yes, MEZ; not stun) is just that; pointblank. You have to run up to someone to use it. Basically it ends up as a "saving throw" (for you AD&D people) versus tanks/assasins; it's prone to fail at critical times; ask the people I've duelled about resisting my "uber" mez, cough. Healers, while having no offence, gets incredible CC spells (including ranged, AE instas, cough).

For the mez/smite to actually be useful, you need to spec smite high, which results in either rundamentary healing and crap buffs, or vice versa. There are balanced clerics, but people seem to assume that everyone has 48 smite, so we'll work from that.

People look at the damage and cry NERF; seriously, smite has a range of 1350 (LESS than the Thane's, a bloody TANK), the same damage cap as mage spells (3x), but without a chance to cause a critical hit. This means that my cleric with the 48 smite can potentially do 675 damage to a target. Sounds like alot, doesn't it? It is, unfortunately the target basically has to be a greycon (or undead/elemental) for us to cap out. With high resists and HP we don't do that much damage, given the casting time.

Smiters are resilient, which is why people picked them over wizards; we can, in no way, ever come close to their damage output. We are, however, fairly hard to kill when the instants are ready, which has lead to the rediculous nerf debate. In a 1on1, we can be, and often are, deadly; few classes would wish to go up against us. That said, we don't get a 1on1 very often. Why? We can't stealth. We have no speed. This equates to us being useless soloing (sure, we could defeat a group of lower cons, and higher cons if they played poorly, but we have no true soloing capacity per se), so we need to group, or follow a zerg. Now, formidable and resilient as we are, we do not determine who wins battles. The infamous healer is far, FAR better in these situations.

The discussion is moot anyway, since Mythic has decided to nerf us; at least I'll be able to buff after the patch.

 

[old.chesnor]

- Pathfinder -

You seriously don't get it when you compared a Healer and Cleric. you state that you can potentially smite for 675dmg. Lets make this figure more realistic and easy to mamange. Call it 500. So you can smite at 1350 for 500dmg, get perhaps 3 smites in. Thats 1500dmg. Most Healers will not spec Augmentation higher than 5 (until 1.50) as that line sucks. That will give Healers a whopping 1.6dps damage add (at 48 Smite Clerics get 9.2dps). We can use basically the same weapons, although Healers get 2h. So not only can you hit for 1000s of ranged damage, but you outmelee us also.

And you utterly contradict yourself with statments like :-

This equates to us being useless soloing (sure, we could defeat a group of lower cons, and higher cons if they played poorly, but we have no true soloing capacity per se),

Err, if you can kill a group!? of lower cons or higher cons that are not playing well, then you can solo...simple eh!

Basically, and I have much experience of getting pwned by Gromit in the frontiers, Clerics are far and away the best healing class in the game, even post nerf.

Back on track, I am speccing for 43 smite, 23 rejuv and 22 enhancments. Would any non-hysterical 'we been teh nerfed I del0t0ring' Clerics care to tell me if this is a viable template. And I really don't want to hear 'we suck now' because you don't. You rock.

 

[old.Revz]

In this version of the game I don't think 43 smite actually lands you on a spell so the only thing speccing it that high does is reduce your already very low variance by perhaps 0.001% You would be better off going to 44 smite (the final 30 second mez) or stopping lower and putting more in enhance.

In case you are interested I have 35 smite, 31 enhance and 26 rejuv. The spells I use by far and away the most are my buffs, my stun (which is baseline smite so you don't need to spec for it) and my mez (which at 35 smite is 25 seconds long). If I was doing it all over again I might drop smite a little more and bump enhance.

Having 26 rejuv is, in my opinion, an oft overlooked little gem You get the next level group heal and a 50% rez which despite the casting time is absolutely brilliant. Casters love you bringing them back with half power so they can do something without sitting for 5 minutes.

Also, although me and Path disagree over the severity of the smite nerf the combined effect of it all is pretty nasty for a class that is basically the mainstay for Albion in a lot of situations. I feel especially sorry for high smite clerics (which is why I would not recommend going high smite these days) as they are totally gutted by it.

 

[- Pathfinder -]

As far as your damage calculation goes, it's entirely correct - as long as I'm facing someone many levels below me and who's not wearing extensive resist gear. The typical Mid I run into is a yellow con, I do not hit yellow cons for 500 damage. Given the resist ratio, I can't safelty land three smites on a target; I normally expect at least one to be resisted. I agree that the damage add should be placed under Enhance, but really, it's not a very efficient tool; you will still be outmeleed by most classes (and you're not liekly to end up fighting a Healer; I fought Mordia (50 healer) for fun once, and her 2hand hammer did some serious damage, given the circumstances

It's not an actual contradiction; yes, I CAN solo a small group IF it contains suitable classes and IF they are complete newbs (three bluecon tanks all charging me at once, for instance). A TANK could solo as well, depending on the "skill" of his opponents. True soloing is based on your ability to pick your fights; clerics, without stealth and speed, cannot do that.

Basically, you consider clerics uber as they can take down most other classes in a 1on1. So we can, but it comes with severe limitations.

As for your template, if you want to smite it's either that or go 49 smite for the AE (Thanes humble our 39 AE etc). Template works, if you want to smite, go for it.

As for clerics being a "sucky" class past 1.51; no, we're still useful, especially since our baseline stun remains. Having tested a cleric on Pendragon though, I for one have to redefine my role - so a respec to enhance will be in order.

 

[Danya]

Blaen will get buffs? wow and there was me used to getting buffed and only telling the difference from the icons on the screen.

 

[- Pathfinder -]

Originally posted by Dannyn
Blaen will get buffs? wow and there was me used to getting buffed and only telling the difference from the icons on the screen.

 

[Vell]

Originally posted by old.Revz
It is quite worrying the number of people willing to stick their oar in about why the cleric deserves to get nerfed when they are so badly misinformed about its basic abilities.

Yes, I agree
It also pisses me off when people say healers rock too, quoting that they have 15million different types of CC.
It's really not relevant how many different types we have, BECAUSE THEY ARE ALL ON THE SAME TIMER (after patch 1.51). If I've mezzed you, I can't mezz you again until the timer is up, even if I do have a million different mezz spells, I can still only use 1 on you! And guess what! The same goes for my stun! Sure, I can mezz you and then stun you, but then so can minstels, clerics, eldritch, and mentalists.
And hey, Clerics also get buffs a billion times better than mine....

 

[- Pathfinder -]

A smiter does not get very good buffs, for obvious reasons.

 

[Danya]

Originally posted by - Pathfinder -

Awww poor pathy

As for the healer thing. You are the only class with a stun longer than 9 secs and additionally it's the only AE stun in the game... You also have the only ranged AE insta mez (till the bard gets it, where's the insta AE mez for albion, huh?!)

 

[old.chesnor]

Yes, thats it Healers. Stun the enemy to death !