Casino

[adams901]

Last night and decided to dig out my video player and watch Casino, I had forgotten what a great film this was. De'niro and Pesci are great actors and with the new actors we have seen over the last couple of years I fail to see anyone who can play or match the Mafia role we get from Pacino, De'niro, Pesci, Brando or Sizemore, which leads me to think that once these fine actors are gone we will lose the capacity to produce films like this.

 

[Ash!]

Possibly. Its not just the actors though that make the film great. Its needs a sound production team and a superb Director. Although Spielberg is not everyones cup of tea, Would his films be as good with another director ?

 

[adams901]

I know what your saying but my point is there are no "newer" actors (in my eyes) that can play the type of character as convincingly as pacnio or de'niro. We have Ben Affleck who is a brilliant actor but I see him as more of an action film character.

You can have the greatest director and film crew in the world but unless you have the right actors it just wont work.

 

[Ash!]

I do agree with your point. Pacino. De Niro, Pesci seem to have the intensity to bring off the characters they portray

 

[shadow`]

I watched a gangster type movie called "A Bronx Tale" which was on bbc1 after The Shining on Saturday.

De Niro directed and starred in it, and it was pretty excellent. Definitely recommend anyone to see it if they ever get the chance.

 

[nath]

Affleck is fucking shit.

Benicio Del Toro is fucking ace*









*this may or may not be relevant

 

[jake cop]

Originally posted by adams901
I know what your saying but my point is there are no "newer" actors (in my eyes) that can play the type of character as convincingly as pacnio or de'niro.

It may have escaped everyone's notice but Pacino hasn't done anything decent for years. He's replaced his earlier intensity and subtlety with a knack for shouting his lines when the script bails out on him. He did this in Heat, which was critically indifferent and he did it in the Insider, supposedly a great film.

We have new actors emerging all the time, who'd have thought that Mark Whalberg could act? But he can, then there's Andy Garcia, the one redeeming light in the darkness that was Godfather III. For a really hot young actor though there's Joaquin Pheonix, Commodus in Gladiator.

 

[Moving Target]

Originally posted by shadow`
I watched a gangster type movie called "A Bronx Tale" which was on bbc1 after The Shining on Saturday.

De Niro directed and starred in it, and it was pretty excellent. Definitely recommend anyone to see it if they ever get the chance.

I also watched this. Was better than the Shining (which was fucking shite).

 

[Ash!]

Originally posted by jake cop


It may have escaped everyone's notice but Pacino hasn't done anything decent for years. He's replaced his earlier intensity and subtlety with a knack for shouting his lines when the script bails out on him. He did this in Heat, which was critically indifferent and he did it in the Insider, supposedly a great film.

We have new actors emerging all the time, who'd have thought that Mark Whalberg could act? But he can, then there's Andy Garcia, the one redeeming light in the darkness that was Godfather III. For a really hot young actor though there's Joaquin Pheonix, Commodus in Gladiator.

Nor has De-Niro. Last film I can think of was Ronin which was nothing more than average. Men of Honour with Cuba Gooding Jnr was nothing short of pitiful

Out of interest which is the best Gangster type flick ?

I go for Carlitos Way

 

[jake cop]

Originally posted by blade07
Nor has De-Niro. Last film I can think of was Ronin which was nothing more than average.

Too true, they've both been trading on the reputations of their earlier works. They were both fine actors in their day, maybe they still are but they haven't found the right projects.

As for the best gangster flick, I can't honestly look any further than Goodfellas. Casino, although a decent film was a remake anyway. Godfather II is one of the finest peices of film making ever, but Pesci's psychotic killer can't be beat.

 

[adams901]

Films no longer contain the brilliance that older films such as Casino, Goodfellas, La Confidential and the rest that I have not mentioned brought to the screen. Pacino , De'niro and Pesci where/are great for their time, I admit they have not had many good films lately but that is probally due to the lack of creativity that has plagued the hollywood over the last few years.

As for Mark Whalberg while he is a good actor I would not put him in the same league as Pacino, De'niro or Pesci, when they are cast in films like those I mentioned above they are in their element, and very few people can match them.

Andy Garcia has been around for years I would not class him as a new actor and yes I would say he is a great actor

It seems hollywood goes through stages where we get shitloads of movie from the same genre, (Action, Sci-Fi, Romance etc), we need a couple of good mafia style films directed by Scorsese casting De'niro, Pacino and Pesci then we will see them in their true light.

At the end of the day I suppose it is all down to a particular persons taste in films, I love mafia films and most people associated mafia flicks with de'niro or Pacino. I have a strong passion for movies and to be honest am not happy with the quality hollywood has produced over the last few years, and it doesn't look like its going to improve anytime soon, for me the 90s contained many films that I will class as greats.

**EDIT**
@ Jake... You have to admit there haven't been any "good" mafia style films for for a long time and casting De'Niro and Pacino in a film other than a mafia film is like casting Bruce Willis in a love story.

 

[Ash!]

Could James Gandolfini make the jump from little screen to big screen. He plays the part of Tony Soprano very well. He seems to command authority and his the ruthlessness associated with mafioso types. I may not be looking beyond him in the Soprano's so correct me if I am wrong

Could he be the one to reignite the genre ?

As for Whalberg. Hes ok. Nothing special IMHO

 

[caLLous]

Ray Liotta is still around (imo with a recent career best performance in Narc). But there are no young'uns that could match the cast of Goodfellas nowadays.

 

[Trem]

Can I just say....Pacino - Insomnia, Insider(his acting more than the films, although both were excellent).

 

[Lester]

My two cents....

James Gandolfini HAS made the leap to big screen (before Sopranos actually) and is top class.

Casting the same actors in the same roles is just something I'm not interested in and I'm sure neither are they.

L.A. Confidential cannot be classed as old (and did not star De Niro, Pacino or Pesci)

As for the thread starter, yes those four or five guys were good but the only one of those still making good movies (playing different characters) is Pacino.

Sizemore, De Niro and Pesci are just one trick ponies now it seems (I'm not saying they're shit , just coasting) And Brando, well.

Finally, it's only just 2003, give 'em a chance

 

[legendario]

I agree with lester mostly except the comment about de niro being a one trick pony (the other 2 are though)

I think flawless, meet the parents and men of honour presented a different side to his acting.

He can do more that the just the mafia thug.

 

[jake cop]

Originally posted by oldlester
Casting the same actors in the same roles is just something I'm not interested in and I'm sure neither are they.

True, if you said to De Niro or Pacino that they should make more mafia films because it's what they're best at they'd be offended. If an actor becomes typcast, as I don't believe they are, then career is heading for a downward spiral.

Sizemore is typecast, he played exactly the same role in Saving Private Ryan and Black Hawk Down (to name just two) and it shows a lazy actor accepting the same roles so that he doesn't have to do any work. The audience accept him in that role because they've seen him play it before.

To truly make a great film with great performances you need actors to play roles that they have never done before to challenge them. When George Clooney played Seth Gecko in From Dusk 'til Dawn it was a completely different role for him and he excelled in it.

 

[adams901]

Originally posted by oldlester
L.A. Confidential cannot be classed as old (and did not star De Niro, Pacino or Pesci)

I didnt say they where in it, i stated it was a good film that todays films are hard reached to match, and as for it not being an old film it isn't a new film either.

only one of those still making good movies (playing different characters) is Pacino.

I disagree De Niro still stars in the occasional good film (the Score being one of them), but it is hard to star in good films if the quality of writing leaving hollywood is average.

Sizemore, De Niro and Pesci are just one trick ponies now it seems (I'm not saying they're shit , just coasting) And Brando, well.

I definatly would not say they are one trick ponies, that couldnt be further from the truth.

Originally posted by jake cop
if you said to De Niro or Pacino that they should make more mafia films because it's what they're best at they'd be offended.

They are best at making mafia films, they have each stared in good films that are not mafia related but for me they really shine when they play gangsters.

If you look at it this way... My job is in IT, put me infront of a phone and ask me to sell a product and I would, but I would not be able to do it as efficiently as I can IT, I know this is not really the same as acting but the point im trying to get across is some people are good at certain things and for them it is mafia films, Bruce willis is good in action films, put him in a kids film (disneys The Kid) and he isn't half as good as he normally is.

 

[jake cop]

Originally posted by adams901
My job is in IT, put me infront of a phone and ask me to sell a product and I would, but I would not be able to do it as efficiently as I can IT

And De Niro, Pesci and Pacino are actors. Give them a role and they will act at being whatever that role demands. To keep playing the same role time and time again typcasts them and shows them as being lazy. An actor wants to try to different roles to test himself, you don't learn if you keep doing the same thing.

To say you want to see De Niro in more mafia films is very short sighted. Is he an actor or not?

People like Segal play a cop in every movie because he's not an actor, De Niro is and he should be allowed to try different roles.

 

[adams901]

I did not say he "shouldn't" act in other films, I said for me they shine in mafia related films, it does not matter what proffession they are in, everyone regardless of who they are is good at certain things more than they are others, to say they are actors so they SHOULD be good in everything they do is wrong. A footballer is a footballer but some are better in midfield than they are in defence, does this make them a bad footballer?

So once again... They have starred in good films not relating to mafia, but I find their mafia films better, just like I find Bruce Willis in an action film better than Bruce Willis in a kids film.

 

[jake cop]

You're missing the point about acting. An actor looks for a well written and fleshed out role with a decent script, and hopefully a talented director who knows how to work with actors.

Your analogies about footballers and IT workers are inaccurate. De Niro considers himself, rightly so, a decent actor. Whatever the role; he will endeavour to excel in it.

 

[Lester]

*WAITS FOR FLAMES*

Raging Bull>Deerhunter>taxi driver>Angelheart>MIdnight Run>CApe Fear>Meet The Parents>Analyze This>Goodfellas.




Twelve Monkeys>Pulp Fiction>Whole Nine Yards>Unbreakable>Die Hard 2>Die Hard 3

 

[jake cop]

You're gonna need to clarify that one for me oldlester, while you do I'll get my matches.

 

[adams901]

:wall: I have not said they are bad actors in any other films, I have stated I (as in ME) prefer them in gangster films. If you ask for a bad film that they have been in no one (well hardly anyone) will mention the gangster films. Everyone has strenghts and weakness even actors.

My original point was no one can match or beat them for the gangster roles they have played in previous years.

Originally posted by oldlester
*WAITS FOR FLAMES*

Meet The Parents and Analyze This

I thought those 2 were good films and I have them both on DVD

 

[Lester]

I know m8.... It's all just a matter of opinion in the end -somebody out there thinks Rocky & Bulwinkle is the best film De Niro has ever done

And Joe Pesci is definitely a one trick pony.......IMO of course.

 

[legendario]

Analyze this is greater than goodfellas?

FS lester you deserve to be shot in the head for that comment.

I bagsy first shot.

 

[jake cop]

Originally posted by adams901
:wall: I have not said they are bad actors in any other films, I have stated I (as in ME) prefer them in gangster films.

No one said you did mate.

Originally posted by adams901
to say they are actors so they SHOULD be good in everything they do is wrong.

Now this is a stupid statement. To act means to become something you are not. If you are a decent actor you will be able to tackle every role with the same energy, drive and conviction. I've worked with actors, to suggest that they're better at some roles than others would be offensive. It's suggesting that they don't know their craft.

 

[Lester]

:touch:


They are all better than Goodfellas.

Goodfellas 2 was better than Goodfellas fs!

 

[adams901]

ok it may be offensive and they may tackle each role with the same drive and conviction but it doesnt mean they will be better or as good at it as they are in other roles. Every actor has been in a film where they are stupidly bad.

Wesly Snipe - Too Wong Foo
Gene hackman - Get Shorty
Bruce Willis - The Kid

There are many more I can list but its hard to when you have to keep minimising the screen so people think your working lol

 

[Lester]

Actually just to make you hate me more errr.. I thought Gene Hackman was good in Get Shorty.